Hey everyone, I read the topics in here every once in a while just to get a better idea of how the whole licensing process and maintenance side works and it’s been really informative. I often discuss firearm issues with a coworker and I try to get him the correct information if possible.

This morning he was discussing about how there is technically a “registry” without an actual registry. When I questioned him on what he was talking about, he told me that the owner of the LGS he uses was telling him that during his twice yearly ATF audits that the agents peruse all the documents in the bound books and can take note on individuals and what they’ve bought. The owner also told him this was why the firearm information (type, serial number) was moved to the front page of the form so it was easier for them to see and document.

What I believe, correct me please if I’m wrong, was that during ATF audits they only were verifying an FFL was following ATF regulations such as proper documentation, storage, etc. They’re not coming in, flipping through your bound book and taking down names and serial numbers. They’d need some sort of warrant or something to take that information down, I would assume. I do know if an FFL loses/ends their license, the bound book is given to the ATF, but would that be a similar situation?

Anyway, I know there are several of you here with decades of experience with this so I was hoping to get some good information. Any corrections would be appreciated, as I’m not an FFL so my knowledge is all second/third hand.

Compliance inspections occur yearly or 'every few years' depending on the type of FFL and your location.  Areas with a large number of FFLs don't have enough ATF IOIs (Industry Operations Investigators) to do frequent inspections.

One of the things they look at is the previous 12 months of 4473s. They're looking for mistakes on the forms and will address what they find during the inspection review with the FFL. What other information they gather from that inspection process may never be passed on to the FFL.  If a customer's pattern of behavior catches their attention, they could, and have, investigated further.

FFLs maintain the 4473s for 20 years and then destroy them.  If the FFL closes business before that 20 year mark, and they're shipped to ATF's West Virginia facility.

as a small dealer,  and as someone who's father was a small dealer,,  I have been thru a double handful of Compliance reviews or inspections,


ATF shows up,  or leaves a business card/note if I am closed
we schedule a day to do an inventory (as in the Compliance folks come in and compare my inventory to what is on the bound book)

once the went thru every 4473 I had,  the last, pre cooties, they did all we had in the past calendar year
I give them a quiet corner, sit up a table and chairs, and give them the paperwork

the usually check the boxes, and approval numbers, ,  

then the lead guy schedules a day to come back after they review everything and tell me what was wrong,


never a big deal,
no dogs shot,
no black helicopters,
once one guy had a dark sedan,,,


they flip thru the paperwork way to fast to take down any info of the type mentioned,

Dad passed in 2011,  I ran the license as a Successor until it expired,  then had to clean up and close out what was left,

maybe 4 months after the FFL expired we were done, and the IOI/Compliance guy that was  helping me picked up all the 4473's,
I also gave them all the copies of the form 4's we had processed over the years (that ended up being helpful for another deceased FFL later)


anyway,

about a year goes by, and I have had a new FFL for a short while,

get a call from the tracing center,  wanting a trace on something that was sold,

when we get to the details and dates I told the nice lady I could not help her,

she did not like that answer and got a bit short,  telling me who she was, requirements to comply etc etc,

I told her I understood all that and would be happy to comply,  however that trace request would be on the old license that had expired,  and that all the paperwork was loaded in the back of a Gov Sedan maybe 3 months prior,  and taken to the local office ,,,,,


she suddenly became very nice again, and said she was going to call the local branch,,,and find out why they had not forwarded the paperwork,,,

Yeah, it's a lot of fun isn't it?

We just had an inspection. Took better part of the week. IOIs are armed with laptops, cell phones, etc. They're checking a lot of different data, multiple firearm forms vs their list, NTNs, your NFA inventory vs theirs, etc.  They can capture as much or as little info as they want.

Ultimately, they're looking for incorrect practices by the FFL and/or criminal activity.

Thanks for the great insights. His main concern was that the government doesn’t maintain a list of who owns what, but the ATF can go to any dealer and write down names, addresses, and serial numbers to their hearts content, then go take some weapons and kill some dogs.

I understand the compliance inspections are just for that, compliance. Beyond an agent seeing a discrepancy or pattern that sets off an alarm, can they gather that information for some other purpose such as creating a national registry by just copying the forms?

It's a volume vs time issue.  They don't have enough time and we generate too much volume.

Calculate the time needed to digitize 3 pages of one 4473.  Multiply that by number of 4473s.  A small to medium shop will generate between 2 and 5 thousand forms a year.  Not particularly feasible.  Unless we put the Cubans in charge, Soviet advisors optional.

That was one of my points to him. If the inspector was just gleaming data from the 4473s, why would he not show up with a portable scanner and just scan all the forms? His concern is what would stop that from happening. I'm sure there is something that would legally prevent them from doing it.

It's a federal form. They're the federal agency chartered to regulate our business. Nothing to stop them from collecting whatever they want on the inspection side, other than the prohibitions against creating a 'registry'.  ATF is very creative about moving lines they stay inside.

They do. With most info on page, they can just drop the 4473s in a doc feeder and done.

This not SOP though.

Federal law restricts ATF from conducting a compliance inspection more than once in any 12 month period......unless the licensee has "issues". If a previous inspection turned up recordkeeping problems or the licensee has had lots of guns turning up at crime scenes ATF may visit him more often.
Having a lot of gun traces with a "time to crime" of less than three years or failing to comply with a gun trace request are not good business.

So if that dealer has ATF in his shop twice a year.....he might not be an FFL for long.

more than 1yr is probably a FFL02

Local ATF folks told me they were mostly interested in "trafficking".    I have seen them in stores with a specific name or names and they are looking for multiple transactions to aid/build/manufacture a case they are working on.  The group of agents I met that day all looked like they were kids fresh out of college.

I have also seen where they look for multiple "assault weapon" transactions in one day and one local dealer actually limits customer purchases to try and prevent this scrutiny.

And then there was the local ATF sponsored gun walking events..............................

Assholes.

During the inspections I've had, they usually check the number of blank spaces in my A&D book against the number of inventory I have on hand.  If that matches, they usually don't dig any further on that avenue.  I've had them check through a random sample of my 4473s to check for errors.  I've never had any issues there.  I have seen them jot down the names of individuals who received firearms in my A&D book alot, but they didn't really jot down what they were buying.  It just seemed to me that they were merely taking note of things that seemed out of the ordinary to follow up on through other avenues.  I've never had them come back to follow up on anything they observed in an inspection.