Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
BCM
User Panel

Posted: 6/21/2018 12:14:59 PM EDT
I'm an FFL. I have a couple that is getting divorced and the husband gifted a couple of guns to the wife. He is insisting that she have the guns legally transferred into her name or he won't give them to her. How do I, as a FFL do that? Wondering how to log them in my A&D book from him. Can he just hand them over and then I do 4473s for them to her?
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 12:54:35 PM EDT
[#1]
I kind of went though something similar when I divorced.

I took a Glock that I had bought for the Ex to a dealer.  If I remember right, he received it in his bound book inventory, as if I sold it too him.  Then, he had her fill out a 4473 and "Sold it" to her.  
I think I paid 25.00 for the paperwork and his time.

It was her gun fair and square as I gave it too her several years before the divorce happened. I just did not want her having a gun in her possession with my name on it after we separated.  
I could not be sure that she would not get broke and sell it to the 1st dick with cash, then they have a gun with my name on it.

What do you know, this happened.  They guy that bought it called me and offered it back to me for what he had paid for it...

Most likely, nothing would have ever come of it, but I didn't want to test that...  
YMMV...
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 1:55:43 PM EDT
[#2]
BATFE could care less about divorce.

Log them into your A/D book from him and 4473 them out to her.  Make your transfer fee / gun or sheet and call it a day.
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 2:59:09 PM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
BATFE could care less about divorce.

Log them into your A/D book from him and 4473 them out to her.  Make your transfer fee / gun or sheet and call it a day.
View Quote
This.
It's all completely unnecessary, but if he wants to pay you to entertain him, then let him.

Many people have misconceptions about how this stuff works. If a gun is being traced (which generally means LE has it), and the initial consumer completed a 4473 from purchasing it new, that consumer is still going to get a call, no matter how many transfers and 4473 forms happen after that.

If they sold it, gave it away, whatever, they can just say so at that time. It's not the big deal people assume it is.
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 3:28:43 PM EDT
[#4]
How is it possible to be an FFL in Florida and not know the answer ?

There is no such thing as registration. Period. The end. Tell client to give her the guns. Should he need to massage his feels he can give her a made up piece of paper with a Bullshit Statement that he left the firearms with her. Should she tell him to fuck off then just write down was left with her on a sheet of paper and throw it in a file somewhere. No one cares.

Yes. You could enter in from him and log out to her for feels. it is not a registration of any kind. No one cares.
It is no different than gifting, selling a lawn mower or a dining room table.
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 3:34:53 PM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
This.
It's all completely unnecessary, but if he wants to pay you to entertain him, then let him.

Many people have misconceptions about how this stuff works. If a gun is being traced (which generally means LE has it), and the initial consumer completed a 4473 from purchasing it new, that consumer is still going to get a call, no matter how many transfers and 4473 forms happen after that.

If they sold it, gave it away, whatever, they can just say so at that time. It's not the big deal people assume it is.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
BATFE could care less about divorce.

Log them into your A/D book from him and 4473 them out to her.  Make your transfer fee / gun or sheet and call it a day.
This.
It's all completely unnecessary, but if he wants to pay you to entertain him, then let him.

Many people have misconceptions about how this stuff works. If a gun is being traced (which generally means LE has it), and the initial consumer completed a 4473 from purchasing it new, that consumer is still going to get a call, no matter how many transfers and 4473 forms happen after that.

If they sold it, gave it away, whatever, they can just say so at that time. It's not the big deal people assume it is.
That's what I thought. Thanks for confirming it guys.
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 3:35:14 PM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
How is it possible to be an FFL in Florida and not know the answer ?

There is no such thing as registration. Period. The end. Tell client to give her the guns. Should he need to massage his feels he can give her a made up piece of paper with a Bullshit Statement that he left the firearms with her. Should she tell him to fuck off then just write down was left with her on a sheet of paper and throw it in a file somewhere. No one cares.

Yes. You could enter in from him and log out to her for feels. it is not a registration of any kind. No one cares.
It is no different than gifting, selling a lawn mower or a dining room table.
View Quote
I know there isn't any such thing as registration. He's just insisting on something to show she owns them now. It's an ugly divorce like so many. And why do you seem so angry?
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 3:53:54 PM EDT
[#7]
If you feel the need, just make it part of the property division that is always stated in the Divorce decree, as long as she is not a known prohibited person, then nothing special needed, they are personal property and the BATF don't give a shit.
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 4:22:04 PM EDT
[#8]
Not angry. Completely astounded someone in the biz asked the question. It is information the most basic Gun shop employee should know inside and out.
There is no process to complete That will do what your customer is thinking of. It does not exist.
Your shop your rules..I would explain it just that way.

Sir..I can log them into the shop coming from you and out to her but there is no legal requirement to do so and it has no legal bearing as a registered owner of a firearm. There simply is no firearm registration in the State of Florida. The 4473 is a piece of paper used by the FFL to establish that the dealer transferred a firearm in accordance with the Gun Control Act of 1968. Nothing more than record keeping. The 4473 and information supplied on the form never leave the store unless a trace somehow finds its way to this store. The only way than can happen is if one of those firearms turns up at a crime and a trace is done. Sir...if you were the original purchaser and the firearm was new. You will be getting the call first anyhow. The first 4473 showing a transfer always gets a call or visit from ATF in a search. Since you did not purchase from this shop new. No one knows anything about it. Firearm traces are done in reverse.
Manufacturers to Distributors to FFL to first Customers. After that in States with no registration then the investigators have to get lucky and hope whomever sold the gun last or next remembers who they sold it to.
Otherwise the trace is dead. They have no clue. It is not traceable.

So..Sir. If that is what you would like to do. I can do that for you..for $..? Please let your ex know she must be a resident of the State for handgun transfers and we will need valid State of Florida ID or Federal ID and proof of Florida residency to complete the transfer for a handgun. Also if she does not have a CCW permit then there is a 3 day waiting period before she can pick them up. CCW permit holders have no wait. However everyone gets the call in Backround check. The call in check costs $? And is not included in the transfer cost.
Thank you, we will take care of it if you decide to go that route.
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 4:23:42 PM EDT
[#9]
OP is an FFL, (guessing newer, since he hasn't dealt with this or anything similar, to apply the logic)  he is asking about the process to take care of a customer.
He never said the BATF cared anything about the divorce, nor did anyone else, even though many have said "The BATF doesn't Care"...

From what I can tell, the OP's customer just want the gun that HE bought as a gift for the Ex in his name out, so if the soon to be Ex wife ever sells it or does something stupid with it, and then in the unlikely event that its traced back to him, he can show a paper trail that it left his possession...

No big deal, help the guy out.  Personal pref on how he wants to handle it...
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 4:45:30 PM EDT
[#10]
If he purchased the guns new and gave them to her, then he is going to get a call no matter what, if something dumb gets done with those guns.  As was already said, they go backwards when running a trace, Manufacture>Distributor>FFL>Original purchaser.  All he has to tell them I no longer own them, period, end of story.
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 4:47:25 PM EDT
[#11]
He'll never have a need to show a paper trail. There is no "in his name". It's just an over-the-counter transaction record, relevant only to that one transaction, not future transactions.

I used to give customers an explanation like Number1gun's above, but after a few years I realized it was a waste of time and shortened my speech considerably. "Sir, that's completely unnecessary due to our state not having registration. There is no federal registration for those either, but if you want it done anyway it's $X".
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 5:24:19 PM EDT
[#12]
Heirloom transfer - log in, log out. Just remember the FEDs will still expect a sale of multiple pistol/revolver form if applicable.
Link Posted: 6/21/2018 10:33:02 PM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
OP is an FFL, (guessing newer, since he hasn't dealt with this or anything similar....
View Quote
That would be a bad guess.
If he doesn't know to log acquisitions in to his bound book and also log out his dispositions then he won't be an FFL for long.

It doesn't matter if the licensee receives the firearm new or used, from a manufacturer, a distributor or another dealer or from the wino that lives in a van down by the river.....you record the acquisition from the person or business you get it from. Just as you would record the disposition to the buyer/transferee who completed the 4473/NICS.
Link Posted: 6/22/2018 10:40:16 AM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
That would be a bad guess.
If he doesn't know to log acquisitions in to his bound book and also log out his dispositions then he won't be an FFL for long.

It doesn't matter if the licensee receives the firearm new or used, from a manufacturer, a distributor or another dealer or from the wino that lives in a van down by the river.....you record the acquisition from the person or business you get it from. Just as you would record the disposition to the buyer/transferee who completed the 4473/NICS.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
OP is an FFL, (guessing newer, since he hasn't dealt with this or anything similar....
That would be a bad guess.
If he doesn't know to log acquisitions in to his bound book and also log out his dispositions then he won't be an FFL for long.

It doesn't matter if the licensee receives the firearm new or used, from a manufacturer, a distributor or another dealer or from the wino that lives in a van down by the river.....you record the acquisition from the person or business you get it from. Just as you would record the disposition to the buyer/transferee who completed the 4473/NICS.
Guys.....I KNOW how to manage my A&D book. Jeeze. I was simply confirming if I could do it that way as I've never facilitated a private transfer before.
Link Posted: 6/22/2018 11:02:03 AM EDT
[#15]
Quoted:
I'm an FFL. I have a couple that is getting divorced and the husband gifted a couple of guns to the wife. He is insisting that she have the guns legally transferred into her name or he won't give them to her. How do I, as a FFL do that? Wondering how to log them in my A&D book from him. Can he just hand them over and then I do 4473s for them to her?
View Quote
They are already hers. This is not your problem. This is divorce property issue.

But as others said, if husband wants to run them through your books, and wife is OK, you profit. Take money and SU.
Close Join Our Mail List to Stay Up To Date! Win a FREE Membership!

Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!

You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.


By signing up you agree to our User Agreement. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win.
Top Top