Title says it all. My old 6-5 Peltor electronic muffs died, so I need to start over. I'm asking for help in setting up a new ear/comms kit. Below are my stipulations. Any and all help is greatly appreciated.

1. Should be comfortable/usable with or without a helmet.

2. More hearing protection is obviously better than less.

3. The radio I have now is the Baofeng BF-F8HP, so I'd like the comms to be hooked up to that and be compatible with it.

4. I'd like it all to be rugged and reliable.

5. Budget...what budget? Just kidding, there is a budget, but I'm not afraid of spending money on something that works well. Let's say I'd prefer to spend under $1k, but that number can be slightly flexible.

I have an Ops-Core bump helmet and an Agilite K-19 plate carrier.

Please be specific about the pieces of gear (headset, wires, pouches, etc.) that I'll need to purchase.

Again, thank you for your assistance.

Well, one option would be AMPs and a set of the Arms for the Helmet. They remove off the Headband in 30 seconds or less. Then get a Disco32 PTT made for AMPs and the Kenwood Connector - they'll work for any radio with the same connector as the BF. I have this exact setup and it works perfectly with BF, Wouxun, and Radtel. The cheapest AMP is the non-connectorized, non - NFM version, and there used to be 20% off codes for Gentex, everywhere (try GARANDTHUMB).

^^^^^ This.

Also, ditch the Baofeng. Rugged and reliable it is not. At all. Don't get me wrong, they're great for LARPing or tranquilo ham use, but spend the money to get something better if you plan on using this in anger. Beyond the sad ham bitching about it's performance as a transceiver, they're really cheaply made component-wise, not durable in the least, waterproof...maybe against a stiff sneeze, and their popularity is primarily a result of a new one being $25 Amazon Prime Same Day Delivery when you make the mistake of looking at it the wrong way and it dies.

If you pick up something like a Moto XTS2500/5000 or EFJ 5100, they take a different PTT, so you're buying twice when the Baofeng shits the bed and you get something better.

AMPs are variable cost. Depends on the options. The sex is the connectorized NFMI. The cheap is the fixed download non-NFMI. Sub-$1k to Plus-$1k.
Disco32 PTT - $100ish-$120ish depending.
Pouches are all over the place. Get what's appropriate. $100 radio pouches are dumb btw...
Stuff like PTT retainers, rangers bands, etc. is cheap enough, $5-$10
Better radio: $300ish-$600ish, digital/analog, usually programmed from the source, most of those guys are giving you a new housing and the crypto boards already installed.

Those Motorolas are "out of print." Are radios something that can be purchased used, but with confidence?

I don't mind buying new, btw.

Absolutely. They're all over eBay and private sellers abound, so as long as the seller isn't an unscrupulous dick you'll be fine. There are tons of them (the radios) around because they're primarily surplus public safety and in the case of a boatload of 2500's, former USMC re-housed radios. They're still going strong because they're built for the type of people who have a habit of breaking ball bearings... I mean, you could also purchase a brand new Moto APX8000 or Kenwood VP8000 but the price tags are reflected right there in the model number.

Sent you a PM reply. Happy to elaborate further depending on what sort of info you want.

Johnny - does the ability to change the AES Key ("Fill") come with these used radios? I've heard the "Programming" stuff is an expensive nightmare. Also, how does one take two digital radios out of the box, and make them talk to each other, without registering anything, with anyone? (I've seen a tutorial for MD390's that involved third party firmware, etc...). Finally, in an SHTF scenario, aren't you back to Analog, if you come across like minded people who have different protocol radios (P25 vs DMR, etc...) or even if same, but no ability to re-key the AES?

I like IP rated Analog with Voice Inversion - easy, and 'Bubba' is still in the dark. I also like the ability to go 136-629 Tx/Rx uninterrupted. I have Meshtastic for Digital Encryption, and AndFLMSG for Encryption over Analog with an APRS Cable. But I'd love to try Digital if I could stay away from 'The Man'

First things first, I'm really sorry for the novel that follows, but I have thoughts. And damn the torpedoes if I'm gonna let anyone stand in the way of shouting my opinions to the internet at large.

The first thing to remember is that most of the info out there is geared towards amateur radio so it's all above board, registered, licensed, etc. The registering thing with DMR is so that you can access the connected networks that require you to be licensed. Example, if you want to jump on talkgroup 91 worlwide and have a chit chat with Sven Svenson in east bumfuck Lapland, yeah, you gotta register, you're transmitting to an internet connected gateway or some sort, whether a repeater bridge, a wifi-enabled hotspot, etc., and everyone gets to hear your conversation. It's just the voice equivalent of an AOL chat room. If you just want to talk simplex you're not worried about any of this. You've gotta dig a little deeper for info on the commercial radios since realistically they're what we're talking about, both from a hardware performance side, as well as the setup/programming. And this is ignoring all of the serious public safety stuff like system keys, dynamic talk groups, APCO Phase 1 or Phase 2 trunking, control channels, man down, blah blah blah. You're not going to ghetto rig third party firmware for this, that's firmly in the realm of amateur radio trying to get that stuff to do things they're not designed to do.

Any of the radios have the ability to keyfill either through hardware or software. You can either score an expensive factory KVL, or a cheap KFD from some place like Omaha Comms. They work the same. If you get MotoTRBO radios there's no key filling, it's all in the software. No extra hardware needed. Generate AES256 keys and copy/paste in the CPS. This can have some repercussions depending on your level of paranoia. In practice, if you've already been hacked to the point where someone is jacking your keys from your laptop with a keylogger or pulling it from RAM you're already smoked.

The radios have the ability to do infinite key retention so if you're not planning on doing a bunch of zeroing keys on the regular, the keys will never expire. The reputable resellers will load keys for you already, and for a small group of people realistically you never have to touch them other than to actually operate them. Programming isn't an expensive nightmare at all, but like anything else, there is a learning curve. If you're planning on running crypto in the civilian/non-licensed world you're not being legal anyway, so acquiring the software isn't much of an ethical leap. Depending on the radio, the software is free too. At some point you need to take responsibility for maintaining the system, whether analog or digital regardless. When the radioactive cannibals are roving around the wastelands, are you gonna have a mechanic in your group, or when your Mad Max van breaks down are you just gonna shrug your shoulders and leave it on the side of the road? You either make someone responsible for the radios, or you hope that Granny Ethel can figure out how to FPP her Baofeng. Digital radios aren't any harder, they're just a little more complex. With that comes an order of magnitude of capability.

As for digital-digital simplex, easy enough. With DMR, you just match frequency and timeslot and color code and you're in business, but with the significant advantages of digital. P25 is really just frequency and NAC. All of which can be accessed from the front panel. Sure you can settle on analog for interops, but realistically, if we're in a situation where we're considering welcoming like-minded folks into the fold, there are absolutely non-like-minded folks who will be trying to listen in. It's just a function of where society will be at that point.

Putting your trust in analog with voice inversion as opposed to actual encryption is like saying, "well my front door is locked with the handle so I don't need to dead bolt it or lock the garage door, the windows, and the back door." It just sounds like Donald Duck. It's not actually hiding you from anything but the most casual listener. And anyone that's actually taken an interest in you isn't going to find it a barrier to anything. It's like people who think that PL tones are an effective way to stay hidden on the airwaves. A kid sitting by his window sill with a walkie talkie and a notebook is all is takes to ruin your day on analog.

As for giant wideband use, sure, it's nice to be able to cover the whole range of VHF/UHF, but it's really not necessary. Entire states fit their entire public safety systems into a single band, and anyone looking is going to see you wherever you're transmitting so from an amateur radio perspective it's cool, but utility wise it's sort of a non-starter. It's neato, but in terms of giving you excess capability, not worth losing out on other things IMO. That being said, the dream is still an all band all mode encrypted handheld that will do everything digital, everything analog, air band receive/transmit, automatic satellite doppler shift, etc.. For $12k you're almost there with a Moto APX8000, Kenwood VP8000, or Harris XL-200P.

Meshtastic stuff is cool but it really requires infrastructure to make decent use of it. You're talking about building custom nodes you can squirrel away all over the place if you really want it to be useful for a small team. An 80 acre rural plot is really gonna need about 10 of them if you want to truly do it right and failure proof the system. Urban area? If you can get them up high you might get away with 20 of them for the same coverage. Remember, it's LoRA, you're basically trying to use soy bean farming data links. Also competing with every IoT egg timer and plant water monitoring system in every apartment. And realistically no one is getting ahold of the really fancy MANET stuff like Silvus. Even the GoTenna stuff has barriers to entry even beyond cost. If you look at a standalone node being housing, solar, battery, node, and antenna, you're still into it for $100-ish per node for the good stuff. Not expensive, but not cheap either considering latency and bandwidth limitations. Don't get me wrong, the potential is super cool, but it takes A LOT of work to do it right and have a really bombproof network.

As for FLMSG over analog APRS, everyone interested knows all the digipeaters are on 144.390, APRS isn't encrypted so you're already doing complicated computer-based front-end encryption before you even transmit. And still anyone listening to APRS is gonna know exactly where those packets are coming from even if they can't decode the packets. I mean, it's also illegal to encrypt packet radio but again, only amateurs are going to get their panties in a twist over that. FLMSG was developed for NBEMS so by it's nature it's open to everyone who can listen. It's also very limited in capability. Like the Meshtastic stuff, it's really an amateur play thing at this point until you spend the big bucks for GoTenna or Silvus, but at that point you've gotta give "The Man" everything just to be able to buy into it.

Honestly, a couple MotoTRBO 7550e's and a computer with CPS and Depot will get you encrypted DMR, FPP-enabled firmware, and all of the entitlements. Also the normal DMR features as well. Really you're just limited to a single band instead of the whole of VHF/UHF. This also keeps you from needing a key fill device. That being said, since you really need a computer to program any of these radios effectively, analog or otherwise, you might as well go P25 with a KFD and FPP doesn't require getting wonky regional Asian firmware like the TRBO's. If you're not using a computer and have to FPP every radio, analog or otherwise, you're in for a terrible time anyway, and I feel for whoever has to do that.

@JohnnyC thanks for taking the time with that. Two things:

I use Meshtastic all the time with 3 buds - we're getting 1Km between devices in thick, wooded, hilly terrain, and we're still on Firmware 1.x, On Firmware 2.x the range has increased a lot - we're just lazy with flashing. It's definitely prime time ready for digital encrypted comms in a local area.

Don't get hung up when I typed APRS - I meant just the cable - nothing to do with the service. We use any frequency we want, and just burst pre-encrypted text with AndFlmsg. This is just done for testing - it isn't something we use a lot.

All I'm worried about with the analog, is casual listeners. Keying *any* device with a sophisticated attacker is dangerous.

Thanks again, the digital info was helpful.

Some little odds and ends that I think are actually necessary with the Feng and U95 PTT are the Great Plains Creations Exoskeleton and PTT Guard.

Or....you know....3D print one for pennies.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5896199