What’s the best way to fix the guide rod on my polymer 80 from hitting my suppressor? It barely hits it. I have not tried to shoot it to see if it works fine. But it locks open by cycling by hand. I already filed the roundness off of the end to flaten it out. Took off about a 1/16”-1/8”. Get a longer barrel?

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Not sure the answer but that does look like a really small gap of barrel sticking out. Mine are significantly larger

What barrel is that? I’m assuming it’s a Poly80 Glock frame.

They designed the barrel wrong. It needs to be longer. I’ve seen this with a couple manufacturers.

Get as longer BBL or switch to a 34 upper

It’s from a company called rock slide. I bought a complete upper from them. Works great other then this.

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So they apparently never tested it to see if it would work, cause I cannot imagine any silencer that would work with that.

Show them the problem and see if they will make you a longer BBL.

Exactly

Longer barrel is the answer. If the suppressor has an XL piston available that might work as well.

ETA: this is what my Gemtech/LWD barrel looks like:

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Wouldn’t an XL length piston work as well?

Does Gemtech make them?

SilencerCo makes XL pistons.

And the Lunar is not compatible

While most barrel tenons are a little further out, that's a suppressor/booster design fail.  1/4" minimum clearance is needed to ensure against guide rod contact, and it should be assumed that pistols exist where the shoulder or thread termination is right at the slide face (Beretta 92s are often threaded this way with stock barrels).  From the looks of it, there's barely 1/8" of piston protruding from the housing.

So it works great other than, you know, not working for what it was designed for?

Funny.  When we spent all those months testing it with dozens of factory and aftermarket barrels this never came up.

It also uses a piston/ LID design going back a decade. The Lunar LID is nothing new or different from the Blackside/ GM45.

The barrel is designed improperly.  They owe OP  a barrel or a refund.

Don’t buy from no name companies.

Works without the can. I have not even tried with the can. I was afraid I might hurt my can.

The barrel does look a little short.  The guide rod also protrudes quite a bit from the front of the slide while in battery.

You could always cut more off of the guide rod.  You will just lose the captured function of the guide rod making reassembly more tricky.

I'm more concerned about the second picture.  They jacked with the ejection port window AND the hardened locking surface.  I would not trust this slide.  I would not buy this slide.  I would not recommend this slide or this company.

That barrel is too short to use with most suppressor body and piston configurations.  Three to four threads engagement is the rule of thumb for full threaded fastener strength.  You could try adding a spacer or shim for clearance provided you leave 3-4 threads engagement. As long as you retain at least 3-4 threads of engagement and keep it tight to a square shoulder (of a spacer or shim stack) it should function fine once you create some clearance. An extended piston is the preferred solution if somebody makes one.

The threaded Sig 320 barrel is stupid looking and long because of that issue.

Better too long and goofy looking than too short and unusable.

Better that suppressor manufacturers operate with the understanding that it is our responsibility to ensure enough clearance from slide face to booster housing.  Said it before, I'll say it again; OP's case is far from the only one where there is little if any distance from slide face to shoulder/beginning of thread tenon on a short recoil handgun.  Design a can that has <1/4" of piston protruding, better offer XL pistons.  Yeah, you can pass the buck and blame the gun or barrel maker, but in the end you still have an owner wishing he'd gone with a different can and remembering that the next time he buys.

I offer shorty pistons for the no guide rod 1911 & BHP crowd who want minimal gap, and I'll custom build pistons of any length, but my pistol cans have 1/4" of piston protruding with my tri-lugs or any standard 2" 10-point piston.

So I talked to the manufacture of this barrel today. They were nice on the phone. The guy told me all their barrels are this length. He also said he owns a  silencerco barrel for his G17 and his guide rod hits as well. But I could trade my old barrel back and pay the difference for another brand on their site. So not really sure it will fix my issue. Maybe it’s a gen3 problem since gen4-5 use a bigger guide rod and spring.

And what happens when the next barrel manufacturer trims off another .100? .125 ? Another .250?

There are thread standards out there. AAC and SilencerCo make 1/2-28 thread guides along with instructions on how much clearance is needed. Have for over a decade.  These jackasses either didn’t read them or more importantly didn’t give a shit.

For every one of these too short barrels there are 50 that thread shit correctly.  These guys are incompetent. I could throw a lawn dart in the air in the dungeon at SHOT and probably hit a company that provides a properly threaded 1/2-28 Glock barrel.

At the end of the day the right fix is to get a new barrel- one made to the print. As opposed to settling for some company that apparently doesn’t care that they are selling an inferior product to unassuming customers.

You can't "trim it back" further than the slide face.

I make a good share of my living fixing what other manufacturers fuck up; my opinions on the right way to manufacture a given part for a given application that I'm familiar with are well founded.  When it comes to threading and threaded attachments, there are a lot of very incompetent designers, engineers and machine operators out there.  I've had to chase threads on countless muzzles, create undercuts, run taps into everything from Silencerco brakes that were below minimum minor to chasing the 1/4-28 threads in very expensive custom receivers because they were too tight even for class 2 fasteners.  And that's just on the gunsmithing side of things.  General machine work is a whole 'nother story.

As threaded pistol barrels are concerned, suppressors & booster housings/pistons should be designed so that a tenon which is absolutely flush with the muzzle face still provides 1/4" minimum clearance.  If some manufacturers want to bank on most barrels having greater protrusion, that's their prerogative, but threads like this wouldn't even exist if they gave more consideration to such variables.  Again, that's why I have my standard pistons and also offer short and custom length pistons.  Gemtech chose to design with very little piston sticking out past the booster housing, and to not offer long pistons, so the OP is in a jam.  He wouldn't be having this issue with one of mine.  Or a TiRant.  Or an Octane.  Obsidian.  Etc, etc.

I feel like maybe you aren't familiar with who PHD and ikickhippies are...

Seems like all of the options have been covered, OP.  Using that can with that piston and that barrel and guide rod will result in the suppressor hitting the guide rod.  Your options are to:

1.  Live with the suppressor beating on the guide rod
2. Get a different barrel
or
3. Use a different can that has a longer piston.

You have to decide.

Same. I was gonna post the same but didn’t want to look like I was calling the guy out.

Also had another critical thinking idea:

With the volume of posts here if silencers and the depth of their pistons were that big of an issue we would see one of these posts weekly, if not monthly.

But we don’t. My humble guess is because people who purchase silencers typically use well known barrel manufacturers or OEM barrels.

In 12 years I can only think of one of these threads that resulted in the barrel manufacturer cutting the barrel out of print.

There will soon be SAAMI spec thread drawings for manufacturers to adhere to. Can’t wait.

Are you trying to convey infallibility predicated on accomplishments & accolades?

Does it matter?  Is someone's statement more or less accurate based on resume?

Many here are likely more familiar with who I am/what I do than they realize.  I don't have the same name on all bulletin boards, hosting accounts or social media.

https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/03/30/mini-manual-machine-ar-15-ecco-machine-home-built-awesomeness/

https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/02/07/youtuber-builds-18-9-oz-repeating-rimfire-rifle/

https://www.guns.com/news/2018/08/30/turning-a-suomi-subgun-into-a-9mm-sewing-machine-video

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCrO8qCoLozuXPz_VMbBCogQ

https://www.facebook.com/ECCOmachine/

I don't think the entire suppressor-buying crowd is that savvy.  The number of barrels and attachments I've had to chase threads on/in or completely rethread also suggest there's not that much uniformity among well known manufacturers.   Aside from ANSI/ASME thread standards, there exists no universally accepted specification for tenon lengths, distance from given points, fore & aft undercut.   I've had to do work up to & including rethreading lots of factory barrels from some of those well known & respected manufacturers because a DT can or muzzle device bottomed out due to lack of undercut, or the muzzle contacted internals of a can before the mount touched shoulder.  For instance, there is more than one manufacturer out there doing AR-length tenons on rimfire barrels, when rimfire tenons should really be no longer than .475".  Anyone who's tried to put certain rimfire cans on an M&P-15/22 or KelTec CMR-30 has discovered this for themselves.  A .625" tenon on centerfire rifles may also bottom out in a number of muzzle devices without a crush washer or shims.  And then there are plenty of factory threaded barrels out there which are not axially aligned and concentric, causing bafffle strikes.  Like I said above, I make a good share of my income correcting these issues.

There's nothing us manufacturers can do to address poor alignment aside from increase the aperture size in our cans, which none of us are about to sacrifice performance just so some crappy AK barrel won't send a bullet into a baffle.  But we can mitigate the problems arising from lack of standards on tenons with our mounting systems.  As with pistols cans having enough piston protrusion to work with slide face flush shoulders, my brakes and direct thread mounts for rifles & rimfires are all designed to work with tenons up to .650" length, and they are all undercut in case the barrel they're going on isn't.  The decision to build that way is a result of having to modify so many barrels and muzzle attachments from other manufacturers.

And from that day forward I'll be in your corner on any debate over how far out a gunmaker or barrel maker should start the tenon.  Until then, I maintain that it's incumbent on us to offer mounting solutions that won't leave our customers high & dry, at least not without detailing compatibility requirements in product descriptions.  But it's a free country with an open market and plenty of forums to commend or condemn products, so if someone wants to just do as they see fit and let the chips fall where they may, that's their business.

And on that note, I'll shut up.  After all, I do make money solving problems for end users that are not addressed by major manufacturers.

Your critique of barrel threading sloppiness is spot on, but sort of supports that the OPs barrel maker hasn't actually tried to integrate too many popular designs onto their product.  As to those popular suppressor designs, can makers like to have suppressive volume within the advertised length of their product, so a longer piston makes their product look longer.  A longer barrel can give a little more velocity in unsuppressed mode and a longer lever arm for the mass of a compensator.  All the different solutions get similar results as far as suppressor function. I personally prefer a slightly extended barrel, and/or the availability of extra long piston.  I still think a nice thick 1/2-28 spacer from SiCo or Gemtech or Precision Armament might save the day here, and the tolerance stacking through a .45 can shouldn't be an issue.

Suppressors are a little bit like wine, cigars, and brandy.  They have a character that isnt completely quantifiable, and are burdened under the same ATF market distorting regulatory bullshit.  It isn't surprising there are different tastes and claims.

Does not matter who he is. Statements don't become more or less correct based on who the person is. They stand on there own.

You are free to do that.

It would seem to me to be Obvious Business 101, that if I want to enter market making threaded BBLs, I might want to make sure my BBLs work with existing products, than to expect MFGS to all suddenly tool up and make new product just for me.

The market will decide if silencer users want 87 pistons for one silencer and have to swap them every time they put it on a different gun, or just buy 1 piston and a bbl/gun with a BBL with enough clearance. I will vote with my wallet, as I am sure others will too. There is 0% chance I would ever buy from this company.

Clearly.  While I firmly hold that our suppressor designs should provide the necessary slide face clearance by themselves, I also am well aware than many don't.  Ergo, when I do custom adapters for pistols that have no threaded barrel available, my default is to have the shoulder .250" from muzzle face.  Same reason that, while my suppressors will go over any tenon up to and including .625" AR length, I thread centerfire rifles at .550" and pistols & rimfires at .450" with proper undercuts and 2A threads to ensure that my customers don't run into issues trying to screw on whatever they wish to, as I've encountered many muzzle accessories which have no undercut and threads that are often interference to the point of galling with a 3A muzzle threads.

I guess it's up to the OP whether to hold Gemtech or Rock Slide responsible for his problem.  Sounds like the company he procured the barrel from is going to make it right though.

Yes, but the reverse is also true, which is why I opted for the design I did.  It's a bit of a chicken-or-egg conundrum, since there have been so many variations of both threaded pistol barrels and pistol suppressor booster/piston designs.  Still, there are lots of threaded barrels out there, factory and aftermarket, that have well less than 1/4" from slide face to shoulder.  Some models from Beretta, CZ, Sig, FN, HK, Kimber and others have similar protrusion to what's on the OP's.

It never ceases to amaze me how much money some gun owners will spend on what I consider silly shit for aesthetic purposes.  I've had customers pay over $200 for barrel turning and custom press fit sleeves and then a Cerakote job rather that simply put a plug screw where a sight has been removed.  $100 to remove 1/2" of barrel & rethread so there's no gap from hand guard to flash can.  Not to mention what some folks will spend for slide lightening cuts and other accents or engraving.

It will only be true if most Silencer MFGs make new pistons to fit the Rock Slide BBL. I do not see that happening.

I've actually already seen your Facebook page.

If I'm ever in the market for a badly welded 28oz. can that costs as much as an Omega I'll be in touch...

Since I don't offer a welded 28 oz can, I can't help you.

I do have one suppressor that heavy, but it has no welds.  It's a continuous fire rated machine gun can with a monolithic mount & tube machined from solid 422 crucible stainless bar stock.

The only externally welded can I offer is a 13 ounce, 5" long 100% 17-4 H900 5.56 critter



If that's the "badly welded" can you had in your mind's eye, perhaps you shouldn't mention the Omega in a benchmark capacity:

Just get the xl piston. It should mention in thepaper work you may have to do that with some weapons. Easy breezy not complicated

Pretty sure gemtech does not even make them. At least I can’t find any.

You are correct.  They don’t. Maybe the dude that’s convinced it’s not a gun problem can custom make you one. Since he’s a silencer manufacturer and all.

Are there not any other manufacturers pistons that will fit a gemtech

If he has a LUNAR-45, it apparently uses a unique piston that’s quite different than the pistons used by SilencerCo, Rugged, and others.

https://gemtech.com/gm-45-and-blackside-45-lid-piston-core.html

Yep that’s the one. Except mine do not look shinny anymore. All black now.

That SUCKS brother. Sounds like your going to have to get the g17 long slide barrel. I know that it's possible though that it will work with other guns though.

My fn tactical 45 has more clearance than my G21 using a regular piston on my TI RANT 45. That said, I just use the extended piston.

Either way that just really sucks.

Well my guess would be GSL and all the companies they white box for (Nemo, Silent Legion, etc) would share.

But at the end of the day no XL pistons.

But as a note you could put the factory plastic guide rod back in the gen 3 and use it. If it will work with that setup. It will not hurt the suppressor and the gun will still function. Till you get a new barrel.

The plastic one will flex upward a little. I did this until I got an extended one.

Plus that suppressor will actually move forward on the piston if the rod does contact it just a little.

Grab suppressor and pull forward. It moves, thats why it has a piston. To allow it to move with a non fixed barrel.

As long as you can fully retract slide to the rear, plus lock it back. If it were mine I'd shoot a few rounds through it and see how it works. Worse thing that could happen is it wont cycle. But if you can pull the ALL THE WAY BACK. I bet it will fire just fine.

You can actually hold the slide with your hand and shoot the gun. It's not as violent as you think. The rod only moves up and forward some. It does not slam hard against anything.

The worst thing that could happen would be a fte or ftf. But like I stated. If you can cycle the slide all the way back and all it's doing is just touching. It'll fire and cycle. Plus suppressor moves on piston.

Oh yeah make sure the piston is lubed good.

What really sucks is I believe 1911s require an extended piston I believe I read that. Not sure though.

Shooting the pistol in a situation where the piston isn't seated is bad news. Worse yet would be to have the piston not fully seated and also have something pushing the suppressor off center (like the guide rod for instance)

If the piston isn't seated then the can may not be aligned perfectly with the core and you could get a baffle strike

So a ftf or fte isn't the worst that can happen, not by a long shot

"That dude" certainly could, though it would be more expensive than a $99 LWD barrel with the complexity of the Lunar piston.  I get $90 for custom length SiCo or AAC style

The suppressor DOES NOT WOBBLE ON THE PISTON. It is designed to move forward. If you can fully retract the slide rearward and the guide rod just touchs the suppressor nothing will happen.

Even if it does it will not knock the suppressor out of alignment, that's absolute nonsense. It would just slide forward on the piston.

Now on a fixed barrel weapons like the Walther PPK. Where the barrel is afixed to the frame and does not move.

Your not suppose to use a piston. Just a threaded end cap. I'd be concerned if there was a guide rod to contact the suppressor. But there's not and even if there were. It would not move because of the barrel being afixed.

Bullet strikes happen from threading the suppressor on wrong or bullets leaving the barrel in irregular fashion.

My G17 guide rod touchs my Griffin Resistance 9 suppressor. I've fired over 2k through it. Heck the guide rod on all my 9mm glocks touch the resistance.

The supressor does not wobble side ways on the piston nor can it be pushed side ways if installed properly.

Look at the picture the op POSTED the guide rod with slide fully retracted is just barely touching suppressor. It's not pushing the suppressor 1/2 way, not a 1/4 heck I doubt not even 1/64 it will not effect the FUNCTION.

I'm not being a smart ass but these things are not toys that easily break. They are built extremely tough. I've put my fair share through hell in my time in battalion and never broke one.

Not saying you can't, but I seriously doubt op will do what it takes to cause one to fail.

It looks to me like this under $20 1/2-28 threaded spacer would leave enough threads for engagement and provide enough clearance:

https://www.store.silencerco.com/products/1-2x28-rifle-thread-spacer?variant=221756564

It's not ideal but my Beretta only has about 0.330" tenon length.