User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 7:16:51 PM EDT
As the title says, I have been debating the NV gear lately until my head hurts.....I even made a spreadsheet of the different options........there's just no hope
 Budget is very tight......about 6K....... This setup would not be for hunting, although it would be fun to check out the wildlife at night. Our back fence butts up to a large field, and sometimes I can hear the coyotes howling.....this setup would be mostly for civil unrest/SHTF type stuff.....possibly home defense but I have an AR15 pistol with a TLR laser/light setup for that and pretty satisfied with it. My main weapon of choice for this would be my Daniel Defense DDM4®V7®P .300 Blackout pistol. I have a Sandman Dead Air silencer on it and run sub ammo. I also have an Aimpoint T2 on a Geissele 1.93 mount that I have never used but may sell it.... Options: PVS-14 Keep T2 Spot with Thermal handheld PVS-14 Sell T2 Thermal scope (AGM Rattler, BO Vibe, etc) Some type of IR laser Nice thermal Sell T2 Visible laser for daytime use Cheap NV monocular to spot (Bushnell Equinox Z2....) or NVG10 on helmet Thanks in advance for any advice.... |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 7:59:54 PM EDT
[#1]
First two are your best bets. You will likely regret buying a cheap digital NV.... If I've heard that story once I've heard it six hundred times!!!
We have PVS14s in stock with high specification 20UM L3 Harris unfilmed tubes or Elbit VH or YH high grade thin filmed WP tubes in stock ready to ship out same day they are ordered. You could definitely come in at budget with a thin filmed WP3 PVS14 and a Hogster Vibe (a few in stock currently also) or just above budget with a 2500 FOM unfilmed PVS14 and a Hogster Vibe. Feel free to call, email or PM if you need any assistance. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 8:32:46 PM EDT
[#2]
For your intended use, I think target ID is paramount. Good NV with an IR illuminator will give you the best no-light target ID capability.
$6000 can get you a decent PVS14, helmet with mount, and a weapon mounted IR laser/illuminator. Personally, I'd get that setup first then add thermal down the road. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 8:58:31 PM EDT
[#3]
you can do what you are intending to do with 6k, but you'll need to buy used, or go one route or the other with thermal or NV. I think you'll just sacrifice too much trying to cram in all of that gear at 6k if it has to be new. you dont want digital nv and you likely wont want any thermal under 256 res.
If I had 6k right now and wanted to do what you are intending, I would do the following: - Right now on the EE, you could grab that Super Yoter for 3k (it is 640 res) and a very capable unit. https://www.ar15.com/forums/Equipment-Exchange/Super-Yoter-super-reduced-price-35mm-thermal-scope-3000/172-2338573/ - There is also an AGM TS25-256 for $1150 (and it is so under budget you could build a dedicated upper for it). You could wait for an autogated PVS-14 to pop up 2k-2.5k, or grab one from JRH / TNVC, as well. Or you could even get that PVS-7 with the PERST Laser and Surefire Vampire for 2.2k on the EE and that solves your helmet, mount, illuminator, & IR laser issue, too. Granted... its a PVS-7, but its totally workable and gets you everything you need to get going. You could always dump it and buy a PVS-14 if/when stuff ever gets back to normal. https://www.ar15.com/forums/Equipment-Exchange/Gen-3-PVS-7-Perst-4-Gen-3-green/172-2317422/ I don't know any of the sellers or anything, but you could go this route and even spend some $ on a night fighter class. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 9:21:31 PM EDT
[#4]
Get a decent thermal - it's almost like cheating. That will take about 2/3 of your budget. Save more money and fill in from there.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 10:52:33 PM EDT
[#5]
If you have no other RDS you can throw on to replace your T2 and you need it to be a 24/7 the first option is the best IMHO. While a TWS is great it's more for a static rig trying to navigate by stumbling around in the dark or with a TWS alone is not advisable. Also in a civil unrest situation running a TWS is going to eat through you stash of batteries rater quickly. While passively aiming with a T2 is not as good as a dedicated LAM, it is do able. With the TLR VIR II depending on ambient lighting your IR illuminator may be limited to @ 50-60 yards, so if you're looking for more of a better offensive rig your 14, T2, and a Steiner D2 maybe a better alternative. Also as fund are acquired a handheld scanner like an AGM TM160 with a PID range @ 100-125 and decent detection can be found for @ 300-400.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 10:58:06 PM EDT
[#6]
That PVS-7/Perst/Surefire gear here on EE looks like a great deal........the lack of depth perception is concerning with PVS-7 though. If you were stationary it wouldn't be a problem....walking with it would really seem to be difficult.
The problem I have with any IIT or digital NV is someone being able to spot you with just a cellphone camera....or at least that's my understanding. That's one of the pros of thermal to me...... Thanks for all the suggestions......still learning a lot about all this. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 11:11:01 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted: If you're looking for more of a better offensive rig your 14, T2, and a Steiner D2 maybe a better alternative. Concur. Quoted: The problem I have with any IIT or digital NV is someone being able to spot you with just a cellphone camera....or at least that's my understanding. Not sure what you mean by this, but I think you are mistaken. Thermal is great for detection, but poor for navigation, movement, and target identification. Thermal also eats through batteries really quickly. It's a great supplement to NV but not a substitute for the intended use that you've described. ETA: Another option to save some money would be to replace your T2 mount with a taller Unity, add a Surefire Vampire light, and shoot passively under NV with the Aimpoint. It won't have the range of a good laser/illuminator and it will have more down range signature when the IR light is activated, but it's a lot cheaper. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 11:16:31 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Concur. Not sure what you mean by this, but I think you are mistaken. Thermal is great for detection, but poor for navigation, movement, and target identification. Thermal also eats through batteries really quickly. It's a great supplement to NV but not a substitute for the intended use that you've described. ETA: Another option to save some money would be to replace your T2 mount with a taller Unity, add a Surefire Vampire light, and shoot passively under NV with the Aimpoint. It won't have the range of a good laser/illuminator and it will have more down range signature when the IR light is activated, but it's a lot cheaper. Yeah, come to think of it...I am wrong....sort of. I guess the only thing that would give your position away would be using IR illumination or IR laser, right? Or is some IR invisible even to a cellphone? |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 11:21:25 PM EDT
[#9]
There's no PID with a thermal. Period. Unless it's the walking dead and you're the last human alive and you give no shits about anyone but yourself. Do zombies have heat signatures? :P
For realistic application of these tools, you are going to want to do the following: 1. You can use a thermal handheld scanner for heat signature detection. 2. You will want to use your NV to navigate and potentially close the distance in order to PID and then subsequently kill/scare off/talk to/whatever. Put the money into a good NV monocular. Keep the T2 for passive aiming. Spend some coin on a decent IR illuminator and laser, or at the very least a good illuminator. The rest of the sheckels can go towards a handheld thermal scanner. We all like to buy the "best" and when it comes to using weapon sights, a really nice 640 image is simply pleasant to look at. Is it necessary? Nah, not at all but if you can do it, why not? A 384 resolution handheld scanner will give you a shit ton of detection range and will do the job just fine. Talk to Robert. He will get you squared away with his no bullshit approach. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 11:31:42 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yeah, come to think of it...I am wrong....sort of. I guess the only thing that would give your position away would be using IR illumination or IR laser, right? Or is some IR invisible even to a cellphone? Most cameras have an IR filter, so they wouldn't be able to see the laser/illuminator. However, some of the front facing cameras on cell phones aren't filtered and may be able to see them. That said, I don't think people walking around in the darkness trying to scan with the front facing phone camera is a practical concern. Even if they did, they'd be a beacon to NV and painting themselves with so much light that you wouldn't need to hit them with an illuminator anyway. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 11:37:17 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Most cameras have an IR filter, so they wouldn't be able to see the laser/illuminator. However, some of the front facing cameras on cell phones aren't filtered and may be able to see them. That said, I don't think people walking around in the darkness trying to scan with the front facing phone camera is a practical concern. Even if they did, they'd be a beacon to NV and painting themselves with so much light that you wouldn't need to hit them with an illuminator anyway. Good point.......I'm just trying to find the best solution for staying as invisible as I can, given my purpose for this gear....... Thanks |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 11:47:42 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Good point.......I'm just trying to find the best solution for staying as invisible as I can, given my purpose for this gear....... Thanks For the sake of invisibility, laser-based illuminators have much less down range signature than LED-based illuminators like the Steiner D2 and lR light heads. Based on everything you've said in this thread, I'd buy the following for the primary purpose of engaging humans that pose a deadly threat in a SHTF situation: PVS14 $2500 Full power PEQ15 $2000 used Ops Core Carbon bump helmet $500 Wilcox G24 mount and dovetail J-arm $800 Total $5800 I'd spend the extra $200 on a good white light for the rifle if you don't already have one. You could also save some money with a Rhino mount instead of Wilcox. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/19/2023 11:57:48 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For the sake of invisibility, laser-based illuminators have much less down range signature than LED-based illuminators like the Steiner D2 and lR light heads. Based on everything you've said in this thread, I'd buy the following for the primary purpose of engaging humans that pose a deadly threat in a SHTF situation: PVS14 $2500 Full power PEQ15 $2000 used Ops Core Carbon bump helmet $500 Wilcox G24 mount and dovetail J-arm $800 Total $5800 I'd spend the extra $200 on a good white light for the rifle if you don't already have one. You could also save some money with a Rhino mount instead of Wilcox. Brother...where are you finding ops core carbon bumps for 500 bucks? Are you talking about the older, discontinued variation? |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/20/2023 12:05:11 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Brother...where are you finding ops core carbon bumps for 500 bucks? Are you talking about the older, discontinued variation? Yeah, Ops Core is liquidating the older Carbon for $450 on their website. I have both versions. The Carbon SF is great, but the older Carbon is a steal at half the price: https://shop.gentexcorp.com/ops-core-fast-carbon-high-cut-helmet/ |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/20/2023 8:52:33 AM EDT
[#15]
This a tough one. The best solution is fusion, which is out of the budget, so you have all these other options. Perhaps another to consider; get a decent -14, USGI J-arm, RhinoII, and used GI/bump helmet; use the T2 and 1.93 mount for passive, and active sighting, with both visual and IR light (SF Vampire). Add in a Holosun 117IR laser if desired. This set up gives you decent entry-level NV with bucks left over for a decent thermal scanner. This would give you a good start for static, defensive operations at closer ranges. The emphasis here is on thermal for target detection, with illum, either visual or IR, for positive target ID, using the RDS for aiming. And perhaps the IR laser as a back-up sight.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 3/20/2023 8:56:56 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There's no PID with a thermal. Period. Unless it's the walking dead and you're the last human alive and you give no shits about anyone but yourself. Do zombies have heat signatures? :P For realistic application of these tools, you are going to want to do the following: 1. You can use a thermal handheld scanner for heat signature detection. 2. You will want to use your NV to navigate and potentially close the distance in order to PID and then subsequently kill/scare off/talk to/whatever. Put the money into a good NV monocular. Keep the T2 for passive aiming. Spend some coin on a decent IR illuminator and laser, or at the very least a good illuminator. The rest of the sheckels can go towards a handheld thermal scanner. We all like to buy the "best" and when it comes to using weapon sights, a really nice 640 image is simply pleasant to look at. Is it necessary? Nah, not at all but if you can do it, why not? A 384 resolution handheld scanner will give you a shit ton of detection range and will do the job just fine. Talk to Robert. He will get you squared away with his no bullshit approach. The question of the ages, you would have to assume sunlight hitting on them would warm the skin a bit and therefore create some heat signature, at least enough to observe movement.  As far as IR illuminators goes, checkout the Luna ELIR3 for a great long distance lower cost illuminator. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/20/2023 6:02:58 PM EDT
[#17]
Are there any NV companies that give discounts to members of this website?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 3/20/2023 6:32:55 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are there any NV companies that give discounts to members of this website? Yes, just give us a call, we offer an Arfcom discount. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/23/2023 4:56:54 PM EDT
[#19]
I'm leaning toward a PVS-14, thermal mono spotter, Vis/IR laser, and use my T2.
Looking at some of the AGM mono spotters.....wondering if 384 is overkill, and 256 would be adequate since it is not for ID but for detection |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/23/2023 4:59:21 PM EDT
[#20]
i would buy a used 640 before i would even consider a new 256/384
|
|
|
|
Posted: 3/23/2023 8:49:19 PM EDT
[#21]
Personally, I'd do the following:
Nice thermal SCOPE Keep T2 on a QD mount Thermal for SHTF would be king. It's amazing how much my buddies miss with their dual NODS when we're out hiking. If there's a deer 5 feet off the trail bedded down they'll walk right past it, meanwhile it's lit up like a Christmas tree for me. If SHTF I'm worried about other people - and thermal is an incredible advantage. I like something with a wide FOV (NOX18) - at my close suburban distances that's all the resolution I need. Get it from JRH. I will say NV is better at pretty much everything else. Depends on your priorities. I have both. I'd never be without the thermal although I use it much less. The NOX uses USB battery packs and 18650 (rechargeable) batteries. You'll need them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/23/2023 9:43:03 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: i would buy a used 640 before i would even consider a new 256/384 That depends on the units. The FLIR PTS233 shows up wildlife alot better than the AGM Rattler 640. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/23/2023 10:28:42 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm leaning toward a PVS-14, thermal mono spotter, Vis/IR laser, and use my T2. Solid plan. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/24/2023 2:49:15 PM EDT
[#24]
A few more questions:
Is it possible to identify a person using thermal? I would think not since it's just a heat signature, but thought I would ask. Using a good PVS-14, what would be a rough estimate on range for identification (to tell one person from another)? I know this is a tricky question because there are lots of variables...what they are wearing may obstruct the view, some people are more recognizable than others...etc. Thanks |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/24/2023 3:14:53 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A few more questions: Is it possible to identify a person using thermal? I would think not since it's just a heat signature, but thought I would ask. Using a good PVS-14, what would be a rough estimate on range for identification (to tell one person from another)? I know this is a tricky question because there are lots of variables...what they are wearing may obstruct the view, some people are more recognizable than others...etc. Thanks You cannot tell who it is but with practice you can tell what it is. Clear difference between an old couple out for a stroll and a group of young men moving aggressively. You'll learn to read body language in humans and animals. For the who the best option on the cheap is a 3x magnifier for your 14 and an illuminator that will punch out a ways. Some magnifiers are better than others and there's a thread around somewhere about them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/24/2023 3:24:01 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Using a good PVS-14, what would be a rough estimate on range for identification (to tell one person from another)? I know this is a tricky question because there are lots of variables...what they are wearing may obstruct the view, some people are more recognizable than others...etc. Thanks Quote HistoryQuoted: Using a good PVS-14, what would be a rough estimate on range for identification (to tell one person from another)? I know this is a tricky question because there are lots of variables...what they are wearing may obstruct the view, some people are more recognizable than others...etc. Thanks There is no magic answer on this because it entirely depends on lighting and atmospheric conditions. there are a LOT of through tube videos on Youtube. I would suggest starting there to get an idea - because it may also help with tube type selection and thermal selection. A lot of through tube videos are a lot better in person, but you will get a rough idea. you will PID a human with thermal. You would likely want NV to determine which human you are actually looking at. Thermal may just show clothing as all the same color, where NV will still show darker or lighter clothing and designs/patterns in the fabric. This setup would not be for hunting, although it would be fun to check out the wildlife at night. Our back fence butts up to a large field, and sometimes I can hear the coyotes howling.....this setup would be mostly for civil unrest/SHTF type stuff. Honestly... for SHTF type stuff, I would suggest a decent PVS-14 & some type of quality night fighter course, and go from there. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/25/2023 6:03:34 PM EDT
[#27]
What about the Sionyx Opsin compared to the PVS-14 Gen 3? From what I gather, the Opsin runs pretty well with no IR illumination which would reduce your downrange signature.
Anybody running both that can chime in? |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/25/2023 6:34:42 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What about the Sionyx Opsin compared to the PVS-14 Gen 3? From what I gather, the Opsin runs pretty well with no IR illumination which would reduce your downrange signature. Anybody running both that can chime in? All of the TNVC guys were literally laughing at its performance compared to analogue Gen 3 during vSHOTT this week. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/26/2023 12:10:56 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What about the Sionyx Opsin compared to the PVS-14 Gen 3? From what I gather, the Opsin runs pretty well with no IR illumination which would reduce your downrange signature. Anybody running both that can chime in? This member owns both technologies: SiOnyx OPSIN Review |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/30/2023 4:19:04 PM EDT
[#30]
Anyone with a Steiner S35 that would give their opinion?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 3/30/2023 4:56:45 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All of the TNVC guys were literally laughing at its performance compared to analogue Gen 3 during vSHOTT this week. To be fair, we were mainly laughing at the IVAS program. Check out this Open Source info: https://taskandpurpose.com/news/army-ivas-goggles-headaches-nausea-neck-pain/ |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/30/2023 5:36:43 PM EDT
[#32]
Yea, the OPSIN is 301g, I'm seeing the 14 listed as ~350g. Thanks for clearing that up.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 3/30/2023 6:29:41 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For your intended use, I think target ID is paramount. Good NV with an IR illuminator will give you the best no-light target ID capability. $6000 can get you a decent PVS14, helmet with mount, and a weapon mounted IR laser/illuminator. Personally, I'd get that setup first then add thermal down the road. I’m going to “second” this opinion. Having done an all night competition shoot under NODs out to about 300 yards, having some sort of illumination for target ID is pretty crucial. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/30/2023 6:43:19 PM EDT
[#34]
I should plug vSHOTT
 vSHOTT Night 3 if you watch it on our YouTube channel, you will see video chapters. Buck & Augee discuss IVAS/digital in the "Will Gen 4 Tubes Ever be a Thing" chapter. Everybody is in agreement that digital is indeed the future but there is plenty of documented info that demonstrates that it is a loooong ways out in terms of being a serviceable head borne system and/or replacing analog systems for MIL customers. Here is some more info if anyone cares to read about it some more: https://taskandpurpose.com/news/army-ivas-dote-2022-testing-assesssment/ https://breakingdefense.com/2023/01/moving-on-army-and-microsoft-agree-on-path-ahead-for-ivas-with-latest-1-2-variant/ Of course, IVAS is not the same as the commercial products available for the recreational user, but it is still 100% relevant information. |
|
|
|
Posted: 3/31/2023 8:53:45 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Anyone with a Steiner S35 that would give their opinion? I enjoy mine, but that's keeping in mind the screaming deal I got last BF on it when they were getting blown out. Not sure what the price tag is now, but I have the S35 on a suppressed 12.5" 6.5G and find it fairly intuitive to navigate the menu. Zeroing was a PITA, but that could have just been based on this being the first dedicated thermal scope I've zeroed straight from the box. It's heavy...no getting around that. ETA: I use mine as a dedicated scope (just to be clear) and use RNVGs with a COTI for navigation/detection. I'm not a hunter but would like to get into hog hunting in a year or two. I'm planning to get a lighter weight handheld scanner at some time. |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/6/2023 12:44:36 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All of the TNVC guys were literally laughing at its performance compared to analogue Gen 3 during vSHOTT this week. FWIW, if I recall we were laughing about the disconnect between the claims of its performance, and in particular, the Army program office's mental and linguistic gymnastics required to call a program a "success" when it made everyone who tested it sick and worse at their jobs. The OPSIN and / or IVAS are impressive for what they are, but they're not, in the opinion of most, including the DoD, a "mature" technology ready for combat use, which I would remind is the background / context of most of the folks involved in that particular discussion. ~Augee |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/6/2023 11:16:51 PM EDT
[#37]
Still haven't pulled the trigger on anything.....but I DO have a reduction in funds, thanks to stupidity on my part.........got scammed
Live and learn |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/6/2023 11:50:50 PM EDT
[#38]
Post the details. Will be instructional for people in a similar situation. As far as the rest get a good pvs14 and bump helmet from a trusted vendor. Get a tlr-vir2 for round 300$ and mount it at 12oclock. Keep your t2 and get a riser or unity mount. Go learn to move and shoot. You're now better off than 99.9% of the population.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 12:27:40 AM EDT
[#39]
IMO SHTF is kind of a poor reason to spend 6k+ for something. that's a lot of money sitting in the safe. will likely be sold for some loss in a year or two if you dont actually use it. having shooting buddy with nods as well that you can go out at night with and shoot and train with would make it a lot better. I have a 14 with a raised eotech, perst laser arisaka IR250 illuminator and cheap and midrange hand held thermal. I would much prefer a multi use thermal with rifle mount capability. any thermal is a handheld if you're brave enough. but no hand held can be rifle mounted. but like everything its useless if you dont train with it.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 12:40:17 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: IMO SHTF is kind of a poor reason to spend 6k+ for something. that's a lot of money sitting in the safe. will likely be sold for some loss in a year or two if you dont actually use it. having shooting buddy with nods as well that you can go out at night with and shoot and train with would make it a lot better. I have a 14 with a raised eotech, perst laser arisaka IR250 illuminator and cheap and midrange hand held thermal. I would much prefer a multi use thermal with rifle mount capability. any thermal is a handheld if you're brave enough. but no hand held can be rifle mounted. but like everything its useless if you dont train with it. Well, it ain't 6K now....see a couple of posts above 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 12:45:49 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Post the details. Will be instructional for people in a similar situation. Well, it's a really dumb one on my part......bought a PVS-14 from texasguntrader.com, it's a selling site only so there is no feedback scores.....guy had been a member since 2019. Paid with Venmo but there is a checkbox for "buyer protection"......don't know if it does any good though.......anyway, we had been talking thru text messages......after I sent the money he went crickets.....I called a couple of times and left messages but now he's blocked my number. I feel pretty stupid.....been lucky all these years I guess. |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 6:49:57 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, it's a really dumb one on my part......bought a PVS-14 from texasguntrader.com, it's a selling site only so there is no feedback scores.....guy had been a member since 2019. Paid with Venmo but there is a checkbox for "buyer protection"......don't know if it does any good though.......anyway, we had been talking thru text messages......after I sent the money he went crickets.....I called a couple of times and left messages but now he's blocked my number. I feel pretty stupid.....been lucky all these years I guess. That sucks. Used NV equipment seems to attract a particularly shady set of characters an unfortunately it's unlikely law enforcement will do anything about it. That's the danger of trying to make your $ go further vs playing it safe. There's people here with a lot of gear and the discussions sometimes get off in the weeds but at the end of the day it's the Indian and not the arrow. I would shelve the thermal idea and get your NV in place. A 14 and basic ir tools is the must have along with a lot of training so I would focus on that. If you don't have prior .mil experience it will take awhile to get skilled in its use and this will give you time to save funds and also get an idea of what would add the most to your capabilities down the road. |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 9:56:02 AM EDT
[#43]
@liveround
That's terrible news. If you consider spending the $ on a new device, shoot me a PM and I'll take care of you. |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 1:28:01 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, it ain't 6K now....see a couple of posts above What is your budget? |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 3:55:59 PM EDT
[#45]
My NV is pretty much unused since I moved to thermal.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 6:02:34 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What is your budget? About 4K now |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 6:51:43 PM EDT
[#47]
I would reach out to Venmo, or your bank, along with filing a police report.
Print off screen shots of any correspondence. I would assume $2000 scam (obtaining money by false pretense) or however it is worded in Texas is a felony. Otherwise he's going to end up scamming some other people. If you do purchase NVGs, I would definitely consider going through TNVC, USNVG, Steeles etc. Most of the reputable places include a warranty on your device. Yes you're paying more upfront, but a spec sheet and a warranty may be worth it. Good luck. |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 8:00:00 PM EDT
[#48]
Yikes. That sucks. The feedback on this site is outstanding and while there are issues now and then, most people hold true to the feedback.
You need to file reports with your local police and venmo to get your $ back or at least have him blocked from the site so he cant screw anyone else over. Most people at a site for 4 years won't pull that kind of crap... its a heck of a time investment (4 years) on a scam for only 2k. :( You have a cell #, and the venmo info. At the very least I'd be filing whatever I can and seeing if he is on any of the Facebook NV groups pulling the same crap. |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 8:06:56 PM EDT
[#49]
The total price that I lost was $2325. I did file with Venmo, disputed charge with my credit card (from Venmo account), filed a claim with the FTC, put an ad on the original website telling people to stay away from him. Left him some choice text messages. Called him at ungodly hours.
Have not filed with local police yet........... |
|
|
|
Posted: 4/7/2023 9:07:16 PM EDT
[#50]
I would file a report with the local PD and provide as much info as possible. I'd then forward copies of the report to your CC company, Venmo, and the website.
It isn't still an active listing, is it? This is horrible. 2.3k is a major chunk of change. I am not familiar with that website, so who knows what level of personal details they collect. Sorry for the loss and hopefully you are able to recoup it. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
