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Posted: 4/22/2018 2:44:32 AM EDT
Okay guys I've decided I want to go the trust route, but am unsure where to get my trust. I'm going to go with one of the online options, not a local attorney. I've been looking at some of the sites that offer NFA trusts and for the most part they don't give a ton of info on what makes their trust different and how it compares with the others.

Before I just blindly pick a trust and end up stuck with whatever I get, I thought I'd ask here for your experiences. Any insight to these companies and how their trust differ that you can offer would be greatly appreciated.

Gun Trust Guru - $100 on sale - https://www.guntrustguru.com/

NFA Lawyers LLC - $99 - https://nfalawyers.com/

199Trust - $79 - https://199trust.com/

Any other companies I should consider?

Gun Trust Guru does provide a nice FAQ section so I at least have an idea of what their trust is, and they also have a comparison of how their trust stacks up against the SilenceroCo and Silencer Shop trusts. Assuming all of that info is true, the differences from those two sound significant. Additionally, Gun Trust Guru doesn't include a Schedule A, and from what I can tell the trusts from all of the others include the Schedule A. Any thoughts on this? I do like the idea of not including a list of everything I own every time I buy something new.

Thanks for your help!
Link Posted: 4/22/2018 1:33:46 PM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
....... they also have a comparison of how their trust stacks up against the SilenceroCo and Silencer Shop trusts. Assuming all of that info is true, the differences from those two sound significant....
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Their "comparison" is chock full of inaccuracies and faulty assumptions:

Designed Specifically for Firearms
Our gun trust was designed from the ground up by an experienced gun trust attorney to address issues relating to the use, possession, and transfer of firearms.
View Quote
So are the ones from SiCo and Silencer Shop.

Their form is a generic living revocable trust form that never includes the words "firearm," "gun," "weapon," "National Firearms Act," "NFA," "Gun Control Act," "GCA," or any other words that would remotely indicate that their form is a gun trust.
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Which means jack squat. A "gun trust" doesn't need to have those words in it.

Holds Any Type of Firearm
Our gun trust is designed to hold NFA firearms and non-NFA firearms. We even provide you with the legal document that you can use to assign any non-NFA firearms that you would like to include in your gun trust. This is very useful if you would like to convert one of your pistols or long rifles to a short-barreled rifle.
Their instructions state that their "form" should not be used for non-NFA firearms.
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There is no benefit to having non NFA firearms in a gun trust. Title I firearms don't need a Form 4 to possess.

No Schedule or Inventory of Firearms Provided to Outside Third Parties
Our gun trust is specifically designed to protect your privacy relating to your ownership of firearms. When a third party, such as a gun shop employee or the ATF sees our gun trust, the only property that they can determine is included in our gun trust is $1.00.
Their form includes a Schedule A and an Inventory of Trust Assets for listing all firearms in the trust and for disclosing a detailed list of the firearms to all third parties who see a copy of the trust.
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<----Silencer Shop Powered By Dealer who has done around 600 Silencer Shop transfers to trusts and has never seen ANYONES trust document. The trust doesn't get sent to the dealer doing the transfer. Silencer Shop submits it for the buyer/transferee with the Form 4 directly to ATF. In addition I've transferred another 3-400 non NFA firearms from vendors other than Silencer Shop.......and I've never seen any of those trust documents either. The buyer/transferee submits that himself.

Appoint Co-Trustees Anytime Without Amending Your Gun Trust
Our gun trust is designed so that you are the only person who needs to sign the gun trust in front of a notary to establish your gun trust, which means that you can buy your NFA firearm from your Class 3 dealer immediately. After your gun trust is created, you can use another legal document that we provide to you to appoint additional co-trustees anytime (so that they can use and possess your NFA firearms) without needing to amend your gun trust or paying an attorney to amend your gun trust. Further, you can appoint additional co-trustees either as long-term trustees or as short-term trustees (such as while you and a friend are on a hunting trip).

Their form requires you and all of your other co-trustees to sign the form in front of a notary before your trust is created. After your trust is created, you must amend your trust each time that you want to appoint an additional co-trustee.
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Hogwash. Silencer Shop's Single Shot Trust does not require a notary.

At $24.95 the Silencer Shop Single Shot Trust is a bargain and the Single Shot Unlimited beats that.
Link Posted: 4/23/2018 2:08:47 AM EDT
[#2]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Their "comparison" is chock full of inaccuracies and faulty assumptions:

So are the ones from SiCo and Silencer Shop.

Which means jack squat. A "gun trust" doesn't need to have those words in it.

There is no benefit to having non NFA firearms in a gun trust. Title I firearms don't need a Form 4 to possess.

<----Silencer Shop Powered By Dealer who has done around 600 Silencer Shop transfers to trusts and has never seen ANYONES trust document. The trust doesn't get sent to the dealer doing the transfer. Silencer Shop submits it for the buyer/transferee with the Form 4 directly to ATF. In addition I've transferred another 3-400 non NFA firearms from vendors other than Silencer Shop.......and I've never seen any of those trust documents either. The buyer/transferee submits that himself.

Hogwash. Silencer Shop's Single Shot Trust does not require a notary.

At $24.95 the Silencer Shop Single Shot Trust is a bargain and the Single Shot Unlimited beats that.
View Quote
Okay. That being said, I believe my original question still stands. I'm not interested in Silencer Shop's Single Shot trust, and their regular trust costs more than any of the options I originally inquired about. Does Silencer Shop's "normal" trust offer anything that these others don't?
Link Posted: 4/23/2018 5:46:20 PM EDT
[#3]
I purchased the Gun Guru Trust and immediately started assigning non-NFA lowers into my trust, of course each item gets it's on assignment sheet for notary. I've submitted two form 1's (paper applications) and one form 4 through Silencershop.com all using my trust.  Anytime I had a question they are quick to email me back within 10-20 minutes each time. So far everything I have read on their FAQ and reviews online appears this trust seems G2G.
Link Posted: 4/23/2018 10:04:00 PM EDT
[#4]
It would help if you were more specific about what you want the trust to do.  Everyone's situation is different.
Link Posted: 4/23/2018 11:18:29 PM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
It would help if you were more specific about what you want the trust to do.  Everyone's situation is different.
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Nothing special I guess. I'm just a regular single guy who wants to buy a few suppressors and SBRs and share them with my dad and brother.
Link Posted: 4/24/2018 11:36:25 AM EDT
[#6]
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Quoted:
Nothing special I guess. I'm just a regular single guy who wants to buy a few suppressors and SBRs and share them with my dad and brother.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
It would help if you were more specific about what you want the trust to do.  Everyone's situation is different.
Nothing special I guess. I'm just a regular single guy who wants to buy a few suppressors and SBRs and share them with my dad and brother.
I know you aren't interested,  but IMO the single shot trust is the way to go.

As I understand it you will either have to remove them from a trust the entire time you are waiting for EACH  transfer, or they will have to submit to the checks. Having to remove their ability to posess the NFA items for a year at a time kind of defeats the purpose doesn't it?

Single shot you do the bullshit and add them to it later. I had been wanting for a single shot trust since 41f and finally found theirs. I bought a lifetime supply.  You can form 1, transfer MGs... the only down side is you have to use an affiliated dealer.
Link Posted: 4/24/2018 4:13:11 PM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
......Does Silencer Shop's "normal" trust offer anything that these others don't?
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Who knows? Unless you have one of each to compare NO ONE really knows. And I doubt you'll find anyone who has used all of those you mention above.
And why would they? As long as the trust is valid for the state where you reside at the time you submit your Form 4 it really doesn't matter.

I wouldn't trust anyone selling their trust "as better" when comparing their trust vs everyone else. Unbiased they are not. That "comparison" I commented on above? No way in hell will I ever refer a customer to him. If his comparison is that faulty, what other mistakes does he make?
Link Posted: 4/24/2018 4:15:35 PM EDT
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

I know you aren't interested,  but IMO the single shot trust is the way to go.

As I understand it you will either have to remove them from a trust the entire time you are waiting for EACH  transfer, or they will have to submit to the checks. Having to remove their ability to posess the NFA items for a year at a time kind of defeats the purpose doesn't it?

Single shot you do the bullshit and add them to it later. I had been wanting for a single shot trust since 41f and finally found theirs. I bought a lifetime supply.  You can form 1, transfer MGs... the only down side is you have to use an affiliated dealer.
View Quote
This. +1000
The flexibility that the Single Shot gives you is worth every penny.
Nearly 75% of my buyers using a trust now go with the Single Shot. Even those with existing "traditional" gun trusts.
Link Posted: 4/26/2018 7:12:36 PM EDT
[#9]
Link Posted: 4/26/2018 8:58:10 PM EDT
[#10]
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Quoted:

<----Silencer Shop Powered By Dealer
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Really? We couldn’t tell that you may be a little biased.....

To the OP,

Any of the traditional style trusts that have worked for many other people, will work for you.

Before deciding to go with one, ask your future trustees how they feel about getting printed every time you want to submit something.  You’re not going to want to hassle with removing them, them not having access, then adding them back. If they don’t want to get printed every time you want to submit, I would recommend that you reconsider a separate trust for each item.
Link Posted: 4/26/2018 9:43:47 PM EDT
[#11]
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Quoted:
Really? We couldn’t tell that you may be a little biased.....
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:

<----Silencer Shop Powered By Dealer
Really? We couldn’t tell that you may be a little biased.....
"Really" I don't give a shit what trust one of my transferees uses. It doesn't affect me or the transfer one bit and I don't make a nickel from SS when someone buys a trust from them.
What I DO LIKE is the concept of a separate trust for each NFA firearm. And when someone else offers a trust for $24.95 get back to us.
Link Posted: 5/1/2018 8:46:24 AM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:
Okay guys I've decided I want to go the trust route,

Any other companies I should consider?

Thanks for your help!
View Quote
Have you considered https://nwgunlawgroup.com/

I see you are in Washington and my local gun shop provided a pamphlet on them.  But $750 for their Silver edition looks expensive.

I am also considering GunTrustGuru.  Looks like it is pretty much written by Jim Willi in Texas.

Have you made a decision yet?
Link Posted: 5/2/2018 2:04:08 AM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Have you considered https://nwgunlawgroup.com/

I see you are in Washington and my local gun shop provided a pamphlet on them.  But $750 for their Silver edition looks expensive.

I am also considering GunTrustGuru.  Looks like it is pretty much written by Jim Willi in Texas.

Have you made a decision yet?
View Quote
Yes I checked them out. They are spendy at $750. Other than having someone local to call I don't see what that $750 gets me that the $100 trusts don't?

Right now I'm leaning towards Gun Trust Guru.
Link Posted: 5/2/2018 6:34:28 AM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Right now I'm leaning towards Gun Trust Guru.
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I went with them. Good value for the money spent.
Link Posted: 5/2/2018 7:53:45 AM EDT
[#15]
My original purchases are under a trust that was setup with a local lawyer that deals with gun trusts. My two recent purchases I went with the silencer shop single shot unlimited. The reason I went with that was I could use the Silencer Shop kiosk for prints and take a passport photo from my phone and take away from the hassle. My dealer is willing to put anything I order in the Silencer Shop inventory at no extra cost to submit forms this way, so it works out for me. Now i can roll my own prints and have a passport photo taken as well as visit my dealer for the paperwork but that takes a lot of time for me to run around and go do all of that.
Link Posted: 5/2/2018 11:03:09 AM EDT
[#16]
I am also going to give the Silencer Shop Single shot a go.  My LGS has a kiosk.  I'll be in soon to check it out.
Link Posted: 5/3/2018 1:25:13 AM EDT
[#17]
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Quoted:
My original purchases are under a trust that was setup with a local lawyer that deals with gun trusts. My two recent purchases I went with the silencer shop single shot unlimited. The reason I went with that was I could use the Silencer Shop kiosk for prints and take a passport photo from my phone and take away from the hassle. My dealer is willing to put anything I order in the Silencer Shop inventory at no extra cost to submit forms this way, so it works out for me. Now i can roll my own prints and have a passport photo taken as well as visit my dealer for the paperwork but that takes a lot of time for me to run around and go do all of that.
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As I understand it I can do all of that at the kiosk whether my trust is from Silencer Shop or not.
Link Posted: 5/3/2018 11:06:19 PM EDT
[#18]
You can just need everyone's prints on file and passport photo.
Link Posted: 5/29/2018 11:24:56 PM EDT
[#19]
I used http://www.wildcattrust.com. Worked great for what I needed
Link Posted: 5/30/2018 9:10:06 AM EDT
[#20]
Any trust can become a "single shot" trust.  Just create a new trust with a new name for each item you purchase.  Take your existing trust, rename it, get it notarized. Bang, new trust for each item.
Link Posted: 5/30/2018 7:10:51 PM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Any trust can become a "single shot" trust.  Just create a new trust with a new name for each item you purchase.  Take your existing trust, rename it, get it notarized. Bang, new trust for each item.
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Seriously is this true because most have a trust that requires notarizing and single shot trusts don't require a notary ?
Link Posted: 5/30/2018 8:13:50 PM EDT
[#22]
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Quoted:

Seriously is this true because most have a trust that requires notarizing and single shot trusts don't require a notary ?
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Some states require notarizing, others don't.
Link Posted: 6/1/2018 8:48:46 AM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Seriously is this true because most have a trust that requires notarizing and single shot trusts don't require a notary ?
View Quote
The SS Single Shot Trust not requiring a notary is a potential liability.  As pointed out, some states require a trust to be notarized to be legally recognized.  Unless you've talked with an experienced trust lawyer in your state, and they confirm that you don't need one, having a notary officiate the singing of the document is a good idea, and is not usually too much of a hardship.

I ended up going with Gun Trust Guru.  I liked the way the function/maintenance of the trust was structured compared to copies of the Silencerco and SS trusts that buddies had, and was able to have a phone conversation with the lawyer who wrote it and owns the site when I was shopping.  I bought their trust and then jail-broke the text for my own use (only).  I make up a new one for each serial, and use it like a Single Shot.  It takes two trips to the notary - one to activate the trust, and one to add co-trustees once the stamp comes back.  It's bookended at that point, no need to remove and re-add trustees, or send in paperwork for all the family members on the trust.
Link Posted: 6/1/2018 9:24:39 AM EDT
[#24]
I used 199Trust, for a single Trust. Very quick and easy. I had questions, several times, and they responded to emails quickly and professionally. No issues w/ ATF/NFA when filing.

Some friends wanted to go the trust route so I simply copied the format and they inserted appropriate, specific, information.
Link Posted: 6/1/2018 2:32:40 PM EDT
[#25]
I went with the silencer shop trust
got it emailed over this morning actually.
I just need to get it notarized and emailed back to them.
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