Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
BCM
User Panel

Site Notices
Posted: 6/13/2021 1:09:50 AM EDT
If I were to form 1 my AR pistol as an SBR, once completed, am I legally allowed to change or add accessories, such as different sight(s), vertical grips, stocks, binary trigger, etc, or is the firearm "fixed" in the configuration it was registered?
Link Posted: 6/13/2021 1:31:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/13/2021 1:33:02 AM EDT by Marquar]
Not fixed at all regarding parts like triggers, accessories like scopes, or even barrells or the upper. I believe you are supposed to be able to restore it to the length and caliber in the registration or notify the ATF of the new length and/or caliper.
Link Posted: 6/13/2021 1:32:57 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Marquar:
Not fixed at all regarding parts like triggers, accessories like scopes, or even barrells or the upper. I believe you are supposed to be able to restore it to the length and caliber in the registration or notify the NRA of the new length and/or caliper.
View Quote

Put the bottle down and go to bed.
Link Posted: 6/13/2021 1:54:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/13/2021 1:56:56 AM EDT by EDL]
I'm aware you can amend the form 1 to add calibers so you can swap uppers, I was just curious if any other changes, like those mentioned, would also require some form of gubmint permission first.

I haven't decided for sure yet, but thinking since I just ordered a suppressor for it (form 3 was approved so it's on its way from the place I ordered it to my FFL/SOT in my state), won't do form 4/prints, etc until it arrives....but I figure if I am going to "be on uncle sam's register" for that, might as well go all the way, form 1 it as an SBR and not worry about the whole dang pistol brace BS, especially if I'm free to ad, remove, change accessories at will.

I have no plans to move from this state (or this house) ever, so not concerned about the crossing state lines stuff either.
Link Posted: 6/13/2021 3:11:17 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By EDL:
I'm aware you can amend the form 1 to add calibers so you can swap uppers, I was just curious if any other changes, like those mentioned, would also require some form of gubmint permission first.

I haven't decided for sure yet, but thinking since I just ordered a suppressor for it (form 3 was approved so it's on its way from the place I ordered it to my FFL/SOT in my state), won't do form 4/prints, etc until it arrives....but I figure if I am going to "be on uncle sam's register" for that, might as well go all the way, form 1 it as an SBR and not worry about the whole dang pistol brace BS, especially if I'm free to ad, remove, change accessories at will.

I have no plans to move from this state (or this house) ever, so not concerned about the crossing state lines stuff either.
View Quote
Caliber- put multi
yes, once an sbr, you are free to have fun with accessories and stocks.
Link Posted: 6/13/2021 7:19:53 AM EDT
Do you ask permission to add accessories to your non-SBR rifles?

Same logic applies here
Link Posted: 6/13/2021 7:33:59 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Dyzastr:
Caliber- put multi
yes, once an sbr, you are free to have fun with accessories and stocks.
View Quote


Is the ATF now allowing “multi” for Form 1’s.?  They used to reject those a few years back.
Link Posted: 6/13/2021 8:16:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/13/2021 2:10:01 PM EDT by schornstinefager]
After a few examiners typed in all the calibers they figured out multi was easier . Also manufacturers  lowers were marked with it  they once made me send a pic to prove it so who knows what they wnt this week
Link Posted: 6/13/2021 10:49:16 AM EDT
I hadn’t heard that you can put multi anymore either.  Can someone verify that it’s back?
Link Posted: 6/13/2021 2:23:56 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By NotIssued:
Do you ask permission to add accessories to your non-SBR rifles?

Same logic applies here
View Quote


No, and common sense would tell you the same applies to SBR's...but an SBR is an NFA item and we're talking the ATF here.  I don't take anything for granted with those yahoos.
Link Posted: 6/14/2021 1:54:47 AM EDT
You are supposed to make (build) the SBR in the configuration you submit.

After that you can modify the SBR as you want (short of drilling any 3rd holes, state laws, or replacing the part that you marked, if you DIDNT mark the receiver).  They "request" you update them if you make a permanent configuration change (caliber, barrel length, OAL) but it is not "required".
Link Posted: 6/14/2021 10:50:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/14/2021 10:51:19 AM EDT by KalmanPhilter]
SBR are unique among NFA items in that they are only an NFA item when configured as a SBR.  Even when you “remove“ an SBR from the NFA, the registry entry remains with a note.  

You need to be truthful on the tax form, but once approved you have leeway to modify your property.  You don’t need to amend anything to swap uppers.  With a modular design such as an AR-15 length and caliber changes aren’t permanent, so notification isn’t even useful in most cases.

The most probable time the configuration description can cause an issue is on a subsequent transfer shoukd the new form not match what is in the registry. This just delays approval and requires either a new Form matching the registry, or a letter prior to sale, updating the registry.  People don’t sell SBRs often, but if you ever do it’s easiest to just return to registered configuration.
Link Posted: 6/14/2021 12:45:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/14/2021 12:57:55 PM EDT by KitBuilder]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By willi3d:
I hadn't heard that you can put multi anymore either.  Can someone verify that it's back?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By willi3d:
I hadn't heard that you can put multi anymore either.  Can someone verify that it's back?
You're correct. It's been disallowed for many years. Nothing has changed.

Do not list multi.

List the actual caliber it will be. You may only list one.

Once it's made, you can change the caliber and lengths whenever you like.

Originally Posted By KalmanPhilter:
SBR are unique among NFA items in that they are only an NFA item when configured as a SBR.  Even when you "remove" an SBR from the NFA, the registry entry remains with a note.
Yep, same as SBS, and AOWs made from handguns.

You need to be truthful on the tax form, but once approved you have leeway to modify your property.  You don't need to amend anything to swap uppers.  With a modular design such as an AR-15 length and caliber changes aren't permanent, so notification isn't even useful in most cases.

The most probable time the configuration description can cause an issue is on a subsequent transfer shoukd the new form not match what is in the registry. This just delays approval and requires either a new Form matching the registry, or a letter prior to sale, updating the registry.  People don't sell SBRs often, but if you ever do it's easiest to just return to registered configuration.
This.

It only matters when/if you transfer it.

Either keep enough parts to match the configuration listed on the last form ATF approved (and return it to that matching config prior to the transfer), or send ATF a note updating the present configuration in the registry prior to initiating a transfer, listing the new/current data.

(That's what @Marquar was saying, so stop making fun of him guys. )

If you're keeping it forever then you won't have to do anything.
Link Posted: 6/15/2021 9:09:54 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By KitBuilder:
Yep, same as SBS, and AOWs made from handguns.
View Quote

Or large-bore destructive devices.
Link Posted: 6/17/2021 1:48:25 PM EDT
I just started the process to make a title 1 AR pistol into a title 2 sbr, getting my trust notarized today.
Once approved then I can put a stock, vertical grip and magnified rifle scope on it and swap around accessories as I choose.
I can also strip it all off back to a pistol non-sbr configuration and treat it as a title 1 pistol again.

Went pistol to sbr route so I can switch back and forth between a suppressed 300 blackout pistol and a 6.5 grendel sbr hunting rifle.
Link Posted: 8/3/2021 3:10:50 PM EDT
Can you efile a form 1 as an individual?
Link Posted: 8/3/2021 3:25:54 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By manowar669:
Can you efile a form 1 as an individual?
View Quote


Yep. Pretty easy.
Link Posted: 9/27/2021 11:42:19 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By sawgunner73:


Yep. Pretty easy.
View Quote


Yep and in 22 days. Ask me how I know. I just sent another one off, lets see if its faster.
Link Posted: 9/27/2021 12:06:44 PM EDT
I change my SBR's all the time and I don't notify the ATF.  No requirement to do so....
Link Posted: 9/28/2021 1:22:39 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By KalmanPhilter:
SBR are unique among NFA items in that they are only an NFA item when configured as a SBR.  Even when you “remove“ an SBR from the NFA, the registry entry remains with a note.  
View Quote


SBRs are not unique.  All NFA items are categorized based on configuration, except for machine guns.  Machine guns are unique in that they are always machine guns, regardless of configuration.
Link Posted: 9/28/2021 2:30:35 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By eodinert:


SBRs are not unique.  All NFA items are categorized based on configuration, except for machine guns.  Machine guns are unique in that they are always machine guns, regardless of configuration.
View Quote

Silencers are always silencers.  But you're correct in that SBRs, SBSes, AOWs and DDs can be modified to where they're still functional title I firearms but no longer title II.
An error occurred on the server when processing the URL. Please contact the system administrator.

If you are the system administrator please click here to find out more about this error.