Myself, @Limited04 and a few other guys got to shoot under NODs last night. I’ve only had the chance to shoot with NODs one other time and it was only a couple of rounds. Last night it was a group of us and I got to run some drills and really settle in with the gear.

There were six of us shooting total. Gear ranged from PVS-7s all the way to PVS-31s paired with a full-power MAWL.



I was running an American Blast Systems IIIa helmet, surplus’s Rhino II mount and a JRH Enterprises Photonis Echo PVS-14 paired with a Streamlight TLR-VIR II mounted at 12 o’clock. I have about $3400 in the entire setup. It is certainly on the lowest end of the NV spectrum.





I’ve had the PVS-14 for about 4 months. I’ve had it out for walks down the beach, bike rides and hikes through the woods several times a week since I got it. I’ve gotten very used to it for navigation. Shooting with it has been rare. Too rare. That changed for the better last night.

The night started with just starlight but it was mostly clear. There was enough ambient light to easily see a few hundred yards down the creek that runs next to the range, the image was just slightly grainy. Supplemental IR for target ID was not needed but it was certainly helpful.



I was able to turn my red dot down to a NV setting and, using it to passively aim, I was able to co-witness and zero the IR laser on the TLR very quickly. A quick check on paper to start the night showed it was perfectly zeroed.

I do wish there was a way to separate the IR light from the IR laser on the TLR, but generally when you need a laser, you probably need a light to be sure of you target anyway. For a $300 light, it was very impressive. I had no problem lighting up the targets (black-painted steel) at 50 yards and the laser seemed to keep up with the full power units, especially at the shorter ranges.

I stepped down to the creek and fired the laser at the farthest bend about 400 yards away. The laser was really bright at that range and easy to see.

About an hour into the night a 90%+ moon rose and the night really turned into day. We ran drills and weapon manipulations for several hours. It turns out that speed mag change that I thought I was good at slowed down a bit and got a little fumbly when the weapon blurred due to the focus being set for further out. The only other problem I had was the grin plastered to my face the whole night.

I got to try out the PVS-7s as well as the WP thin-film PVS-31s.  Surprisingly, the -7s were better than I expected.


The -31s didn’t really wow me like I was expecting. I’m sure the high amount of moon illumination really helped equal out the units, and they were really impressive, but I didn’t feel like I was at a huge disadvantage with my Echo -14s. I did really like the binocular vision. I’ve ridden bikes and rode 4-wheelers with my -14s and it can be done, but I can see where the dual tubes would be really beneficial.

Overall I am extremely happy with my lower-tier setup. The PVS-14 performs much better than I expected and the TLR-VIR works extremely well, especially at the closer ranges we were shooting.

More pics:

Badass!
Is the VIR2 mounted solid on the rail or does it have any play? Any issues with muzzle flash and autogate?

ETA
And after reading the rest of your OP, i thought of a quote i heard a while back. Something like

"A user trained more so behind a -14 is more proficient than one trained less behind duals/quads"

Keep it up and great to hear

VIR2 is solid. I did torque it with a nickel. No issues with the autogate. I didn’t even see my muzzle flashes. The smoke from the burned powder was a bit difficult to see through under IR illumination

Nice write up man.
There's been a lot of hate for the photonis echo's on here, but I think they're great for the money!
I'd buy mine again if I had to do it over.
I only lasted about 10 months before moving from a pvs-14 to binos, both photonis, so just a fair warning, you will want binos haha.

Thanks.  I saw the PVS-14 as a ‘gateway drug’ into NODs. I’m hoping to get thermals this year and maybe duals in the next couple of years.

I ended up with photonis binos from JRH Robert and sort of impulse bought a coti when eurooptics was selling off the last stocks of them.
I'd highly recommend the photonis binos BTW.
Thinking about selling the coti and getting a handheld 640 resolution thermal.
It's awesome that we, the lowly citizens, can literally buy super powers!

Thermal is just as mind blowing as NV. Maybe even more so. And you don’t have to worry about hurting it during the day. I use my thermal way more than my NV.

VIR2 is indeed solid.  A nickel is the perfect tool for the mount and a 22 LR rim works great for the laser adjustments in the field.  I tighten them to 10 inch pounds and then add a witness mark, so only the nickel is necessary after a battery change.  After numerous tests, I am completely content with their ability to return to zero after being removed and reattached.  I've owned close to two hundred IR lasers of at least fourteen different types, the bang/buck ratio on these is greater than anything else I've ever seen.  In 2005 this device would've probably been denounced as witchcraft.  

I just watched the 2022 SHOT Show Streamlight video and was a tad disappointed that there was not an update to the TLR VIR II.  I was secretly hoping for a 1000 lumen white light version with a more recessed mode switch to make it fully compatible with TLR-1 holsters...  without sacrificing battery life  At the same time, I see why they may look at this product as perfectly good as is...  but a guy can hope.  

Good on you for going out there and using your stuff, you are already ahead of most people that own NV.  Doing so is a ton of fun and will quickly illuminate potential areas of improvement (pun intended).

Looks like a lot of fun.

On the Photonis, IMHO they have 90% of the capability of a UF L3 at half the cost.

Don't say that too loud. Lol

Cool shit.

Awesome thread! It's cool to see others actually using their kit and training with it!

Ridgeline has been advertising night vision courses lately.

They're semi local to me, so I'm tempted to drive by and check it out.

That’s exactly what I was thinking but was afraid to say here in fear of ridicule. If I had spent $12k on a set of UF L3 and then looked through a set of Photonis I think I would have felt ripped off. To make a direct comparison with my tube, I closed one eye when I was wearing the -31’s and spent a few minutes walking around and I could only barely see any difference. I’m sure the difference gets much bigger during low illumination, but in that night there was barely any difference.

Now binos vs a single tube, there was quite a bit of difference there.

I don't have a gucci L3 unfilmed bino set up but I did buy a autogated BNVD with photonis tubes from JRH during Black Friday. I haven't had a chance to use it much other than going out into the backyard but it really does fine 90-95% of the time. Where I did notice a few issues was during the new moon a few weeks ago. There was a very distinct difference between the amount I was able to see with the photonis tubes vs the thin filmed L3 green phosphor PVS-14 I also tested.

Other than that, I'm very happy with the $1.5K I saved over the single gated XLS spec and $3-4k I saved over a single gated harris tube setup.

The low illumination performance is where I was guessing there would be a huge difference. A little bit of illumination goes a long way. I was out on Ocracoke, considered the darkest part of the entire east coast, with no moon and overcast. I watched as a raccoon passed maybe 50 yards away. I could see a lump moving but the image was kind of snowy. I hit it with the IR illuminator and it lit up like daylight.

I know I’m at a disadvantage to the tier 1 NODs, but overall it’s still a superpower. When things go loud I’m guessing lasers and illuminators make everything close to equal. On partial to full illumination I’m not too far behind.

I did forget to add my experience with passive aiming. It’s slightly awkward, but aiming with a red dot on NV setting is much easier than I thought. It’s weird but it almost feels like the dot is floating out in front and less like looking through the tube. My dot is a cheap Holosun, but the NV settings are perfect especially for adjusting and confirming zero of the IR laser.

In a world saturated in NV I'm really hesitant to rely on lasers/illuminators. Thermal is the crutch I am using to overcome any limitations my "poors" photonis echo setup has. That 3 grand I saved by going with the photonis spec bnvds went a long way towards getting my Nox 35

I have a “Gucci” L3 WP set of DTNVS and a ECHO -14. My routine as of the past few months is to get up before 6am, throw on the NVGs and go for a walk. I’m 15 miles out of town so I still get a good bit of ambient light. Add to that the ground is covered in snow right now. I can choose either one but for my little walks I grab the Photonis every time. I can see into the open and closed stands of ponderosa pine just fine. Now, if I had to play passive hide and go seek inside my house I’d grab the L3 WP every time.