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Link Posted: 6/15/2019 9:16:15 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

Where the MDR is concerned, I'm not sure "lighten up" is possible.
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I think you are correct again, from memory the platform actually got heavier from design specs to production. It would be nice if at least the .223 got a reduction in weight, it's a heavy .223 bullpup.
Link Posted: 6/15/2019 10:16:34 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Aussie_E:
I think you are correct again, from memory the platform actually got heavier from design specs to production. It would be nice if at least the .223 got a reduction in weight, it's a heavy .223 bullpup.
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Originally Posted By Aussie_E:
Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

Where the MDR is concerned, I'm not sure "lighten up" is possible.
I think you are correct again, from memory the platform actually got heavier from design specs to production. It would be nice if at least the .223 got a reduction in weight, it's a heavy .223 bullpup.
It got quite a bit heavier, and more expensive, between announcement and production. Like 1.5ish lb I think offhand?
Link Posted: 6/16/2019 9:29:29 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By Aussie_E:
I think you are correct again, from memory the platform actually got heavier from design specs to production. It would be nice if at least the .223 got a reduction in weight, it's a heavy .223 bullpup.
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Originally Posted By Aussie_E:
Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

Where the MDR is concerned, I'm not sure "lighten up" is possible.
I think you are correct again, from memory the platform actually got heavier from design specs to production. It would be nice if at least the .223 got a reduction in weight, it's a heavy .223 bullpup.
How would that even work? The whole point is the barrel & bolt head are the only changes (right?) which everyone was gaga over for some reason --was it supposed to be cost-effective, or something? The gun's 2000$!-- and a 556 barrel and bolt head are gonna weigh *more* than a 308, all else being equal. So the only options are to accept a substantial weight/size penalty for a smaller cartridge, or use a much lighter profile barrel for a lesser weight but equal size penalty for a smaller cartridge, along with accuracy degradation. I just don't get it; if a company came out with a 5.56 that used all AR10 parts, they'd be laughed out of the room. Now, a 308 that uses pretty much all AR15 parts on the other hand (POF Revolution) offers a legit advantage over prior art as well as growth potential from the newfound modularity.
Link Posted: 6/16/2019 12:18:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:

It got quite a bit heavier, and more expensive, between announcement and production. Like 1.5ish lb I think offhand?
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Got to recoup all the Delphi tech MIM setup fees...
Link Posted: 6/16/2019 12:24:12 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By barnbwt:

How would that even work? The whole point is the barrel & bolt head are the only changes (right?) which everyone was gaga over for some reason --was it supposed to be cost-effective, or something? The gun's 2000$!-- and a 556 barrel and bolt head are gonna weigh *more* than a 308, all else being equal. So the only options are to accept a substantial weight/size penalty for a smaller cartridge, or use a much lighter profile barrel for a lesser weight but equal size penalty for a smaller cartridge, along with accuracy degradation. I just don't get it; if a company came out with a 5.56 that used all AR10 parts, they'd be laughed out of the room. Now, a 308 that uses pretty much all AR15 parts on the other hand (POF Revolution) offers a legit advantage over prior art as well as growth potential from the newfound modularity.
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Haven't you learned...DT and the MDR is pretty much untouchable to criticism on the interwebs...
Link Posted: 6/19/2019 8:01:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/19/2019 8:17:19 PM EDT by ryder6908]
I signed up for a long range class in October and plan on taking the MDR. I want to buy a box of a bunch of different ammo and see what groups the best. Any recommendations on what to pick up? So far here is what I'm thinking:

175gr FGMM
130gr barnes ttsx
150gr ttsx
155gr hornady amax
150gr federal fusion
168gr magtech

Any other suggestions?

While I do want to test the barnes, they're too much to shoot the class with.

Edit:
Added these to the list so far

DT's own 175gr
Federal=Vital-Shok 150Gr Nosler Tip
150gr gold dot
Link Posted: 6/19/2019 8:13:02 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By ryder6908:
I signed up for a long range class in October and plan on taking the MDR. I want to buy a box of a bunch of different ammo and see what groups the best. Any recommendations on what to pick up? So far here is what I'm thinking:

175gr FGMM
130gr barnes ttsx
150gr ttsx
155gr hornady amax
150gr federal fusion
168gr magtech

Any other suggestions?

While I do want to test the barnes, they're too much to shoot the class with.
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Might not hurt to test DT's house brand. Desert Tech .308 Ammunition Page
Link Posted: 6/19/2019 8:20:09 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

Might not hurt to test DT's house brand. Desert Tech .308 Ammunition Page
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Good call, they say: *Desert Tech guarantees 0.5 MOA accuracy from its ammunition when fired from Desert Tech accuracy guaranteed rifles and all proper shooting protocol is followed.

I assume that means their SRS, would be interesting to see how it compares
Link Posted: 6/19/2019 9:50:53 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Might not hurt to test DT's house brand. Desert Tech .308 Ammunition Page
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Originally Posted By ryder6908:
I signed up for a long range class in October and plan on taking the MDR. I want to buy a box of a bunch of different ammo and see what groups the best. Any recommendations on what to pick up? So far here is what I'm thinking:

175gr FGMM
130gr barnes ttsx
150gr ttsx
155gr hornady amax
150gr federal fusion
168gr magtech

Any other suggestions?

While I do want to test the barnes, they're too much to shoot the class with.
Might not hurt to test DT's house brand. Desert Tech .308 Ammunition Page
Yeah, seeing as it was the only ammo they built the gun to work with...
Link Posted: 6/19/2019 9:58:53 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By barnbwt:
Yeah, seeing as it was the only ammo they built the gun to work with...
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Originally Posted By barnbwt:
Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Originally Posted By ryder6908:
I signed up for a long range class in October and plan on taking the MDR. I want to buy a box of a bunch of different ammo and see what groups the best. Any recommendations on what to pick up? So far here is what I'm thinking:

175gr FGMM
130gr barnes ttsx
150gr ttsx
155gr hornady amax
150gr federal fusion
168gr magtech

Any other suggestions?

While I do want to test the barnes, they're too much to shoot the class with.
Might not hurt to test DT's house brand. Desert Tech .308 Ammunition Page
Yeah, seeing as it was the only ammo they built the gun to work with...
Odd...my two have worked with whatever I've fed them from Federal hunting loads to ZQi milspec.
Link Posted: 6/19/2019 11:54:38 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

Odd...my two have worked with whatever I've fed them from Federal hunting loads to ZQi milspec.
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That is odd since you are in the vast minority. But congrats.
Link Posted: 6/20/2019 5:44:35 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Odd...my two have worked with whatever I've fed them from Federal hunting loads to ZQi milspec.
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Originally Posted By barnbwt:
Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Originally Posted By ryder6908:
I signed up for a long range class in October and plan on taking the MDR. I want to buy a box of a bunch of different ammo and see what groups the best. Any recommendations on what to pick up? So far here is what I'm thinking:

175gr FGMM
130gr barnes ttsx
150gr ttsx
155gr hornady amax
150gr federal fusion
168gr magtech

Any other suggestions?

While I do want to test the barnes, they're too much to shoot the class with.
Might not hurt to test DT's house brand. Desert Tech .308 Ammunition Page
Yeah, seeing as it was the only ammo they built the gun to work with...
Odd...my two have worked with whatever I've fed them from Federal hunting loads to ZQi milspec.
On what gas setting? And how many rounds have you shot through them?
Link Posted: 6/20/2019 6:54:58 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:

On what gas setting? And how many rounds have you shot through them?
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Whatever the normal setting has been for the gas valve of the day. Total is about 300 rounds through each.
Link Posted: 6/20/2019 9:41:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/20/2019 9:42:07 PM EDT by barnbwt]
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

Odd...my two have worked with whatever I've fed them from Federal hunting loads to ZQi milspec.
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I mean, I could be wrong, but I seem to recall some dozens of pages back, DT saying the guns were designed for their in-house ammo, hence the oodles of stoppages using other stuff...exactly how Remington tried to explain away R51 issues, lol ("the manual says to only use Remington ammunition...")

It's rather odd to suggest an obscure, boutique, expensive ammo source for a simple variety test when "whatever [you've] fed" your gun has worked fine. Is there something notably different about the DT ammo that's worth examining? Or just another excuse to send them more money?
Link Posted: 6/20/2019 10:11:06 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By barnbwt:

I mean, I could be wrong, but I seem to recall some dozens of pages back, DT saying the guns were designed for their in-house ammo, hence the oodles of stoppages using other stuff...exactly how Remington tried to explain away R51 issues, lol ("the manual says to only use Remington ammunition...")

It's rather odd to suggest an obscure, boutique, expensive ammo source for a simple variety test when "whatever [you've] fed" your gun has worked fine. Is there something notably different about the DT ammo that's worth examining? Or just another excuse to send them more money?
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Let's just stop...right here. Go back to what I originally replied to...the OP asked for types of ammo to test, and since several were premium loads, I suggested DT's house load. Nothing more. No conspiracy. No old guy behind the curtain. A cigar is just a cigar. A question was asked, I answered it.
Link Posted: 6/21/2019 9:56:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/21/2019 9:57:35 AM EDT by thehun06]
DT originally mentioned they used: DT match, American Eagle and legit military Federal M80 ball...no other ammo was used during its design and release...then the reviews came with the MDR choking...DT blamed us for using cheap ammo...they didn't care for maaaany months...they even said their MDR performs better than Tavors, SCARs, HK and FN (which I called them out on and they deleted that post but thank goodness I qouted them right away on BPF)...they didn't care until inrange complained about it...then...they just applied a ratio of 11% to the gas ports to "fix" it....

Knowing how tight the chamber is...I bet it was blueprinted from their in-house ammo.
Link Posted: 6/21/2019 10:17:38 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By thehun06:
DT originally mentioned they used: DT match, American Eagle and legit military Federal M80 ball...no other ammo was used during its design and release...then the reviews came with the MDR choking...DT blamed us for using cheap ammo...they didn't care for maaaany months...they even said their MDR performs better than Tavors, SCARs, HK and FN (which I called them out on and they deleted that post but thank goodness I qouted them right away on BPF)...they didn't care until inrange complained about it...then...they just applied a ratio of 11% to the gas ports to "fix" it....

Knowing how tight the chamber is...I bet it was blueprinted from their in-house ammo.
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I thought I remembered that at least mostly correctly.

I mean, if DT's ammo actually works in their gun, that's a good reason to use it. Why that ammo doesn't overlap with the standard spec enough to be compatible with NATO ball begs some questions, however.

Going back to my R51 example; Remington were being cheap & only tested with their house ammo, which had narrow bullet ogives. It worked fine, so they never realized they were making short-chambered garbage that completely lacked a leade into the bore. It truly wasn't an issue until you tried shooting other makers' ammo with fatter bullet profiles (or tried a go gage). Obviously an egregious example and not what's happened with the MDR/DT ammo but the point is the same; something about that gun/ammo combo is at the far edge of spec, hence the common issues.

Although, maybe if you defend the gun & company enough from criticism, those issues never manifest?
Link Posted: 6/28/2019 9:34:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/28/2019 9:41:49 AM EDT by chevypowerzz4]
The M4-72 muzzle brake seems to tame the recoil nicely. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb3HQ6pwsxQ&list=LLlxXFaongGaU10Ak2m6ZbDw&index=4&t=0s
Link Posted: 6/28/2019 9:38:09 AM EDT
I'm here for the shitshow
Link Posted: 6/28/2019 9:53:21 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By chevypowerzz4:
The M4-72 muzzle brake seems to tame the recoil nicely. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb3HQ6pwsxQ&list=LLlxXFaongGaU10Ak2m6ZbDw&index=4&t=0s
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That hurts my teeth just to watch
Link Posted: 6/28/2019 10:01:55 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By chevypowerzz4:
The M4-72 muzzle brake seems to tame the recoil nicely. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb3HQ6pwsxQ&list=LLlxXFaongGaU10Ak2m6ZbDw&index=4&t=0s
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It actually looks pretty fun when it cycles correctly...man that berm looks tiny

BTW, there's a brief shot where he has a plain forked brake on it (is that the factory one?) while prone shooting. For a gun this short, in a position as rigid as prone, the muzzle jumps upward a full 2-3 inches with each shot. I think that may have prompted the brake swap. As short and neutrally-balanced as bullpups are, I can't help but wonder if mounting the moving mass parts lower (think BREN or Garand...or AUG) might improve that aspect of handling. On a conventional layout, that stuff is all so far forward of the stock support, that the effect of its vertical position doesn't change the recoil impulse much, compared to the impact of stock shape. It's painfully obvious with the MDR, that the BCG hitting the rear causes the top-heavy, neutrally-balanced gun to pivot about the pistol grip, exacerbating the effect of recoil. The RDB does it too, but in 5.56 it's of course less of an issue (also the gun simply doesn't cycle anywhere near as hard)
Link Posted: 6/28/2019 10:21:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/28/2019 10:24:51 AM EDT by RDTCU]
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Originally Posted By barnbwt:

It actually looks pretty fun when it cycles correctly...man that berm looks tiny

BTW, there's a brief shot where he has a plain forked brake on it (is that the factory one?) while prone shooting. For a gun this short, in a position as rigid as prone, the muzzle jumps upward a full 2-3 inches with each shot. I think that may have prompted the brake swap. As short and neutrally-balanced as bullpups are, I can't help but wonder if mounting the moving mass parts lower (think BREN or Garand...or AUG) might improve that aspect of handling. On a conventional layout, that stuff is all so far forward of the stock support, that the effect of its vertical position doesn't change the recoil impulse much, compared to the impact of stock shape. It's painfully obvious with the MDR, that the BCG hitting the rear causes the top-heavy, neutrally-balanced gun to pivot about the pistol grip, exacerbating the effect of recoil. The RDB does it too, but in 5.56 it's of course less of an issue (also the gun simply doesn't cycle anywhere near as hard)
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RFB doesn't seem to suffer from that issue as much.
Yes, even with the gas tuned well, it's still got a thump to it, which a good brake would help tame that if you can stand the blast 18" from your face.





Link Posted: 6/28/2019 3:48:19 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Trash_Panda:
I'm here for the shitshow
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After 2years? of delays and lies before the actual release of production guns and the almost 2 years of shit show failures since then I sincerely hope it's in the past now.
Link Posted: 7/3/2019 9:28:17 PM EDT
So my rifle arrived at DT on the 06/20.. I called and talked to the warranty dept. today to see if they had any updates. They said there are 8 rifles ahead of mine and that things were going slower than they would like but faster than they were. They said things should be going faster from now on. I didn't give me a hard timeline but was assured that it will be tested once the revisions are complete with three different types of ammo (PMC, American Eagle, and Malaysian surplus). Hopefully I will have it back soon.
Link Posted: 7/4/2019 10:04:31 AM EDT
Not sure if this was posted here before, and I have no idea what the status is on this, as I haven't contacted them about it:

https://shootingsight.com/product/project-update-mdr/

https://shootingsight.com/product/mdr/
Link Posted: 7/4/2019 11:28:51 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By MAC21500:
Not sure if this was posted here before, and I have no idea what the status is on this, as I haven't contacted them about it:

https://shootingsight.com/product/project-update-mdr/

https://shootingsight.com/product/mdr/
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Am I reading right that his last update was October 2017? Cue the “stick a fork in it...” memes.
Link Posted: 7/4/2019 1:07:43 PM EDT
I would be very surprised if the Shooting Sight trigger ever comes to market. In my discussions with Art it has been on the back burner for quite some time.
Link Posted: 7/7/2019 11:15:08 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:

On what gas setting? And how many rounds have you shot through them?
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Mine loves sig .308, the grouping were by far the best. I went to my local indoor club and the shop next door buying a box of each. Then headed out, sig shot the best
Link Posted: 7/9/2019 2:49:00 PM EDT
I'm guessing most have seen the latest InRange TV 5.56 MDR videos, but I'll link them here for continuity's sake:



Link Posted: 7/9/2019 4:16:36 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Kwisak:
Mine loves sig .308, the grouping were by far the best. I went to my local indoor club and the shop next door buying a box of each. Then headed out, sig shot the best
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Originally Posted By Kwisak:
Originally Posted By doty_soty:

On what gas setting? And how many rounds have you shot through them?
Mine loves sig .308, the grouping were by far the best. I went to my local indoor club and the shop next door buying a box of each. Then headed out, sig shot the best
I’ve heard good stuff about Sig’s .308. Have you shot any FGMM through it? That stuff usually shoots best for me in my .308’s. Usually the 168’s outshoot the 175’s by a hair for me it seems like.
Link Posted: 7/9/2019 7:55:28 PM EDT
Looks like the 5.56 version is doing pretty well. Time will tell more, but it looks promising.

I still wouldn't touch the .308.

I won't be in the market again for a couple of years now so we'll know more about it and the Tavor 308.

I wanted the MDR in .308 to be reliable and be ready to run back when I bought my Tavor but it wasn't, so I decided on a 5.56 bullpup option. I'd wanted a .308 first and then get a 5.56.
Link Posted: 7/9/2019 9:17:17 PM EDT
Got mine back from getting the bolt carrier issue looked at and had the updates done. Sps300 on setting 2 functions fine with the load I was using. No apparent brass damage. It did short stroke 2-2 or 3-3 with a bit lighter load on that setting. So it's still not as versatile as an Ar. Looks like they replaced the frame rails again, not much play in the carrier now. It had the 2018valve in it when I sent it back. It did not return with it. I sent an email asking for my valve or my $50 back, got an auto-reply. A little pissed about that. I need to send another email.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 12:03:13 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By newguy2k3:
Got mine back from getting the bolt carrier issue looked at and had the updates done. Sps300 on setting 2 functions fine with the load I was using. No apparent brass damage. It did short stroke 2-2 or 3-3 with a bit lighter load on that setting. So it's still not as versatile as an Ar. Looks like they replaced the frame rails again, not much play in the carrier now. It had the 2018valve in it when I sent it back. It did not return with it. I sent an email asking for my valve or my $50 back, got an auto-reply. A little pissed about that. I need to send another email.
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If you paid for the 2018 valve, you should be due a credit for it. This is a credit, not cash back, sadly.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 12:06:49 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

If you paid for the 2018 valve, you should be due a credit for it. This is a credit, not cash back, sadly.
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Horseshit. As it stands now I don't have my $50 or the goddamn valve.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 12:26:30 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By newguy2k3:
Horseshit. As it stands now I don't have my $50 or the goddamn valve.
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Originally Posted By newguy2k3:
Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

If you paid for the 2018 valve, you should be due a credit for it. This is a credit, not cash back, sadly.
Horseshit. As it stands now I don't have my $50 or the goddamn valve.
No kidding. To hell with a credit. The man paid $50 for an item, and he received the item. They removed the item and returned the gun without it. He's out $50, or the item. The only way to make him whole is to either refund the $50 or ship the valve. If the new "fix" doesn't need the valve, the the only way to make him whole is with $50. Having to spend $50 in their store is bs customer service, and likely illegal, since they won't have $50 in actual cash value in the items in the store, the merch will be marked up. They may have $10 in the merch and have it marked at $50. He paid retail for the valve, now they've made money on the valve and have his $50.

They have to refund him cash / credit card.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 12:46:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/10/2019 12:47:26 AM EDT by doty_soty]
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Originally Posted By newguy2k3:
Horseshit. As it stands now I don't have my $50 or the goddamn valve.
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Originally Posted By newguy2k3:
Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

If you paid for the 2018 valve, you should be due a credit for it. This is a credit, not cash back, sadly.
Horseshit. As it stands now I don't have my $50 or the goddamn valve.
That’s pretty bad. I’d want the valve even if it were now useless just on the principle. I don’t care if that’s dumb logic, if I paid for it, it’s mine.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 2:18:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/10/2019 2:19:43 AM EDT by pavlovwolf]
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:
That’s pretty bad. I’d want the valve even if it were now useless just on the principle. I don’t care if that’s dumb logic, if I paid for it, it’s mine.
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:
Originally Posted By newguy2k3:
Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

If you paid for the 2018 valve, you should be due a credit for it. This is a credit, not cash back, sadly.
Horseshit. As it stands now I don't have my $50 or the goddamn valve.
That’s pretty bad. I’d want the valve even if it were now useless just on the principle. I don’t care if that’s dumb logic, if I paid for it, it’s mine.
Screw that. If the update makes the valve useless, he should get his money back, and some ammo and swag for his troubles. A rifle costing over $2000, and he has to pay $50 to make it work, and then it still doesn't, and then he sends it in and gets it back without his money? That's bullshit of the highest order.

At this point I'd have driven to their HQ and tossed the rifle through their window and told them to kiss my arse.

The thing ought to come with a cleaning kit, gun oil, and anal lube.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 6:01:39 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:

If you paid for the 2018 valve, you should be due a credit for it. This is a credit, not cash back, sadly.
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Sounds like a BTDT ... the customer disservice shit show just keeps getting “better”
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 11:49:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/10/2019 11:49:32 AM EDT by MAC21500]
This is exactly why I was going to strip the old parts off my rifle before sending it in.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 12:42:19 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By MAC21500:
This is exactly why I was going to strip the old parts off my rifle before sending it in.
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Wise choice.

1st RMA left surefire mount on. Returned tight as shit with no timing shims.
2nd RMA sent in with factory hider hand tight for thread protector. No fh returned
3rd RMA asked for a replacement fh but nothing returned
4th RMA returned with replacement factory fh, no gas valve that I PAID for.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 1:37:36 PM EDT
Are they paying shipping each time? 4x shipping would be pretty pricey for their fuckups if not.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 1:43:00 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Kali_Refugee:
Are they paying shipping each time? 4x shipping would be pretty pricey for their fuckups if not.
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They did. There was something they didn't fix or screwed up everytime it was there and I'll be damned if I was gonna pay for it.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 2:16:31 PM EDT
Glad I opted for a SCAR instead of this mess.
Link Posted: 7/10/2019 7:30:45 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By thehun06:
Glad I opted for a SCAR instead of this mess.
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If they had gone with a sr-25 mag rather than proprietary I'd probably own one
Link Posted: 7/11/2019 10:25:19 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By newguy2k3:

If they had gone with a sr-25 mag rather than proprietary I'd probably own one
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I have 16S...so AR mags...but for .308...I invested into a M14 EBR platform...

Link Posted: 7/11/2019 11:50:17 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By newguy2k3:
If they had gone with a sr-25 mag rather than proprietary I'd probably own one
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Originally Posted By newguy2k3:
Originally Posted By thehun06:
Glad I opted for a SCAR instead of this mess.
If they had gone with a sr-25 mag rather than proprietary I'd probably own one
@newguy2k3
https://www.ar15.com/forums/Armory/SR25-lower-receivers-for-the-SCAR-17S-what-say-you-/24-496896/
Link Posted: 7/18/2019 9:14:16 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By barnbwt:

It actually looks pretty fun when it cycles correctly...man that berm looks tiny

BTW, there's a brief shot where he has a plain forked brake on it (is that the factory one?) while prone shooting. For a gun this short, in a position as rigid as prone, the muzzle jumps upward a full 2-3 inches with each shot. I think that may have prompted the brake swap. As short and neutrally-balanced as bullpups are, I can't help but wonder if mounting the moving mass parts lower (think BREN or Garand...or AUG) might improve that aspect of handling. On a conventional layout, that stuff is all so far forward of the stock support, that the effect of its vertical position doesn't change the recoil impulse much, compared to the impact of stock shape. It's painfully obvious with the MDR, that the BCG hitting the rear causes the top-heavy, neutrally-balanced gun to pivot about the pistol grip, exacerbating the effect of recoil. The RDB does it too, but in 5.56 it's of course less of an issue (also the gun simply doesn't cycle anywhere near as hard)
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Would love to see pics of your berm.
Link Posted: 7/19/2019 7:56:19 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By ARsR4ME:
Would love to see pics of your berm.
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Originally Posted By ARsR4ME:
Originally Posted By barnbwt:

It actually looks pretty fun when it cycles correctly...man that berm looks tiny

BTW, there's a brief shot where he has a plain forked brake on it (is that the factory one?) while prone shooting. For a gun this short, in a position as rigid as prone, the muzzle jumps upward a full 2-3 inches with each shot. I think that may have prompted the brake swap. As short and neutrally-balanced as bullpups are, I can't help but wonder if mounting the moving mass parts lower (think BREN or Garand...or AUG) might improve that aspect of handling. On a conventional layout, that stuff is all so far forward of the stock support, that the effect of its vertical position doesn't change the recoil impulse much, compared to the impact of stock shape. It's painfully obvious with the MDR, that the BCG hitting the rear causes the top-heavy, neutrally-balanced gun to pivot about the pistol grip, exacerbating the effect of recoil. The RDB does it too, but in 5.56 it's of course less of an issue (also the gun simply doesn't cycle anywhere near as hard)
Would love to see pics of your berm.
Not mine, but it's 12ft tall. I'd have to be *very* confident in my rapid fire accuracy with such a hard-recoiling weapon to mag dump at that range, but that's me.
Link Posted: 7/20/2019 1:15:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: Yesterday 2:48:45 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By barnbwt:

It actually looks pretty fun when it cycles correctly...man that berm looks tiny

BTW, there's a brief shot where he has a plain forked brake on it (is that the factory one?) while prone shooting. For a gun this short, in a position as rigid as prone, the muzzle jumps upward a full 2-3 inches with each shot. I think that may have prompted the brake swap. As short and neutrally-balanced as bullpups are, I can't help but wonder if mounting the moving mass parts lower (think BREN or Garand...or AUG) might improve that aspect of handling. On a conventional layout, that stuff is all so far forward of the stock support, that the effect of its vertical position doesn't change the recoil impulse much, compared to the impact of stock shape. It's painfully obvious with the MDR, that the BCG hitting the rear causes the top-heavy, neutrally-balanced gun to pivot about the pistol grip, exacerbating the effect of recoil. The RDB does it too, but in 5.56 it's of course less of an issue (also the gun simply doesn't cycle anywhere near as hard)
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I swapped the factory FH for a comp for this reason, felt a lot of vertical muzzle rise with the factory flash hider, probably because there's virtually no weight out front.
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