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12/11/2018 1:58:31 AM
Posted: 11/18/2018 8:53:45 PM EST
Which one to get. Doing a nice ar build, taking my time and im trying to decide on which of these models to get.

Dbal D2 seems awesome, fully featured and great illumination. Not sure on laser intensity vs others. Also seems large and heavy and will sit high off the rifle

Atipal is the standard. Simple controls. Streamlined (sits on the rail nice). Durable. Illumination and laser seems sub par nowadays.

Mawl seem good in theory. Everyone says its illuminator and laser are excellent in intensity. Not to sure on the placement though. It seems to really put some weight on the right side. Also not sure i like the controls that much.

Holosun. I actually have 2 of their cheap ir laser units that have impressed me. I wouldnt mind one of thier elite units but they are never available. Thier mid units arent bad but seem kinda like the dbal in bulkiness. Also not as "top teir".

Thoughts?
Link Posted: 11/18/2018 9:14:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/18/2018 9:26:13 PM EST by terry1]
Well I have a D2, Atipal-C and a MAWL now have second one order.

I like them all for different reasons the highest performer overall would be the MAWL, but that comes at a steep price. That said it’s not always my choice to carry many times I like the Atipal-C for certain task and my D2’s have been work horses over the years with killer IR Illuminator range.

Been using the Atipal a lot lately it’s just simple stupid easy to use and the IR laser with diffuser gives a very small clean dot a big plus for hunters. IR illum works will 75-100 yards min in most all conditions and for a IR laser based illum I find the illum light cleaner looking than other models out there not full of artifacts or swirls. The draw back is it’s a fixed illum FOV however it works well for me. Overall a compact and lite weight model that’s rugged.

D2 is big and bulky and performance is fantastic overall lasers to illum. Best value for a long ranger hunting IR laser/Illum combo.Before the MAWL this was the class 1 system to beat for overall laser/Illum performance. The D2 was my first high end laser after years years and years of use it still amazes me. Size is it’s draw back and some folks point out there is slight glow at the illum base you can see close ranges, however that’s never been a issue for me. Plus I can see some glow from even the dbal 9007 and A3 also.

Heck given a choice I would like to see a mil-spec type tough model the size of the Atipal or smaller with dual IR/green lasers or just IR laser alone with IR Illum laser or LED based that would kick IR light out there say 200-250 yards well for under $1000.
Link Posted: 11/19/2018 11:48:43 AM EST
I have a MAWL and a D2. They both perform really well.

The illumination of the MAWL is soooo clean. The ability to switch the illuminator between low, medium, high on the fly is really awesome. Indoors the low flood is completely awesome. Outdoors on high it punches. I do not notice it placing any undue weight on the right side of the rifle. The mounting is rock solid. The ergonomics to run it without a tape switch are great.

The D2 really has some punch too. It is slower because you have to manually focus the illuminator by rotating the bezel. That is fine for hunting, especially overwatch hunting, or hunting where you have a pretty good idea where the target will end up. It is just slower to change between functions than the MAWL is. The mount on mine is crapped out and I have to switch it to a home brew modified Larue. I can't get Steiner to email me back to save my life. But it's also over $1500 cheaper on the used market.

All said and done. When I am ready here shortly, I will be selling the D2 and buying another MAWL; unless something changes and someone comes out with something better. It's an incredibly intuitive system. People just get hung up on the price. It's priced that way because it's new, hangs with the full power units, and it's never been done before. I have a feeling if it was priced the same as the other units, the EE would be flooded as all get out with DBALs and Atpials.... It's just a better system.
Link Posted: 11/19/2018 12:05:15 PM EST
Do you have problems running support side shooting?
Link Posted: 11/19/2018 12:19:42 PM EST
I am right handed. I am assuming you are the same?

Typically when using the MAWL you are shooting under nods. So you are aiming with the laser. Even if during the day you would be aiming with the visible laser. All you do is rotate the gun over a little more. No big deal at all. The surefire and the MAWL just act as a nice little palm swell to hold on to. I don't have particularly big hands and it's still quite easy for me.

If you were trying to use the illuminator and shoot passively through the red dot with a higher mount from the weak side it would be tricky. As Sam from TNVC explained it to me, awkward shooting positions are where the TAPS can be an advantage with the MAWL. But I see that as a rare if ever situation, at least for me.

HERE are some pictures of me reaching each of the controls on the MAWL from the strong and weak sides.

Hope that helps.
Link Posted: 11/20/2018 4:45:30 PM EST
Ive had/have all but the holosun.

Just my quick $.02:

The D2 and the MAWL do the same thing and offer the same performance. Or at least close enough that you can't really tell the difference. Excellent IR Illuminator on both. The MAWL just does it with a user interface and ergonomics that are lightyears ahead. Law of diminishing returns and all that - is it worth 2x the money for you?

The ATIPAL-C is in a complete different category IR Illuminator wise. It doesn't even compare. The full power one is a different story though.

FWIW, Ive sold my D2 and MAWL and now use a ATIPAL-C with a TNVC Torch on a qd mount. When im hunting i dont always like to have to use my gun to illuminate things. Having a torch is better. You can always get both i suppose, and if money was no object then id have a MAWL and a torch. But the ATIPAL-C and Torch combo is what I use and it works well for my needs (100% for hog hunting)
Link Posted: 11/20/2018 9:31:49 PM EST
Not to highjack this thread but how does a mawl compare to a full power atpial/peq 15?
Link Posted: 11/20/2018 10:19:20 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Branman530:
Not to highjack this thread but how does a mawl compare to a full power atpial/peq 15?
View Quote
Beats it(ir illuminator). Plus you have a warranty, don’t have to worry about a legal grey area.
Link Posted: 11/21/2018 9:39:42 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Branman530:
Not to highjack this thread but how does a mawl compare to a full power atpial/peq 15?
View Quote
IR laser on the full power peq is much stronger. MAWL still has the edge on the Illuminator and ergonomics. Realistically the laser on the MAWL (or any other class 1 dbal/atipal-c) has more than enough power. The laser on class 1 units will go farther than you can PID something anyway. So really the only reason you would go with a peq as a civilian is for the Illuminator, which like I said, the MAWL does better any way. Or I guess some might like the novelty of a restricted unit or want a clone rifle. That’s fine too. The full power units aren’t too hard to find but you aren’t too far away from MAWL pricing at that point and you are going to have $2K tied up in an illiquid asset that can be confinscated from you at any time and you have 0 manufacturer support. Juice ain’t worth the squeeze for me
Link Posted: 11/21/2018 10:05:53 AM EST
Anyone have any thoughts on the Zenitco lasers from Russia? Seems like you can get full power laser/illuminator without the legal issues.
Link Posted: 11/24/2018 2:29:14 PM EST
Just looked that up, seems interesting. Would be cool to put on a ak74
Link Posted: 11/27/2018 12:41:55 PM EST
Link Posted: 11/28/2018 7:45:38 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TNVC_Sam:

Legally you still cannot possess any laser over .7 mw
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Not smartassing you but who would enforce that? Who would prosecute you over that?
Link Posted: 11/29/2018 1:19:01 PM EST
Possess, or sell commercially?
Link Posted: 11/29/2018 3:08:55 PM EST
I had dibs on a full power peq15 for $800 but after some thought decided the grey area and lack of support was not worth it. Realistically a dbal was going to be more than adequate for my needs
Link Posted: 11/29/2018 3:46:17 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Zac87:
I had dibs on a full power peq15 for $800 but after some thought decided the grey area and lack of support was not worth it. Realistically a dbal was going to be more than adequate for my needs
View Quote
well can you hook me up?
Link Posted: 11/29/2018 5:01:36 PM EST
Lol unfortunately it sold already. I did think about grabbing it and passing it onto someone else but thoughts of the govt kept creeping into my head
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