User Panel
Posted: 5/20/2018 10:53:38 AM EDT
This just started happening, my 223 brass is getting stuck in my RCBS small base resizing dies. One die has resized 4-5,000 rds, other is new. Both have been cleaned. The brass is all Lake City shot out of 2 different AR's.
The brass is tumbled in corn cob to clean, lubed with Frankford Arsenal case lube. Even bought some new Frankford Lube and still have problems. I have resized thousands of rounds without any problems before this and have not changed anything I have done. Now the sticking starts |
|
Interesting problem. What press? Could it be an alignment issue?
|
|
Quoted:
Interesting problem. What press? Could it be an alignment issue? View Quote I just cleaned the die on the T-7, gave it a shot of lube, let it dry and tried sizing some of the same clean, lubed brass. First one stuck. |
|
If I follow you correctly, you are using spray lube.
Are you shaking bottle very well before use? How are you applying? How many sprays? I suspect you are not using enough lube. How long do you let lube dry before sizing? I would never use a SB die. |
|
Dillon spray lube or homemade lanolin and 99% isopropanol are the only spray lubes I consider useable.
I use Imperial Sizing Die Wax and have never stuck a case with it. I have reloaded for semi-auto rifles for 35 years now and never needed a small base die to get 100% reliability. The question becomes why do you think you need a small base die? I never crimp either, but that's another topic. Properly adjusted standard sizing dies have been great in my experience. Hornady makes two different types of sizing wax, a reddish brown and a clear/white. The clear white wax is excellent and works just as well as Imperial in my experience. The secret to using wax is not to get any on the case shoulder or the neck and very little on the the case body. A little goes a long way. |
|
Not a criticism, but what is the reason for using a small base die?
|
|
When sized with a small base die the round chambers 100% of the time. Been using small base dies for couple years.
The Frankford lube is lanolin/alcohol mix. I spray a decent coat on brass and shake it around let it set for a few minutes. I just sized a bunch of 6.5 Creedmoor on my T-7 with a Redding die and everything went smoothly. I can understand a problem if a changed something, but been sizing my brass the same way without issues until now. When I resize 223 brass I resize at least a 1,000 rounds of brass at a time. I guess I can order some Dillon lube. I know I have a Dillon sizing die somewhere. |
|
Quoted:
Not a criticism, but what is the reason for using a small base die? View Quote |
|
If you prefer SB die that's your choice so won't even go there.
You say you cleaned the die. What did you clean it with? It sounds to me like you have gulling in that die. Do a partial sizing as far as you can go without sticking it then wipe the casing clean and look for scratches. If the die does in fact have gulling ( brass stuck to the interior wall) it's not a big deal. There are several safe and easy ways to remove it. Motor |
|
use more case lube
make this instead of buying dillon of FA https://www.ar15.com/forums/armory/Case_Lube_for_cheap_bastards/42-305174/ |
|
All of the above advice on making sure your dies are not polluted and are galling... plus...
Make sure if you are using an expander, that it hasn’t drifted into a poor position (too high or way off center). Try a few after checking for galling marks and inspecting the inside of the dies with a borescope, and start without the decapper/expander stem first to see what if any evidence of galling you have. This helps isolate errors of adjustment or the wrong shell holder, from tribological problems. Good Luck. |
|
I use a small base. Mainly cause one of my AR is a .223 chamber, non-chromed. I found it helped reliable feeding and extraction in that particular rifle.
Anyhow...spray lube. I gave up on spray lube, both commercial, and home made. The only times I've stuck cases, was with a spray lube. Only took a handful of them and I quickly decided that wasn't for me, so back to the normal lube on a pad arrangement for me. |
|
I was beginning to have this happen sporatically too.I tried alot of differnt lubes until i found hornady unique case lube.I have resized close to 5000 cases since switching, and no more stuck cases.
|
|
Quoted:
All of the above advice on making sure your dies are not polluted and are galling... plus... Make sure if you are using an expander, that it hasn’t drifted into a poor position (too high or way off center). Try a few after checking for galling marks and inspecting the inside of the dies with a borescope, and start without the decapper/expander stem first to see what if any evidence of galling you have. This helps isolate errors of adjustment or the wrong shell holder, from tribological problems. Good Luck. View Quote I noticed something different in the instructions of the small base dies that warned that the leading edge of the expander must at least 3/16" up into the die body. This same warning is not mentioned for the regular FL die. You have to read carefully as I thought it was referring to the normal 3/16" of the depcap pin that must extend out of the die body. This indicates to me that the expander portion of a small base die requires more attention as to where it sits in the die body. Maybe this is because of the tighter/smaller tolerances in the small base sizing die. As far as a small base die being more difficult to stroke through the press, I didn't find that to be the case for my 300BO. I use Imperial sizing was and have never had sticking cases on any caliber or with any die. I don't know. I'm no expert on this, but there appears to be a small difference in the instructions between small base and FL for the sizer die. |
|
Quoted:
Yeah, I was wondering how he had the expander/decapper located in the sizing die. I have a small base RCBS set of 300BO dies as it was all I could find on short notice when I started 300BO loading. I have a set now that has a conventional FL sizing die. I noticed something different in the instructions of the small base dies that warned that the leading edge of the expander must at least 3/16" up into the die body. This same warning is not mentioned for the regular FL die. You have to read carefully as I thought it was referring to the normal 3/16" of the depcap pin that must extend out of the die body. This indicates to me that the expander portion of a small base die requires more attention as to where it sits in the die body. Maybe this is because of the tighter/smaller tolerances in the small base sizing die. As far as a small base die being more difficult to stroke through the press, I didn't find that to be the case for my 300BO. I use Imperial sizing was and have never had sticking cases on any caliber or with any die. I don't know. I'm no expert on this, but there appears to be a small difference in the instructions between small base and FL for the sizer die. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
All of the above advice on making sure your dies are not polluted and are galling... plus... Make sure if you are using an expander, that it hasn’t drifted into a poor position (too high or way off center). Try a few after checking for galling marks and inspecting the inside of the dies with a borescope, and start without the decapper/expander stem first to see what if any evidence of galling you have. This helps isolate errors of adjustment or the wrong shell holder, from tribological problems. Good Luck. I noticed something different in the instructions of the small base dies that warned that the leading edge of the expander must at least 3/16" up into the die body. This same warning is not mentioned for the regular FL die. You have to read carefully as I thought it was referring to the normal 3/16" of the depcap pin that must extend out of the die body. This indicates to me that the expander portion of a small base die requires more attention as to where it sits in the die body. Maybe this is because of the tighter/smaller tolerances in the small base sizing die. As far as a small base die being more difficult to stroke through the press, I didn't find that to be the case for my 300BO. I use Imperial sizing was and have never had sticking cases on any caliber or with any die. I don't know. I'm no expert on this, but there appears to be a small difference in the instructions between small base and FL for the sizer die. The pin adjustment is very critical for these dies. Thanks!! |
|
Any chance brass that’s been loaded many times could be work hardened?
|
|
Never had a stuck case while resizing, anything. I reload eleven calibers.
I've used RCBS and Hornady case lube and lube pad for years. Tried some Lee paste lube and it worked, but it's messier than the RCBS/Hornady liquid. I've never used spray lube but I've seen a lot of threads on several forums where people were having problems with stuck cases and they were using One Shot. I've only cleaned a die once, and it was a seating/crimping die when I was shooting a lot of lead .45 acp ammo I'd case/lubed/sized myself using those old Lee lubing/sizing kits (over 35 years ago.) Not saying that cleaning dies is bad, I've just never had to do it. I've used Pacific, Lee and RCBS dies over the years, none of them small bases resizing dies. I considered buying one a few years ago when I had issues with my newest, most expensive AR15 build but finally bought headspace gauges and realized the problem was the bolt/barrel fit, not the dies. Even then (before I replaced the bolt) I saw a difference in resizing dies. Lee dies produced the most problem cases, the Pacific dies did better and the RCBS dies were the best of the three as none of the cases resized with the RCBS dies failed to chamber (the carbine wouldn't chamber 10 our 10 empty pieces of brass resized with the Lee and Pacific .223 resizing dies.) Try switching lubes. Use too much lube and the cases can/will buckle at the shoulder due to the hydraulic pressure created when excess lube builds up and crushes in the softer brass case because it can't swell out the harder steel resizing die. Use too little lube and you get stuck cases. |
|
Once you have stuck a die in a case examine the die very carefully after removal.
It may need polishing to make sure any brass that galled on the die walls is removed. As in some bore cleaner paste. The slightest amount of brass stuck to the die wall will catch more brass and leave scratches in the shells. |
|
Read direction on the bottle.
Hence spray lube is pretty much DIY case lube, which is just thinned down lanolin via alcohol. So you have to make sure to shake the bottle to start with, and once you have coated the cases, have to give them enough time for the alcohol to evaporate off. [youtube]https://youtu.be/3vAL0WtuEQc[/youtube] |
|
|
I use Dillon lube. Spray the brass and up into the die periodically.
Smooth as butter. |
|
Spray lube... You always get a few cases that end up with not enough lube that are hard to size or want to stick than you start getting galling in die. If you want to use spray.... hand lube a case every 15-20 rds with Lee/RCBS case lube when you resize.
Personally I only use spray lube for inside necks and use a RCBS lube pad for outside of case body. |
|
Quoted:
This just started happening, my 223 brass is getting stuck in my RCBS small base resizing dies. One die has resized 4-5,000 rds, other is new. Both have been cleaned. The brass is all Lake City shot out of 2 different AR's. The brass is tumbled in corn cob to clean, lubed with Frankford Arsenal case lube. Even bought some new Frankford Lube and still have problems. I have resized thousands of rounds without any problems before this and have not changed anything I have done. Now the sticking starts View Quote |
|
Quoted: In 38+ years loading 223, I have never used spray lube and I have never stuck a case. Try a different lube. If that solves your problem then you can go back and examine how you are using the spray lube for clues as to why it stopped working. View Quote Spray lube work very well for me. |
|
Clean the die with a strong copper remover, I expect the interior has a thin film of brass causing galling.
A polish with JB Boreshine would not hurt. |
|
I haven't read the whole thread so maybe this was covered but isn't Frankford Arsenal lube the same as Dillon lube? Unless they make another variety I had some that was in a pump bottle that seemed like it was identical to Dillon lube.
It worked fine for me but I prefer Lee lube mixed with alcohol and in a pump sprayer. The only lube I am not fond of is Hornady One Shot but sometimes I will use a little of that for .44 magnum if loading on my 650. NEVER for rifle though. If all else fails get some Imperial Sizing Wax. I don't think you could get a stuck case with a micron of that. |
|
Quoted:
I spray a decent coat on brass and shake it around let it set for a few minutes. View Quote If in a baggie, be sure to dump them out and let them sit for a while and let the solvent evaporate 100%. Otherwise, they stick. Have you tried spraying the inside of the die and then wiping it clean (just a rag, no solvent during wipe)? Did you lube the expander ball and/or inside of case necks? |
|
Quoted:
Does this perhaps mean you spray in a baggie? If in a baggie, be sure to dump them out and let them sit for a while and let the solvent evaporate 100%. Otherwise, they stick. Have you tried spraying the inside of the die and then wiping it clean (just a rag, no solvent during wipe)? Did you lube the expander ball and/or inside of case necks? I have one of the large margarine tubs I put two handfuls of brass in and spray, shake around and spray again, then dump into a larger container to sit till dry. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I spray a decent coat on brass and shake it around let it set for a few minutes. If in a baggie, be sure to dump them out and let them sit for a while and let the solvent evaporate 100%. Otherwise, they stick. Have you tried spraying the inside of the die and then wiping it clean (just a rag, no solvent during wipe)? Did you lube the expander ball and/or inside of case necks? I have one of the large margarine tubs I put two handfuls of brass in and spray, shake around and spray again, then dump into a larger container to sit till dry. |
|
Quoted:
The key as dano mentioned is to let the alcohol evaporate. View Quote If they still seem to stick, I say screw it and they get rolled on a pad with RCBS lube. That always works for me. |
|
Try a different lube. A wax-based lube instead of a spray lube eliminates cases getting stuck when sizing .30-06. I didn’t believe that the lube would matter, but it definitely did.
|
|
Personally I have never been able to reliably master spray lubes. Everyone else can, so I guess it's just me; but I've found going back to the old pad and squeeze-on lube system, makes my stuck-case problems magically all go away.
Otherwise, lots of other good replies too. You might want to hit the inside of your die with a solid de-grease/break-cleaner hit, and wipe out - to start anew. Sometimes lube/goo retention can work against you in a die. |
|
I just finished resizing all my 223 brass. I ran over 3,000 rounds of brass through the press. I used both the Frankford and RCBS spray and let each tub I sprayed the brass in sit over night. With the amount of brass I resize at a time using pads to lube them will never work.
The two problems were the decapping pin not adjusted right and really shaking the shit out of the spray lube. |
|
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.