Looking for good bullets to load subsonic for my 300 BO.  My stamp should be here any day now for my AAC SDN-6.  I have a few boxes of commercial Remington 220gr OTM and for hunting some of the Hornady 190gr Sub-X.  But I am probably going to end up setting up my Dillion 650XL for 300 BO and was wondering what are good bullet to be using?  Something cheap for subsonic plinking loads and the occasion suppressed carbine match and some good expanding bullets for subsonic hunting.  What are you guys using?

OST... I’m in the same boat OP.

What type of gun do you have? Bolt vs semi auto?

I’m using 150gr FMJ with trail boss powder. That’s in a RAR bolt gun.

The gun is an AR made from parts.  The barrel is a Ballistic Advantage, 16-inch, 1:7 twist, pistol length gas system.  So far without the suppressor it cycles everything I have feed it, super or sub-sonic. Since the picture below was taken KAK Micro Flash Can has been replace by a 51-tooth AAC flash-hider to mount the SDN-6 on.



Two bullets:
First, an inexpensive 190-220 gr bullet I can use for sub-sonic plinking and the occasional carbine match. Accuracy capable of minute of 1/2 size Metric target A-zone at 50 yards and if I could hit an 8-inch plate at 150 yards with it (assuming I do my part) all the better.  Jacketed, plated or coated lead would be fine.  I would like to avoid un-coated lead.

Second, a good expanding hunting bullet.  I don't mind paying for this bullet as I am probably going to only load ~50 of these a year once I have a reliable load worked up.  Performance is key here.  Something capable of 2-MOA at 100 yards would be nice.  200gr+ and expanding at impact velocity out to 100 yard (assuming I manage to launch it at ~1050fps).  The biggest critter I will use it on will be whitetail deer and I won't stretch it more than 100 yards. Very few of my hunting location allow shots much over that.  Almost every deer I have taken on my current hunting property has been at 60 yards or less.

I simply buy Hornady 30 cal 208Gr BTHP from Midway when it's on sale for around $30 for 100 count. Rarely you can find really good deals on bulk bullets from Midway too.
I don't mess with cast bullets at all. Way too messy and high maintenance!

I'm curious why Hornady hasn't made the 190 Sub-X bullet available yet for reloading.

I tried the cheap coated bullets and had poor results. They still leaded no matter what I did. Even bought a special die to help with scratching the coating with no success.

I have came to the conclusion to just buy a good FMJ bullet and leave it at that. Im sure their is a good platted bullet out there but have not tried any yet.

I really wish that I could get a 147gr subsonic to work. You can find pulled or second M80 for cheap like $85 per 500. The only problem with them is few published subsonic loads and the only one that I have found which is Trail Boss probably is not gassy enough to run the action.  I wish someone would make titegroup in a large more voluminousness type flake or ball. Something like that would yield better results.

And for a subsonic hunting round I use these. Maker Bullets.

Last time I bought some they were under $40 so not sure if I caught a sale or they have went up. Have not killed anything with them yet.

Did just find these. They may be worth a try. The price seems fair.

Everglades Ammo 200 & 220Gr Platted 300 BLK @ $27 & $28

Is the reduced noise going from supers to subs worth the almost certain wounded animal that you will have to track much further?
Subs are not "quiet", they just don't have the same "crack" as supers.

I've shot hogs with subs, but I wasn't worried with recovery, and I'm glad I wasn't, because some of them made it a lot further than they should have with good hits.

110gr Barnes supers are my only .300blk hunting bullet for the foreseeable future.  Taken several hogs and deer with it, most DRT or within 20 yards.

Now I've shot (and won a few) 2-gun matches with suppressed 8" 300blk shooting subs, I like the S&B 200gr load for general off-the-shelf plinking, but this caliber will eventually force me to start reloading...

I have an 8 inch barrel and reload exclusively. I have not found any subsonic loading that will reliably cycle my gun. I need a suppressor to get enough gas. I have also not had any luck making subsonic 150 and 165 gr jacketed bullet loads that reliably cycle the action even with a can. A 200 gr cast coated bullet over 10.3gr IMR4227 and a CCI 400 primer works well in my gun. I use Win 396 with 150gr interlocks and CCI 450 primers for my supers that work loud or quiet. I will say,  30 rounds with 200+ gr bullets are heavy.

I can see your point but your painting with a broad brush. There are a number of Heavy subsonic bullets designed to expand at low velocity. The ones I listed above will open up at 600FPS . With the right load you would have a effective humane killing range of 150-200 yards.

I think the main question is how much $$$ is one willing to sink into killing something super quietly.

I have chased that dragon with my RAR in 300BLK and a few subsonic bullets. After looking back at what I spent and toyed with,  I wish I would have stuck with my 308 and normal loads for hunting and played with subsonic plinking loads on the side.

But im strictly talking about bolt guns.

The Maker Bullet seem like a good deal for the hunting bullet assuming they have good terminal performance.

I have been hunting with minimal cartridges (410 slug guns, 10mm handgun) for a few years I am willing to be very selective about what shots I take when hunting with such minimal cartridges.  I also will not be only hunting deer with these bullets.  I have a raccoon and coyote problem I will addressing also and would like to use the rifle/bullets for those too.  If all else fails I will go back to my 110gr Barnes TAC-TX as you suggest.

It's not just about expansion threshold, you've also got to consider:
Penetration if/when it expands.  Just because it expands doesn't mean it will do much damage to something vital.  
Penetration through bone with less-than-perfect placement.
Shot placement in general.  Subs do not fly like supers, and unless you have a rangefinder and dope, you can very easily be off by several inches.

A heavy 300blk sub from a 16" barrel has about as much energy at 100yd as a medium load 9mm out of a handgun up close.

That's important, know your limitations.
I for one like to carry a slightly larger envelope for success...

These 245 hard cast powder coated lead bullets were recommended to me.
I bought a box but haven't loaded them yet.

http://missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=204&category=6&secondary=36

I have been using the Sierra Match King in 190 and 220.  Pricey, but yet cheap when compared to the factory loaded offerings.  I am saving so much by reloading that I don't cheap out on the projectiles for the .300.

If your barrel is longer than 9 inches, your priorities are not in order.

I have had this 300 BO for a while built it back when everyone was still hashing out if pistol braces where or where not legal and if you could or could not shoulder them so I went simple and made a no doubt about it legal carbine.  Its been a fun gun.  I have a few bare lowers that no doubt one of them will become a 9-10 inch 300BO pistol now that I have the suppressor.

I just posted this on another section that had a similar question.  I'm lazy, so I basically just copy/pasted it here for the approximate 2-cents it may be worth.

This thread is very typical and somewhat understandable to have so many different opinions and assessments of 300BO. Why?...'cause people use the caliber in so many applications. That yields lots of different results with some bad and some good.

Suppressed? Nine inches is optimum for most subsonic loads. Hunting game animals with it?...not ideal at all but doable with precise bullet placement. It was developed for quiet anti-personnel use after the advent of the 300 Whisper. The history is often argued here, and it's often the "chicken or the egg" scenario.

Supersonic 300BO? The beauty of the caliber at this level is its flexibility. You can shoot them in most short barrels with some very decent results in hunting scenarios as long as the game isn't too large and the bullet selection is appropriate.

If you choose properly designed ammo in the 110g-125g range pushed in the area of 2400 fps, you can kill deer and other medium game with ease. The argument of the comparison to the AK47 in the lethality department is reasonable as their ballistic performance is relatively identical. It's usually in the specific bullet selection and velocity combination that you can usually obtain better results with the 300BO. But isn't choosing the right bullet/ammo usually the critical element in how well a caliber performs? Of course it is.

Much of the purse swinging occurs when people compare hunting results with all kinds of somewhat inappropriate bullet/ammo choices to vastly superior choices available in over-the-counter ammo or home loads. As with most firearms used to kill something, the right bullet for the right job yields much better outcomes.

There is probably no "one" best case scenario for 300BO when talking barrel length, ammo, or intended use. It's all over the board. Choose wisely for your scenario.

On one 300BO I went with a 9.5" barrel in pistol build solely intended for suppressed use with only subsonic ammo. I even leave the suppressor on this gun all the time, as I live in the country and occasionally go out and shoot the skunk, racoon, or other varmint causing my dog to go nuts. My neighbors a 1/2 mile down the road appreciate that. Very quiet.

The 208g AMAX bullets I load for it don't expand in these varmints, but they're just as dead because they are not north American brown bear size. I would not hunt deer with this bullet, but I'm sure the right shot would bring one down. Perhaps some Hornady 190 Sub-X hunting ammo would do a much better job there.

Now, my second 300BO is a dedicated 16" rifle for supersonic ammo only. With the right powder and 110g-125g bullet you can squeeze out about the most speed you can reasonably expect from a 300BO AR...just a hair over 2400 fps in my load for the Hornady 110g V-Max. This ammo is good for deer and below. It's great on a feral pig too. Just be aware it's not a long range cartridge like 6.5CM and such.

There is an awesome selection of sub and sonic ammo available over-the-counter, so one should be able to find just about anything you need without reloading. I can't imagine being an AR guy and not having at least one setup in 300BO.

Ah yup,  just ordered several more boxes this morning.

, 11.8grs of CFE BLK works my sbr.  Reliable and quiet.

I wouldn’t consider this anything but a plinking load.

Attached File

What COAL are you loading?

Attached File


2.015

Also loaded on my Dillon 650.   CFE BLK throws a very consistent charge.

THX

I'm going to try 10 grs RL-7 (because I have that on hand).

Are you flaring the case mouths at all to prevent shaving?

Yes.   I use a lee universal flaring tool.

I've been using berry's 220gr bullets for plinking over cfeblk.

How is the accuracy of these bullets?  Any issue with plating separations?  I have not used Berry's in years but back then I was having issues plating pealing off 40S&W bullet by the time I got them to Major power factor.

I haven't noticed any problems.  I use 300blkout in a 10.5 in PDW AR15 .   I spent my time developing loads for my barrel, cycling and keeping it subsonic.  Accuracy testing was only sighting in my reddot.  I used lilgun, h4198 and cfeblk.  I never went above 1100FPS.

I have been using these 200 grain plated bullets.  https://accuraoutdoors.com/product/30-caliber-200gr-spitzer-point/

Great accuracy and easy to load. Have a 8.5" barrel with a suppressor.

Price at the gun store where I bought them has been less than the online price. Problem is there are none in stock anywhere.  Looking to try some coated bullets if these don't become available again soon.

I am having problems getting a load developed.

I'm trying to use Reloader 7 since I use it in my 6.8 and have seen several loads online using it.
And it's slower than 1680 and WC680 so I think I should be safe.

I tried 10.5 grains, and wasn't getting bolt lock back from single rounds, so I ended up with 11.3 to date.
That gives me reliable bolt hold open.
But when I put two rounds in the mag, I can load the first, fire, but the second one gets caught on the feed ramps.

Ejection is right at about 2:30.

I've tried COAL from 2.1 down to 2.0.  I'm concerned about going too much shorter because I don't want to raise the pressure.
I have read of others going down to 1.9 to feed these bullets.
Primers are starting to flatten at 2.0 OAL and 11.3 grains.
No swipes.

Unfortunately, I don't have a chrony so I don't have that data to test with.

I notice that if I have the bolt locked open, insert a magazine, and release the bolt catch, it won't feed.  It hangs up.
But if I insert the mag and manually cycle the action, it feeds fine.

So I think when I manually cycle I'm pulling the bolt back further and it is feeding OK.
So when I'm shooting it, the bolt might ...just... come back far enough to catch the mag, but the timing is somehow messed up, so it won't feed right.

So I'm wondering if it isn't feeding because OAL is too long, or I have too little powder and it's still almost short stroking.

With these heavy bullets I assume the magazine feeds slightly slower than with a 5.56 round.  The heaviest factory round I've used is 220gr.

Most of the 1680, WC680 loads I see are in the 11.5 range.
Since Rel 7 is slower I'm wondering if I could bump up the powder charge a bit.
CFE BLK looks like it's a bit slower than H4198, and H4198 and Rel 7 are nearly identical.
The max load on Hodgdon's site for a 230gr bullet is 11.3gr CFE BLK and 10.8 H4198, which makes me rethink upping the charge.
But you're running 11.8 CFE BLK OK.

Any ideas on what to try?

I got a bunch of Noslers CC 190gr bullets for cheap a load them up with 11gr H4198.  I dont like the idea of shooting coated bullets through a sealed suppressor.

Not busting on you in anyway. Not that you'd probably care anyways

What you just described all boils down to personal responsibility of the shooter. Let's assume that if a person is going to use a sub to hunt with they are responsible enough to know exactly what they are capable of doing.

I've hunted hog with subs, a .17 HMR as well have my buddies and never had one run off.

You can not put everyone in the same group nor judge everyone the same. Yes of coarse there are better calibers to hunt with.

But no matter what anyone hunts with. Someone will say something else is better.

But every time someone wants to try something different they get a lecture as to why they should not do it. The poster that said shot placement had a lot to do with it was right.

If you shoot the animal in the ass with sub it will run away. But if you put a good shot in it with a good bullet and even in some cases a fmj if you hit them in the brain. It will kill them.

You just have to adjust your shooting and way of thinking. Also is it worth hunting quitely. Hell yes it is. To some anyways. Also using subs is ALOT QUIETER than supers, not just a little.

If your hunting close to houses subs are the way to go. Especially if it is at night. BTW I also use a 6.8 spc suppressed also. I also use the barnes 110 tac ammo also.

But I do hunt suppressed with subs to. You can kill just as effectively with subs as with anything else. If you know what your doing.

If you take the time to learn what your gear can do. If a person does not know how their weapon shoots. It would not matter if it were a sub or super.

They'll still screw up. Hunting with subsonic ammunition is not hard nor complicated. But some people have a tendency to make things more complicated than they are.

I'd also equate the sub to a 45 acp instead of a 9mm that are shot are under 100 yd. Again knowing what your weapon can do is the key to success no matter what calibers you use. Also practice.

The OP simply by posting here. Tells me that he's a responsible person and showing the initiative to learn what he must do to be effective.

I'm positive he'll do great hunting with his 300 blkout in subsonic as have many other people here have. There's some great advise on bullets being given here also.

Have a great time OP. I just had knee replacement surgery so I could tear the hog up this fall, winter and spring down here.

To hot in the summer and bugs are to bad. I will be using my 300 blkout sometimes and shooting subs.

Oh yeah I'll be using a 17 HMR ALSO. LOL but that's from s blind and up close at a feeder and brain shots. They drop no running. Do that with just one older guy because it's his property and that's what he allows.

That coating stays intact even after berm impact.

The Maker bullet expands beautifully in water. I’ve tried both the 300 Blk and 458 Socom versions and managed to catch one of each.

I use 220 Lapua Scenar-L bullets for my plinking subs (I got a REALLY good deal on a bunch in the winter) over 10.5 grains of VV N120.

I also like 4227 for subs, but they aren’t as reliable in my X95.

I'm not disagreeing with your post, but this would be a very large assumption to make.
With some shooters, when they get a new toy the first question is "what can I hunt with it?"
They'll sight in at 100yd with their new suppressed SBR with subs, and then one day a nice 10pt will walk out at 150yd, buck fever kicks in, and the temptation is too great.

This of course is not everyone, but speaking from experience with other hunters, there are those that limit themselves with their equipment choices while being overconfident in their abilities with that equipment.

I spent some time in the desert a couple of weeks ago with my chrono and laptop, trying to answer for myself the same question as the OP. I tried about a dozen different loads, using A1680 and Lil' Gun. I loaded both supers and subs. The best data that I took home that day was that the cheapest round I loaded turned out to work the best for me. I was shooting a 16" 1/8 BA barrel with a pistol length gas system. Standard BCG and standard weight JP captured spring buffer. I was using a YHM titanium can. The data is below for the Berry's 200 grain plated bullet over Lil'Gun. It is not all the data from the day, as it was a darn good day, but it is what mattered to me.

This is a plinking round, but the groups were 1.5 MOA with the 8.1gr load, and very consistent and quiet. I was so happy with it that I came home and loaded up several hundred.

LilGun
8.1200 berry
Shot fps
1

1062
2

1081
3

1091
4

1089

Avg  1081
ES    29
S.D.11.45

I have helped sight in guns for a lot of people over the years. Some couldn’t hit a large hay bale at 100 yards with a 270. And some can’t shoot worth a lick with a B.B. gun. It’s all about shot placement and understanding what your equipment will or will not do.

The bullet I mentioned above has a minimum expansion velocity of ~900 fps iirc. I’m sure the similar products from Lehigh have similar performance.  He’ll run out of elevation adjustment before it drops down slow enough for that to be a problem.

That said, shot placement will be a problem. Using the numbers from my own data, it looks like the difference between 100y and 150y is nearly a foot of extra drop.

That was not the experience I had with other coated bullets. The lands wore the coating down to bare lead and there was flecks left in the can. I stopped using them until I got a serviceable can.

However, they did shoot pretty well so there is that.

As far as cheap bullets I like to buy the 200+ gr Hornady's at 10-15% off from Cabelas and for really good deals I buy Nosler seconds from Shooter Pro Shop. I have had good luck with their 190's and up but obviously their 220's are awesome.

No screaming deals just yet but the stock doesn't last long when they are there.

http://www.shootersproshop.com/loading-reloading-bullets/shopby/f/caliber/30/isAjax/1.html

Midway USA has Seconds from other manufacturers too they occasionally mark way down.

If loading for hunting, make sure it expands with subsonic velocities.  I have been using Lehigh Defense 194gr ME and they also offer the CF 174gr as well.  Works very well subsonic/suppressed for PA whitetail.  Not cheap, but works very well.

While you do still get a fair amount of the coating that stays on the bullet, my experience has been that you get a significant amount of buildup in a silencer.

See Here.