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Posted: 9/1/2023 9:03:28 AM EST
[#1]
Quoted: I have a 1-6 on my 16" rifle. I've had issues with astigmatism in the past but recently sold the one RDS that I had zero issues with. Thinking about an EXPS3-1 with a holosun magnifier. I will be using mostly 77g SMKs with this build and have access to 3-400 yard range frequently. It is my cqb/night/mid range pretty much this is what im grabbing if shit goes down. That being said I have a good stash of 62g black hills TSX so an etched reticle with a top mounted mini dot would be ideal. ACOG/RMR is out of my price range. I've used an nx8 and was pleased with it on the 12.5 Now I have an atacr. I understand it's out of your price range. I'm good from 0-800 with mk262's. I'm getting 2650 fps with 262's, an explorr, and a 12.5 core |
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Posted: 9/1/2023 9:43:11 AM EST
[#2]
Do your eyes have any issues with the T2?
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Posted: 9/1/2023 9:44:29 AM EST
[#3]
2.5x10 Nightforce
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Posted: 9/1/2023 10:11:52 AM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do your eyes have any issues with the T2? Ive never gotten my hands on one. I know the eotechs don't mess with my eyes as much. Most RDS iv'e played with even my credohx have some sort of starburst effect unless i'm in broad daylight. |
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Posted: 9/1/2023 10:15:56 AM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 2.5x10 Nightforce thoguht about trying to find an nxs or shv for my 16" gun and put a rds on top, then moving my lpvo to the 12.5. I really would like the capability for very quick 50 and in shots on this setup with intermediate range capability being secondary. |
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Posted: 9/1/2023 10:39:33 AM EST
[#6]
My 12.5" has had a Steiner P4Xi, Delta Styker HD 1-6X, and now wears an EXPS 3-0 with Primary Arms micro magnifier. I had taken it out to 550 on steel with the Delta, which was great for that, but I find most of my actual shooting is 200yards and less. For that I prefer a dot, of which I prefer an EOTech. I grabbed a magnifier for 200 and beyond. I have a 16" with 4-16X if I really need to be accurate at distance.
ETA: There isn't much of a need IMO for bullet drop hashes or mil hashes out to 300. I can easily do that with the dot and magnifier. I plan to shoot Cola Warrior Northwest with the 16" in February, but I am going to mess around with my current 12.5" setup to see how I can do from 300-550 with it. |
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Posted: 9/1/2023 12:37:11 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My 12.5" has had a Steiner P4Xi, Delta Styker HD 1-6X, and now wears an EXPS 3-0 with Primary Arms micro magnifier. I had taken it out to 550 on steel with the Delta, which was great for that, but I find most of my actual shooting is 200yards and less. For that I prefer a dot, of which I prefer an EOTech. I grabbed a magnifier for 200 and beyond. I have a 16" with 4-16X if I really need to be accurate at distance. ETA: There isn't much of a need IMO for bullet drop hashes or mil hashes out to 300. I can easily do that with the dot and magnifier. I plan to shoot Cola Warrior Northwest with the 16" in February, but I am going to mess around with my current 12.5" setup to see how I can do from 300-550 with it. This is really what i'm leaning towards. Especially if I can get into some night vision in the next year. (thermal first) |
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Posted: 9/1/2023 12:39:29 PM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is really what i'm leaning towards. Especially if I can get into some night vision in the next year. (thermal first) That's another reason I jumped on an EXPS. Not sure when it will happen, but it will. |
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Posted: 9/1/2023 12:46:09 PM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's another reason I jumped on an EXPS. Not sure when it will happen, but it will. Yep i remember you from the other 12.5 threat i had going. I left a space on the front of my rail for a laser. lol Trying to get used to sucking in my grip a bit to accommodate the fun parts up front. |
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Posted: 9/1/2023 3:05:29 PM EST
[#10]
Either a Romeo 5 or Romeo 5XDR, can't remember. "Nothing Fancy" (no pun intended)
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Posted: 9/2/2023 1:49:32 AM EST
[#11]
Quoted: ACOG/RMR is out of my price range. Even if you buy used and replace the rmr with a holosun? Cause if I were you that's exactly what I'd do. In fact, that is what I do. |
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Posted: 9/2/2023 7:45:35 AM EST
[#12]
Red dots have always been my go-to sight option, because it allows both eyes open and fits my primary use of close and mid range. I have magnifiers on qd mounts for occasions that I want/need to reach out for farther hits and/or get a better view of the target area.
The kicker is that my eyes have always seen a comma instead of a clean dot with my Aimpoint Micro H1, Acro P2, and both Leupold deltapoint pros. My original 3x primary arms magnifier has always just enlarged the comma along with the target. My newer Aimpoint 3x-c sorta fixes the dot and my newest eotech 5x actually produces a clean, albeit larger dot. I've always just worked around it by zeroing off the top of the comma, but in recent years, the comma has begun to bloom and is causing my hits to open up a bit. Years ago, my cousin had an Eotech xps that I never shot with but did take notice of its nice crisp and round dot. I still always wrote them off due to their extra size and weight compared to my tiny red dots. The bloomed comma finally broke me down and I decided to roll the dice on an Eotech, not knowing if I'd still see a clean dot after all these years. I opted for the EXPS3-2 because it's buttons are on the side to clear a magnifier and it has NV for when I eventually delve into that. Happy to say, i still see a crisp dot with it. And furthermore, the holographic dot doesn't increase in size in front of the magnifier like the led dots, so precision at all distances is left entirely up to me. I don't yet have a lot of time behind it, but the EXPS3-2 and 5x magnifier is looking like a great combo to take advantage of both the 50/200 and 500 yard dots that stay a consistent 1 moa in size. The sight now lives on my go-to AR, with the 5x close by. |
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Posted: 9/2/2023 9:22:22 AM EST
[#13]
Took the hx off the 16” gun and ran it around like this. I like it but damn 1.5 height just isn’t it. 1.93 is more comfortable all day when doing some heads up stuff. I was trying to keep this setup as light as I could. However with an sb2 clearing (hopefully soon) and a laser I doubt it’ll happen. The credo is very easy to use up close. Not quite as fast as a dot but very comparable. Acog RMR ish setup sounds great but finding a used acog for my budget just isn’t feasible. I have about $700. If I were to leave the credo on this I would have to find something for my 16” gun in the 2-10 range and put a dot on it which could end up doable.
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Posted: 9/2/2023 9:54:28 AM EST
[#14]
You could always grab a Primary Arms micro prism and ADM mount, then an offset mount and Holosun. @-OdieGreen- is running a similar setup and happy with it the last I saw.
https://www.ar15.com/forums/AR-15/Primary-Arms-SLX-3X-Microprism/18-765865/?page=16#i8553530 |
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Posted: 9/2/2023 12:48:36 PM EST
[#15]
Just swapped out my LMT (MARS-L) upper's barrel w/a 12.5" mid-length barrel on a registered SR-15 lower...Elcan w/a Docter RDS. I've not gone past 300 yards (my range's longest) with this, but consistently bang steel 80% of time using 55gr milsurp.
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Posted: 9/2/2023 2:04:56 PM EST
[#16]
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Posted: 9/2/2023 8:49:32 PM EST
[#17]
1-8 credo
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Posted: 9/2/2023 9:26:20 PM EST
[#18]
If you're looking to go budget oriented, I'd seriously consider getting a 3X PA and a good mount for it. You'd come in under budget. My 11.5 has a TA33 and I think it's a perfect set up for my needs. The PA is the same concept. A light, compact 3X. I've gone back and forth with adding an RMR, but in the end I don't think I need it. Shooting a 3X up close, with both eyes open isn't difficult and I'm not competing, where 10ths of a second matter. Check out some of the threads on the PA 3X.
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Posted: 9/4/2023 5:06:20 PM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ive never gotten my hands on one. I know the eotechs don't mess with my eyes as much. Most RDS iv'e played with even my credohx have some sort of starburst effect unless i'm in broad daylight. Very curious about your experience with the Credo HX. 1-6 SFP with the LED dot hunter reticle I presume? That dot produces same symptoms as a red dot? I've also entered the astigmatic world and have been adapting optic choices accordingly. I was looking to pick one of those up for my MCX. Even picked up a 1.93 scalarworks for it from the EE already. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 6:56:42 PM EST
[#20]
Right now my 12.5 is running a swampfox arrowhead 1-10 on it. I can reliably make hits out to 500 yards with it.
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Posted: 9/4/2023 9:45:49 PM EST
[#21]
TA44
Super lightweight and compact Definitely use it more often for 100y and in, but I've taken it out to 300-400y no problem so long as the targets are clear and you know your holds (or have a sufficiently large target) |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:39:51 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Very curious about your experience with the Credo HX. 1-6 SFP with the LED dot hunter reticle I presume? That dot produces same symptoms as a red dot? I've also entered the astigmatic world and have been adapting optic choices accordingly. I was looking to pick one of those up for my MCX. Even picked up a 1.93 scalarworks for it from the EE already. Yes. However outside it is not noticeable until setting 9/10. I keep my on 6/7. I love that optic on my 16” gun. I don’t use the LPVO to make retarded long shots though. More of getting those tight shots within 300. It truly runs close to a RDS. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:52:59 PM EST
[#23]
k16i in a NF mount
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Posted: 9/5/2023 7:59:21 AM EST
[#24]
On a budget, a P4Xi (old reticle, not new) in a 1.93” mount works well on a 12.5” and is astigmatism friendly. Very bright dot, reticle hashes line up pretty close. Definitely get you to 500 pretty easily. Lightweight and compact, quick to use in conventional positions.
You asked what we use on our 12.5’s, but I don’t have astigmatism: Comp M4s in Larue lower third, A2 fixed BUIS. T2 in Scalarworks 1.93”. T2 in Scalarworks 1.93”, Aimpoint 3x in Scalarworks 1.93” FTS QD. VCOG in Unity 2.05” My P4Xi in ADM Recon H 1.93” is on a different gun right now. I’m looking to replace one of my T2s with a Comp M5b, just because. I don’t think any of my other LPVOs are particularly well-suited for a 12.5”. I don’t yet know what I’m going to do with this info, but I recently learned that a 508t in a Arisaka offset mount lines up with a flipped-to-the-side magnifier in a Scalarworks mount. For people who’s astigmatism is corrected by looking through a magnifier, this might be a useful zeroing trick for a offset dot. Dunno the practicality yet, just found it interesting. |
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Posted: 9/5/2023 8:30:34 AM EST
[#25]
Kino transplanted to a ute2 upper receiver. Irons.
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Posted: 9/5/2023 8:45:38 AM EST
[#26]
I went with a 1-6x Razor and offset ACRO. I thought about swapping the optic setups on these two, but my 12.5" is my go-to, do-most rifle so I figured an LPVO would be a better choice.
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Posted: 9/5/2023 9:05:54 AM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Kino transplanted to a ute2 upper receiver. Irons. The one I use a Comp M4 lower third with fixed A2 BUIS is a Kino. Its a classy gun. |
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Posted: 9/5/2023 8:02:38 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes. However outside it is not noticeable until setting 9/10. I keep my on 6/7. I love that optic on my 16” gun. I don’t use the LPVO to make retarded long shots though. More of getting those tight shots within 300. It truly runs close to a RDS. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Very curious about your experience with the Credo HX. 1-6 SFP with the LED dot hunter reticle I presume? That dot produces same symptoms as a red dot? I've also entered the astigmatic world and have been adapting optic choices accordingly. I was looking to pick one of those up for my MCX. Even picked up a 1.93 scalarworks for it from the EE already. Yes. However outside it is not noticeable until setting 9/10. I keep my on 6/7. I love that optic on my 16” gun. I don’t use the LPVO to make retarded long shots though. More of getting those tight shots within 300. It truly runs close to a RDS. Thanks for the feedback. I guess I'll have to try it and see. Maybe go with a vendor who will accept returns and exchange if need be. That reticle was looking very attractive for an SBR that will spend most of it's time at 1x. |
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Posted: 9/6/2023 12:13:36 PM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thanks for the feedback. I guess I'll have to try it and see. Maybe go with a vendor who will accept returns and exchange if need be. That reticle was looking very attractive for an SBR that will spend most of it's time at 1x. It really shines at x1. I love it. There just isn’t a lot of rail space available on my 12.5 w/ an mcmr 10. Also my 12.5 is my indoors/city go to gun. I’m just not quite as fast with it. I think it would serve best on my recce rifle honestly if I had the $$ I would put a 3x9 or 2x10 on my 16” with a top mounted rds. And do a rds/mag on my 12.5 I just don’t want to get rid of the credo hx because it is a super nice optic that would fit very well on a future build and be a great placeholder in my recce gun. I want to grab a colt A4 at some point and toss the credo in that in a 1.93 mount for a fun gun. |
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Posted: 9/6/2023 1:02:28 PM EST
[#30]
EOTech EXPS3 and G33 magnifier.
12.5" Hodge SBR |
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Posted: 9/7/2023 10:03:17 AM EST
[#31]
I’m sure you are seeing in all the recommendations in this thread that you are creeping right back into the ACOG price point. $700 on the EE will get you a TA33 horseshoe (I got one a bit below that last year).
I would go that route and save for a piggybacked RMR when you can. The TA33 is perfect for that barrel length with 62/69s and the RMR on top gives you back the heads up shooting position you are after with t higher mounts while still getting that good cheek weld for reaching out a bit further. 
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Posted: 9/8/2023 3:59:44 AM EST
[#32]
What offset mount are you using for the Acro? I dig it
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Posted: 9/8/2023 8:01:31 AM EST
[#33]
Quoted: ...Thinking about an EXPS3-1 with a holosun magnifier.... Why the Holosun magnifier? The Eotech magnifier should be with the Eotech! It's practically the law! 
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Posted: 9/8/2023 12:56:09 PM EST
[#34]
For right now, a PA 2.5 prism that I got on sale.
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Posted: 9/8/2023 3:29:21 PM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What offset mount are you using for the Acro? I dig it Arisaka offset. Awesome mount |
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Posted: 9/8/2023 4:41:17 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why the Holosun magnifier? The Eotech magnifier should be with the Eotech! It's practically the law! They’re cheaper. I’ve owned one before. I’ve used the eotech magnifier too. I cannot tell a difference in the two really. Why pay $300 for a name when you can get as far as I can tell the same for $150 |
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Posted: 9/8/2023 7:57:07 PM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They’re cheaper. I’ve owned one before. I’ve used the eotech magnifier too. I cannot tell a difference in the two really. Why pay $300 for a name when you can get as far as I can tell the same for $150 That's why I have a primary arms micro magnifier behind mine. I was able to compare it side but side with a G33. G33 has slightly higher magnification, but the PA honestly seems clearer. |
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Posted: 9/8/2023 7:59:32 PM EST
[#38]
I have the vortex 5x prism on mine, I have made first shot shits on steel out to 400.
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Posted: 9/9/2023 11:54:16 AM EST
[#39]
Trying to keep it lightweight. Too many rds options. The primary arms prisms look great but I can’t stand chevron reticles. Honestly I might just put a holosun 403r and hm3x magnifier on it. I don’t think I’ll have night vision anytime soon and I’ll have a thermal before that on a dedicated night gun/hunting rig. Idea is to be able to carry both with the 12.5 carrying me throughout the day.
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Posted: 9/9/2023 9:52:17 PM EST
[#40]
NX8 1-8 capped with fcdmx reticle mounted in a NF 1.93 Ultramount.
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Posted: 9/10/2023 10:54:57 AM EST
[#41]
wish there was aimpoint reliability with a more crisp reticle. I guess you can't have your cake and eat it too. Holosun crispness with aimpoint reliability. The options are real. Even a Ta31 ECOS up in the EE for $999 shipped. wish i had about $300 more in my budget. I would snag the fuck out of that.
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Posted: 9/10/2023 5:51:45 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: TA44 Super lightweight and compact Definitely use it more often for 100y and in, but I've taken it out to 300-400y no problem so long as the targets are clear and you know your holds (or have a sufficiently large target) That. |
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Posted: 9/10/2023 10:15:23 PM EST
[#43]
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Posted: 9/12/2023 11:05:23 PM EST
[#44]
Trijicon REAP-IR
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Posted: 9/13/2023 6:15:04 AM EST
[#45]
Mine has the PA GLX 2x prism. Just waiting for its suppressor to clear the second time through.
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Posted: 9/13/2023 7:01:29 AM EST
[#46]
12.5 is that weird in-between length, so it needs that weird in-between optic (ta33)
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Posted: 9/13/2023 7:07:27 AM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You could always grab a Primary Arms micro prism and ADM mount, then an offset mount and Holosun. @-OdieGreen- is running a similar setup and happy with it the last I saw. https://www.ar15.com/forums/AR-15/Primary-Arms-SLX-3X-Microprism/18-765865/?page=16#i8553530 I have the Gen III prism on my 12.5. But it's going to get a hand me down micro 3x when I get the micro 5x for its 16" big brother. |
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Posted: 9/13/2023 10:27:41 AM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 12.5 is that weird in-between length, so it needs that weird in-between optic (ta33) TA33 horseshoe is great at 12” for me with 62gr BTHP using a 50yd zero. 69gr is also well within 1MOA for me and my load and both are verified out to 600yds, after which I go transonic anyway. But as always, BDC reticles are useless if you don’t know your velocities. 
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Posted: 9/13/2023 5:51:12 PM EST
[#49]
I have a eotech exps2 on my 12.5, on a unity riser.
I want a 5x magnifier on the unity mount, but $$$. my brother, hes into NV pretty big, and had the setup I have currently, exps3 though, he liked it...but it was heavy.. and not that far off price wise from a acog TA02 with RMR on top. he says its night and day lighter too. he yanked off the EO and bought a TA02 with RMR on top up front. RMR works well under nods, not sure how the acog is, but having the fixed 4x he said is awesome, hes covered up close with the RMR and is good to reach out. idk, thats what he tells me. it makes sense..he has astigmatism as well. |
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Posted: 9/13/2023 6:25:26 PM EST
[#50]
Both of my 12.5s have a P4Xi in a 1.93” NF Ultramount
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