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CA, USA
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Posted: 2/13/2023 10:23:50 PM EDT
I have an AR-15 with a built in QD attachment hole in the aluminum handguard, which is keymod. I can't see inside the handguard, but the QD hole doesn't appear to be reinforced or anything like that. I'm just wondering if anyone has had bad experiences with this kind of setup. The fear is that over time, or with abuse, the strap could bend or otherwise disform the handguard around the QD hole.
I'm inclined to think it's ok, since the handguard was designed like this, and it seems like most handguards these days have QD holes near where it meets the receiver. Any help appreciated. |
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Posted: 2/13/2023 10:40:52 PM EDT
[#1]
Some handguards do have a reinforcing collar (Geissele is one) but I haven’t heard of issues with it being a problem unreinforced.
Especially if you are patrol carrying over your chest, muzzle down, the weight would mostly be on the buttstock end anyway. |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 2/14/2023 12:13:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: ARgonot]
[#2]
I've noticed that a lot of handguards (obviously constructed of aluminum) often have integrated machined QD sling sockets. I've often wondered if the sling's steel QD connectors could over time wear the aluminum sockets. I've also noticed that often the more expensive, if not over priced, aluminum handguards often have steel QD sling mounts inserted within them. GrovTech have several different threaded QD sling socket inserts that can be used for a relatively cheap price if you shop around. I've used them many times. If concerned, you can drill your handguard out, run a thread tap, screw these in using Loktite and rest assured they will not strip out.
I highly doubt that a sling socket near the muzzle end of a handguard will cause damage/warping of the handguard. If I'm wrong then I'd be open to see evidence to the contrary. |
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Posted: 2/14/2023 4:23:25 PM EDT
[#3]
Just run and gun on the range with mine, but it's still doing good after 10 years of use.
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USA
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Posted: 2/14/2023 5:29:27 PM EDT
[#4]
The chances of you or anyone blowing-out an aluminum QD socket are slim. That said, it can happen.
This is an option if you desire steel reinforcement. |
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Posted: 2/22/2023 3:50:55 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WTFShane: Just run and gun on the range with mine, but it's still doing good after 10 years of use. I haven't had any problems with the Al hole blowing out either. |
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WI, USA
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Posted: 4/25/2023 4:43:38 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ed_Victory: The chances of you or anyone blowing-out an aluminum QD socket are slim. That said, it can happen. This is an option if you desire steel reinforcement. Thanks, just what I was looking for! |
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Posted: 4/25/2023 7:08:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: -OdieGreen-]
[#7]
You guys want to see a dead body?
 This is the BCM made Cloud Defensive rail. This was after 5-7k rounds, and it got used a lot. It still holds unless the swivel is pulling straight out with a little oomph. I switched to a single point now since it’s an HD gun. You can see where it’s egged out and rolled at the back, likely from the extra tension from slinging up. I also had a Samson Rail years ago that gave out entirely after about half the round count. The external swivels hold up significantly better for some reason, even the aluminum ones. I keep a few in my spare parts bin just in case, but BCM and Expo have held up great. Also have a Rise Armament in rotation that hasn’t seen much use yet. I think the new Geissele sockets would outlast me, I just prefer a front mount. Otherwise I don’t recommend internal sockets for hard/extended use anymore.  |
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OR, USA
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Posted: 4/25/2023 7:54:30 PM EDT
[#8]
I do know that if it pulls out and the muzzle is pointed at the top of your foot while in flip flops that you get a cool purple bruise about the size of an A2 FH.
That was with a PSA handguard. I use a para clip for the front now. |
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WY, USA
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Posted: 4/25/2023 10:04:48 PM EDT
[#9]
On my DDM4V7 the socket cut outs use a reinforced moveable collar. I don't think I've worn any out in any other guns but that's the first I'd seen a collar.
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OH, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2023 9:37:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: HunterKiller86]
[#10]
An aluminum socket will eventually give out when used with steel QD swivels- its just how steel interacts with other materials.
The FCD socket is your absolute best bet IMO. I believe BCM and magpul make steel ones as well. |
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Posted: 5/3/2023 10:42:14 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By -OdieGreen-: You guys want to see a dead body? https://i.ibb.co/6rD9fgY/55-A28-A1-C-4608-4-EB0-A587-3-EBE6-FF4-F11-E.jpg This is the BCM made Cloud Defensive rail. This was after 5-7k rounds, and it got used a lot. It still holds unless the swivel is pulling straight out with a little oomph. I switched to a single point now since it’s an HD gun. You can see where it’s egged out and rolled at the back, likely from the extra tension from slinging up. I also had a Samson Rail years ago that gave out entirely after about half the round count. The external swivels hold up significantly better for some reason, even the aluminum ones. I keep a few in my spare parts bin just in case, but BCM and Expo have held up great. Also have a Rise Armament in rotation that hasn’t seen much use yet. I think the new Geissele sockets would outlast me, I just prefer a front mount. Otherwise I don’t recommend internal sockets for hard/extended use anymore. https://i.ibb.co/0MW5PvS/CC07-A1-BA-606-E-407-D-9-BC6-7493-FB73833-C.jpg On some of the Geissele rails, the QD socket is positioned so that you cannot use a standard QD sling swivel. Kind of a disappointing lack of use testing. |
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Posted: 5/3/2023 11:04:03 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FightingHellfish: On some of the Geissele rails, the QD socket is positioned so that you cannot use a standard QD sling swivel. Kind of a disappointing lack of use testing. I believe this was only the old models where the socket was built in the rail. The new ones use the insert so it should be able to work no matter what. |
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Posted: 5/3/2023 12:04:42 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By -OdieGreen-: I believe this was only the old models where the socket was built in the rail. The new ones use the insert so it should be able to work no matter what. Here’s a newer G rail, with insert, not compatible with standard QD swivel. Magpul in this case.  Attached File |
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Posted: 5/3/2023 4:49:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: -OdieGreen-]
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FightingHellfish: Here’s a newer G rail, with insert, not compatible with standard QD swivel. Magpul in this case. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/64501/FFC57196-7EB3-44BA-9A3B-76B7B5F24556_jpe-2804383.JPG Ah. I’m not a fan of the Mk14 and Mk16 rails so that I didn’t know. I can confirm the Magpul sockets work with both the Mk4 and Mk8. I thought they said the sockets were the same but maybe not? ETA: Never mind, I see what you mean. It runs into the rail. I’ve had a few stocks where I had to run it out of position due to the anti rotation and never had any real issues with. I do a lot of offhand shooting putting a lot of pressure on the sling too. I’d just run it horizontal if need be.  
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2023 10:19:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Stowe]
[#15]
Quote HistoryBCM definitely has a steel mloc socket. I have one Edit: I've never had a problem with aluminum sockets, but as much as I vary my guns I probably haven't given any particular one enough time to fail |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/5/2023 9:05:47 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HunterKiller86: An aluminum socket will eventually give out when used with steel QD swivels- it's just how steel interacts with other materials. |
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Posted: 5/5/2023 9:18:30 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HunterKiller86: An aluminum socket will eventually give out when used with steel QD swivels- its just how steel interacts with other materials. The FCD socket is your absolute best bet IMO. I believe BCM and magpul make steel ones as well. This^. It’s the one I use. Melonited steel, it will endure. |
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Posted: 5/9/2023 1:40:00 AM EDT
[#18]
I’ll add the FCD / SOLGW QD mount is the only way to go. I’ve had an aluminum mount fail in a carbine course.
Also, MK16 rails integral QD slots are useless. Doesn’t matter if they have the gold insert or not. |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 5/9/2023 8:26:45 AM EDT
[#19]
I believe the URX4 has a steel reinforced QD socket built into the rear of the handguard. I am not aware of any other handguards with steel reinforced built-in QD sockets.
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/9/2023 8:53:24 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HunterKiller86: I believe the URX4 has a steel reinforced QD socket built into the rear of the handguard. I am not aware of any other handguards with steel reinforced built-in QD sockets. My magnet said nope on my URX4. |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 5/9/2023 1:10:45 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HunterKiller86: I believe the URX4 has a steel reinforced QD socket built into the rear of the handguard. I am not aware of any other handguards with steel reinforced built-in QD sockets. These manufacturers do and I know there's many more: LaRue Tactical Geissele Daniel Defense Midwest Industries |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 5/9/2023 1:11:49 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ArizonaRifleman: My magnet said nope on my URX4. Could be stainless steel. |
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Posted: 5/10/2023 9:54:46 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ARgonot: These manufacturers do and I know there's many more: LaRue Tactical Geissele Daniel Defense Midwest Industries Cross Machine and Tool (CMT) Added one to the list. |
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Posted: 5/10/2023 9:54:12 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ARgonot: Could be stainless steel. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ARgonot: Originally Posted By ArizonaRifleman: My magnet said nope on my URX4. Could be stainless steel. There are indeed steel, whether ole boy's magnet is broke or not. Definitely NOT aluminum. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/11/2023 12:35:21 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ARgonot: Could be stainless steel. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ARgonot: Originally Posted By ArizonaRifleman: My magnet said nope on my URX4. Could be stainless steel. That's a good possibility. Magnet definitely worked though as it stuck right to the barrel immediately afterwards and as we all should know the only type of stainless that a magnet won't attract to has austenitic crystal structure as not all stainless will attract magnets. This should have been known. Thanks for pointing this out as it does make more sense. The sockets can be removed internally or using the swivel itself to remove and are installed after the URX4 comes back from anodizing. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2023 9:00:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: KissMethod17]
[#26]
if you are a fan of using a Magpul Paraclip instead of the traditional QD sling swivel, Magpul makes the QD Paraclip adapter. The adapter installs into any QD socket including those integrated into handguards. These install very tightly and have not loosened up one bit. There is no rotational movement when installed, you basically pick which direction you want the "loop" to point. The adapters look like they could also work with HK hooks, mash hooks, etc. Since it does not move, no wear occurs on the socket, despite the adapters being made of steel.
I prefer using a paraclip on the front end of my sling as its easier to undo for me, particularly when wearing gloves and is even quicker to detach than traditional QD sling swivels IMO. I have had integral QD sockets wear out to a point where their anti-rotational benefits no longer worked and it would free-spin. These were only on handguards that were not reinforced with a steel socket, but were part of the aluminum machine work. I have a feeling that over more time and use the sockets would have failed all-together. The adapters take up space that was already taken up by the integral QD sockets themselves. Its nice to be able to reliably use that space now and without worry of wearing out the aluminum there. This aspect is more important if you have limited rail space such as a carbine-length handguard or, in my particular case, a DDM4V3 with its mid-length quad rail. https://magpul.com/qd-paraclip-adapter.html?mp_global_color=118 |
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Posted: 5/26/2023 1:59:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: erwinp]
[#27]
If the gun sees use, the steel QD will eventually wear an aluminum QD slot. For the price (~$20ish), it's cheap to just add a steel QD socket where you want it and never have to worry.
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Posted: 5/26/2023 1:59:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: erwinp]
[#28]
Accidental double post.
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NV, USA
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Posted: 8/15/2023 6:15:41 AM EDT
[#29]
Besides BCM and FCD, who else makes a steel M-lok QD socket?
I made the mistake of buying a Magpul and Arisaka socket before finding out they’re aluminum so ended up returning them. Will prob go BCM |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 8/15/2023 7:05:29 AM EDT
[#30]
I'd just go with one of those 2 and call it good. Both of my main "go to" ARs have the BCM ones. They're solid
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NV, USA
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Posted: 8/15/2023 10:16:23 PM EDT
[#31]
yeah BCM it is!
you would think magpul, blue force gear, and arisaka would use steel since they’re charging $20+ per socket |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 8/16/2023 5:00:37 AM EDT
[#32]
There's a good chance that if you'd never been to AR15.com, you could live your entire life with an aluminum one and never realize how close you'd come to near certain death. However, threads like this one are why I'm running around with a steel socket mounted right next to the built in aluminum one
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OR, USA
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Posted: 8/21/2023 6:49:14 PM EDT
[#33]
Tie sling on with parachute cord
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Posted: 8/21/2023 8:11:44 PM EDT
[#34]
We will soon have a fixed steel sling loop mount for both Pic rails and MLOK. QD swivels have their places, I rarely use them, if you have a ling with an emergency quick release, it might be better to use a fixed sling loop and eliminate the QD swivel and the cost.
The problem with QD swivel is their quality varies, it adds another part that can fail if you got an el cheapo one made in China. As for QD mounts, sockets should have helicoil inserts, or be made in steel. Steel vs. aluminum, aluminum will give way much sooner. |
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Posted: 8/22/2023 6:30:03 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Duffy: We will soon have a fixed steel sling loop mount for both Pic rails and MLOK. QD swivels have their places, I rarely use them, if you have a ling with an emergency quick release, it might be better to use a fixed sling loop and eliminate the QD swivel and the cost. The problem with QD swivel is their quality varies, it adds another part that can fail if you got an el cheapo one made in China. As for QD mounts, sockets should have helicoil inserts, or be made in steel. Steel vs. aluminum, aluminum will give way much sooner. That is exactly what I've been doing with a QR buckle sling, except with paracord to secure the sling to the rifle. I can't wait to see what you guys come up with. |
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