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Posted: 7/18/2021 11:20:09 AM EDT
[#1]
Maybe and adjustable gas port??????
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Posted: 7/18/2021 11:22:59 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Maybe and adjustable gas port?????? Should have added that I don't want to add that. I have some 5000+ rounds on this set up that worked flawlessly before the new captured spring. |
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Posted: 7/18/2021 11:35:33 AM EDT
[#3]
What weight buffer and spring were you running before the SCS?
Should be a 1:1. The SCS with 3 steel weights in a carbine buffer, 1 Tungsten weight = H1, etc. There are also 5 different springs that can tune the SCS. I don't recall the colors offhand but it's easy enough to look them up to see if you're running the 1:1 spring equivalent. There is certainly a school of thought that would say dealing with overgassing is to limit the gas, not play with the buffer and spring. That school of thought would say that you're fixing the symptom vs fixing the underlying issue. There is another school of thought that thinks if it's not malfunctioning, then run it as is. Don't fix it if it's not broken so to speak. A little extra gas aids in reliability which is why most come that way. Just throwing out there the options. |
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Posted: 7/18/2021 11:36:36 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Should have added that I don't want to add that. I have some 5000+ rounds on this set up that worked flawlessly before the new captured spring. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Maybe and adjustable gas port?????? Should have added that I don't want to add that. I have some 5000+ rounds on this set up that worked flawlessly before the new captured spring. So you were running flawless? Seems the answer is clear. |
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Posted: 7/18/2021 11:48:32 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What weight buffer and spring were you running before the SCS? Should be a 1:1. The SCS with 3 steel weights in a carbine buffer, 1 Tungsten weight = H1, etc. There are also 5 different springs that can tune the SCS. I don't recall the colors offhand but it's easy enough to look them up to see if you're running the 1:1 spring equivalent. There is certainly a school of thought that would say dealing with overgassing is to limit the gas, not play with the buffer and spring. That school of thought would say that you're fixing the symptom vs fixing the underlying issue. There is another school of thought that thinks if it's not malfunctioning, then run it as is. Don't fix it if it's not broken so to speak. A little extra gas aids in reliability which is why most come that way. Just throwing out there the options. I was using a Maxim Defense PDW brace but finally decided to SBR it. The brace had a special heavy buffer system in it because of the weird length. I only shoot it suppressed. Underlying issue? Why would a good upper be that overgassed with standard 55grn target loads? |
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Posted: 7/18/2021 12:21:11 PM EDT
[#6]
Was your primary reason for using the JP SCS noise mitigation? There are other ways to address that. There are also a number of ways to tune the gas system beyond a adjustable gas block.
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Posted: 7/18/2021 12:28:18 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I was using a Maxim Defense PDW brace but finally decided to SBR it. The brace had a special heavy buffer system in it because of the weird length. I only shoot it suppressed. Underlying issue? Why would a good upper be that overgassed with standard 55grn target loads? What barrel do you have? Yes, most nearly every AR that is manufactured, and most barrels sold for them, use oversized gas ports to aid in cycling reliability. You run into issues undergassing WAY WAY before you run into issues overgassing it, so companies err on the side of caution and overgas from the factory. It's extremely common to the point it is nearly universal. Suppressing it even moreso. I'd go AGB in this case if it were me, but I'd try an H2 buffer first since that's cheaper to try (you need two tungsten weights) and also make sure you're running at least the medium rate spring in the SCS. Actually if it were me I'd ditch the SCS. The only place I've found them to actually be worth the squeeze is 300 BLK where the spring becomes the loudest part. 
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Posted: 7/18/2021 1:04:01 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What barrel do you have? Yes, most nearly every AR that is manufactured, and most barrels sold for them, use oversized gas ports to aid in cycling reliability. You run into issues undergassing WAY WAY before you run into issues overgassing it, so companies err on the side of caution and overgas from the factory. It's extremely common to the point it is nearly universal. Suppressing it even moreso. I'd go AGB in this case if it were me, but I'd try an H2 buffer first since that's cheaper to try (you need two tungsten weights) and also make sure you're running at least the medium rate spring in the SCS. Actually if it were me I'd ditch the SCS. The only place I've found them to actually be worth the squeeze is 300 BLK where the spring becomes the loudest part. It's a complete 12.5" MCMR upper from BCM. I guess if it's ovegassed now it was the whole time, but the heavy pistol buffer masked it. I'd also rather have it overpassed than under. This isn't a race gun it's for defensive purposes. Noise was part of it but I mostly liked just having a buttery smooth self contained spring and buffer. I just found their used guide on their site and apparently I should have definitely bought an H2. Whoops. But it looks like I can take the two tungstens off my old one and swap so I should be good I think. |
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Posted: 7/21/2021 3:15:09 PM EDT
[#9]
This is weird. I added two tungsten weights and it is still ejecting really far forward.
Should I even care? I just want to know why it ejected fine on the other one and not this. Buffer is now heavier than the last and still no change. Worn out gas rings or something? |
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Posted: 7/21/2021 4:04:50 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is weird. I added two tungsten weights and it is still ejecting really far forward. Should I even care? I just want to know why it ejected fine on the other one and not this. Buffer is now heavier than the last and still no change. Worn out gas rings or something? Did you confirm spring weight? |
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Posted: 7/21/2021 4:13:44 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Did you confirm spring weight? I called JP and they said there is no reason to switch springs when adding tungsten to make it a heavier H2/H3. They also brought up the point that the previous one I was using only had two weights total so it was actually lighter than what I'm using now. Would a heavier spring would slam the bolt forward harder/quicker increasing the problem or cause the bolt to go rearward slower delaying the forward return? It still seems to function flawlessly. Does it really even matter? |
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Posted: 8/4/2021 8:12:31 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I called JP and they said there is no reason to switch springs when adding tungsten to make it a heavier H2/H3. They also brought up the point that the previous one I was using only had two weights total so it was actually lighter than what I'm using now. Would a heavier spring would slam the bolt forward harder/quicker increasing the problem or cause the bolt to go rearward slower delaying the forward return? It still seems to function flawlessly. Does it really even matter? Have you replaced our extractor spring, oring, and or plunger in those 5k rounds? That wearing can cause a shift in ejection pattern. Are you experiencing increased gas in the face or recoil? The ejection pattern charts and such are seriously overrated and next to useless. |
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Posted: 8/4/2021 8:32:55 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So you were running flawless? Seems the answer is clear. This. The spring is the very last thing you should ever mess with in an AR. Not only are you sending yourself down a rabbit hole, you’re making the most common and high wear part into something unstandardized that throws off the balance of everything else, which costs significantly more but lasts significantly longer. |
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Posted: 8/6/2021 3:36:24 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This. The spring is the very last thing you should ever mess with in an AR. Not only are you sending yourself down a rabbit hole, you’re making the most common and high wear part into something unstandardized that throws off the balance of everything else, which costs significantly more but lasts significantly longer. Quote HistoryQuoted: This. The spring is the very last thing you should ever mess with in an AR. Not only are you sending yourself down a rabbit hole, you’re making the most common and high wear part into something unstandardized that throws off the balance of everything else, which costs significantly more but lasts significantly longer. The answer is not clear since I'm not going to be running a brace that the old SCS was fit for.... Quoted: Have you replaced our extractor spring, oring, and or plunger in those 5k rounds? That wearing can cause a shift in ejection pattern. Are you experiencing increased gas in the face or recoil? The ejection pattern charts and such are seriously overrated and next to useless. No I haven't. I guess I can throw a new BCG in and see if it changes. Bottom line, should I give a shit about ejection pattern if everything is running fine? |
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Posted: 8/9/2021 1:13:23 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bottom line, should I give a shit about ejection pattern if everything is running fine? No, but if you’re picky, kinda. The AR is designed to unlock at a specific time. When you step outside of that, you get increased wear and tear. That doesn’t mean your rifle is going to break after a few range trips by any means. Due to the excess gas and unchecked reciprocating weight, you get added stress to the bolt as the carrier speed is increased. It also means you are unlocking early, so the casing hasn’t had time to retract, causing more extractor wear and possibly chewing up your brass a bit. Ejection pattern also isn’t a 100% indicator, but typically is a good tell. I’d say shoot it with little worry while you order a heavier buffer to test. |
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