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Link Posted: 1/19/2021 9:57:52 PM EST
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Originally Posted By elucidate:
For those making actual clones, once I've thoroughly sanitized some images I'll post some examples of the huge variations between rifles.

The information to follow is specific to regional SWAT.

For this post, I wanted to touch on gas blocks. You will sometimes see the Troy if the rifle is an early conversion and it is not a regularly used gun. (they cut barrels and opened gas ports early on in this program)

For newly built uppers, or guns with replacement barrels they use Colt barrels with the Geissele gas block.

What you will see here is a gas block taken from a Gen 1 Federal rail, issued directly to Quantico with the rail (as in, contract fulfillment, this is not a commercially obtained rail), and then a picture of a regular commercial gas block that shipped with a normal G rail.

Notice they are exactly the same. At some point they may have been shipping restricted gas ports with the rails, but seemingly not now. The gas port on the barrel is 0.70.

They also do not use the pin, and only use the set screws.

Factory
https://i.imgur.com/jYXMFvN.jpg

FBI
https://i.imgur.com/ctTbAlp.jpg




View Quote


Maybe not now or currently issued guns (this could have been "fixed" with a correctly spec'd barrel via contract) but early on G had .067 restricted gas blocks. I have one on my build, I think it's one of 2 or 3 that are floating around here on the forums and was procured from someone with direct ties to G. My only regret was not buying the other 2 or 3.
Link Posted: 1/19/2021 10:04:01 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Bhavin22:

Seem some for you old guys/gals might just need your eyes checked
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Originally Posted By Bhavin22:

Seem some for you old guys/gals might just need your eyes checked



Definitely consider old guy now, lol
Link Posted: 1/20/2021 3:13:02 AM EST
Geissele has DDC rails on sale on their site currently, no other colors. I have a grey rail on my wishlist hoping it comes back in stock soon.
Link Posted: 1/20/2021 8:56:16 AM EST
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Originally Posted By kevblah:
that 100% looks gray or silver to me
View Quote

Well you are 100% wrong!
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 12:00:18 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By JLAudio:


Maybe not now or currently issued guns (this could have been "fixed" with a correctly spec'd barrel via contract) but early on G had .067 restricted gas blocks. I have one on my build, I think it's one of 2 or 3 that are floating around here on the forums and was procured from someone with direct ties to G. My only regret was not buying the other 2 or 3.
View Quote

If going with a .067 BRT gas tube, would you run it with an H2 buffer and regular carbine spring? I'm almost done getting all my parts together, deciding what to do with the gas tube and buffer assembly is really my last decision. I have a stripped 6933 barrel, which it sounds like is significantly overgassed.

If I could just throw a regular gas tube and H2 on it and be good, I would. But it sounds like a restricted gas tube or gas block is the way to go, for both clone correctness and reliability.

For reference, I'll be shooting brass 5.56 and .223. No steel.
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 12:24:38 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AZgunner:

If going with a .067 BRT gas tube, would you run it with an H2 buffer and regular carbine spring? I'm almost done getting all my parts together, deciding what to do with the gas tube and buffer assembly is really my last decision. I have a stripped 6933 barrel, which it sounds like is significantly overgassed.

If I could just throw a regular gas tube and H2 on it and be good, I would. But it sounds like a restricted gas tube or gas block is the way to go, for both clone correctness and reliability.

For reference, I'll be shooting brass 5.56 and .223. No steel.
View Quote


Thats what i run it with. I wish I grabbed one of those 6933 barrels from Apex before they sold out for a spare, it was a good deal. I use one of the older colt 11.5 heavy barrels with a .070 port but has the .067 g block. My lower is a SBR'd colt m4 carbine lower from brownells in 2018ish, swapped the buffer to a a spare colt h2 buffer i had, spring is the same carbine spring the lower arrived with. suppressor is a surefire rc or sb depending on what i grab from the range bag. muzzle device is a surefire closed tine flash hider, my favorite mount, but not correct for a SWAT clone as far as i understand.
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 9:07:20 AM EST
FYI... only the best firearms has Rock River stripped lowers in stock $125 each
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 2:12:52 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/21/2021 2:14:00 PM EST by Bhavin22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AZgunner:

If going with a .067 BRT gas tube, would you run it with an H2 buffer and regular carbine spring? I'm almost done getting all my parts together, deciding what to do with the gas tube and buffer assembly is really my last decision. I have a stripped 6933 barrel, which it sounds like is significantly overgassed.

If I could just throw a regular gas tube and H2 on it and be good, I would. But it sounds like a restricted gas tube or gas block is the way to go, for both clone correctness and reliability.

For reference, I'll be shooting brass 5.56 and .223. No steel.
View Quote

I got the same barrel and went with the brt EZTUNE mix car tube. It is .067ish if you run it with a can you need to use the H2 if you run it without a can you will need to use the car/H buffer. Hopefully that makes sense. If I run the H2 and no can it will not cycle and jam trying to load the next round.
If you don’t want to swap buffer I would just run a H with or without the can also and deal with the smaller increase in gas.
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 4:41:47 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By elucidate:
For those making actual clones, once I've thoroughly sanitized some images I'll post some examples of the huge variations between rifles.

The information to follow is specific to regional SWAT.

For this post, I wanted to touch on gas blocks. You will sometimes see the Troy if the rifle is an early conversion and it is not a regularly used gun. (they cut barrels and opened gas ports early on in this program)

For newly built uppers, or guns with replacement barrels they use Colt barrels with the Geissele gas block.

What you will see here is a gas block taken from a Gen 1 Federal rail, issued directly to Quantico with the rail (as in, contract fulfillment, this is not a commercially obtained rail), and then a picture of a regular commercial gas block that shipped with a normal G rail.

Notice they are exactly the same. At some point they may have been shipping restricted gas ports with the rails, but seemingly not now. The gas port on the barrel is 0.70.

They also do not use the pin, and only use the set screws.
View Quote

Thanks for sharing this information, it's always interesting to learn more about the real deal. I think I'll have to deviate from clone correctness when it comes to the gas block. I added the BRT gas port insert to reduce it to 0.67, since it seems ideal for a non-suppressed barrel, based on BRT's recommendation. I'm planning to have the gas block pinned too, just for a little extra security, and since it'll be hidden from view anyway.
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 4:57:14 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By JLAudio:

suppressor is a surefire rc or sb depending on what i grab from the range bag. muzzle device is a surefire closed tine flash hider, my favorite mount, but not correct for a SWAT clone as far as i understand.
View Quote


#metoo

Love my SF SOCOM RC & SB cans. I got mine on sale from Arms Unlimited a couple years ago.

I also use the Closed Tine for both.
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 5:22:54 PM EST
^ same here!
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 6:36:59 PM EST
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 6:55:15 PM EST
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 7:09:06 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By C6H12O6:


Green or black?
View Quote


It's obviously DDC, what's wrong with your eyes?
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 8:17:31 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By C6H12O6:


Green or black?
View Quote

Black. I'm going for an Agent clone, as this will be my work gun and we're only allowed to do all black furniture.
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 10:52:49 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Slu54:


It's obviously DDC, what's wrong with your eyes?
View Quote

That’s my line! What’s wrong with everyone’s eyes in here!
Link Posted: 1/22/2021 12:50:25 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bhavin22:

That’s my line! What’s wrong with everyone’s eyes in here!
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Originally Posted By Bhavin22:
Originally Posted By Slu54:


It's obviously DDC, what's wrong with your eyes?

That’s my line! What’s wrong with everyone’s eyes in here!

I should have said it's grey, just to troll everyone.
Link Posted: 1/22/2021 5:06:38 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By YardDogOne:
FYI... only the best firearms has Rock River stripped lowers in stock $125 each
View Quote


Thanks. I snagged one.  Also, does anyone know if current HRT rifles with the DDC rails are still being built with the heavy HRT style barrel or if they are using the 6933s now? I have a DDC MK4 and a 6933 barrel and don't want to try to wait for an OD rail but also don't want to shell out for a different barrel. But, if I have to then I have to.
Link Posted: 1/23/2021 12:22:46 PM EST
Well DDC rail ordered
Will run a Heavy profile barrel
Eotech
Stock- not sure
Irons- Troy
Sling- not sure
Lower- not Colt but will use an SBR lower
Link Posted: 1/23/2021 12:37:04 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By dempsy1:
Well DDC rail ordered
Will run a Heavy profile barrel
Eotech
Stock- not sure
Irons- Troy
Sling- not sure
Lower- not Colt but will use an SBR lower
View Quote


Just got my DDC a couple days ago. I’m also gonna use a hbar (Colt 11.5).

Here’s a mock-up w/ my T2 from my OD Fed:

Attachment Attached File


Will I get banned from the thread if I send the rail to “Chop Boss” for an FSB cut-out?
Link Posted: 1/23/2021 1:56:07 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By C6H12O6:


Just got my DDC a couple days ago. I’m also gonna use a hbar (Colt 11.5).

Here’s a mock-up w/ my T2 from my OD Fed:

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/123535/154233DF-15F2-443A-8C63-F7EEE72EE3B6_jpe-1792989.JPG

Will I get banned from the thread if I send the rail to “Chop Boss” for an FSB cut-out?
View Quote

Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 1/23/2021 4:00:21 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By C6H12O6:


Just got my DDC a couple days ago. I’m also gonna use a hbar (Colt 11.5).

Here’s a mock-up w/ my T2 from my OD Fed:

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/123535/154233DF-15F2-443A-8C63-F7EEE72EE3B6_jpe-1792989.JPG

Will I get banned from the thread if I send the rail to “Chop Boss” for an FSB cut-out?
View Quote



DO IT then post photos
Link Posted: 1/23/2021 4:15:21 PM EST
Lol a member replied to my EE WTB G gas block ad so rail chop won’t happen.
Link Posted: 1/23/2021 6:16:18 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By C6H12O6:
Lol a member replied to my EE WTB G gas block ad so rail chop won’t happen.
View Quote

It would look so sick with a chop! Do it
Link Posted: 1/23/2021 7:22:00 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Bhavin22:

It would look so sick with a chop! Do it
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bhavin22:
Originally Posted By C6H12O6:
Lol a member replied to my EE WTB G gas block ad so rail chop won’t happen.

It would look so sick with a chop! Do it




Attachment Attached File



Peer pressure time!
Link Posted: 1/26/2021 1:15:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/26/2021 1:15:36 PM EST by Bhavin22]
Chop!Chop!Chop!
Is it working?
Link Posted: 1/26/2021 2:55:32 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/26/2021 5:02:25 PM EST by C6H12O6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bhavin22:
Chop!Chop!Chop!
Is it working?
View Quote


Maybe if there’s enough interest I’ll take one for the team.

Attachment Attached File

Link Posted: 1/26/2021 7:58:39 PM EST
Swat with OD g19

Link Posted: 1/26/2021 8:17:15 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By C6H12O6:


Maybe if there’s enough interest I’ll take one for the team.

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/123535/46D6F898-B0E3-4AE8-ABA9-0509C1C4BEF7_jpe-1798023.JPG
View Quote


Please don't.
Link Posted: 1/26/2021 8:33:40 PM EST
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Originally Posted By AZgunner:


Please don't.
View Quote

You stay out of this!
Do it!
Link Posted: 1/26/2021 9:50:16 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bhavin22:

You stay out of this!
Do it!
View Quote View All Quotes
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Originally Posted By Bhavin22:
Originally Posted By AZgunner:


Please don't.

You stay out of this!
Do it!



Choppy McChoppinson
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 10:39:55 AM EST
Well this thread is WAY off track. Let's get it back.

This is a 100% real rifle.



Some key points:

The HRT mount is often used within Regional as well as HRT, it all depends on if said regional guys were involved in the early testing of the new rail and accessories solution, if so they tend to keep the stuff vs moving over the the DD mount. The DD mount is definitely more common though.

Commando barrels are 'the' barrel that is correct for regional SWAT. Some are converted 14.5s that are chopped, although those are now rare. More common are regular 11.5" commando barrels. The newest are Colt CAGE code marked barrels, you will see these where people have had barrels replaced. Not all barrels are Colt, although most are.

There are a good number of the RRA marked Hogue grips out there as people moved them over from their previous RRA lowers.

Colt lowers come from multiple sources, including Crane, so some are weirdly marked or older, such as the one above is a M4 Carbine, US property marked. Not an M4A1, although many are M4A1 marked.

With lasers, both PEQ15 and LA-5 are being used.

There is a large variety in the finer details, mostly related to how long the particular person has been in position.


Link Posted: 1/27/2021 12:02:43 PM EST
Nice picture and update!

Is that also the issued receiver end plate for the buffer tube?  Looks to be a Magpul plate?
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 2:46:03 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/27/2021 2:57:25 PM EST by Bhavin22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By elucidate:
Well this thread is WAY off track. Let's get it back.

This is a 100% real rifle.

https://i.imgur.com/TSIjB9I.jpg

Some key points:

The HRT mount is often used within Regional as well as HRT, it all depends on if said regional guys were involved in the early testing of the new rail and accessories solution, if so they tend to keep the stuff vs moving over the the DD mount. The DD mount is definitely more common though.

Commando barrels are 'the' barrel that is correct for regional SWAT. Some are converted 14.5s that are chopped, although those are now rare. More common are regular 11.5" commando barrels. The newest are Colt CAGE code marked barrels, you will see these where people have had barrels replaced. Not all barrels are Colt, although most are.

There are a good number of the RRA marked Hogue grips out there as people moved them over from their previous RRA lowers.

Colt lowers come from multiple sources, including Crane, so some are weirdly marked or older, such as the one above is a M4 Carbine, US property marked. Not an M4A1, although many are M4A1 marked.

With lasers, both PEQ15 and LA-5 are being used.

There is a large variety in the finer details, mostly related to how long the particular person has been in position.


View Quote

Thanks for the update. Looks like mine is pretty much 100% besides the surefire CT and RC can.
I even have the OG pre production rail with the radius cut by the receiver like to pic you posted.
Also just ordered a RRA grip to replace the Magpul

Link Posted: 1/27/2021 3:14:29 PM EST
Also any idea if that is the polymer Magpul trigger guard or the enhanced?
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 3:37:38 PM EST
Trigger guard is the metal, enhanced magpul.

Endplate is the Magpul QD.
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 3:52:02 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By elucidate:
Trigger guard is the metal, enhanced magpul.

Endplate is the Magpul QD.
View Quote

Any idea what sling most are running
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 3:59:27 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bhavin22:

Any idea what sling most are running
View Quote
Varies.

One shown is a green VTAC
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 4:27:16 PM EST
As much as I want to stay clone correct, I just don't think I can do an Ergo or Hogue grip. I'll be using my rifle on duty, so I think I'll go with a Magpul K2+.
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 4:44:19 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/27/2021 4:44:42 PM EST by Slu54]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By elucidate:

https://i.imgur.com/TSIjB9I.jpg
View Quote


Oh, so they're using those DDC rails now?
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 4:54:28 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By elucidate:
Trigger guard is the metal, enhanced magpul.
View Quote

Wow, I finally have a use for the triggerguard! I took mine off an old rifle several years ago in favor of the polymer version.

Really interesting to see the M4 lower with the sear still in place, and built on that early Colt forging. Wish those forgings were easier to come by as 80%s.
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 7:50:10 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/27/2021 7:50:31 PM EST by Bhavin22]
Just slapped the Magpul enhanced guard in and have the RRA grip inbound.
Already had the Magpul qd end plate
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 8:28:08 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By elucidate:
Well this thread is WAY off track. Let's get it back.

This is a 100% real rifle.

https://i.imgur.com/TSIjB9I.jpg

Some key points:

The HRT mount is often used within Regional as well as HRT, it all depends on if said regional guys were involved in the early testing of the new rail and accessories solution, if so they tend to keep the stuff vs moving over the the DD mount. The DD mount is definitely more common though.

Commando barrels are 'the' barrel that is correct for regional SWAT. Some are converted 14.5s that are chopped, although those are now rare. More common are regular 11.5" commando barrels. The newest are Colt CAGE code marked barrels, you will see these where people have had barrels replaced. Not all barrels are Colt, although most are.

There are a good number of the RRA marked Hogue grips out there as people moved them over from their previous RRA lowers.

Colt lowers come from multiple sources, including Crane, so some are weirdly marked or older, such as the one above is a M4 Carbine, US property marked. Not an M4A1, although many are M4A1 marked.

With lasers, both PEQ15 and LA-5 are being used.

There is a large variety in the finer details, mostly related to how long the particular person has been in position.


View Quote

Great post.
Link Posted: 1/27/2021 8:35:51 PM EST
Got started on mine today when the rail came in- EVERYTHING is WIP




Other “inspired” builds


Link Posted: 1/28/2021 10:15:11 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AZgunner:
As much as I want to stay clone correct, I just don't think I can do an Ergo or Hogue grip. I'll be using my rifle on duty, so I think I'll go with a Magpul K2+.
View Quote


I've seen them with Magpul grips
Link Posted: 1/29/2021 9:51:48 AM EST
Are most using surefire lights now?
Link Posted: 1/29/2021 5:31:00 PM EST


I picked up a RRA lower for my DDC HRT build. I want to clone their LE markings. Colt and Bushy do engraving, but it looks like RRA does a stencil of some kind. Anyone have an idea how I can achieve this look?
Link Posted: 1/29/2021 7:14:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/29/2021 7:15:12 PM EST by Bhavin22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ResponsibleSecond:
https://ibb.co/cxr926D

I picked up a RRA lower for my DDC HRT build. I want to clone their LE markings. Colt and Bushy do engraving, but it looks like RRA does a stencil of some kind. Anyone have an idea how I can achieve this look?
View Quote

I cant see a image.
Never mind got it to load
Link Posted: 1/29/2021 8:36:29 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/29/2021 8:37:13 PM EST by YardDogOne]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Bhavin22:

I cant see a image.
Never mind got it to load
View Quote




here it is


Link Posted: 1/29/2021 8:41:42 PM EST
That looks like it’s laser engraving many places can do it.
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