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Posted: 7/28/2020 7:31:33 PM EDT
[#1]
Have you shot it?
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Posted: 7/28/2020 7:39:40 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Have you shot it? |
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Posted: 7/28/2020 7:41:15 PM EDT
[#3]
No, but that's not the point. I don't want a hillbilly gun that "works" but could work better. I want to be able to say I have a high-quality build that a professional put together. If it ever comes time to sell or trade it, I'll never get factory money for it, I know, but having a pro put it together is peace of mind for using it and for selling it. It's insurance on a weapon I'll be trusting my life to, and I don't trust other people that I don't know a thing about, if it's a build.
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Posted: 7/28/2020 7:47:37 PM EDT
[#4]
If you don't have faith in the gun, part it out and sell off the parts. You would probably be able to recoup most of the $ you have into it and then you can buy a factory gun. If it were me, I'd maybe check that the barrel nut is torqued to spec and that the headspace is good.
I've never seen anyone advertise that they were a Noveske certified armorer, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. Might want to try Rainier Arms if you are determined to have it taken apart and rebuilt. |
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Posted: 7/28/2020 7:58:22 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you don't have faith in the gun, part it out and sell off the parts. You would probably be able to recoup most of the $ you have into it and then you can buy a factory gun. If it were me, I'd maybe check that the barrel nut is torqued to spec and that the headspace is good. I've never seen anyone advertise that they were a Noveske certified armorer, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. Might want to try Rainier Arms if you are determined to have it taken apart and rebuilt. To your first point: I'm honestly tired of dealing with people online at the moment. Parting out a $2500 gun just isn't going to work for me. I have very little time, and I'm not running around selling things piecemeal for, once again, not what I paid for it. It's probably staying with me forever, at this point, but again, whether it does or not, I'd like a little peace of mind that I'm not going to get doing myself. To your second point: I figured I'd ask. You never know, and the more I ask, the more I find out. I'd rather ask a stupid question and get a stupid answer and maybe get a better answer than I thought. Someone on here ought to know a guy that works there and might like making some money on the side. |
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Posted: 7/28/2020 8:01:56 PM EDT
[#6]
Check out d.wilson mfg, excellent gunsmith and works on extremely rare and expensive guns. He’s the only dude I would ever trust with my noveske and any P&W job. He’s moving right now to Colorado so he’ll be back in about a week or so. If you check out his website he says when he’ll be back with his new address.
Seriously check him out, if you have an Instagram his work speaks volumes. Really fast turnaround time |
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Posted: 7/28/2020 8:12:13 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Check out d.wilson mfg, excellent gunsmith and works on extremely rare and expensive guns. He’s the only dude I would ever trust with my noveske and any P&W job. He’s moving right now to Colorado so he’ll be back in about a week or so. If you check out his website he says when he’ll be back with his new address. Seriously check him out, if you have an Instagram his work speaks volumes. Really fast turnaround time Thank you. If anyone can attest to his work, I would appreciate it. Also, what's your experience with him? |
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Posted: 7/28/2020 8:51:20 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thank you. If anyone can attest to his work, I would appreciate it. Also, what's your experience with him? I have used D. Wilson in the past. I would not use his services again. ETA: I've heard nothing but good things about Retro Arms Works. |
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Posted: 7/28/2020 9:06:33 PM EDT
[#9]
sent you an email
Glad you decided to keep it, their [Noveske] rifles, even builds tend to be accurate and reliable. I have a local place that I use for custom work on my stuff, and they're great, but it may not make sense for you to send it across country. Lone Star Armory Feel free to give them a call too. Andrew is great, and will be able to answer any questions you may have |
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Posted: 7/28/2020 10:36:00 PM EDT
[#10]
It would help if you could elaborate on where you see potential problems.
I have had a number of Noveske rifles. The unique parts are the receivers, the barrel, and the hand guard. The other parts are mostly standard stuff with Noveske markings The other parts are not unique. |
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Posted: 7/28/2020 10:41:14 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It would help if you could elaborate on where you see potential problems. I have had a number of Noveske rifles. The unique parts are the receivers, the barrel, and the hand guard. The other parts are mostly standard stuff with Noveske markings The other parts are not unique. I believe he wants someone that either works for Noveske or has an impressive resume to tear the rifle down, inspect the parts and rebuild it. |
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Posted: 7/28/2020 11:53:03 PM EDT
[#12]
I bought a Noveske 5.56 NMm0 7PT barrel, Gen 1 Noveske lower, Noveske chainsaw upper, matched it with a Colt BCG, Geissele SSA trigger, Sopmmod stock.
I put it together myself, I'm no armorer, but I can honestly say the rifle is more accurate than I am. If you haven't shot it yet, put some rounds out, you might be pleasantly surprised. |
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Posted: 7/29/2020 12:33:52 AM EDT
[#13]
How about calling Noveske and asking them to give the piece meal gun a once over? Worth a try. Good luck.
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Posted: 7/29/2020 12:37:52 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It would help if you could elaborate on where you see potential problems. I have had a number of Noveske rifles. The unique parts are the receivers, the barrel, and the hand guard. The other parts are mostly standard stuff with Noveske markings The other parts are not unique. Noveske just got back to me today about the lower again. It's from 2015. I want someone with some credentials to their name to tear it down and put it back so that there is no doubt it's good to go. I have no idea who put it together. it's entirely possible the upper is factory, but considering the guy who traded it to me didn't even know (or lied) about not knowing what it was puts into question everything about it. It'd be easier if the BCG was identifiable and the upper itself was easy to recognize, but so far the upper is completely foreign to me, and the only part on their I cannot confirm is Noveske beyond a shadow of a doubt is the bcg. Everything else in the upper is Noveske marked a certifiable, and parts are on the way from Noveske if it isn't. The lower isn't a big deal. The lower is from them and the rest doesn't' really matter. It's a Giessele trigger, h2 buffer, and of course everything else is unknown, but it's really hard to mess up a LPK. So, it's just the upper that needs put back together, because for all I know, the gas block and headspace are off enough to run, but not enough to be called a Noveske. With this high quality of parts, I want assurance. |
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Posted: 7/29/2020 12:38:49 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I believe he wants someone that either works for Noveske or has an impressive resume to tear the rifle down, inspect the parts and rebuild it. You are correct. I want a name-brand name or someone who works their. I don't want some gun shop that puts pictures on fb but has never taken a legitimate class for it. |
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Posted: 7/29/2020 12:41:15 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I bought a Noveske 5.56 NMm0 7PT barrel, Gen 1 Noveske lower, Noveske chainsaw upper, matched it with a Colt BCG, Geissele SSA trigger, Sopmmod stock. I put it together myself, I'm no armorer, but I can honestly say the rifle is more accurate than I am. If you haven't shot it yet, put some rounds out, you might be pleasantly surprised. The issue isn't putting rounds down range. The issue is I don't know how reliable the person is who put it together. Is the gas block isn't on there tight enough, the gas port and block are off by enough to create issues down the road, the headspace is off a little bit, then I have a really expensive rifle that isn't doing what it could be doing. The quality of the parts should match the quality of the person putting it together, and I don't even know who put it together. I have a $2500 rifle that needs to run like a $2500 rifle. Know what I mean? There shouldn't be any doubt at all. |
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Posted: 7/29/2020 1:15:02 AM EDT
[#17]
If you are determined to throw money at it then try Wilson Combat, Sons Of Liberty, Adco or Rainier Arms.
Someone will take your money. Everyone in the industry is balls to the wall right now so be prepared to wait. |
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Posted: 7/29/2020 10:01:58 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How about calling Noveske and asking them to give the piece meal gun a once over? Worth a try. Good luck. They don't do any custom work or smithing. They're just a manufacturer. They turned me down on that, but it's a good idea. |
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Posted: 7/29/2020 10:03:08 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you are determined to throw money at it then try Wilson Combat, Sons Of Liberty, Adco or Rainier Arms. Someone will take your money. Everyone in the industry is balls to the wall right now so be prepared to wait. It's either that or take a huge loss selling it and using that money to get a factory top-tier rifle that'll still set me back $500 I would guess at the least. Nothing wrong with the parts. I might throw it out there and see what takes. |
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Posted: 7/30/2020 8:44:30 PM EDT
[#20]
It's a cruel world for sure. I worked for a well known gun maker. We shipped a few lemons. But we made them right. And some of the better ar15 builders I have seen are hobbyists.
If you want a gun that runs well, that might send you to a place no one has heard of. But they might work on your gun. Most legit shops dont want other peoples issues and would not take the work. They'd sense your desperation and over bill and under deliver anyway. My advice is probably not what you want to hear.....take a builder's class. Get familiar with the system, rebuild it yourself. |
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Posted: 7/30/2020 11:58:16 PM EDT
[#21]
I understand what you’re saying but it’s not like that lower can be put together several different ways. If it makes you feel better send it to a smith to tru up the upper receiver, put the barrel nut on it and check the headspace and finish it up. I guess I’ve been lucky but all my builds have shot better than expected.
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Posted: 7/31/2020 1:45:22 AM EDT
[#22]
Definitely understand the OP wanting what he thought he paid for. I wouldn't want something that wasn't up to expectations. Personally, I would cut my losses, sell the gun and get what I want. It's a seller's market right now. Maybe the gun sells higher than anticipated. Good luck.
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Posted: 7/31/2020 11:02:50 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Definitely understand the OP wanting what he thought he paid for. I wouldn't want something that wasn't up to expectations. Personally, I would cut my losses, sell the gun and get what I want. It's a seller's market right now. Maybe the gun sells higher than anticipated. Good luck. One of the things I have noticed in several safety intensive workplaces. Confidence matters. (Why Glock uses that word in their advertising.) Your performance, your actions, your calculus, is different if you have confidence in your equipment. If your equipment is not top tier, but it is serviceable and does the job and you have confidence in it, you move with confidence. If you have a top tier, name brand, super expensive tool, but in the back of your mind you don't know if that tool will work when you need it the most, then you will not move with confidence. There is a reason an old 12-valve dodge is popular. There is a reason that an old Colt A2 is popular. There is a reason people still buy 30-06 rifles. Etc etc. If you don't think you will ever have confidence in the rifle, sell it. |
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Posted: 7/31/2020 11:46:28 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The issue isn't putting rounds down range. The issue is I don't know how reliable the person is who put it together. Is the gas block isn't on there tight enough, the gas port and block are off by enough to create issues down the road, the headspace is off a little bit, then I have a really expensive rifle that isn't doing what it could be doing. The quality of the parts should match the quality of the person putting it together, and I don't even know who put it together. I have a $2500 rifle that needs to run like a $2500 rifle. Know what I mean? There shouldn't be any doubt at all. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I bought a Noveske 5.56 NMm0 7PT barrel, Gen 1 Noveske lower, Noveske chainsaw upper, matched it with a Colt BCG, Geissele SSA trigger, Sopmmod stock. I put it together myself, I'm no armorer, but I can honestly say the rifle is more accurate than I am. If you haven't shot it yet, put some rounds out, you might be pleasantly surprised. The issue isn't putting rounds down range. The issue is I don't know how reliable the person is who put it together. Is the gas block isn't on there tight enough, the gas port and block are off by enough to create issues down the road, the headspace is off a little bit, then I have a really expensive rifle that isn't doing what it could be doing. The quality of the parts should match the quality of the person putting it together, and I don't even know who put it together. I have a $2500 rifle that needs to run like a $2500 rifle. Know what I mean? There shouldn't be any doubt at all. Headspace isn't something that can be adjusted or "screwed up" by a builder during a build, it either headspaces correctly or not based on the bolt and barrel. Nothing during the build process is going to affect that. As for gas block alignment, just look at it. If there are any serious alignment issues, it should be readily apparent (which would also affect reliable function). There are a few tests you can do using compressed air. Could also try a cheap Amazon borescope and have a look through the gas port. ARs aren't rocket science, at least when it comes to reliable operation (so long as you're using quality parts). Nothing you do is going to change the fact that it's not a complete Noveske rifle when it comes to resale value. If you just absolutely have to send it to someone for a teardown and rebuild, John Thomas at Retro Arms Works and ADCO are both top quality AR "smiths." If your concern is your lack of confidence in the person who built it, having it put together by those guys should alleviate any of your worries there. |
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Posted: 7/31/2020 12:23:56 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted: Headspace isn't something that can be adjusted or "screwed up" by a builder during a build, it either headspaces correctly or not based on the bolt and barrel. Nothing during the build process is going to affect that. As for gas block alignment, just look at it. If there are any serious alignment issues, it should be readily apparent (which would also affect reliable function). There are a few tests you can do using compressed air. Could also try a cheap Amazon borescope and have a look through the gas port. ARs aren't rocket science, at least when it comes to reliable operation (so long as you're using quality parts). Nothing you do is going to change the fact that it's not a complete Noveske rifle when it comes to resale value. If you just absolutely have to send it to someone for a teardown and rebuild, John Thomas at Retro Arms Works and ADCO are both top quality AR "smiths." If your concern is your lack of confidence in the person who built it, having it put together by those guys should alleviate any of your worries there. Today's adco is not the adco that built the reputation. |
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Posted: 7/31/2020 12:48:46 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Today's adco is not the adco that built the reputation. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Headspace isn't something that can be adjusted or "screwed up" by a builder during a build, it either headspaces correctly or not based on the bolt and barrel. Nothing during the build process is going to affect that. As for gas block alignment, just look at it. If there are any serious alignment issues, it should be readily apparent (which would also affect reliable function). There are a few tests you can do using compressed air. Could also try a cheap Amazon borescope and have a look through the gas port. ARs aren't rocket science, at least when it comes to reliable operation (so long as you're using quality parts). Nothing you do is going to change the fact that it's not a complete Noveske rifle when it comes to resale value. If you just absolutely have to send it to someone for a teardown and rebuild, John Thomas at Retro Arms Works and ADCO are both top quality AR "smiths." If your concern is your lack of confidence in the person who built it, having it put together by those guys should alleviate any of your worries there. Today's adco is not the adco that built the reputation. I'd be interested in hearing why you think that is. It's been probably about a year since I've sent any work to them, but I've had numerous muzzle devices pinned/welded as well as gas blocks taper pinned by them over the past 5 years, never once had a negative experience. |
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Posted: 7/31/2020 8:55:24 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: One of the things I have noticed in several safety intensive workplaces. Confidence matters. (Why Glock uses that word in their advertising.) Your performance, your actions, your calculus, is different if you have confidence in your equipment. If your equipment is not top tier, but it is serviceable and does the job and you have confidence in it, you move with confidence. If you have a top tier, name brand, super expensive tool, but in the back of your mind you don't know if that tool will work when you need it the most, then you will not move with confidence. There is a reason an old 12-valve dodge is popular. There is a reason that an old Colt A2 is popular. There is a reason people still buy 30-06 rifles. Etc etc. If you don't think you will ever have confidence in the rifle, sell it. I'm not ready to eat that loss yet. I'd rather drop a couple hundred in it, swap some parts, and have it checked over. Then at least I'll know the rifle is good to go, even if no one wants to pay factory price for it. I've been down that road way too many times. I'm tired of taking an L. |
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Posted: 7/31/2020 10:36:36 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not ready to eat that loss yet. I'd rather drop a couple hundred in it, swap some parts, and have it checked over. Then at least I'll know the rifle is good to go, even if no one wants to pay factory price for it. I've been down that road way too many times. I'm tired of taking an L. I'm not sure I recognize your "loss." As mentioned previous, I've purchased a "few" Noveske rifles. About the only thing I've left "stock" in the ones I've kept is the barrel and upper receiver components (with a few changes). They do a good job with the barrel and upper. The rest of the parts are just normal stuff. I replace the following parts: Trigger group; Bolt Catch; Take Down and Pivot Pins; Magazine Catch parts; Buffer and recoil spring; Safety selector; All lower detent pins and springs; Castle nut; Bolt Carrier; Bolt and components; and, some other smaller stuff. By the time I'm done, I've got another $1K in the rifle. Not to mention my time and tooling. So, after doing this a few times, I just started buying Noveske uppers and stripped matching lowers. I'm very pleased with the results, but I've got a lot more money in parts and have absorbed a lot more shop time that anyone would normally put into a stock Noveske rifle. I would not sell a finished modified Noveske rifle for much less than $6K. So I would not even try. |
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Posted: 8/1/2020 12:06:45 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not sure I recognize your "loss." As mentioned previous, I've purchased a "few" Noveske rifles. About the only thing I've left "stock" in the ones I've kept is the barrel and upper receiver components (with a few changes). They do a good job with the barrel and upper. The rest of the parts are just normal stuff. I replace the following parts: Trigger group; Bolt Catch; Take Down and Pivot Pins; Magazine Catch parts; Buffer and recoil spring; Safety selector; All lower detent pins and springs; Castle nut; Bolt Carrier; Bolt and components; and, some other smaller stuff. By the time I'm done, I've got another $1K in the rifle. Not to mention my time and tooling. So, after doing this a few times, I just started buying Noveske uppers and stripped matching lowers. I'm very pleased with the results, but I've got a lot more money in parts and have absorbed a lot more shop time that anyone would normally put into a stock Noveske rifle. I would not sell a finished modified Noveske rifle for much less than $6K. So I would not even try. The loss would come from selling it when no one is going to buy a build for what I've put into it. That's generally a loss. I've traded around for awhile now, and usually trying to do so evenly. I don't always make it out on top, but on this one, there's no point in trying. From what I can tell, it's probably a factory upper with a stripped lower. I'm not worried about the lower. I'm going to swap everything that isn't branded in the upper with something new and logo'd. So, with all that I'm going to spend extra on it, I might as well keep it. I'm not selling it for a loss of several hundred dollars. I should have just bought a factory rifle and sold the other stuff when I had the time. |
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Posted: 8/1/2020 8:40:59 AM EDT
[#30]
Post some pictures. If you think it's a factory upper someone here will be able to confirm that I'm sure. Would you want it taken apart and put back together if it is?
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Posted: 8/1/2020 9:26:57 AM EDT
[#31]
I have one of the early RECOns , 3 digit S/N , NM 8PT barrel. looks like any regular AR.
I'm sure yours is a keeper |
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Posted: 8/1/2020 10:10:06 AM EDT
[#32]
I'm confused,but that's normal
Nothing really "magic" about any AR except the quality of the parts and attention to detail on assembly. While I agree several are better than others with care,time and good parts any AR can be reliable. My first AR build was a MSTN, Noveske barreled clone on a LMT upper when LMT uppers were unobtainium. The damn thing was so accurate I sold my bolt gun!!!! I get it that it may not be a true Noveske rifle but ya gotta do what makes you feel the best. My recent contacts with Noveske makes me wonder how things are going without John there???!!! |
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Posted: 8/1/2020 5:20:25 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Post some pictures. If you think it's a factory upper someone here will be able to confirm that I'm sure. Would you want it taken apart and put back together if it is? The problem is no one knows what the factory uppers look like from only 2015, and I can never find any pictures. At this point, I literally just bought the last thing on my list that has an iron cross on it. So when it gets here, literally everything in it will be from noveske regardless of what year. "I have one of the early RECOns , 3 digit S/N , NM 8PT barrel. looks like any regular AR. I'm sure yours is a keeper" It's 5 digits and it's from 2015 now that they got back to me. I'm just looking to make sure it's good to go. Nothing like trusting some random dude to build a top-tier upper and have it be off just so slightly as to not know, but eventually something show. I like peace of mind. |
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Posted: 8/1/2020 8:24:26 PM EDT
[#34]
I have owned more than a few dozen Noveske rifles, going back about 10 years. Still have 3 here.
I have a 3 digit, below 600, SN rifle, and the highest SN I have personally owned was just under 20k. All that to say, not all of their parts were branded. Several of mine didn't have a cross or any other markings on the BCGs, and they were factory rifles/SBRs. I sent you an email several days ago with my contact info, im hapy to share what I know. As long as the upper was assembled correctly, not much will be different from the "factory" vs a competent gunsmith. Spending an extra several hundred on Noveske marked parts was not necessary, especially if youre going to have it rebuilt, it only sunk you deeper into this rifle. No disrespect, but i think it was a fools errand Even if you end up keeping it, and you know it has all the "N" stuff in there, its sadly still not a "Factory Noveske", and sadly will never be. Hopefully you can trade this off to someone, but don't be like the dude that fooled you... its not a factory rifle... In your last/previous Noveske ID thread, I said just keep it. Shoot it and enjoy. I stand by what I said then. |
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