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Posted: 2/19/2019 6:08:44 AM EDT
I want to hear your guys feedback on this issue. I watched videos of guys saying Lancer is the best mag and then the other crowd say Magpul m3 is the best. I do like the fact Lancer uses metal feedlips on their mags and I know USMC went with Magpul. I'm looking the drop some serious coin on mags, so i would like to hear what y'all got to say.
Link Posted: 2/19/2019 7:04:34 AM EDT
[#1]
They are both great mags.  I give Lancer the overall win.  I'd take two Magpul mags over one Lancer.  If I had to do it all over again, i'd just buy Lancer, but I won't be selling my Magpuls.  I've got quite the collection going.
Link Posted: 2/19/2019 11:36:03 AM EDT
[#2]
Magpul M3
Link Posted: 2/19/2019 12:02:17 PM EDT
[#3]
You're forgetting the Poll...

If you're stacking deep, Magpul M2. M3s gave me drop issues with a few rifles. No prob with Lancers though, good to go.
Link Posted: 2/19/2019 12:35:37 PM EDT
[#4]
I'm not sure one is better than the other,, they're just different. I have lots of both (well, 40+ of each, I know that's not "lots" to some). Honestly, you're good to go either way.
Link Posted: 2/19/2019 1:06:34 PM EDT
[#5]
Get plenty of both.
Link Posted: 2/19/2019 9:20:31 PM EDT
[#6]
That's a tough call.  I have both and they've always been 100% with everything I've ever done with them, so I dunno.

Something about the Lancers makes them more appealing though.  They just seem a little higher class in how they feel and look.  But this could be purely cosmetic.

You can't go wrong with either.  Whatever you decide will be the right choice.
Link Posted: 2/19/2019 9:23:04 PM EDT
[#7]
get both and some okay surefire e2s
Link Posted: 2/20/2019 5:56:42 AM EDT
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
get both and some okay surefire e2s
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Im on the E2 kick these days.

But I dig some Lancers.
Link Posted: 2/20/2019 7:12:39 AM EDT
[#9]
A while back I decided to go forward with Lancer.

Very happy with that decision.
Link Posted: 2/20/2019 10:13:50 AM EDT
[#10]
I just got a couple Lancers in the mail yesterday. The polymer walls seem very thin and flexible. Even the metal feel lip portion is easy to flex when the follower is depressed. I have not used the Lancer at all, but the Magpul mags feel more robust.

Wall thickness may not be an important part of magazine reliability, however I have seen others say that the Magpul M2 is less robust than the M3, when the Lancer seems less structurally supported than both.

I will be getting more Lancers in colors not widely available from other manufacturers, but my stockpile mags will be Magpul or OKay aluminum.
Link Posted: 2/20/2019 5:42:05 PM EDT
[#11]
The Lancer AWM are the most durable AR magazines on the planet, many torture / abuse tests on the internet showing them coming out on top.  The M3 is the most reliable 30 round AR magazine on the planet, and is very durable in its own right, but not nearly as much as the lancer.
Link Posted: 2/20/2019 10:44:13 PM EDT
[#12]
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Quoted:
get both and some okay surefire e2s
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Yeah.. I seen them for $12 a piece. How do they work in other non ar15 platforms? I have a x95, acr etc.
Link Posted: 2/21/2019 3:28:27 PM EDT
[#13]
I prefer the texture of Lancers.
Link Posted: 2/21/2019 4:40:21 PM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Yeah.. I seen them for $12 a piece. How do they work in other non ar15 platforms? I have a x95, acr etc.
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not sure unfortunately. i noticed is said okay surefire e2s. meant to say surefeed
Link Posted: 2/21/2019 6:45:18 PM EDT
[#15]
Lancers for me.  I shoot a lot of wildcat rounds and MP mags don’t cut the mustard.  Never a problem with the AWMs in any caliber I feed them.  If Lancer made a 6.8mag I’d never buy anything else.
Link Posted: 2/23/2019 8:00:44 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
I want to hear your guys feedback on this issue. I watched videos of guys saying Lancer is the best mag and then the other crowd say Magpul m3 is the best. I do like the fact Lancer uses metal feedlips on their mags and I know USMC went with Magpul. I'm looking the drop some serious coin on mags, so i would like to hear what y'all got to say.
View Quote
I will put it like this. Two primary reasons I will never get a Lancer mag. 1) No military or LE in the world will issue them or use them and 2) metal feed lips are not necessary for the 5.56 round when it comes to polymer mags. Current Magpul M3 mags are quite durable. Not worried about feed lips cracking at all with those mags.

A secondary reason is that Lancer mags are thick as hell.
Link Posted: 2/23/2019 11:12:54 PM EDT
[#17]
No mil would adopt free flat rail systems for many decades, that was never a legit reason for a civy not to run them during those days. Not that there's really equivalency there, it's just silly to only "accept" mil spec parts, when mil spec pretty much means durable sure, but not the best.
Link Posted: 2/24/2019 11:02:11 AM EDT
[#18]
Magpul claimed metal feedlip polymer magazines were not feasible, Lancer proved them wrong.
As far as the Corp selecting them, Fitzpatrick was a Marine and has very deep pockets.
Link Posted: 2/24/2019 11:07:44 AM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I will put it like this. Two primary reasons I will never get a Lancer mag. 1) No military or LE in the world will issue them or use them and 2) metal feed lips are not necessary for the 5.56 round when it comes to polymer mags. Current Magpul M3 mags are quite durable. Not worried about feed lips cracking at all with those mags.

A secondary reason is that Lancer mags are thick as hell.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
I want to hear your guys feedback on this issue. I watched videos of guys saying Lancer is the best mag and then the other crowd say Magpul m3 is the best. I do like the fact Lancer uses metal feedlips on their mags and I know USMC went with Magpul. I'm looking the drop some serious coin on mags, so i would like to hear what y'all got to say.
I will put it like this. Two primary reasons I will never get a Lancer mag. 1) No military or LE in the world will issue them or use them and 2) metal feed lips are not necessary for the 5.56 round when it comes to polymer mags. Current Magpul M3 mags are quite durable. Not worried about feed lips cracking at all with those mags.

A secondary reason is that Lancer mags are thick as hell.
Lancer L5AWM. Standard issue for armed London police, also Polish military approved. Thick as hell? Are you sure you're not looking at a PMag. How long have you worked for Magpul?
Link Posted: 2/24/2019 11:13:37 AM EDT
[#20]
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Quoted:
The Lancer AWM are the most durable AR magazines on the planet, many torture / abuse tests on the internet showing them coming out on top.  The M3 is the most reliable 30 round AR magazine on the planet, and is very durable in its own right, but not nearly as much as the lancer.
View Quote
This man speaks the truth. Lancers are the best.
Link Posted: 2/24/2019 11:20:24 AM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:
The Lancer AWM are the most durable AR magazines on the planet, many torture / abuse tests on the internet showing them coming out on top.  The M3 is the most reliable 30 round AR magazine on the planet, and is very durable in its own right, but not nearly as much as the lancer.
View Quote
Agree..  My stockpile of Lancers is building.
Link Posted: 2/24/2019 5:41:21 PM EDT
[#22]
Keep in mind the feed lip geometry of the pmag and the lancer are different.The pmag works well with the M855A1. If that matters to you.

Looking at mine I can tell that the lips on the lancer are almost the same as the USGI mags. Whereas pmag presents the round at more of an upward angle.

Check this thread: https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Unscientific_M855A1_magazine_feed_test__Updated_with_even_more_unscientifically_photos_/17-684147/

Pmags are good to go: https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/07/21/us-armys-new-magazine-failure-usmc-test-enhanced-performance-magazine-shows-performed-worse-predecessor-pmag/
Link Posted: 2/25/2019 2:24:58 AM EDT
[#23]
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Quoted:
Keep in mind the feed lip geometry of the pmag and the lancer are different.The pmag works well with the M855A1. If that matters to you.

Looking at mine I can tell that the lips on the lancer are almost the same as the USGI mags. Whereas pmag presents the round at more of an upward angle.

Check this thread: https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Unscientific_M855A1_magazine_feed_test__Updated_with_even_more_unscientifically_photos_/17-684147/

Pmags are good to go: https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/07/21/us-armys-new-magazine-failure-usmc-test-enhanced-performance-magazine-shows-performed-worse-predecessor-pmag/
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M855a1 doesn't matter to me. I mostly shoot m193 anyway.
Link Posted: 2/25/2019 2:29:40 AM EDT
[#24]
So here is what I plan on doing. I already have 20 magpul m3 mags. 10 windowed in mct color and 10 black non windowed. I prolly buy another 20 m3 non windowed mags in black, buy 40 lancers and 20 surefeed mags. Btw what is the differences between surefeed regular and surefeed e2? I know the followers are different color but what are the rest of the differences?
Link Posted: 3/3/2019 10:03:49 AM EDT
[#25]
A couple years ago it was all about how a magazine could stand being run over by a truck.  Lancer won all these tests hands down. Now bullet angle seems to be must important feature??
Link Posted: 3/3/2019 12:06:11 PM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:Lancer L5AWM. Standard issue for armed London police, also Polish military approved. Thick as hell? Are you sure you're not looking at a PMag. How long have you worked for Magpul?
View Quote
London police, that don't carry firearms at all and are too scared to use guns until terrorists walk all over the city. I won't count them as a legitimate LE resource.

PMAG M3 are a lot thinner than the L5AWM mag but I prefer USGI mags. How long have you worked for Lancer?
Link Posted: 3/3/2019 4:32:58 PM EDT
[#27]
For me it's Lancers first then PMAGS.
Link Posted: 3/3/2019 11:20:14 PM EDT
[#28]
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Quoted:
London police, that don't carry firearms at all and are too scared to use guns until terrorists walk all over the city. I won't count them as a legitimate LE resource.

PMAG M3 are a lot thinner than the L5AWM mag but I prefer USGI mags. How long have you worked for Lancer?
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Quoted:
Quoted:Lancer L5AWM. Standard issue for armed London police, also Polish military approved. Thick as hell? Are you sure you're not looking at a PMag. How long have you worked for Magpul?
London police, that don't carry firearms at all and are too scared to use guns until terrorists walk all over the city. I won't count them as a legitimate LE resource.

PMAG M3 are a lot thinner than the L5AWM mag but I prefer USGI mags. How long have you worked for Lancer?
You over looked part of the post, sport. And no the M3's are not thinner than the L5AWM.
So how long have you worked for Magpul?

Okay industries for me.

Link Posted: 3/3/2019 11:36:16 PM EDT
[#29]
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Quoted:
A couple years ago it was all about how a magazine could stand being run over by a truck.  Lance won all these tests hands down. Now bullet angle seems to be must important feature
View Quote
Yep.
Everyone is worried about feeding M855A1. Even though it's not really commercially available and averages $1.00 a round.
Link Posted: 3/4/2019 12:02:43 AM EDT
[#30]
My vote is for Lancer.

I have around 150 Pmags and they are just my SHTF stockpile that has grown over time. * Damn you PSA and your deals on them

That being said I have / use Lancers 99% of the time and the pmags just sit.
Link Posted: 3/4/2019 12:13:03 AM EDT
[#31]
Can’t go wrong with either
Link Posted: 3/4/2019 12:30:24 AM EDT
[#32]
I prefer Lancer, but M3 mags have been just as well built and reliable for me. M2s though, I have broken 3 or 4 of those, both black and colored.
Link Posted: 3/4/2019 8:58:09 AM EDT
[#33]
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Quoted:
Yep.
Everyone is worried about feeding M855A1. Even though it's not really commercially available and averages $1.00 a round.
View Quote
yep. At this point you're 100x more likely to stumble upon 300 blk in 'the wild' during SHTF, and the AWM is better than the regular 556 pmag when it comes to big subs, so when it comes to compatibility, I'd rather have the AWM. I understand why magpul would focus on that, they want mil contracts, but 855A1 compatibility couldn't be any less of a factor for 99% of retail consumers.
Link Posted: 3/8/2019 5:25:39 PM EDT
[#34]
My experiences:

I LOVED Lancer mags. The metal feed lips and indestructible nature through torture tests really had me on board. Since that time, I still think they are good mags, but a few things I've noticed.

1. Reload drills in dusty Ohio summer, this was approximately 3 years. Nothing hardcore, just dropped the mag from the gun and reloaded from a belt. Then I would pick up all the mags, reload them, and repeat. Well, I had a lancer follower bind pretty hard after soem time running these drills. It had to be disassembled and cleaned to function. Okay Ind. and Magpul mags never choked under same use. I made a post on here about it an Lancer sent me a new mag free of charge. Link to my original post from 06/23/2016: Lancer Mag Problem

2. Just about two months ago, reload drills in a few inches of snow. Same thing as above. Lancer follower binded up and cause FTF. I did not have to disassemble it to get the follower free, but it did experience several more FTF so I marked the mag and picked up a new one. Okay Ind. mags never choked, but I had since sold off all my Pmags in favor of Lancer so I didn't have a Pmag to compare that day.

3. On an open bolt, I've inserted Lancer mags forcefully enough that the front of the bullet will pop up out of the mag, while the rear is still retained by the feed lips. Bullet sits at about a 45 degree angle. This either causes a FTF, or if you notice it, to take the time to remove mag and re-seat the round. M3 Pmags have a secondary "tab", I'll call it, toward the front of the round that helps control the round stack, which I believe helps prevent to issue the Lancer has (I could be wrong if that is why, or just different feedlip geometry). I have not excpereinced the same problem with M3 Pmags, and honestly can't recall if I've had the problem with Okay mags but nothing comes to mind. Pcture of "Tabs" (I stole this picture from @picatinnypete from a 2015 post he made):



The above tabs now exist on all colors of M3 Pmags, not just sand.

I just bought 15 M3 Pmags to do more testing with them, Lancer, and Okay USGI mags. From what I have personally experienced, I feel Magpul have the most reliable feeding. I've never had an issue with feeding from Okay Ind., but the travel is so smooth in a Pmag and it nevers seems to get any more gritty, where in in Okay I have felt a bit more resistance when filthy compared to clean.

If you want the mag body to last forever, Lancer is the way to go. No issues with cracked feed lips or spine separation the Pmags have had, or dented bodies and feed lips from USGI mags (I've never personally expereinced either issue but plenty of evidence out there). Of the Magpuls,I will only buy M3 Pmags because of drop testing I've seen documented on M2 mags, but thats just me.

If you want the best price w/ a long reputation and better (IME) feed reliabilty than Lancer reliability, Okay Ind.

My two issues with Lancer seemed sporatic, but they happened. I feel the tolerances in Lancer are almost too tight, personally. But I'm no engineer and obviouly this is just my opinion from expereince/feel. I still will keep and use my Lancers, but Okay and Magpul sit in my rifles/pistols ready to go. I also loaded up Magpuls with the intent of never unloading them to see if/when feed lip cracking begins. I imagine this will be several years down the line.
Link Posted: 3/8/2019 5:37:21 PM EDT
[#35]
I'd take the Lancers all day, everyday.  I've seen too many Magpul mags fail in a variety of ways and it's almost universally in areas that are metal in the Lancers.

ETA-. The people I know and trust feel the same way.  Guys like Karl Erickson of Tactical Rifleman.
Link Posted: 3/20/2019 6:36:14 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
I want to hear your guys feedback on this issue. I watched videos of guys saying Lancer is the best mag and then the other crowd say Magpul m3 is the best. I do like the fact Lancer uses metal feedlips on their mags and I know USMC went with Magpul. I'm looking the drop some serious coin on mags, so i would like to hear what y'all got to say.
View Quote
When the Marines issued the steel Hk mags they ended up with bent feed lips galore.
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 8:54:34 AM EDT
[#37]
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Quoted:

When the Marines issued the steel Hk mags they ended up with bent feed lips galore.
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How does that apply to this conversation?  Do you know of a single case of lancer feedlips bending or becoming malformed?  For the last decade this forum has been looking for an indestructible magazine.  Now they haveit and suddenly it’s not important anymore.  Weird, or do we always need a boogeyman to keep the conversation going?
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 9:25:26 AM EDT
[#38]
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Quoted:
Yep.
Everyone is worried about feeding M855A1. Even though it's not really commercially available and averages $1.00 a round.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
A couple years ago it was all about how a magazine could stand being run over by a truck.  Lance won all these tests hands down. Now bullet angle seems to be must important feature
Yep.
Everyone is worried about feeding M855A1. Even though it's not really commercially available and averages $1.00 a round.
If it becomes surplus or sold as XM855A1 do you want to buy all new mags for it?

It's clearly a superior round, it's been the Army standard issue round for 10 years, eventually it'll be at Walmart.
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 11:20:04 AM EDT
[#39]
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Quoted:
If it becomes surplus or sold as XM855A1 do you want to buy all new mags for it?

It's clearly a superior round, it's been the Army standard issue round for 10 years, eventually it'll be at Walmart.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
A couple years ago it was all about how a magazine could stand being run over by a truck.  Lance won all these tests hands down. Now bullet angle seems to be must important feature
Yep.
Everyone is worried about feeding M855A1. Even though it's not really commercially available and averages $1.00 a round.
If it becomes surplus or sold as XM855A1 do you want to buy all new mags for it?

It's clearly a superior round, it's been the Army standard issue round for 10 years, eventually it'll be at Walmart.
I doubt it.
Do you not remember a few years ago when the ATF tried to ban M855?

Edit to add: It will never be surplus, Clinton made sure no US military ammo can be surplussed.
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 11:26:47 AM EDT
[#40]
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Quoted:

How does that apply to this conversation?  Do you know of a single case of lancer feedlips bending or becoming malformed?  For the last decade this forum has been looking for an indestructible magazine.  Now they haveit and suddenly it’s not important anymore.  Weird, or do we always need a boogeyman to keep the conversation going?
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I believe even aluminum feed lips are more shock resistant than steel, they’re more likely to crack or wear than deform. Steel when deformed takes a set especially tempered steel. I have lancers, they’re nice are they magic? No they’re just another mag.
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 11:29:12 AM EDT
[#41]
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Quoted:

When the Marines issued the steel Hk mags they ended up with bent feed lips galore.
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Not all steel is created equal, not even close.  The composition and, and even more importantly the heat treatment, of the steel can cause it to vary significantly.  Anyone big into knives / swords will understand this.

With that said, there is a lot more to a mag than just the toughness of the body.

The most important trait of the magazine is reliability, it has to feed the rifle without issue.

Next most important trait I would say is durability.

Then ergonomics.

Then long term usage life / longevity.

IMHO, the tan follower brownells USGI magazine is the best mix of all of the above traits.  A hair under the Pmag in reliability, very durable, light, compact (fits in any mag pouch), and ergonomic, and will outlast all of the other AR15 mag types that use the old style USGI SS spring by far.

The lancer is the most durable mag by far, and it is very ergonomic and light for a polymer mag, which I like.  Allows it to fit into many USGI mag pouches without issue.  However, I have read too many iffy things in regards to pure feeding reliability that I just don't trust them enough.  They failed miserably in the Marine corps magazine trials, came in last place by a significant margin compared to the other magazines tested (Pmags, EPMs, tan follower USGI).

In theory, they are the best magazine ever.  The most durable with the same weight / profile of a standard USGI magazine.  If reliability was up there with the others, they would be "the mag".  However, it isn't, so they're not!

I don't like how the Pmags are bulkier, esp the floor plates.  The G3s are less bulky than the G2s / "MOE", but the floor plates still make them a bit of a nuisance.  I have had mixed experiences with their polymer construction, and am not sure how they will hold up long term with time.  However, in terms of pure reliability, they are the best of all magazines by far, much better than the lancer.

I also think the round count window is more useful in telling you remaining round count than just a transparent body, when half of the rounds are obscured by the magwell.  Therefore, I think that pmags are  a better magazine than the lancers.

However, both lancer and Pmags still use the same old USGI style SS spring that is inferior in longevity to the new tan / EPM USGI spring design.

The brownells tan follower USGI mags are still better overall than lancer and pmags.
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 12:24:11 PM EDT
[#42]
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Quoted:

Not all steel is created equal, not even close.  The composition and, and even more importantly the heat treatment, of the steel can cause it to vary significantly.  Anyone big into knives / swords will understand this.

With that said, there is a lot more to a mag than just the toughness of the body.

The most important trait of the magazine is reliability, it has to feed the rifle without issue.

Next most important trait I would say is durability.

Then ergonomics.

Then long term usage life / longevity.

IMHO, the tan follower brownells USGI magazine is the best mix of all of the above traits.  A hair under the Pmag in reliability, very durable, light, compact (fits in any mag pouch), and ergonomic, and will outlast all of the other AR15 mag types that use the old style USGI SS spring by far.

The lancer is the most durable mag by far, and it is very ergonomic and light for a polymer mag, which I like.  Allows it to fit into many USGI mag pouches without issue.  However, I have read too many iffy things in regards to pure feeding reliability that I just don't trust them enough.  They failed miserably in the Marine corps magazine trials, came in last place by a significant margin compared to the other magazines tested (Pmags, EPMs, tan follower USGI).

In theory, they are the best magazine ever.  The most durable with the same weight / profile of a standard USGI magazine.  If reliability was up there with the others, they would be "the mag".  However, it isn't, so they're not!

I don't like how the Pmags are bulkier, esp the floor plates.  The G3s are less bulky than the G2s / "MOE", but the floor plates still make them a bit of a nuisance.  I have had mixed experiences with their polymer construction, and am not sure how they will hold up long term with time.  However, in terms of pure reliability, they are the best of all magazines by far, much better than the lancer.

I also think the round count window is more useful in telling you remaining round count than just a transparent body, when half of the rounds are obscured by the magwell.  Therefore, I think that pmags are  a better magazine than the lancers.

However, both lancer and Pmags still use the same old USGI style SS spring that is inferior in longevity to the new tan / EPM USGI spring design.

The brownells tan follower USGI mags are still better overall than lancer and pmags.
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I fully understand this. The harder the temper the more brittle, the softer the more ductile. Steel feed lips are probably best at a spring temper somewhere in the middle. Harder to bend, but once bent they’re basically trashed. You don’t want them so hard they crack but you don’t want them so ductile the deform under pressure. The Hk mags I saw came back from a deployment, none of them fed because of deformed lips.

The Marine’s explanation was basically that that’s what happens to magazines that get kicked around a Humvee over a deployment. To the military they’re a consumable. I hear the Marines now chose the Magpul. They all have pros and cons and like most things nothing’s perfect, everything has compromises. One guy here claims he switched from Magpul to Lancer because the mag stop shoulder on the Magpuls wore down allowing the mags to over insert....not exactly sure how thats a big change because the shoulder on the Lancers is polymer too...

I have some of the Brownells mags with the anti-tilt brown followers and my issue with those is the followers themselves are rough due to the fiber filled composition. They are supposedly dry lube impregnated but I’ve noticed that higher temperature storage seems to degrade their lubricity compared to something like the Magpul followers which are very smooth and also considered self lubricating. The brown followers seem to feel rough and dry and they drag after awhile even abrading the moly-disulfide coating on the interior of the mag which accumulates on their wear points.
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 12:50:27 PM EDT
[#43]
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Quoted:
I doubt it.
Do you not remember a few years ago when the ATF tried to ban M855?

Edit to add: It will never be surplus, Clinton made sure no US military ammo can be surplussed.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
A couple years ago it was all about how a magazine could stand being run over by a truck.  Lance won all these tests hands down. Now bullet angle seems to be must important feature
Yep.
Everyone is worried about feeding M855A1. Even though it's not really commercially available and averages $1.00 a round.
If it becomes surplus or sold as XM855A1 do you want to buy all new mags for it?

It's clearly a superior round, it's been the Army standard issue round for 10 years, eventually it'll be at Walmart.
I doubt it.
Do you not remember a few years ago when the ATF tried to ban M855?

Edit to add: It will never be surplus, Clinton made sure no US military ammo can be surplussed.
I do remember that, I still think it'll be commonplace some day.
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 1:32:14 PM EDT
[#44]
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 2:50:35 PM EDT
[#45]
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I have some of the Brownells mags with the anti-tilt brown followers and my issue with those is the followers themselves are rough due to the fiber filled composition. They are supposedly dry lube impregnated but I’ve noticed that higher temperature storage seems to degrade their lubricity compared to something like the Magpul followers which are very smooth and also considered self lubricating. The brown followers seem to feel rough and dry and they drag after awhile even abrading the moly-disulfide coating on the interior of the mag which accumulates on their wear points.
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Be more concerned with how things actually perform, and less concerned with how you think they will based on "feel".
Link Posted: 3/21/2019 3:44:36 PM EDT
[#46]
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I believe even aluminum feed lips are more shock resistant than steel, they’re more likely to crack or wear than deform. Steel when deformed takes a set especially tempered steel. I have lancers, they’re nice are they magic? No they’re just another mag.
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I don’t know they are both pretty tough.  For the  past 10-12 years the main message of this forum ha been that USGI aluminum magazines are fragile.  Yes steel will bend and deform , my question specifically is has that happened to a lancer magazine? Google : broken lancer magazines and report back....
Link Posted: 3/22/2019 11:23:45 AM EDT
[#47]
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Be more concerned with how things actually perform, and less concerned with how you think they will based on "feel".
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That observation was established AFTER the followers started hanging up...

Further investigation found that the brown followers in Okay’s version of the improved mag were not as rough and had slightly different cutouts. Since the mag springs are specific to that follower type on those mags, replacement can’t be with Magpuls unless I replace the springs too, so I will try to get Okay followers to replace.
Link Posted: 3/25/2019 3:27:43 PM EDT
[#48]
Link Posted: 3/25/2019 3:42:10 PM EDT
[#49]
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Quoted:
The contention is/was that metal feedlips provide no benefit, not that you couldn't do it. And, they don't. Metal bends and stays bent instead of deflecting and returning to proper geometry. Proper polymer can maintain correct geometry and return to that after deflection, even if cracked. Plus, the dual material construction provides a variability that is more difficult to QC, metal feedlips provide more drag on the round/strip more energy off the BCG, mechanical adhesion of the two components can fail in the drop tests, etc. The steel lancer feedlips do provide some additional resistance to bending over USGI aluminum, though. It's not a terrible magazine, it has just been tested and found wanting in durability as well as in reliability. You may use Lancers for a few hundred or a few thousand rounds on the range, in typical range conditions, and have no issues. If it works for you, great. I get it...it would just seem to make sense that the steel feedlips would provide some benefit. It just doesn't test out that way.

The TOP tests aren't the same as what most folks test in YouTube videos. There are a lot of other drops and impacts, specifically full weapons drops, that are pretty hard on mags. The dust test is also a killer for mags with softer body compositions, like the Lancer.

The USMC chose the PMAG because in multiple rounds of testing at Aberdeen over several years, it was best. In the end, the GEN M3 PMAG was the most reliable commercial or government magazine tested by a very, very large margin, and passed all TOP 03-02-045 durability and environmental tests.  In the USMC tests, the Lancer L5AWM finished dead last, with multiple ammunition types in the test, not just M855A1. Those test results were published, and you can find them online. Later rounds of testing, including one round of tests that went to 250,000 rounds through PMAGs convinced Army to approve the SEP proposal and fully approve fielding the M3 with regular magazine funds. SOCOM approved as an authorized user when USMC did. AirForce adopted, as did Coast Guard and NSW. Last round of testing was over 30,000 rounds between magazine-related stoppages for the M3.

Richard or Magpul's "deep pockets" had nothing to do with selection, and he was an NCO, so he knows somewhere around zero general officers and influencers in the chain. Lancer's main business is aerospace and carbon fiber components, so their pockets are probably deeper. The USMC cared about nothing but data, and they are extremely happy with their decision.

London metro has pretty much ditched the Lancers due to reliability issues. They are now issuing 300BLK PMAGs going forward. Poland is going to M3. The Netherlands is ditching Lancer and going M3. Estonia looked at test data and chose PMAGs. The French tested and want PMAGs--although we'll see if HK strongarms them with the 416 buy. The Brits will continue with M3 after the EMAGs are gone. The data is hard to ignore, and coupled with a very satisfied USMC, and dissatisfied Lancer users, lots of folks are becoming M3 users, even if they gave Lancer a try.

There has been some confusion about MCT, also. FDE, the original tan color in magazines, provides some challenges due to the nature of the colorant in thin magazine wall stock thicknesses. It works just fine in furniture, but it was always a hair weaker than black in mags, and difficult to QC for that purpose. Every once in a while, you'd get one that was significantly weaker. That's why we discontinued it in favor of the "sand" color program. Sand uses a different material additive package to be stronger than black, and MCT, the new, darker tan, is based on the sand material. MCT is as strong or stronger than black. MCT was what was used for all of the USMC test mags, including the cold weather drops. Black was used in earlier testing. Both window and non-window variants have been in the government testing, performing identically within statistical significance. With the bulk of the USMC fleetwide fielding orders filled, and the US Army on a sustainable path for fielding, you will see MCT in other mags now, first up being the 20rd LR/SR .308 magazines.
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Quoted:
Magpul claimed metal feedlip polymer magazines were not feasible, Lancer proved them wrong.
As far as the Corp selecting them, Fitzpatrick was a Marine and has very deep pockets.
The contention is/was that metal feedlips provide no benefit, not that you couldn't do it. And, they don't. Metal bends and stays bent instead of deflecting and returning to proper geometry. Proper polymer can maintain correct geometry and return to that after deflection, even if cracked. Plus, the dual material construction provides a variability that is more difficult to QC, metal feedlips provide more drag on the round/strip more energy off the BCG, mechanical adhesion of the two components can fail in the drop tests, etc. The steel lancer feedlips do provide some additional resistance to bending over USGI aluminum, though. It's not a terrible magazine, it has just been tested and found wanting in durability as well as in reliability. You may use Lancers for a few hundred or a few thousand rounds on the range, in typical range conditions, and have no issues. If it works for you, great. I get it...it would just seem to make sense that the steel feedlips would provide some benefit. It just doesn't test out that way.

The TOP tests aren't the same as what most folks test in YouTube videos. There are a lot of other drops and impacts, specifically full weapons drops, that are pretty hard on mags. The dust test is also a killer for mags with softer body compositions, like the Lancer.

The USMC chose the PMAG because in multiple rounds of testing at Aberdeen over several years, it was best. In the end, the GEN M3 PMAG was the most reliable commercial or government magazine tested by a very, very large margin, and passed all TOP 03-02-045 durability and environmental tests.  In the USMC tests, the Lancer L5AWM finished dead last, with multiple ammunition types in the test, not just M855A1. Those test results were published, and you can find them online. Later rounds of testing, including one round of tests that went to 250,000 rounds through PMAGs convinced Army to approve the SEP proposal and fully approve fielding the M3 with regular magazine funds. SOCOM approved as an authorized user when USMC did. AirForce adopted, as did Coast Guard and NSW. Last round of testing was over 30,000 rounds between magazine-related stoppages for the M3.

Richard or Magpul's "deep pockets" had nothing to do with selection, and he was an NCO, so he knows somewhere around zero general officers and influencers in the chain. Lancer's main business is aerospace and carbon fiber components, so their pockets are probably deeper. The USMC cared about nothing but data, and they are extremely happy with their decision.

London metro has pretty much ditched the Lancers due to reliability issues. They are now issuing 300BLK PMAGs going forward. Poland is going to M3. The Netherlands is ditching Lancer and going M3. Estonia looked at test data and chose PMAGs. The French tested and want PMAGs--although we'll see if HK strongarms them with the 416 buy. The Brits will continue with M3 after the EMAGs are gone. The data is hard to ignore, and coupled with a very satisfied USMC, and dissatisfied Lancer users, lots of folks are becoming M3 users, even if they gave Lancer a try.

There has been some confusion about MCT, also. FDE, the original tan color in magazines, provides some challenges due to the nature of the colorant in thin magazine wall stock thicknesses. It works just fine in furniture, but it was always a hair weaker than black in mags, and difficult to QC for that purpose. Every once in a while, you'd get one that was significantly weaker. That's why we discontinued it in favor of the "sand" color program. Sand uses a different material additive package to be stronger than black, and MCT, the new, darker tan, is based on the sand material. MCT is as strong or stronger than black. MCT was what was used for all of the USMC test mags, including the cold weather drops. Black was used in earlier testing. Both window and non-window variants have been in the government testing, performing identically within statistical significance. With the bulk of the USMC fleetwide fielding orders filled, and the US Army on a sustainable path for fielding, you will see MCT in other mags now, first up being the 20rd LR/SR .308 magazines.
/thread
Link Posted: 3/25/2019 7:52:42 PM EDT
[#50]
It's been awhile since Magpul has chimed in.
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