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Posted: 3/6/2021 3:13:14 PM EDT
[#1]
I'd say its a good way to get you started and don't overthink the barrel length topic.
Absolutely no problem to put together a sub MOA setup with an 11" barrel - there are plenty out here. |
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Posted: 3/6/2021 3:14:50 PM EDT
[#2]
I don't have one. I build my own as I like having parts I have used before and I am a natural at working with my hands.
I know people that own either of the rifles you have, and they say there is nothing really "wrong" with them. Many of them bought these rifles at the start of all the chaos last summer, becoming first-time AR owners. Many shops in the area had them in stock or on short-order and they were bought on the spot, no hesitation. The rifles shoot decently sized groups when used with good ammunition according to them and none of them shoot steel cased stuff, and stick to brass cased ammo from Federal and Hornady, with some of the Wolf Gold thrown in. In my opinion, they are decent rifles for the money, as long as they are not jacked up though the roof, especially as you are starting out and getting a feel for the AR game. The upgrade to the Victor may be worth it, it just depends on you and if those specific pieces/parts meet your approval. |
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Posted: 3/6/2021 3:17:12 PM EDT
[#3]
I have a saint b5 16in and a victor 11.5in. The lady has a 10.3 edge pistol. We love all of them. The edge is really nice but I’m perfectly happy with the victor and the b5. No issues at all with any of them. They look great. Fit and function is great.
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Posted: 3/6/2021 3:19:56 PM EDT
[#4]
I don't care for Springfield at all. If the CEO pulls a Bill Ruger and kicks the bucket or steps down; maybe I'll consider it.
But I won't deny that they look like good rifles/specs/parts. Even the factory iron sights are pretty decent (Made by UTG), some use BCM furniture which is a nice plus too. Barrel/Bolt specs aren't bad at all either. As far as I know it's the only way to get the BCM Polymer handguard in M-Lok too. S&W Rifle specs are kind of a mystery. They act like it's some kind of super duper secret formula. The Saint will get you more bang for your buck. S&W Warranty is amazing if you have any issues, but it's an AR that can be easily fixed by yourself with a little research. Personally though I would just build. |
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Posted: 3/6/2021 3:25:31 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted: I am getting back into shooting after growing up in a gun household with one of everything. All the guns were lost in my 20s to a fire. We had a .22 rifle and a 9mm pistol and was looking for a small pistol for my wife and when my wife was handed the MP 15-22 pistol in the shop she had to have one. Now I am considering a real AR15. My local gun shop has S&Ws and Springfield Armory's Saints in stock. I was considering the Saint in the basic model which is in stock or waiting for the Victor which they have on order to come in for my first AR. I would likely get one with a 16" barrel but would consider adding a longer barrel upper for some precision shooting down the road. If parts were not so hard to find and going for a premium I would consider building my own but given the current shortages, would the Saint be a good start? Is the Saint 'Victor' upgrade worth the extra dollars? What is the price? |
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Posted: 3/6/2021 3:35:35 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Personally though I would just build. I am concerned about either not being able to get parts or having to pay a huge premium on them and the waiting times for the parts. |
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Posted: 3/6/2021 3:38:05 PM EDT
[#7]
My shop has been charging normal retail or less. Which surprised me because I live in a boutique tourist town where things are usually very expensive.
I think the stock Saint (which is in stock) is around $900. I would have to wait for the Saint Victor to come in, and who knows how long that would take. I think the Victor retails around $1200. |
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Posted: 3/6/2021 3:56:58 PM EDT
[#8]
The Saint B5 was my first AR, purchased last year and I love it. I've had 0 issues so far. Modification wise I've added a BCM carry handle and Midwest Industries 2 piece free float handgaurd. If the price is right for you I'd go for it. Victor wouldn't be bad ethier, IMO depends what vibe your going for. Do you want an A2 style FSB or full free float handgaurd.
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Posted: 3/6/2021 4:05:54 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Saint B5 was my first AR, purchased last year and I love it. I've had 0 issues so far. Modification wise I've added a BCM carry handle and Midwest Industries 2 piece free float handgaurd. If the price is right for you I'd go for it. Victor wouldn't be bad ethier, IMO depends what vibe your going for. Do you want an A2 style FSB or full free float handgaurd. Is the B5 the base model Saint? I am not sure of what I want for the front of the gun. Our MP15-22 has such a short barrel and limited real estate, not many options with it. I don't know the difference of the A2 vs free float. I picked up a book from the library on the AR but only read the first two chapters so far. For short-term use I have seen a nearby tactical training place offer a Carbine/Pistol training day and thought it would be a lot of fun. Even my wife who was afraid of guns 2 months ago said let's do that someday soon. |
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Posted: 3/6/2021 4:22:34 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am concerned about either not being able to get parts or having to pay a huge premium on them and the waiting times for the parts. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Personally though I would just build. I am concerned about either not being able to get parts or having to pay a huge premium on them and the waiting times for the parts. Depends on the store honestly. The biggest down side about building right now is shopping around. If I were making a build today here's what I would do. Aim Surplus for the Guts of the Rifle. Lower is your call but I've had good experiences with Anderson "Ghost" lowers. No ugly logo/text. Aim's Barrels are made by Ballistic Advantage and have pinned gas blocks for extra durability. It's a really good deal since you don't have to ship a barrel out for this work. Their BCGs are on par with Toolcraft as well. These items are in stock and they ship quickly.  Attached FilePrimary Arms for the rail/misc parts. The Expo Combat Rail is OEMed by Cross Machine Tool. It's literally a $250 rail for only $100 and does include a QD Sling attachment, rail segment and barrel nut wrench. These are in stock and ship pretty quick as well.  Attached FileAdd $5 for a flash hider or more for one that you prefer. Also I forgot to include a gas tube.. Oops.. Another $10-15 lol I guess that cost a bit more than I thought though. Honestly you might be better off getting the Saint for $1200 out the door if you aren't confident with building (especially since taxes are charged online now  . ) But building is still really fun and tools are too expensive. (BEV Block, decent roll pin punches, 50 cent clevis pin for front detent, BCM Barrel nut wrench for castle nuts, aeroshell, breaker bar, torque wrench, and a vise will get an AR built np) On the plus side you will have the knowledge to do your own repairs/trouble shooting. Whichever you choose to do enjoy it. $1200 for the Saint doesn't seem bad. But taxes/excise tax might drive that cost up a bit. Any money you save building can definitely go toward something like an Aimpoint Pro/Trijicon MRO/Romeo 4 More or less the mock up with be similar to this. The rail would have a complete top rail though. Click To View Spoiler The sights springfield uses are only $50 a set. |
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Posted: 3/6/2021 4:48:08 PM EDT
[#11]
Can't go wrong with a Saint it M&P since your local shop carries both. Get it and enjoy.
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Posted: 3/6/2021 8:21:50 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Is the B5 the base model Saint? I am not sure of what I want for the front of the gun. Our MP15-22 has such a short barrel and limited real estate, not many options with it. I don't know the difference of the A2 vs free float. I picked up a book from the library on the AR but only read the first two chapters so far. For short-term use I have seen a nearby tactical training place offer a Carbine/Pistol training day and thought it would be a lot of fun. Even my wife who was afraid of guns 2 months ago said let's do that someday soon. Kinda sorta, basically. Its priced the lower/base model style, but they also have a couple variants priced the same. One with a BCM handgaurd and flip up front sight with a picatinny gas block, one with the BCM handgaurd and A2 FSB, then the Mlok version with different handgaurd and FSB.As far as I know they are the same with a couple minor differences (handgaurd/front sight/gas block). You can't really go wrong with ethier. Both can be setup for "you" and your style. Free-floating hand guards tend to be a bit more accurate due to less pressure/manupliation of the barrel. But as your first AR I recommend grabbing something you can afford and shoot the hell out of it, get real familiar with the platform. They are stupid customizable and can be transformed to whatever suits your needs. |
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Posted: 3/6/2021 11:56:56 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Depends on the store honestly. The biggest down side about building right now is shopping around. Honestly you might be better off getting the Saint for $1200 out the door if you aren't confident with building (especially since taxes are charged online now Whichever you choose to do enjoy it. $1200 for the Saint doesn't seem bad. Thanks that is what I needed to hear. "I can't save a significant amount by building my own first gun over the Saint or S+W." I imagine I will likely buy a S+W and maybe change the upper receiver to create a different variant of whatever I buy. Or maybe build an AR9 for my wife. Just guessing whatever I get won't be my last AR. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 12:16:04 AM EDT
[#14]
Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms are the LAST options
I would consider because of what they tried to pull off in Illinois. I would buy PSA BEFORE those two. If it's all you can find, push the go button. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 12:21:50 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms are the LAST options I would consider because of what they tried to pull off in Illinois. I would buy PSA BEFORE those two. If it's all you can find, push the go button. This, except the last sentence. I would get the S&W and upgrade the rail later or better yet a Colt 6920 for 1200. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 1:59:36 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Kinda sorta, basically. Its priced the lower/base model style, but they also have a couple variants priced the same. One with a BCM handgaurd and flip up front sight with a picatinny gas block, one with the BCM handgaurd and A2 FSB, then the Mlok version with different handgaurd and FSB. I read a few more on the Springfield site and others. They call those things the "furniture," which I find pretty humourous. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 2:04:14 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This, except the last sentence. I would get the S&W and upgrade the rail later or better yet a Colt 6920 for 1200. I already have a S&W 15-22. It is a lot of fun but feels plasticy and jams a lot. Would the real S&W ARs be better built? The hard part is the options of either parts or prebuilt ARs, is most all are out of stock. In all my shopping I have yet to see a Colt available. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 2:54:07 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I already have a S&W 15-22. It is a lot of fun but feels plasticy and jams a lot. Would the real S&W ARs be better built? The hard part is the options of either parts or prebuilt ARs, is most all are out of stock. In all my shopping I have yet to see a Colt available. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This, except the last sentence. I would get the S&W and upgrade the rail later or better yet a Colt 6920 for 1200. I already have a S&W 15-22. It is a lot of fun but feels plasticy and jams a lot. Would the real S&W ARs be better built? The hard part is the options of either parts or prebuilt ARs, is most all are out of stock. In all my shopping I have yet to see a Colt available. It will be better built but the bolt/barrel won't be milspec. The metal will be slightly softer/commercial spec for ease of manufacturing. The receivers are however milspec/aluminum; no issues there. One other down side is they do a 1 in 9 twist for the barrel. It sucks because iirc they used to do 5r rifling with a 1 in 8 twist. The M&P isn't a bad rifle, but I honestly believe PSA freedom is a better rifle/upper. They also would not disclose if bolts are HMP inspected |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 3:23:41 AM EDT
[#19]
I love my 10.3" Saint Edge Pistol. Its one of the better spec'd AR's for the price. I will buy another when possible. It's my go to HD gun.
 Attached FileI just picked up a Ruger AR-556 MPR with an 18" bbl that is an amazing bang for the buck in AR's. I paid $899 but some people paid under $600 when they first dropped a few years back. Both the Saint Edge and the Ruger MPR are great values in regards to AR's. I initially wanted the 5.56 Victor and the 308 Victor. For now, the Ruger MPR filled my 5.56 requirement and I found a SIG 716i, which for the price is another amazing value, to fill my .308 requirement. Check them all out before you buy. You won't regret it either way. Back to your original question, I wouldn't hesitate to purchase another Springfield Saint AR and yes its worth it to upgrade. All the above firearms are great and provide enough value to justify purchasing a factory built gun. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 3:36:05 AM EDT
[#20]
If you’re trying to go the cheap route, just build your own. The only thing you have to look around a bit for right now is bcgs.
Building your own will be way better and far cooler than any of the budget factory ARs |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 4:52:02 AM EDT
[#21]
Go IWI Zion. Great starter. Great price. Exceptional quality.
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Posted: 3/7/2021 11:26:44 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you’re trying to go the cheap route, just build your own. The only thing you have to look around a bit for right now is bcgs. Building your own will be way better and far cooler than any of the budget factory ARs Not really looking to go cheap. More bang for the buck to start. Since my only gunsmithing tools are about $30 worh of screwdriver and bits don't think I could build anything that would be a better value than I could buy for $1200 when I have to buy possibly a couple $100 worth of gunsmithing tools. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 11:35:19 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I love my 10.3" Saint Edge Pistol. Its one of the better spec'd AR's for the price. I will buy another when possible. It's my go to HD gun. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/196790/2_jpg-1855490.JPG I just picked up a Ruger AR-556 MPR with an 18" bbl that is an amazing bang for the buck in AR's. I paid $899 but some people paid under $600 when they first dropped a few years back. Both the Saint Edge and the Ruger MPR are great values in regards to AR's. I initially wanted the 5.56 Victor and the 308 Victor. For now, the Ruger MPR filled my 5.56 requirement and I found a SIG 716i, which for the price is another amazing value, to fill my .308 requirement. Check them all out before you buy. You won't regret it either way. Back to your original question, I wouldn't hesitate to purchase another Springfield Saint AR and yes its worth it to upgrade. All the above firearms are great and provide enough value to justify purchasing a factory built gun. That is a sweet looking setup. A lot like my .22 but in a real gun config. I wish I could check them all out but it is hard to get to see many options and the actual choices of what is actually available is super thin. I think if the Saint Victor was in stock now I would grab one and they are "on order" but no idea when they may arrive or even if the configuration I want will come in with the order. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 11:46:56 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It will be better built but the bolt/barrel won't be milspec. The metal will be slightly softer/commercial spec for ease of manufacturing. The receivers are however milspec/aluminum; no issues there. One other down side is they do a 1 in 9 twist for the barrel. It sucks because iirc they used to do 5r rifling with a 1 in 8 twist. The M&P isn't a bad rifle, but I honestly believe PSA freedom is a better rifle/upper. They also would not disclose if bolts are HMP inspected I would assume the higher the rifling ratio the better? In that case the PSA has a 1:7. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 11:51:01 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Go IWI Zion. Great starter. Great price. Exceptional quality. We had an UZI growing up an IWI would be a nice way to move into a modern defense gun. If those were available I would probably grab one. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 1:41:11 PM EDT
[#26]
If ordering something online and having a FFL local to ship to I'd say grab something else but I would say those options are fine if you just want to pick something up.
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Posted: 3/7/2021 2:10:48 PM EDT
[#27]
I have the Saint Victor pistol in 5.56. Never had a hiccup, quality parts and I hear their customer service is awesome, although I’ve never had to use it. I’ve probably shot more steel case than brass out of mine and never had a problem, so I don’t know where that’s coming from. I’d recommend the Victor even if you have to wait a little bit. Personally, I like the floating handguard more than the A2 style. Don’t think you can go wrong with either.
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Posted: 3/7/2021 2:19:34 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If ordering something online and having a FFL local to ship to I'd say grab something else but I would say those options are fine if you just want to pick something up. I am open to suggestions. For the $1000 range what would you recommend? The options are many but it is hard to tell them all apart. Whenever I find a built one recommended they appear to be out of stock everywhere. I would guess everyone else buying is watching the same videos as I am. I am tempted to buy a kit though so I can build my own but not have to search all over to find the parts and potentially struggle for the missing pieces. What about this one? https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-10-5-chf-5-56-nato-1-7-12-slant-m-lok-moe-ept-sba3-pistol-kit.html |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 2:33:39 PM EDT
[#29]
Never Springfield for anything (other than vintage). If it's your first AR, you may not know what they did to their own fellow residents of Illinois in terms of backstabbing them on gun control.
I'll never buy a Springfield Product, ever. . . .Read this and you'll understand why you shouldn't either. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 2:35:48 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We had an UZI growing up an IWI would be a nice way to move into a modern defense gun. If those were available I would probably grab one. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Go IWI Zion. Great starter. Great price. Exceptional quality. We had an UZI growing up an IWI would be a nice way to move into a modern defense gun. If those were available I would probably grab one. +1 on the Iwi Nice specs, good furniture, and the handguard is made by CMT as well |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 2:36:26 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would assume the higher the rifling ratio the better? In that case the PSA has a 1:7. 1/7 isn't better or worse. 1/7 isn't necessary to stabilize lighter (55gr/62) projectiles. The MK12 barrels (designed for shooting 77gr match-grade ammo) are 1/7, but the "goldilocks" twist rate for ARs is 1/8 since it is enough twist for heavier bullets, and works fine for lighter bullets, too. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 2:40:13 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would assume the higher the rifling ratio the better? In that case the PSA has a 1:7. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: It will be better built but the bolt/barrel won't be milspec. The metal will be slightly softer/commercial spec for ease of manufacturing. The receivers are however milspec/aluminum; no issues there. One other down side is they do a 1 in 9 twist for the barrel. It sucks because iirc they used to do 5r rifling with a 1 in 8 twist. The M&P isn't a bad rifle, but I honestly believe PSA freedom is a better rifle/upper. They also would not disclose if bolts are HMP inspected I would assume the higher the rifling ratio the better? In that case the PSA has a 1:7. 1 in 7 or 1 in 8 are ideal imo. You can use the greatest variety of ammo with these while still being accurate. 1 in 9 won't be as accurate with heavier bullets in most cases |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 3:05:28 PM EDT
[#33]
The Saint base model would be similar to a nitride barrelled non free float Palmetto State Armory kit with MOE furniture and EPT trigger upgrade. PSA is cheaper, but Springfield has slight upgrades. PSA doesn’t have a kit with metal back up sights to my knowledge. That said, you can buy a PSA kit and shop around and get metal back up sights for $100-150 depending on features. PSA also only rarely has kits with upgraded Magpul stocks like CTR or Magpul’s SL that would more accurately compete with the BCM or B5 stocks that Springfield uses.
The upgraded Saint Victor has three features no PSA kit has: a pinned low profile gas block, a 7 sided m lok handuard (PSA’s are three sided with unusable rail on the diagonals) and a QD receiver end plate. The Victor also has a muzzle brake instead of a flash hider, but whether that’s an upgrade depends on how close you shoot to buddies and whether you shoot indoors. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 5:26:18 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Saint base model would be similar to a nitride barrelled non free float Palmetto State Armory kit with MOE furniture and EPT trigger upgrade. PSA is cheaper, but Springfield has slight upgrades. PSA doesn’t have a kit with metal back up sights to my knowledge. That said, you can buy a PSA kit and shop around and get metal back up sights for $100-150 depending on features. PSA also only rarely has kits with upgraded Magpul stocks like CTR or Magpul’s SL that would more accurately compete with the BCM or B5 stocks that Springfield uses. The upgraded Saint Victor has two features no PSA kit has, a pinned low profile gas block and a 7 sided m lok handuard (PSA’s are three sided with unusable rail on the diagonals). The Victor also has a muzzle brake instead of a flash hider, but whether that’s an upgrade depends on how close you shoot to buddies and whether you shoot indoors. The trigger on the Victor is also something deserving of mention especially in today's market where a quality trigger will cost $100-$200. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 5:31:20 PM EDT
[#35]
The reason I left the trigger out as a Victor specific upgrade is because the regular Saint also mentions an nickel boron trigger, just not with a flat trigger face. There’s nothing in literature to state whether the rest of the trigger is improved. They do mention trigger improvements to their top of range Edge model.
EDIT: To the OP’s question of PSA being comprable, PSA’s EPT is also a nickel trigger (does not specify “boron” however). |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 5:37:33 PM EDT
[#36]
https://www.classicfirearms.com/rug-8514-ar556-mpr-223-18-coll/
$899 and six are available now! It is the best bang for the price! Here's mine. It is an 18" bbl, so its more of an SPR type rifle than CQB but it can still work in a house or close quarters.  Attached File18"bbl with 1/8 5R twist pattern for accuracy. Rifle length gas, Ruger Elite 452 trigger, free floated M-LOK Handguard, Magpul furniture, bolt is mil-spec 9310 and is machined and shot peened for strength and durability. If you like read up at Ruger.com https://ruger.com/products/ar556MPR/specSheets/8514.html |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 5:41:02 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The reason I left the trigger out as a Victor specific upgrade is because the regular Saint also mentions an nickel boron trigger, just not with a flat trigger face. There’s nothing in literature to state whether the rest of the trigger is improved. They do mention trigger improvements to their top of range Edge model. EDIT: To the OP’s question of PSA being comprable, PSA’s EPT is also a nickel trigger (does not specify “boron” however). I think you are right. I didn't think of that but I've read from owners that the Victor trigger is pretty good. PSA's value on the other hand cannot be argued. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 5:44:50 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am open to suggestions. For the $1000 range what would you recommend? The options are many but it is hard to tell them all apart. Whenever I find a built one recommended they appear to be out of stock everywhere. I would guess everyone else buying is watching the same videos as I am. I am tempted to buy a kit though so I can build my own but not have to search all over to find the parts and potentially struggle for the missing pieces. What about this one? https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-10-5-chf-5-56-nato-1-7-12-slant-m-lok-moe-ept-sba3-pistol-kit.html PSA is a good budget brand? I never had a problem with PSA especially the FN barreled uppers. Do you want a pistol or rifle? I'd grab a lower from PSA complete or build and shop around for high quality complete uppers like Colt, BCM, or something in your price range that you think you'll like. IWI seems like a decent rifle for the money right now as well. Edit- a PSA kit with the ept trigger, chf barrel, and HP Mpi bolt and sba3 ain't bad for a pistol |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 8:44:26 PM EDT
[#39]
Get a PSA, with the FN CHF barrel (if available) or a M&P Sport 2.
Stick to a 1/7 twist barrel. like others said, get a PSA. I own both Colts and PSA, they both shoot everytime I want them too! I get the Colts because I’m a “fan” and re-sale value. |
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Posted: 3/7/2021 9:46:39 PM EDT
[#40]
WITH THE WAY SPRINGFIELD ARMORY SHIT ON THE 2A PERSONALLY THEY'LL NEVER GET ANOTHER CENT OF MY MONEY...................
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Posted: 3/8/2021 4:07:22 AM EDT
[#41]
Your best bet is Colt rifle. Mil-spec rifle. They're still available on-line.
There are other excellent ARs, but all out of stock. Forget the S&W 4140 barreled ARs. Political issues aside, Springfield specs of Saint are pretty good, if you like melonited barrels and carriers. At least they specify that barrel is CMV (Chrome Molybdenum Vanadium). All mil spec rifles use some type CMV barrel steel. Carriers and barrels are chrome lined. Check the specs before you buy, and decide what you like. |
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Posted: 3/8/2021 6:05:05 PM EDT
[#42]
PSA has Zion on sale for $999 now.
Just saw it awhile ago. ETA: I'm sorta partial to Colt. If you can swing a lil more, find one and jump on it. |
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Posted: 3/8/2021 6:30:42 PM EDT
[#43]
https://www.springfield-armory.com/saint-series/saint-victor-ar-15-rifles/
The Victor has the same trigger as the Edge. The Victor has many feature upgrades compared to many entry level guns if you read the spec sheet and compare specs, not names. Compare the details and reviews. Victor's are good guns. |
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Posted: 3/8/2021 9:27:23 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: PSA has Zion on sale for $999 now. Just saw it awhile ago. ETA: I'm sorta partial to Colt. If you can swing a lil more, find one and jump on it. I'd look at the Zion or grab a lower from PSA and go to AU and grab the colt trooper upper |
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Posted: 3/8/2021 11:23:43 PM EDT
[#45]
Like the OP, I was rather late to the AR party.
I put mine together last October from a PSA complete upper and a complete lower: https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-16-m4-carbine-5-56-nato-1-7-nitride-13-5-lightweight-m-lok-freedom-upper-with-mbus-sight-set-no-bcg-or-ch-516444706.html https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-ar15-moe-ept-lower-odg-5165448104.html ...plus a nitride PSA BCG, a BCM CH and a 1-4 LPVO. At the time, almost all of their complete rifles were out of stock, and what was available didn't much appeal to me. My thinking was to use all PSA parts...lacking any experience in the platform. [shrugs] I hoped that way to have the best chance of all parts mating up nicely. Which they did. First time out on the range, I had intermittent failures to go fully into battery. With a bit more oil and some wear in, that went away after a hundred rounds or so. Accuracy is not exactly impressive with bulk XM193...3 inch groups at 100 yds, at best. I felt a lot better about it when I tried some Sierra Blitzkings...which have produced a few groups at a shade over 1 inch. Anyway, I'm happy with it. For what it's worth... |
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Posted: 3/8/2021 11:40:54 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'd look at the Zion or grab a lower from PSA and go to AU and grab the colt trooper upper These are good options. OP, also keep in mind that the Saint has the word SAINT very bigly plastered on the side of the magwell, which looks corny and retarded. Also SA doesn’t make any of their own parts so they’re probably made by BCA for all we know. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:44:44 AM EDT
[#47]
The only problem with Saints is they're made by Springfield!
Many members of the forum will not recommend the tools of Springfield Armory because of their ethics, and I can respect that. Springfield is a business not an ally and so are most of the manufacturers in this industry with the exception of a few. The flip side is would those same members tell me to stop shooting if I was their support by fire and I was saving their asses because I have a Springfield? I doubt it. At the end of the day your not buying a friend your buying an AR, so don't let feelings stop you! The entire Saint line is a step above entry level competition. With the entire Saint line you get a quality AR with Specs usually outweighing the competition in their respective spec and quality class. Within the Saints the best buys are the Victor's! The Edge Pistols cover their own special niche of quality if you favor their specs. Saint = Good Saint Victor = Better Saint Edge = Best |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 11:30:06 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: WITH THE WAY SPRINGFIELD ARMORY SHIT ON THE 2A PERSONALLY THEY'LL NEVER GET ANOTHER CENT OF MY MONEY................... |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 12:35:05 PM EDT
[#49]
Yes that was true what they did. How about Ruger and S&W back in the day with the crime bill support? People have seem to forgive them now. If you like something then just get it.
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:08:36 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The only problem with Saints is they're made by Springfield! I already own a Springfield my 9mm is an XD. If my shop had a Victor in stock, I would go grab it. I also saw an auction for an IWI go for $950 with the cheap red dot. I am still doing my research not sure what size barrel I want. I like the idea of a pistol, but already have one in .22. I don't need a home defense weapon, I did not lock my doors until I started bringing firearms into the home. Now I have to lock the doors. I am considering a 16 or even 20" barrel because this would be our first long range gun. I just got a new gun yesterday, A Walther PPQ22. I am trying to limit myself to one new firearm purchase a week.  I have been having a blast with my MP15-22, just got the backup sights dialed in on Sunday. I was going to attach a photo of it but it looks like I have to host the image elsewhere? |
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