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Posted: 2/26/2020 7:02:02 PM EDT
Retro gents, I am currently planning out two lowers for my SPR projects where a case I acquired had an original H&R SN on it for the rifle. I need to assemble an H&R clone lower and a GM Hydramatic one. The former will probably be a PRI raw 80% with saltwater/electro etch, and the latter a Russian paint with custom SN. I was hoping to get a nice pile of H&R and GM rifles and lower pics to look through but was surprised to not find a ton of them via my usual means.
Talking with @aeyoung it seems I'd be good going either way with Colt export A1 parts from the various sources like Apex or Numrich, or using gray lower parts from ar15sport. What I'd like to know is, does anyone have more info on what features would be expected for H&R lowers in the following SN range? Anything like deep or shallow dimpled pins, regular pins, type of bolt release, mag release, etc. H&R: 20021xx Any pic dumps or references would be appreciated! *Pic of the GM lower for your time and it looks like the bolt release has a number or stamping on it* 
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Posted: 2/26/2020 7:33:01 PM EDT
[#1]
https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/GM_or_HandR_upper_assembly__an_old_and_somewhat_confusing_subject_/123-584919/?
Lance, we had a nice reference thread linked in the "Information Links" in red at the top of the page. Most of the pics have been lost due to photo-suck-its nonsense. Some great information is still in there though. I would try to contact the previous posters of photos to see if they could rehost by some other means. Also our Russian friend posted they were working on H&R lowers in addition to the GM they already have. |
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Posted: 2/28/2020 1:03:49 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/GM_or_HandR_upper_assembly__an_old_and_somewhat_confusing_subject_/123-584919/? Lance, we had a nice reference thread linked in the "Information Links" in red at the top of the page. Most of the pics have been lost due to photo-suck-its nonsense. Some great information is still in there though. I would try to contact the previous posters of photos to see if they could rehost by some other means. Also our Russian friend posted they were working on H&R lowers in addition to the GM they already have. At this point I'm assuming later pins and bolt release in gray from ar15sport or just using Colt export A1 takeoff parts. I saw a clone H&R build that used dimpled pins and wanted to know if a specific SN range may have had those. |
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Posted: 2/28/2020 2:04:51 PM EDT
[#3]
Here's an H&R from apparently the H&R museum, never had an SN assigned but dimpled pins and selector. Hence why I'm curious about whether a low SN H&R A1 within the first 3k apparently made would have dimpled pins or not.
H&R un-serial'd A1 |
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Posted: 2/28/2020 3:39:19 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryAlso our Russian friend posted they were working on H&R lowers in addition to the GM they already have. I am Texan... I am ordering the H&R tools, I sent receiver stubs to my tool/die maker. They will be 1:1 perfect. Check my site for info/preorder info. 14-20 days out from launch. |
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Posted: 2/28/2020 5:42:29 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: NYET! I am Texan... I am ordering the H&R tools, I sent receiver stubs to my tool/die maker. They will be 1:1 perfect. Check my site for info/preorder info. 14-20 days out from launch. Any chance for a deal on early run H&R custom SN while you work out the kinks? |
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Posted: 2/28/2020 9:46:56 PM EDT
[#6]
No kinks to work out, check the website. If it’s a blem it doesn’t ship.
I’ll reply in a bit, my wife is about to beat me. |
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Posted: 2/29/2020 10:57:54 AM EDT
[#7]
So GM vs H&R, are the parts similar. The same. What’s the deal
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Posted: 3/1/2020 1:04:26 AM EDT
[#8]
GM and H&R used the same bolt catches with circles numbers on the front:
GM hammers, triggers and selectors are marked with stylized G with a number inside: 
H&R marked their triggers, hammer and selectors with a plain circled number IIRC. All other lower parts are unmarked and generally lack specificity as to maker. |
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Posted: 3/1/2020 7:27:24 PM EDT
[#9]
Here is a pic of my GM reweld that Braceman did. All the real GM parts came off the same rifle except the front half of the lower. Takedown pins are dimpled.
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Posted: 3/3/2020 9:45:02 PM EDT
[#10]
So my dumb@ss started another thread about GM bolt carriers/bolts. I think i bought a GM Carrier with an early Colt bolt. If we could combine the threads here would be nice.
GM Bolt Carrier/Bolt thread |
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Posted: 3/3/2020 9:52:25 PM EDT
[#11]
Tazaroo,
that gun is so real its unreal. |
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Posted: 3/3/2020 10:54:25 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Tazaroo, that gun is so real its unreal. Thanks man! She's super accurate with a TE and MW that gauge new. |
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Posted: 3/5/2020 12:23:52 PM EDT
[#13]
I wanted to tell y’all that the H&R will be spot on, tools should Be here in a week. Info is on my website for a discounted preorder, 6 slots left.
My guarantee is if the results don’t match expectations I refund the preorder down payment. I went through the stamps line by line, letter by letter. I also found all the parts but the fsb, bolt carrier. I’m pumped. |
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Posted: 3/5/2020 3:21:24 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wanted to tell y’all that the H&R will be spot on, tools should Be here in a week. Info is on my website for a discounted preorder, 6 slots left. My guarantee is if the results don’t match expectations I refund the preorder down payment. I went through the stamps line by line, letter by letter. I also found all the parts but the fsb, bolt carrier. I’m pumped. |
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Posted: 3/6/2020 11:53:54 PM EDT
[#15]
It’s a good excuse to use dimpled pins. I am curious what his dimpled pins look like.
Edit: I just looked at them, use the deep dimpled set. They look good. I didn’t realize he had all that Were all these anodized dark? Is there a specific color they call the GM/H&R’s? Below is the magwell we copied, I have the rear section at his shop too. I just found this flipping through my pics. There are subtle differences in the logo over time. Some of the logos on the transferable examples I have seen look a bit different.  Attached File |
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Posted: 3/8/2020 10:28:00 PM EDT
[#16]
Techno_000 where is your website? Am interested
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Posted: 3/9/2020 5:21:42 PM EDT
[#17]
Was talking it through with @Hunterex , do y'all think it would make more sense that later SNs of GM Hydra and H&R would have had dimpled pins, or early ones? The scenario being either the first 2-3k H&R M16A1s according to the SN I am building, would it have maybe had whatever dimpled pins from Colt or whoever was making them to get guns out the door, or rather the first ones would be up to "normal" M16A1 spec and later on they used up leftover supplies to include dimpled pins/selectors etc?
I doubt I can find a circle-2 bolt release anytime soon but I'm trying to decide what LPK to have ar15sport assemble for me. |
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Posted: 3/9/2020 8:30:39 PM EDT
[#18]
I have an all original GM Hydromatic rifle serial 335xxxxx and it does not have dimpled pins.
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Posted: 3/11/2020 1:13:41 PM EDT
[#19]
Who did GM and H&R contract for the bayonets, or mags?
Was that something they were supposed to deliver with the guns? Y’all will get to see the first H&R on Friday night. I’ll post pics here. |
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Posted: 3/14/2020 3:34:34 PM EDT
[#20]
I’ll move the wording on the receiver body over to the left on the next one so it isn’t crowded looking. Not bad for the first one. I’ll update my page tomorrow and get with the guys that sent in preorders.
 Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 3/17/2020 11:12:54 PM EDT
[#21]
The website is updated with current info, pricing, check out option for preorder customers.
I decided to lower prices to match the economy. Once we are in full swing and back to full retail I will offer Leo/Mil discounts. Back to the discussion. What makes a H&R Charging Handle or buffer tube correct? |
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Posted: 3/18/2020 1:06:45 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The website is updated with current info, pricing, check out option for preorder customers. I decided to lower prices to match the economy. Once we are in full swing and back to full retail I will offer Leo/Mil discounts. Back to the discussion. What makes a H&R Charging Handle or buffer tube correct? What is the web site? Thanks |
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Posted: 3/18/2020 5:20:54 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Those look great!!! What is the web site? Thanks Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The website is updated with current info, pricing, check out option for preorder customers. I decided to lower prices to match the economy. Once we are in full swing and back to full retail I will offer Leo/Mil discounts. Back to the discussion. What makes a H&R Charging Handle or buffer tube correct? What is the web site? Thanks |
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Posted: 3/22/2020 12:11:40 AM EDT
[#24]
A Nodak and PRI GM lower finish off in XM Grey... Just add oil - the color is so nice. These go to an SOT friend... mine and his info in the trigger well.
 Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 3/22/2020 11:41:58 AM EDT
[#25]
After seasoning them a little... next batch I’ll go darker.
 Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 3/23/2020 3:56:54 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Google search: Russian paint Thanks, Penn |
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Posted: 3/23/2020 4:10:05 PM EDT
[#27]
Yours look better than the originals. This is an H&R that Braceman did for me. I was able to save the DOD stamp.
   
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Posted: 3/23/2020 10:18:23 PM EDT
[#28]
Nothing beats the real thing, I actually prefer the imperfections of the real thing. You can’t fake the forging imperfections.
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Posted: 3/24/2020 7:12:46 PM EDT
[#29]
So the GM DOD stamps are huge, has anyone else seen this? Are the ones we are using correct?
I would love a timeline on when they went to small stamps in front of the magwell. |
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Posted: 4/12/2020 6:21:31 PM EDT
[#30]
Stamping the H&R and GM’s for you guys...
I’ll finish up mid week on serial #s  Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 4/12/2020 10:54:36 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Stamping the H&R and GM’s for you guys... I’ll finish up mid week on serial #s https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/C5516B52-1743-486B-B192-EF1B767C6D2F_jpe-1364527.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/AF34BF6C-8A3B-4DB0-9B63-9F43BCF1EA32_jpe-1364528.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/4A70456E-EAA2-4FBF-A2DA-66C33BF18994_jpe-1364530.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/72954A64-3B3F-4EBC-B55F-8019786F79E1_jpe-1364633.JPG I applaud your attention to detail in getting it right by having new stamps made!!! If I had the extra cash right now I’d buy one of each from you! Well done! |
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Posted: 4/13/2020 12:31:23 PM EDT
[#32]
What other mfr’s stamped info other than the obvious one I can’t copy.
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Posted: 4/13/2020 4:04:00 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Stamping the H&R and GM’s for you guys... I’ll finish up mid week on serial #s https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/C5516B52-1743-486B-B192-EF1B767C6D2F_jpe-1364527.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/AF34BF6C-8A3B-4DB0-9B63-9F43BCF1EA32_jpe-1364528.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/4A70456E-EAA2-4FBF-A2DA-66C33BF18994_jpe-1364530.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/72954A64-3B3F-4EBC-B55F-8019786F79E1_jpe-1364633.JPG Wow! All that meat and no potatoes, as the old saying goes.  Such abundance. Wouldn't mind having just one of those.
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Posted: 4/13/2020 10:12:45 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Stamping the H&R and GM’s for you guys... I’ll finish up mid week on serial #s https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/C5516B52-1743-486B-B192-EF1B767C6D2F_jpe-1364527.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/AF34BF6C-8A3B-4DB0-9B63-9F43BCF1EA32_jpe-1364528.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/4A70456E-EAA2-4FBF-A2DA-66C33BF18994_jpe-1364530.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/415053/72954A64-3B3F-4EBC-B55F-8019786F79E1_jpe-1364633.JPG Nice work! |
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Posted: 4/15/2020 11:18:20 AM EDT
[#35]
The 80’s ordered March 20th and before are shipping this week. Keep reading...
I just posted the 100% lower option on my site, if anyone with a current order wants theirs to be a 100% there is an option for you. PUT in the notes that you don’t have your lower yet! ———————————- Here is the link for the 100%’s below: 100% M16A1 Lowers FS - GM or HR ———————————- If you have one of mine now, uncut and not messed with at all there is an option for you. I need pics of any previously shipped 80 to ensure it hasn’t been messed with. If anything has been done to it, cut/drilled/sprayed in paint, bead or sand blasted, sprayed with oil I can’t do anything with it. The grey anodizing is very finicky. FAQ: •Can I send in my own A1 blank (NDS/Brace), there is an option for that under each respective 80% listing. I am not offering that option in the 100%’s yet, unless I currently have your blank (I have one customers NDS / H&R now) *****A few guys asked if I stamp any COLT receivers - NO****** 1. I can’t because I don’t own the stamps, they are still in business making guns 2. I don’t want to get Sued Please don’t email me asking, it makes me reluctant to deal with people that ask. On a side note, I find it bizarre that people are still discussing in open forum who currently does the Colt engraving. When you post pics of the engraving and mention who did it, or tell people who Will do it - your setting the engraver up for a Cease and Desist letter — you will never get another lower from there person after that. “Oh your paranoid, Colt is done making rifles, they don’t care” — they are About to drop another retro, the GUA-5/A/A - they aren’t done. |
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Posted: 4/15/2020 3:27:34 PM EDT
[#36]
One 100% left FYI - just making sure y’all had a shot at it.
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Posted: 4/15/2020 4:14:16 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: One 100% left FYI - just making sure y’all had a shot at it. Just put in the order - hope I got it, these look incredibly well done and I've been waiting to order since you first said you'd be doing the 100%'s. |
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Posted: 4/15/2020 4:50:53 PM EDT
[#38]
@techno_000
I missed the 100% lower offer. Is there anyway that you can open it up for one more? Please. |
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Posted: 4/15/2020 5:08:11 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: @techno_000 I missed the 100% lower offer. Is there anyway that you can open it up for one more? Please. I'm hoping he runs this again sometime soon...I wanted to get an H&R one as well, but only went with GM this time. |
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Posted: 4/15/2020 5:08:50 PM EDT
[#40]
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Posted: 4/15/2020 7:25:11 PM EDT
[#41]
Disregard thanks
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Posted: 4/16/2020 9:47:48 AM EDT
[#42]
Duplicate
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Posted: 4/16/2020 10:34:54 AM EDT
[#43]
Screw it, I posted 10 more.
As long as y’all are patient I will do it. I hate to think y’all didn’t get in. I need to call PRI and order more blanks too. Specify GM or HR in your order. FYI PayPal only processes my debit/credit cards. You don’t need a PayPal account. |
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Posted: 4/16/2020 10:43:27 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Screw it, I posted 10 more. As long as y’all are patient I will do it. I hate to think y’all didn’t get in. I need to call PRI and order more blanks too. Specify GM or HR in your order. FYI PayPal only processes my debit/credit cards. You don’t need a PayPal account. You're a saint. Instead of being a greedy bastard and taking 2 of the 20 slots, I'll just change my order. Can you change my order to an H&R? originally requested GM, will follow with PM details if it's not too late. |
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Posted: 4/16/2020 10:50:54 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Screw it, I posted 10 more. As long as y'all are patient I will do it. I hate to think y'all didn't get in. I need to call PRI and order more blanks too. Specify GM or HR in your order. FYI PayPal only processes my debit/credit cards. You don't need a PayPal account. Scout |
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Posted: 4/16/2020 12:53:43 PM EDT
[#46]
Quoted: Screw it, I posted 10 more. As long as y’all are patient I will do it. I hate to think y’all didn’t get in. I need to call PRI and order more blanks too. Specify GM or HR in your order. FYI PayPal only processes my debit/credit cards. You don’t need a PayPal account. Thank you. Just ordered an H&R. |
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Posted: 4/18/2020 3:48:36 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Screw it, I posted 10 more. As long as y’all are patient I will do it. I hate to think y’all didn’t get in. I need to call PRI and order more blanks too. Specify GM or HR in your order. FYI PayPal only processes my debit/credit cards. You don’t need a PayPal account. It’s Mike. Looking forward to getting my 4 lowers from you. Now you know who I am on this forum too. Thanks for everything. |
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Posted: 4/18/2020 10:34:19 AM EDT
[#48]
I will be taking 80% orders still, but until all the current 100's are back from the CNC shop and on a UPS truck heading to the anodizer I will not be taking any more orders for them.
I don't want to bury myself, or be one of the guys that take infinite backorders. I appreciate everyone here, and I feel honored to be part of the forum. Building these is alot of fun, and being able to give you guys a product this close to the real thing has been a dream of mine for a long time. I originally wanted to build AK receivers, I almost took over a small operation that - in my opinion - is/was the best product out. It never came to be which is fine. --------------------------------------------------------------------- I am still curious what other stamped receivers there are, did FN ever stamp any A2's? I know there are some laser, some are dot peen engraved. |
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Posted: 4/19/2020 6:13:08 PM EDT
[#49]
Here we go. I’m building a Mk12. And it begins
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Posted: 4/22/2020 4:58:00 PM EDT
[#50]
I went ahead and requested two gray LPKs from ar15sport, one with deep dimples for the H&R and the other regular takedowns for my GM lower. I figure it's hard enough for the guys doing actual H&R and GM A1s to find the little bits, I can be happy with some good repros.
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