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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:13:51 PM EDT
[#1]
Check your ammo, although it may jabber been a firearm failure. For replacement check out palmeto state armory.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:15:17 PM EDT
[#2]
What ammo?
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:15:57 PM EDT
[#3]
Glad your son is ok!
Got any pictures of the gun in it's blown up state? Were you shooting reloads by chance? |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:18:06 PM EDT
[#4]
No 300 Blackout ammo in the area?
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:19:06 PM EDT
[#5]
Norinco china sport 223 new in the box from the local gun store, so I was told. This morning I see from internet it's old ammo, but I can't see how that would cause the gun to blow up. I have many pictures but don't know how to submit them on this forum.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:21:12 PM EDT
[#6]
I was thinking 5.56 in a .223 would do that, but if you were using 223 that's strange. Maybe the round that busted the gun was loaded to abnormally high pressure for a 223?
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:22:13 PM EDT
[#7]
Yea, carbon 15's were known for being way more explody than their traditionally constructed counterparts so that's not a surprise*, but that bad sounds like an ammo related issue.
*Bell curve in effect, there are some survivor rifles that get shot and don't break, but there's more than average that do poo the bed. Lots of good inexpensive rifles these days compared to when the carbon-15 was new, Colt of course is the bench mark and has come down in price a lot in the last few years. PSA, Aero, a few other's are cheaper without giving up too much quality, a few more are more expensive while not hitting diminishing returns. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:26:09 PM EDT
[#8]
The gun was rated for 5.56 and 223.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:27:19 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The gun was rated for 5.56 and 223. 
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:27:25 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yea, carbon 15's were known for being way more explody than their traditionally constructed counterparts so that's not a surprise*, but that bad sounds like an ammo related issue. *Bell curve in effect, there are some survivor rifles that get shot and don't break, but there's more than average that do poo the bed. Lots of good inexpensive rifles these days compared to when the carbon-15 was new, Colt of course is the bench mark and has come down in price a lot in the last few years. PSA, Aero, a few other's are cheaper without giving up too much quality, a few more are more expensive while not hitting diminishing returns. Glad to hear no one got hurt really bad, but with a rifle made of proper materials, less damage would have occurred to both the rifle and shooter. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:28:31 PM EDT
[#11]
Very probably the ammunition. The bolt is going to lock into the barrel the same if the gun is plastic, or is aluminum; it's steel on steel bolt locked and sealing the chamber; or the gun won't discharge.
Meanwhile, Norinco ammunition has not been imported into the United States for 25 years; I'm amazed anyone had that in inventory still. When it was new, it was relatively poor quality ammunition, with exceptionally soft brass; moreso than any other brass I had ever handled. 25 years of aged extra low quality gunpowder, charged with the lowest level of precision, into brass that is already very soft. Gunpowder degredation can attack brass metallurgy by the way; as it essentially makes nitric acid. Usually it's visible as the light colored copper corrosion green in the neck of the casing, and around the primer; when the powder starts going bad. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:32:30 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yea, carbon 15's were known for being way more explody than their traditionally constructed counterparts so that's not a surprise*, but that bad sounds like an ammo related issue. *Bell curve in effect, there are some survivor rifles that get shot and don't break, but there's more than average that do poo the bed. Lots of good inexpensive rifles these days compared to when the carbon-15 was new, Colt of course is the bench mark and has come down in price a lot in the last few years. PSA, Aero, a few other's are cheaper without giving up too much quality, a few more are more expensive while not hitting diminishing returns. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:34:12 PM EDT
[#13]
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:35:42 PM EDT
[#14]
Probably a bad round. Just go to PSA and pick out what you want. They're the best value running in the AR world right now.
Order some ammo while you're there too, they've got a deal on 420rd Federal cans right now. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:36:34 PM EDT
[#15]
As much as I want to blame that plastic toy, you had an ammo issue
ETA Flickr blows. I can't embed that one for shit |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:45:29 PM EDT
[#16]
Glad the son is mostly ok .
I also would look most closely at the ammo as the problem. I suppose once you have a failure so bad the bolt lets go things are going to look more spectacular with the carbon 15 than a traditional AR 15. I would like to see photos of the carnage. Honestly I can't remember if the carbon 15 line was started by bushmaster or if it was something Bushmaster bought out to widen their line . I guess it was supposed to give you a slightly lighter gun but with a AR most of your weight is bolt,carrier and barrel Bushmaster in the day was a decent company , The name (and some machinery?) was sold to Remington and its parent company with some of it's former workers in Maine starting up Windom weaponary . Carbon 15 was sort of a odd duck , I never saw any point going in that direction although the couple of standard Bushmaster guns I have owned never gave me any trouble |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:54:27 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I was thinking 5.56 in a .223 would do that, but if you were using 223 that's strange. Maybe the round that busted the gun was loaded to abnormally high pressure for a 223? |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:55:07 PM EDT
[#18]
I uploaded some pictures on Flickr, don't know if it will work but here is the link.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 7:58:37 PM EDT
[#19]
Wooo-wee! Glad everyone is okay.
Looks like it's a recovery operation now. You can probably add some of the lower parts to your spares. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 8:07:49 PM EDT
[#20]
You had an ammo problem. Shooting the cheapest crap ammo that's 30 years old doesn't help the situation.
Then you had high pressure gas escaping into the rifle receivers which are made of a composite material that is unable to handle that kind of pressure. Don't kid yourself however, any firearm is subject to catastrophic failure in the case of an extreme overcharged round or obstructed bore. Bushmaster and Armalite, Chinese ammo, are these people living in the early 90s? |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 8:11:16 PM EDT
[#21]
"Norinco China Sport 223"
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Posted: 5/26/2019 8:16:09 PM EDT
[#22]
PSA is gtg for inexpensive rifles, you can save a few bucks if you buy a kit and assemble the lower yourself. Ask if you have any questions about PSA choices, we have lots of experience. They keep lots of us broke with their daily deals
 If you're willing to cough up $900 buy a Colt and be done with it. Buy better ammo. PSA often has sales on Federal. SGammo.com is a good source too. Check out ammospy.com for prices. Wolf Gold is a good choice for relatively inexpensive reliable .223. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 8:20:59 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
"Norinco China Sport 223" I used to shoot that stuff in the 80s. Smelled like ammonia after you shot it. I probably have a few boxes I shouldn't use still in the basement. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 8:40:36 PM EDT
[#24]
Is it possible to see if the is a bulge in the barrel? I was wondering if one bullet didn’t exit the barrel then follow up shot had no place to go causing the high pressure and failure. With a carbon gun there is probable too many pieces to figure out. Might try website tinypic dot come. Load pics there and it will creat message board links for you. Like photobucket did before they went full retard and require money to use.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 8:46:17 PM EDT
[#25]
When bad ideas collide.
Carbon15s are junk. Period. Norinco ammo was never great, and what you are shooting is older than your children. Buy a PSA premium rifle and good American made ammunition and you'll be fine. You seem new enough to this to prevent me from suggesting something higher up in the price heirarchy. Also, whoever has been advising you on your rifle and ammo purchases is a great salesman and a terrible friend. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 9:06:12 PM EDT
[#26]
Definitely look down the bore to check for a squib that left a bullet lodge in the bore, followed by the round that exploded when fired down a blocked barrel.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 9:13:48 PM EDT
[#27]
link to pics
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Posted: 5/26/2019 9:15:59 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yea, carbon 15's were known for being way more explody than their traditionally constructed counterparts so that's not a surprise*, but that bad sounds like an ammo related issue. *Bell curve in effect, there are some survivor rifles that get shot and don't break, but there's more than average that do poo the bed. Lots of good inexpensive rifles these days compared to when the carbon-15 was new, Colt of course is the bench mark and has come down in price a lot in the last few years. PSA, Aero, a few other's are cheaper without giving up too much quality, a few more are more expensive while not hitting diminishing returns. Actually...Weibull curve.  Attached FileETA.... don't use shit ammo |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 9:29:23 PM EDT
[#29]
-Another vote for a combination crappy ammo and poor quality rifle. I would 1st see if the local shop that sold you 30 year old ammo "new" will replace the rifle. If they do look at a S&W MP15. Armilite would be a 2nd or 3rd choice but only if their providing you a free rifle.
As mentioned if possible look into buying a new complete PSA rifle, this would be prefect https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-pa15-16-chf-m4-carbine-556-nato-premium-classic-ar15-rifle-black.html |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 9:42:47 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not Bell. Actually...Weibull curve. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/1874/700px-Bathtub_curve_svg_png-959092.JPG ETA.... don't use shit ammo Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Yea, carbon 15's were known for being way more explody than their traditionally constructed counterparts so that's not a surprise*, but that bad sounds like an ammo related issue. *Bell curve in effect, there are some survivor rifles that get shot and don't break, but there's more than average that do poo the bed. Lots of good inexpensive rifles these days compared to when the carbon-15 was new, Colt of course is the bench mark and has come down in price a lot in the last few years. PSA, Aero, a few other's are cheaper without giving up too much quality, a few more are more expensive while not hitting diminishing returns. Actually...Weibull curve. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/1874/700px-Bathtub_curve_svg_png-959092.JPG ETA.... don't use shit ammo Learn something new every day. That looks pretty handy to drop when people say stuff like "I don't know what people complain about, my Kimber never jams", "My Anderson build is great", or "my carbon-15 hasn't exploded yet". |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 9:49:03 PM EDT
[#31]
Thanks to all for the suggestions, sounds like all agree I bought a POS rifle with POS ammo. I received my Christmas bonus on December 14th 2012, having purchased Christmas presents for my son I finally had money to buy the girft for me I had always wanted. That was a bad day for America and a great day for gun shops. Every shop I went to was sold out of AR's so I talked with friends, checked craisglist, and backpage. Not sure where I found the guys number but he had a new in the box Carbon15 for $1000.00. SOLD! Next was ammo which was even harder to find. The store that sold me the China Sports is long out of business so I guess I'm on my own again.
My son and I greatly appreciate all the information and we will get a hold of PSA soon. One last question, where do I dispose of the unused ammo? Only have a few rounds but in my 50 years I've never had to give away or dispose of ammo????? |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 9:56:09 PM EDT
[#32]
Damn,.........$1k for a Carbon 15?
Wow Glad your son wasn't seriously injured. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 9:57:18 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thanks to all for the suggestions, sounds like all agree I bought a POS rifle with POS ammo. I received my Christmas bonus on December 14th 2012, having purchased Christmas presents for my son I finally had money to buy the girft for me I had always wanted. That was a bad day for America and a great day for gun shops. Every shop I went to was sold out of AR's so I talked with friends, checked craisglist, and backpage. Not sure where I found the guys number but he had a new in the box Carbon15 for $1000.00. SOLD! Next was ammo which was even harder to find. The store that sold me the China Sports is long out of business so I guess I'm on my own again. My son and I greatly appreciate all the information and we will get a hold of PSA soon. One last question, where do I dispose of the unused ammo? Only have a few rounds but in my 50 years I've never had to give away or dispose of ammo????? |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:02:42 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thanks to all for the suggestions, sounds like all agree I bought a POS rifle with POS ammo. I received my Christmas bonus on December 14th 2012, having purchased Christmas presents for my son I finally had money to buy the girft for me I had always wanted. That was a bad day for America and a great day for gun shops. Every shop I went to was sold out of AR's so I talked with friends, checked craisglist, and backpage. Not sure where I found the guys number but he had a new in the box Carbon15 for $1000.00. SOLD! Next was ammo which was even harder to find. The store that sold me the China Sports is long out of business so I guess I'm on my own again. My son and I greatly appreciate all the information and we will get a hold of PSA soon. One last question, where do I dispose of the unused ammo? Only have a few rounds but in my 50 years I've never had to give away or dispose of ammo????? December 2012 was a bad time to be a 1st time AR buyer. Lucky for you now is a good time for the next few months. Do get one before the next election kicks into full gear, prices will rise. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:04:01 PM EDT
[#35]
Do not buy anything with plastic receivers. Get a Colt 6920.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:07:12 PM EDT
[#36]
Sell the ammo on gunbroker or armslist or even at a gunshow. There are neckbeards out there who love that nasty crap. I'm dead serious.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:07:28 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thanks to all for the suggestions, sounds like all agree I bought a POS rifle with POS ammo. I received my Christmas bonus on December 14th 2012, having purchased Christmas presents for my son I finally had money to buy the girft for me I had always wanted. That was a bad day for America and a great day for gun shops. Every shop I went to was sold out of AR's so I talked with friends, checked craisglist, and backpage. Not sure where I found the guys number but he had a new in the box Carbon15 for $1000.00. SOLD! Next was ammo which was even harder to find. The store that sold me the China Sports is long out of business so I guess I'm on my own again. My son and I greatly appreciate all the information and we will get a hold of PSA soon. One last question, where do I dispose of the unused ammo? Only have a few rounds but in my 50 years I've never had to give away or dispose of ammo????? just take the ammo to the range the next time you go shooting , they should have a bin for loaded bad rounds. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:07:30 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Damn,.........$1k for a Carbon 15? Wow Glad your son wasn't seriously injured. Shit, in 2009 the company I was running the range at was selling 6920's for $2k a pop and we couldn't even get them out of the box and displayed before people bought them. "Is that sold yet" "No, we have to check it in first" "Cool it's mine, let me get my paperwork started". |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:08:45 PM EDT
[#39]
Pull the bullets and dump the powder around the rose bushes as fertilizer.
There are only two kinds of Carbon 15 owners, that that shoot very little and those who have a Carbon 15 that has not blown up yet You can pick up a decent gun from PSA for around $300 bucks plus or minus these days, depending on how you catch their daily deals. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:08:56 PM EDT
[#40]
I shot a shit ton of that old NORINCO China Sports ammo back in the mid 80s. IIRC, it was in a yellow box of 20 with red name with the logo in black. It was really inexpensive, like maybe $125 a thousand. Never had a problem with it.
Does that Bushmaster’s upper receiver carbon fiber or aluminum? |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:18:08 PM EDT
[#41]
I was able to pry the forward hand hold off and there's no buldge in the barrel. I ran a cleaning rod down the barrel thinking maybe a bullet was lodged as some have said and the rod went the entire length of the barrel, picture updated.
The bolt is jammed and I'll need one hell of a wrench to get it loose. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:20:44 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I was able to pry the forward hand hold off and there's no buldge in the barrel. I ran a cleaning rod down the barrel thinking maybe a bullet was lodged as some have said and the rod went the entire length of the barrel, picture updated. https://www.flickr.com/photos/93127904@N07/? The bolt is jammed and I'll need one hell of a wrench to get it loose. |
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:42:01 PM EDT
[#43]
Do make sure your son doesn't have any small slivers of carbon fiber still in his arm....that will give a nasty infection and usually needs to be cut out.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 10:44:53 PM EDT
[#44]
It took some persuation with a vice, pry bar, and hammer but I got the bolt loose and had to drive out. The spent shell came right out with a cleaning rod. I would love to know how this thing exploded with no bullet lodged in the barrel. Pictures updated.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 11:02:16 PM EDT
[#45]
The brass ruptured, spilling high velocity gas’s that tore the receivers apart. Bad ammo, with weaker then as designed AR-15 type rifle.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 11:27:12 PM EDT
[#46]
Case head separation - the brass casing was weak and failed.
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Posted: 5/26/2019 11:39:12 PM EDT
[#47]
Depending on your budget there are many great choices to be had. PSA being the best of the low priced ARs if you can afford it there are many better options. Larue, Noveske, LMT, KAC, LWRC, Colt, HK, SIG, FN are some of the more popular options. Also good Radian, Lantac, Battle Arms, Aero precision Taran Tactical also makes a nice AR. Lots options and lots of opinions everyone has their favorites. Many more options too many to list.
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Posted: 5/27/2019 12:19:28 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I was able to pry the forward hand hold off and there's no buldge in the barrel. I ran a cleaning rod down the barrel thinking maybe a bullet was lodged as some have said and the rod went the entire length of the barrel, picture updated. https://www.flickr.com/photos/93127904@N07/? The bolt is jammed and I'll need one hell of a wrench to get it loose. Yea that sucks dude. Hard lesson. As far as the rifle, the shattered pieces are obviously toast. A lot of other pieces can be stripped off and live on in other rifles though, so now is a good time to learn how to break the rifle into it's little parts, which will help learn about building one of your own from the ground up, and you can always see if people need some of the proprietary parts to fix their carbon rifles. |
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Posted: 5/27/2019 1:26:22 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thanks to all for the suggestions, sounds like all agree I bought a POS rifle with POS ammo. I received my Christmas bonus on December 14th 2012, having purchased Christmas presents for my son I finally had money to buy the girft for me I had always wanted. That was a bad day for America and a great day for gun shops. Every shop I went to was sold out of AR's so I talked with friends, checked craisglist, and backpage. Not sure where I found the guys number but he had a new in the box Carbon15 for $1000.00. SOLD! Next was ammo which was even harder to find. The store that sold me the China Sports is long out of business so I guess I'm on my own again. My son and I greatly appreciate all the information and we will get a hold of PSA soon. One last question, where do I dispose of the unused ammo? Only have a few rounds but in my 50 years I've never had to give away or dispose of ammo????? |
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Posted: 5/27/2019 1:39:07 AM EDT
[#50]
OP, I got first dibs on that rear stock if you don't want it anymore.
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