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Posted: 5/15/2022 8:47:01 AM EDT
[#1]
I found this yesterday. I had just broken the BoreBuddy pin I got a couple of years ago and that had gone over 12,000 rounds with a Hiperfire EDT and 4.5 pound hammer spring. My prior set up was a Geissele with a Taylor Tactical reduced power hammer spring; that helped extend the firing pin life, but the hammer was so slow that any imperfections in my follow through were magnified on the target. The BoreBuddy let me get back to a normal lock time. What's the advantage of titanium? I don't know if there is one, but I'm curious to see how it lasts, and it isn't much more than the firing pin I went there to buy. |
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Posted: 5/15/2022 9:36:10 AM EDT
[#2]
at my skill level, a decrease in lock time won't really help me, but an increase in reliability seems to be a prime objective for Steel Challenge rimfire rifle shooters... I currently use a steel BoreBuddy pin and extractor in my CMMG B unit... just broke a hammer after about 25000 rounds... trying a green dot HS510cgr... I like the Bore Buddy logo... being engineers and shooters also..I'm impressed with the BoreBuddy firing pin... regards Les
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Posted: 5/15/2022 12:02:24 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:... just broke a hammer after about 25000 rounds... Geissele? I would not have guessed that a slow hammer would show so much in my scores, but I do have a fairly bad anticipatory movement sometimes so I would not be shocked if my post-break movement is worse too. One of my better scores involved not focusing on sight alignment much at all, but intensely focusing on follow through. |
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Posted: 5/15/2022 12:05:32 PM EDT
[#4]
zukiphile... RRA NM.... about 25,000 rim fire...the disconnector arm broke off
I've been lucky that I'm able to shoot the action shooting sports with both eyes open... I can break most of the shots as I swing through the targets, and that is why I like the precise 2moa dot of the Holosun 510c... I really try to follow through, naturally, on the stop plate... I start each string with the safety on to give my conscious mind something to do, and shoot the target closest to directly above the start cone, even though I'm told it is not the correct shooting order... I'm about 1.6% out of A, and that is about all I can hope to get... I'm so old my Limited M card in USPSA was shot with a single stack .45.. regards |
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Posted: 5/15/2022 12:11:20 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: zukiphile... RRA NM.... about 25,000 rim fire...the disconnector arm broke off 25,000 is a pretty good run for that. I love those triggers, but had read about one breaking in a 15-22, so I keep them in my centerfire rifles. Someone has a Varmint model up for sale on the EE FWIW. https://www.ar15.com/forums/Equipment-Exchange/RRA-Varmint-3-5-Trigger/119-2251050/ |
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Posted: 5/15/2022 12:18:34 PM EDT
[#6]
I replaced it with a LaRue MBT2s to see if the tool steel works better
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Posted: 5/15/2022 6:05:29 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I found this yesterday. I had just broken the BoreBuddy pin I got a couple of years ago and that had gone over 12,000 rounds with a Hiperfire EDT and 4.5 pound hammer spring. My prior set up was a Geissele with a Taylor Tactical reduced power hammer spring; that helped extend the firing pin life, but the hammer was so slow that any imperfections in my follow through were magnified on the target. The BoreBuddy let me get back to a normal lock time. What's the advantage of titanium? I don't know if there is one, but I'm curious to see how it lasts, and it isn't much more than the firing pin I went there to buy. 12,000 is a great run on any firing pin! Titanium is experimental -- I'm not confident there will be any real benefit except perhaps with reduced power hammer springs or for the FRT crew that constantly deals with light strikes. It was mostly customer requested for the "cool" factor so we're evaluating whether it is worthwhile. |
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Posted: 5/15/2022 7:10:06 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 12,000 is a great run on any firing pin! To re-iterate, that's on a full power hammer spring, so it isn't directly comparable to numbers on reduced power hammer springs. My record for quickest destruction on a full power spring with a CMMG pin was 500 or 600 rounds. I understand there to be real downsides to titanium pins where the pin depends on inertia to deliver the strike, but I don't think CMMG/RTB pins work that way. |
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Posted: 5/15/2022 11:19:09 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To re-iterate, that's on a full power hammer spring, so it isn't directly comparable to numbers on reduced power hammer springs. My record for quickest destruction on a full power spring with a CMMG pin was 500 or 600 rounds. I understand there to be real downsides to titanium pins where the pin depends on inertia to deliver the strike, but I don't think CMMG/RTB pins work that way. Correct -- this pin design essentially just transfers the hammer energy. |
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Posted: 5/16/2022 10:04:35 AM EDT
[#10]
No personal experience on any platform, but a couple other downsides to titanium firing pins that have been noted are: 1) prone to peening; and 2) if and when a pierced primer (or rim) happens, the titanium firing pin tip erodes/burns (sort of like the sparking one sees from titanium silencers, one of which I do have and I have seen the sparking).
FWIW, I have zero interest in having a titanium firing pin in any firearm. I'll stay with steel - blued or chrome plated. Disclaimer: I have no affiliation with or financial interest in any vendor or manufacturer; and I am not a competitive shooter or a blogger who receives any form of compensation for endorsements or favorable public or private comments. Use of vendor and/or product brand names, if any, is for informational purposes only; and products or services were purchased from regular commercial sources. Best of luck. MHO, YMMV, etc. Be well. |
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Posted: 5/16/2022 12:15:54 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: FWIW, I have zero interest in having a titanium firing pin in any firearm. I'll stay with steel - blued or chrome plated. I understand not wanting to pay to test someone's idea. I'm generally an "If it ain't broken..." sort, but the way Bore Buddy presents this is free of risk that one will be stranded without a viable pin. I've dealt with Bore Buddy before, so I've a level of comfort with their ideas. The Bore Buddy steel pin I'm replacing has a much larger strike area on the brass than my CMMG pins that have the familiar vertical line strike. With a reduced power hammer spring, the BB strike area, a circle, was very faint. I believe this means that the BB pin uses the brass more effectively as a cushion for the pin. I would expect that trait itself to prolong pin life. I'm aware that the steel pin can now be had with a semi-circular or curved line strike shape, and I think the titanium pin may have that strike shape. The worst case scenario is that the pin is a failure and I return it for a steel pin. |
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Posted: 5/16/2022 4:28:32 PM EDT
[#12]
to add to the comments... if you are not familiar with the strike imprint of the Bore Buddy firing pin in a CMMG unit...the nose of the firing pin is circular but flat, not a chisel point of a traditional .22lr firing pin, or round nose like a centerfire pin... and because it is round and slightly reduced in diameter, strikes the cartridge rim slightly below the actual rolled edge, so as that it is not necessary to compress the fold of the rim to ignite the priming compound... I see this as a positive improvement, especially with what I perceive as quality control problems with some bulk rimfire cartridge manufacturers... I use a standard hammer spring, and my Bore Buddy pin really smacks the cartridge case...the hammer strike end is conical which allows the hammer to strike the pin when the hammer is more vertical, nearer the centerline of the pin, something I found that promotes pin longevity with my AR9 PCC pins... regards Les
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Posted: 5/20/2022 9:23:27 AM EDT
[#13]
I received my titanium pin last night. It does have the ")" shaped striking surface. I started a spent brass log with an empty cartridge with a full power hammer spring and reduced power hammer spring with a CMMG pin, and another with the old Bore Buddy circular strike surface and full power spring, and a strike from the new titanium pin with a reduce power hammer spring and the heavier rebound spring. My intent is to keep a sample of spent brass periodically as a photographic log.
I was somewhat cool to the ")" shape because the round one I had was serving so well, but the ")" leaves a surprisingly deep impression with a reduced power hammer spring. My hammer spring testing is about bolt velocities, cycling reliability and trigger feel on a specific single stage trigger, not about pin strike depth or pin durability. |
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Posted: 6/16/2022 1:59:19 PM EDT
[#14]
Ran 900 rounds this weekend on my self-assembled AR22 with a Rare Breed FRT-15 trigger and Dead Air Mask suppressor. Also has the Borebuddy weights and extractor installed. The heavy firing pin spring was used as requested.
The rifle ran flawlessly with the Federal ammunition. The RSO actually asked me to keep it to controlled pairs after several mag dumps. 350 was Winchester White Box - Constant FTF, will be relegating this ammo to my Henry rifle methinks. 550 was Federal Bulk - 99.9 perfect (had one or two stovepipes) Attached are pictures of the rifle after cleaning, closeups of the firing pin, and several spent rounds. Everything looks OK so far. Overall I'm pretty happy and I believe if improved the function of the FRT-15 trigger with 22lr.  Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 6/16/2022 5:10:01 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ran 900 rounds this weekend on my self-assembled AR22 with a Rare Breed FRT-15 trigger and Dead Air Mask suppressor. Also has the Borebuddy weights and extractor installed. The heavy firing pin spring was used as requested. I've been working on a guide along with compiling a spreadsheet for data on all known successful .22 FRT builds, and I'm wondering if you'd be willing to share the details on your build? If yes- please click on the link below and fill out one of the empty rows at the bottom since your build info would be of great value to help those still having issues getting their FRTs to run .22. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18LoQ3-tV3gtSNURjyPtqmbc3S23pfA5PSwMuz3ByWEk/edit?usp=drivesdk |
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Posted: 7/4/2022 10:46:58 PM EDT
[#16]
Just updated the list. Wanted to wait for the Borebuddy springs because I really wanted to get the Winchester 555 ammo to work since I have so much of it. Federal Bulk pack looks to be hard to get nowadays.
Ended up going ALL Tungsten for the Winchester. Definitely hotter than the Federal bulk. The 4lb Spring from BB took care of all magazine feeding issues. Fucking finally. 
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Posted: 7/5/2022 11:41:07 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Just updated the list. Wanted to wait for the Borebuddy springs because I really wanted to get the Winchester 555 ammo to work since I have so much of it. Federal Bulk pack looks to be hard to get nowadays. Ended up going ALL Tungsten for the Winchester. Definitely hotter than the Federal bulk. The 4lb Spring from BB took care of all magazine feeding issues. Fucking finally. Thank you for sharing your info! The vast majority of FRT users who've attempted to run .22 haven't had much luck and gave up, so this info is enormously helpful to those still trying. Did you have to mess with the timing at all to get it running? I've found it to be extremely picky with timing and it has to be timed very precisely to run so I'm curious if you have any info on how you timed it (or if you were just extremely lucky and didn't even need to modify the tab). |
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Posted: 7/6/2022 12:06:13 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thank you for sharing your info! The vast majority of FRT users who've attempted to run .22 haven't had much luck and gave up, so this info is enormously helpful to those still trying. Did you have to mess with the timing at all to get it running? I've found it to be extremely picky with timing and it has to be timed very precisely to run so I'm curious if you have any info on how you timed it (or if you were just extremely lucky and didn't even need to modify the tab). Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Just updated the list. Wanted to wait for the Borebuddy springs because I really wanted to get the Winchester 555 ammo to work since I have so much of it. Federal Bulk pack looks to be hard to get nowadays. Ended up going ALL Tungsten for the Winchester. Definitely hotter than the Federal bulk. The 4lb Spring from BB took care of all magazine feeding issues. Fucking finally. Thank you for sharing your info! The vast majority of FRT users who've attempted to run .22 haven't had much luck and gave up, so this info is enormously helpful to those still trying. Did you have to mess with the timing at all to get it running? I've found it to be extremely picky with timing and it has to be timed very precisely to run so I'm curious if you have any info on how you timed it (or if you were just extremely lucky and didn't even need to modify the tab). I didn't have to modify the tab, thankfully. I reckon if necessary I would grab the Borebuddy adjustable trip. For me the weight combo was key. Start with the heaviest weight combo (4 tungstens), load one round, fire, and check to see if the bolt locks back. If not, reduce the weight until it does. Then try a full magazine. This would require the Bettermag magazine adapter, obviously. If you're lucky it will work with similar ammo. If not, you'll have to go back to step one. Even then, sometimes I'd get failures to feed. Especially after the first round. I had the original CMMG spring with thousands of rounds on it. I spent my firing pin beta test credit on their springs and the 4lb worked the best overall to remedy that. What's really helpful is the ability to test in the back yard with sandbags and suppressed. If I had to go to the range to test everytime it would definitely have discouraged me. |
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Posted: 7/12/2022 4:18:38 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I didn't have to modify the tab, thankfully. I reckon if necessary I would grab the Borebuddy adjustable trip. For me the weight combo was key. Start with the heaviest weight combo (4 tungstens), load one round, fire, and check to see if the bolt locks back. If not, reduce the weight until it does. Then try a full magazine. This would require the Bettermag magazine adapter, obviously. If you're lucky it will work with similar ammo. If not, you'll have to go back to step one. Even then, sometimes I'd get failures to feed. Especially after the first round. I had the original CMMG spring with thousands of rounds on it. I spent my firing pin beta test credit on their springs and the 4lb worked the best overall to remedy that. What's really helpful is the ability to test in the back yard with sandbags and suppressed. If I had to go to the range to test everytime it would definitely have discouraged me. You're lucky your sear trip happened to already be timed to work since you were able to skip the tedious process of timing it. Also I meant to mention that I've been working on a .pdf guide for running .22 FRTs which I think I have finally completed it (at least for the time being). I've literally spent over a year now troubleshooting this and finally got all issues resolved on mine while documenting all of the info I've found along the way, so hopefully this will be helpful in case you do encounter any issues later on down the road: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1B9GTcz62RdCUDDWGrOekxLUfZ5SGsqZL/view?usp=sharing |
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Posted: 7/20/2022 9:30:20 PM EDT
[#20]
I decided to follow my test of several thousand rounds on the BB titanium pin and spring, by switching to an old production Taccom firing pin with the remnant of the BB heavy duty rebound spring. I put the closed ends of the spring together and put it back into the Taccom firing pin.
I thought maybe part of the durability of the titanium pin could have been the more powerful spring that came with it. The Taccom broke just short of 800 rounds. |
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Posted: 7/22/2022 11:46:08 AM EDT
[#21]
Interesting results. I have some musings about why the Ti might be lasting longer in this specific firing pin design than soft steel of similar hardness/strength, but that's a rabbit trail in itself.
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