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Posted: 11/30/2017 9:46:30 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Hell it took the RIS II FSP from its selection by SOCOM circa 2007/2008 to make it into wide spread use 2014! with all SOF. Yes by then RIS II without FSP was already chosen to replace it by 2013/2014ish. I finally got a RIS II FSP issued to me in 2014, then early 2015 got the Non FSP rail. SOCOM painfully slow issuing Crane selected items Just my thoughts after 6 tours anyways |
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Posted: 11/30/2017 9:54:01 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You want to know what happened? I'll tell you what happened. First, it was sealed until someone leaked an old presentation on the CRA service rifles Facebook group, but you knew that. I agree that the URG-I seems like the logical progression to the M4/M16 weapon, and hope everyone would follow suite instead of trying to shoehorn in the 416 like so many seem to do(looking at you general scales and your 416=ak-47 reliability crap). |
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Posted: 12/1/2017 2:23:43 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://i.imgur.com/FE40Iyf.png |
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Posted: 12/1/2017 8:39:36 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Nice. |
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Posted: 12/1/2017 10:29:14 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://i.imgur.com/FE40Iyf.png |
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Posted: 12/1/2017 11:53:25 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://i.imgur.com/FE40Iyf.png |
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Posted: 12/2/2017 12:41:03 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mbus pro offset sights? Is this legit? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
https://i.imgur.com/FE40Iyf.png 
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Posted: 12/2/2017 12:42:32 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have no idea what the CRA service rifles Facebook group is, but thanks for the info. I agree that the URG-I seems like the logical progression to the M4/M16 weapon, and hope everyone would follow suite instead of trying to shoehorn in the 416 like so many seem to do(looking at you general scales and your 416=ak-47 reliability crap). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: You want to know what happened? I'll tell you what happened. First, it was sealed until someone leaked an old presentation on the CRA service rifles Facebook group, but you knew that. I agree that the URG-I seems like the logical progression to the M4/M16 weapon, and hope everyone would follow suite instead of trying to shoehorn in the 416 like so many seem to do(looking at you general scales and your 416=ak-47 reliability crap).
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Posted: 12/2/2017 8:21:05 AM EDT
[#9]
Does anyone know if SOCOM has looked into the new Surefire Long Stroke Bolt Carrier?
http://www.defensereview.com/surefire-optimized-bolt-carrier-long-stroke-obc-ls-drop-in-bcg-and-h7s-buffer-system-for-better-weapon-control-reliability-and-durability-best-tactical-ar-15m4m4a1-carbineshort-barreled-rifle/ It's a M4 upgrade designed by Jim Sullivan, and it cuts full auto from 850-950rpm to a much more controllable 550-600rpm unsuppressed, 750rpm suppressed. This would be the perfect compliment to the SF Warcomp and the Geissele High Speed Selector. It would create a truly effective and controllable FA assault rifle. |
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Posted: 12/2/2017 12:29:49 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Does anyone know if SOCOM has looked into the new Surefire Long Stroke Bolt Carrier? http://www.defensereview.com/surefire-optimized-bolt-carrier-long-stroke-obc-ls-drop-in-bcg-and-h7s-buffer-system-for-better-weapon-control-reliability-and-durability-best-tactical-ar-15m4m4a1-carbineshort-barreled-rifle/ It's a M4 upgrade designed by Jim Sullivan, and it cuts full auto from 850-950rpm to a much more controllable 550-600rpm unsuppressed, 750rpm suppressed. This would be the perfect compliment to the SF Warcomp and the Geissele High Speed Selector. It would create a truly effective and controllable FA assault rifle. I tried to introduce FERFRANS to SF (with No luck) The rate reducer works super well, ran it downrange 2014/15 in video can control full auto in double taps 6 shots only 3 trigger pulls FERFRANS full Auto 2x2x2 drill Now with Surefire being a giant company compared to FERFRANS and with a ton of already military contracts. Maybe their bolt carrier will get some traction with the MIL. 
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Posted: 12/2/2017 9:25:34 PM EDT
[#11]
Geissele’s latest Instagram post calls the MK16 SOCOM BKIII rail a thing.
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Posted: 12/2/2017 9:33:47 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Geissele’s latest Instagram post calls the MK16 SOCOM BKIII rail a thing. |
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Posted: 12/3/2017 12:23:45 AM EDT
[#13]
Anyone else notice that in the geissele instagram pic that the mk16 rail had both types of anti rotation tabs on it?
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Posted: 12/3/2017 12:29:15 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Anyone else notice that in the geissele instagram pic that the mk16 rail had both types of anti rotation tabs on it? |
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Posted: 12/3/2017 12:45:17 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Anyone else notice that in the geissele instagram pic that the mk16 rail had both types of anti rotation tabs on it? |
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Posted: 12/3/2017 12:50:09 AM EDT
[#16]
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Posted: 12/3/2017 1:01:21 AM EDT
[#17]
....
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Posted: 12/3/2017 8:01:25 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote History |
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Posted: 12/4/2017 3:49:36 AM EDT
[#19]
I would love to see the DD barrel. If it's a new contour.
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Posted: 12/4/2017 5:16:58 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nope and its just about the same as a FERFRANS which has been out for about 15 years now I tried to introduce FERFRANS to SF (with No luck) The rate reducer works super well, ran it downrange 2014/15 in video can control full auto in double taps 6 shots only 3 trigger pulls FERFRANS full Auto 2x2x2 drill Now with Surefire being a giant company compared to FERFRANS and with a ton of already military contracts. Maybe their bolt carrier will get some traction with the MIL. https://i.imgur.com/a00VTNv.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Does anyone know if SOCOM has looked into the new Surefire Long Stroke Bolt Carrier? http://www.defensereview.com/surefire-optimized-bolt-carrier-long-stroke-obc-ls-drop-in-bcg-and-h7s-buffer-system-for-better-weapon-control-reliability-and-durability-best-tactical-ar-15m4m4a1-carbineshort-barreled-rifle/ It's a M4 upgrade designed by Jim Sullivan, and it cuts full auto from 850-950rpm to a much more controllable 550-600rpm unsuppressed, 750rpm suppressed. This would be the perfect compliment to the SF Warcomp and the Geissele High Speed Selector. It would create a truly effective and controllable FA assault rifle. I tried to introduce FERFRANS to SF (with No luck) The rate reducer works super well, ran it downrange 2014/15 in video can control full auto in double taps 6 shots only 3 trigger pulls FERFRANS full Auto 2x2x2 drill Now with Surefire being a giant company compared to FERFRANS and with a ton of already military contracts. Maybe their bolt carrier will get some traction with the MIL. https://i.imgur.com/a00VTNv.jpg Speaking of Buffers, are you the same Jeff Gurwitch who wrote this article on Hydraulic Buffers? http://www.defensereview.com/hydraulic-recoil-buffers-for-the-tactical-ar-15m4m4a1-carbinesbr-friend-of-foe-from-the-enidine-recoil-buffer-to-the-kynshot-recoil-damper-and-crosshair-buffers/ And if so, are you still using them, and if so, how has the Kynshot held up? I've been on a bit of a buffer research binge lately. |
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Posted: 12/4/2017 5:26:03 AM EDT
[#21]
I still think that the LMT enhanced bolt carrier is still a better option than these reciprocating weight carriers. Longer cam track and extra vent holes are extracting under less pressure which actually aids reliability. These seem to just slow cyclic rate, but it seems to unlock at the same time as a regular M4.
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Posted: 12/4/2017 7:14:35 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I still think that the LMT enhanced bolt carrier is still a better option than these reciprocating weight carriers. Longer cam track and extra vent holes are extracting under less pressure which actually aids reliability. These seem to just slow cyclic rate, but it seems to unlock at the same time as a regular M4. "LMT's .223/5.56 enhanced bolts have a more resilient coating and stronger heat treat, as well as the cartridge case being fully supported by the bolt face. The modified cam path allows for a greater dwell time, and superior extraction. The dual extractor springs help provide a more reliable extraction. Extraction is also greatly improved based on the fact that more of the extractor claw engages the rim of the case. The metal used to create the bolt is also extremely tough and a great improvement over carpenter 158 steel." https://www.strongsidetactical.com/lmt-enhanced-bolt-assembly-5-56-223/ In terms of reduced cyclic rate, that's a huge deal - and that's the opinion of James Sullivan, one of the chief designers of the AR. Reducing the cyclic rate a) substantially improves controllability in full auto (which is 1/2 the purpose of having a 5.56 assault rifle) and b) improves reliability by giving the magazine more time to raise the cartridge into position. The entire video is worth watching, but this shows the huge increase in controllability with the reduced ROF system used in the SF bolt carrier designed by Sullivan: https://youtu.be/gOUKXIrDE0I?t=10m26s |
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Posted: 12/4/2017 11:27:54 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The FERGRANS is a great looking system, it's amazing that never caught on, or any of the other rate reducing drop in systems like the MGI Buffer. Really hoping SF has enough clout to get a reduced RPM system into the M4 - it's pretty much the last piece of the puzzle for the platform after these Block III upgrades are implimented (other then perhaps self lubricating coatings or advanced barrel steel.) Speaking of Buffers, are you the same Jeff Gurwitch who wrote this article on Hydraulic Buffers? http://www.defensereview.com/hydraulic-recoil-buffers-for-the-tactical-ar-15m4m4a1-carbinesbr-friend-of-foe-from-the-enidine-recoil-buffer-to-the-kynshot-recoil-damper-and-crosshair-buffers/ And if so, are you still using them, and if so, how has the Kynshot held up? I've been on a bit of a buffer research binge lately. One teammate ran one downrange no issues. I also have Crosshair buffers that are holding up well If you read my piece I had Crosshair buffer fail early on, they redesigned it and the ones I have now still run after more than a year. If you are going to take the plunge buy theKynshot buffer. I have complete trust in it. ...........Plus the AR10 buffer is also holding up |
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Posted: 12/4/2017 4:53:45 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Isn't most of the benefits of the LMT from the enhanced bolt itself, not the carrier? "LMT's .223/5.56 enhanced bolts have a more resilient coating and stronger heat treat, as well as the cartridge case being fully supported by the bolt face. The modified cam path allows for a greater dwell time, and superior extraction. The dual extractor springs help provide a more reliable extraction. Extraction is also greatly improved based on the fact that more of the extractor claw engages the rim of the case. The metal used to create the bolt is also extremely tough and a great improvement over carpenter 158 steel." https://www.strongsidetactical.com/lmt-enhanced-bolt-assembly-5-56-223/ In terms of reduced cyclic rate, that's a huge deal - and that's the opinion of James Sullivan, one of the chief designers of the AR. Reducing the cyclic rate a) substantially improves controllability in full auto (which is 1/2 the purpose of having a 5.56 assault rifle) and b) improves reliability by giving the magazine more time to raise the cartridge into position. The entire video is worth watching, but this shows the huge increase in controllability with the reduced ROF system used in the SF bolt carrier designed by Sullivan: https://youtu.be/gOUKXIrDE0I?t=10m26s |
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Posted: 12/5/2017 7:51:41 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://i.imgur.com/FE40Iyf.png |
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Posted: 12/5/2017 4:47:09 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes I am. And Kynshot buffers holding up well. One teammate ran one downrange no issues. I also have Crosshair buffers that are holding up well If you read my piece I had Crosshair buffer fail early on, they redesigned it and the ones I have now still run after more than a year. If you are going to take the plunge buy theKynshot buffer. I have complete trust in it. ...........Plus the AR10 buffer is also holding up https://dpmsystems.us/products/ar-15-223-5-56-calibre-rifles-mil-spec-standard-buffer-tube The DPM one looks even more advanced, it has a two stage delay that might be more effective at both reducing recoil and rate of fire: https://youtu.be/uNOCSG9aGFo?t=37s |
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Posted: 12/5/2017 5:00:20 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://i.imgur.com/FE40Iyf.png |
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Posted: 12/5/2017 6:13:47 PM EDT
[#28]
Anybody know why they didn't go with the Hodge rail?
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Posted: 12/5/2017 6:40:24 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thanks man, I plan on either snagging the Kynshot, or the new DPM buffer: https://dpmsystems.us/products/ar-15-223-5-56-calibre-rifles-mil-spec-standard-buffer-tube The DPM one looks even more advanced, it has a two stage delay that might be more effective at both reducing recoil and rate of fire: https://youtu.be/uNOCSG9aGFo?t=37s How proven is DPM? |
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Posted: 12/5/2017 8:12:49 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Kynshot How proven is DPM? I'll probably end up snagging both for science. 
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Posted: 12/17/2017 2:02:18 AM EDT
[#31]
good. its about time they updated the military guns to catch up to civ tech!
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Posted: 12/17/2017 6:22:32 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Nope and its just about the same as a FERFRANS which has been out for about 15 years now I tried to introduce FERFRANS to SF (with No luck) The rate reducer works super well, ran it downrange 2014/15 in video can control full auto in double taps 6 shots only 3 trigger pulls FERFRANS full Auto 2x2x2 drill Now with Surefire being a giant company compared to FERFRANS and with a ton of already military contracts. Maybe their bolt carrier will get some traction with the MIL. https://i.imgur.com/a00VTNv.jpg |
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Posted: 12/25/2017 3:06:42 PM EDT
[#33]
CD posted in the CQBR thread a factory 10.3" theyre getting from FN, not a cut down 14.5. So does that mean its looking good for 14.5 midlength? Since theres no need to chop barrels down now? Also will the midlength be gov or socom profile?
https://www.ar15.com/forums/AR-15/Mk-18-CQBR/118-641240/?page=936#i7572561 |
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Posted: 12/26/2017 1:20:55 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
CD posted in the CQBR thread a factory 10.3" theyre getting from FN, not a cut down 14.5. So does that mean its looking good for 14.5 midlength? Since theres no need to chop barrels down now? Also will the midlength be gov or socom profile? https://www.ar15.com/forums/AR-15/Mk-18-CQBR/118-641240/?page=936#i7572561 http://soldiersystems.net/2017/01/30/shot-show-17-fn-16-tactical-ii-pro-series/ https://fnamerica.com/products/rifles/fn-15-tactical-ii/ This is an 11.5", but FN could obviously make a 10.3", as well as a 14.5" 
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Posted: 12/26/2017 10:21:24 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If they are going FN for the barrels, it would make a lot of sense to just go with a 14.5" FN Tactical II upper, which is FN's Midlength M-LOK derived from their work with Hodge. A turn key factory offering seems simpler and more cost effective then an amalgam of different parts. http://soldiersystems.net/2017/01/30/shot-show-17-fn-16-tactical-ii-pro-series/ https://fnamerica.com/products/rifles/fn-15-tactical-ii/ This is an 11.5", but FN could obviously make a 10.3", as well as a 14.5" http://soldiersystems.net/blog1/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/img_9265.jpg |
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Posted: 12/26/2017 10:24:22 PM EDT
[#36]
I thought it was confirmed that they're using the geissele mk16 rail.
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Posted: 12/26/2017 10:30:53 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I thought it was confirmed that their using the geissele mk16 rail. Also, the barrel is 'GI' type profile. I can see a heavier variant in the future. S/F |
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Posted: 12/27/2017 12:40:53 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is confirmed. It is the new standard. Also, the barrel is 'GI' type profile. I can see a heavier variant in the future. S/F |
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Posted: 12/27/2017 8:36:50 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Won't they run into 2000 era issues again that led to the SOCOM profile? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: This is confirmed. It is the new standard. Also, the barrel is 'GI' type profile. I can see a heavier variant in the future. S/F 
S/F |
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Posted: 12/27/2017 8:44:57 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe, hence why I said the above.
S/F Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: This is confirmed. It is the new standard. Also, the barrel is 'GI' type profile. I can see a heavier variant in the future. S/F
S/F  Attached File |
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Posted: 12/29/2017 12:05:34 AM EDT
[#41]
There is unlikely to ever be a "SOPMOD Block III," as for all intents and purposes, "SOPMOD" is dead.
Visual Augmentations Systems [and] Weapons Accessories (VASWA) are no longer being updated as a "suite" or "package," rather individual components are being upgraded as needed. Different units and organizations regularly try and even request/order specialized parts and components, whether to fulfill operational needs, or to conduct test and evaluation, this does not necessarily mean that they will ever be adopted, ever be granted a "program" status and/or designation within the organization, branch, SOCOM, etc. Generally speaking, the bigger the organization looking into an upgrade and the bigger the program, the more likely that they will introduce changes--this is how things like the EOTech 551/552 become the EOTech 553 (SU-231), the KAC M4 FF RAS becomes the DD RIS II, etc. ~Augee |
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Posted: 1/6/2018 1:31:15 AM EDT
[#42]
So URG-I (Block III) uppers are going to be available direct from Geissele starting in March. 14.5” midlegth DD barrels. I’m excited, I’m not cloner but as an upper It has everything I want.
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Posted: 1/6/2018 1:52:11 AM EDT
[#43]
Brownell's will have them exclusively at least at first and in two configurations. $1,379 for the complete upper with p&w surefire muzzle device. $979 without BCG, charging handle and muzzle device.
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Posted: 1/6/2018 4:03:02 AM EDT
[#44]
Is there any idea why DD was chosen for the barrel over FN chf?
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Posted: 1/6/2018 4:06:08 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is there any idea why DD was chosen for the barrel over FN chf? ETA but then again, SOCOM funding isn't AS limited, so it could be another (maybe performance) factor from testing |
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Posted: 1/6/2018 4:50:13 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It also makes the Mk18 harder to manage. Instead of cutting down M4A1 barrels they'll have to find a supplier to produce carbine barrels, they will have to keep 2 gas blocks, 2 different gas tubes, etc. |
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Posted: 1/6/2018 4:51:11 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One can only hope, but with that said, I believe Colt did an actual study on the pros/cons of Carbine vs Mid-length gas systems and found there were no quality gains in going to a Mid-length setup. But I would be interested to see how, if any, much longer parts last on a 3 position rifle with a Mid-length gas system as opposed to carbine. |
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Posted: 1/6/2018 6:34:35 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Aren’t they buying DD barrels now for the block 2? Or rather, uppers? CD |
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Posted: 1/6/2018 9:33:13 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Probably price. Procurement usually boils down to who can make us this part, in these specs, for the lowest cost. ETA but then again, SOCOM funding isn't AS limited, so it could be another (maybe performance) factor from testing Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Is there any idea why DD was chosen for the barrel over FN chf? ETA but then again, SOCOM funding isn't AS limited, so it could be another (maybe performance) factor from testing |
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Posted: 1/6/2018 4:49:45 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Since the benefits of a 20” rifle and it’s gas system are well known the mid length in theory splits the difference. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
One can only hope, but with that said, I believe Colt did an actual study on the pros/cons of Carbine vs Mid-length gas systems and found there were no quality gains in going to a Mid-length setup. But I would be interested to see how, if any, much longer parts last on a 3 position rifle with a Mid-length gas system as opposed to carbine. |
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