We all know there are other guns out there, But nothing else is as cool and fun as an AR-15

tag

Are we in production yet.  I have a new rifle in the works and am pretty hot and bothered about putting the TD bipod on it?  Also, will there be a swivel attachment version.  I assume that picture of the bipod on the McMillan stock was via some sort of rail adaptor?  Oh, and final height?  thanks

esc,

TangoDown is putting all recources into getting the first production run of the Advanced Combat Bipod done.  Many of them are headed into awaiting Military hands.  I'm not sure what that translates to as far as commercial availablity.

The attachment to the McMillan stock was using a prototype adapter that mounts on the sling swivel.  Yes there will be adapters available.

Leg height from leg release button center to foot is 8.5 inches.  With two 1 inch adjustments. so the three positions would be 8.5, 9.5, 10.5 inches.

Hope this helps and good Luck with the project

tag

Tag


Mike

Tag

tag

Quoted: Gentlemen, We are about 30 days out on commercial production. We have some Military commitments we need to satisfy first, then we should have units available for civvie sale. We will keep everyone posted. Best, Jeff

The Good....

There is a "deadline" fast approaching, for mil testing and acceptance.  That means to us...the TD guys are going to have to "finallize", or as final as it needs to be for acceptance, a design, then submit it.
Once that's done they can produce a "finallized" version, and fill orders...

The Bad...depending on your POV...

Their original submission and "design" was for a light Bipod that would enhance the average combat shooters ability to track and therefore hit "combat" style targets...ie. targets intentionally and purposefully trying to not be shot.  Much different animal than those "cellulose terrorists" many of us have come to know so well.
Fortuneately or unfortueately, as I stated, when the military saw the bipod and came to appreciate its inherent benefits over older designs, they asked, as usual, for a modification of the original design in order to allow it to do...you guessed it, everything.  Not what it was originally intended or designed to do.  So the ever resourceful guys at TD went about doing what they do; coming up w/ a solution.  They are attempting to invent tye "magic bullet" or "magic bipod" in this case.

The Military wants the same bipod, designed to be light but strong enough for use on a 20" or 14.5" M4/M16 platform to be rigid and sturdy enough to work on the SASS type rifles now in development, some of their M14/M21/XM25 style platforms...and the mother of all headaches for the TD guys the SAWs now in use; if at all possible.

These are good things if your a fan of innovation and progress, a bad thing if you're impatient...

The problems are greater than simple structural design/engineering issues...
The synthetic itself needs to be "perfected" it was solid and concrete for the lighter rifles, but w/ the request for it to work on some of the heavier platforms, formulas needed re-mixing and chemical engineering issues came into play.
I'll dabble in "simple" structural stuff but Chem. Eng.?  Be my guest.
Simple man's version?
Too much of "A" and the design has the tensile strength but too brittle for impact strength w/ the added wt.
Too much of "B" and less of "A" and the system has good impact stregth but become too flexible or "wobbly"
So the "perfect" mixture lies somewhere in between and that's taking some research to find.
They are close and will deliver but it's taking time.

The situaution's not ideal for anyone, but it will workout...for all.

/S2

Quoted: (Posted 2/7/2005) Gentlemen, We are about 30 days out on commercial production. We have some Military commitments we need to satisfy first, then we should have units available for civvie sale. We will keep everyone posted. Best, Jeff

Quoted: There is a "deadline" fast approaching, for mil testing and acceptance. That means to us...the TD guys are going to have to "finallize", or as final as it needs to be for acceptance, a design, then submit it. Once that's done they can produce a "finallized" version, and fill orders...

Bait and switch

Bait and switch??

I'm not tracking that .

Please explain.

Quoted: Bait and switch?? I'm not tracking that . Please explain.

 


The design was supposedly finished at SS and would be shipping to civie customers @ 30 days from 2/7/2005. Now it is undergoing redesign so it can be turned into a heavy pig to satisfy every possible .mil application including the SAW? Sounds like a completely different animal from what is described as the intent of this bipod:

Their original submission and "design" was for a light Bipod that would enhance the average combat shooters ability to track and therefore hit "combat" style targets...

sovereign

The modifications made to meet requirements are minimal.  It is no where near a "PIG", and probably won't even be noticed by most.  There's a war on, and priorities are priorities.  I'm glad TD has theirs in order.

Quoted: sovereign The modifications made to meet requirements are minimal.  It is no where near a "PIG", and probably won't even be noticed by most.  There's a war on, and priorities are priorities.  I'm glad TD has theirs in order.

Fair enough. I'll reserve my judgements until it is released. I don't actually NEED a bipod right now, but I'm thinking about a Larue/Harris combo and it would be nice to know if the design of the TD is going to change from what it was originally intended to be, as quoted above.

Quoted: Bait and switch

Quoted: The design was supposedly finished at SS and would be shipping to civie customers @ 30 days from 2/7/2005. Now it is undergoing redesign so it can be turned into a heavy pig to satisfy every possible .mil application including the SAW? Sounds like a completely different animal from what is described as the intent of this bipod:...

Interesting...I was wondering what that bad taste was...I realize now it was your words in my mouth...

How does TD needing to customize a polymer compound in order to allow their bipod to remain light while at the same time remaining strong enough to take the added stresses placed upon it it by a heavier weapon system create a "Pig"?
Unless of course they changed the chemical compound from...oh say...a polymer to say...steel.

Nor can I understand what in my original quote would elude to a "bait and switch".

Their original submission and "design" was for a light Bipod that would enhance the average combat shooters ability to track and therefore hit "combat" style targets... The Military wants the same bipod, designed to be light but strong enough for use on a 20" or 14.5" M4/M16 platform to be rigid and sturdy enough to work on the SASS type rifles now in development, some of their M14/M21/XM25 style platforms...and the mother of all headaches for the TD guys the SAWs now in use; if at all possible.

The point is to remain light and strong...If the TD guys simply needed to add strength simply adding more of the same material could have sufficed.  However added weight would have negated many of the TD design benefits.  So they took the hard route and refused to simply "bulk up" the bipod through

simple structural design/engineering issues

..they went about finding a synthetic formula that allowed the same lightweight design to work on heavier weapons.

/S2

Quoted: Interesting...I was wondering what that bad taste was...I realize now it was your words in my mouth...

You'll be OK.

The point is to remain light and strong...If the TD guys simply needed to add strength simply adding more of the same material could have sufficed. However added weight would have negated many of the TD design benefits. So they took the hard route and refused to simply "bulk up" the bipod through

Perfect! A bipod strong enough to work with the SAW, but still lightweight. As in, less than a Larue/Harris combo, for example.

Quoted: Interesting...I was wondering what that bad taste was...I realize now it was your words in my mouth...

'Know what?  I'm sorry.  I sometimes forget not everyone "knows" me and I forget not everyone realizes I can be a $m@rt@$$ at times.  I should have given you a ...those weren't "hard feelings"...just a bad attempt at humor.

Quoted: You'll be OK.

Give me some credit.  I'll be better than that...

Perfect!

Well, I don't know about that ...but hopefully close to it...

A bipod strong enough to work with the SAW, but still lightweight. As in, less than a Larue/Harris combo, for example.

Thats the idea, anyway, and the problem...
Also remember, TD's under no "obligation" to provide the bipod to the .mil as they've requested.
If the design changes do undermine the integrity of TD's original intent, they do retain the "last word" and can, if they should so choose, to keep everything the way it was, and just not meet all of the .mil's "requests".
I think they are looking at the "request" as A) a challenge, and B) a chance to try and make everyone happy.

Hopefully they can.  It'd be great to see 1) what the polymers can do when really pressed to their maximum potential...and 2) what a little good ol' fashioned American ingenuity can come up w/ when we refuse to accept what's already out and/or what's "easy"..

/S2

Quoted: Also remember, TD's under no "obligation" to provide the bipod to the .mil as they've requested. If the design changes do undermine the integrity of TD's original intent, they do retain the "last word" and can, if they should so choose, to keep everything the way it was, and just not meet all of the .mil's "requests". /S2

I'll admit that the "bait and switch" phrase might not have been the best choice of words

Thanks for the above clarification. What had prompted my comments was that the design was apparently completed and ready for production and then the military made requests that seemed to be moving the design from its original intention. It almost seemed that they were/are requesting that an entirely seperate bipod be produced. Like, maybe a lightweight version and then a heavier version for the SAW, etc. It will be interesting to see the final design. And remember, though I can be an ass, I am not a TD basher. I want to pick one of these up if it doesn't move to far from the design we have seen.

Sovereign,

 The bipod you saw at SHOT will remain the same with EXTREMELY MINOR modifications to improve the end product for everyone.  Take my word for it, TD is working feverishly to get it done ASAP.    The 30 day quote by ARMRER was a best case.  In the real world of developing, manufacturing and producing products, best cases are few and far between.  PLEASE BE PATIENT..it will be worth it.


 TD has been asked to come up with a better mouse trap when it comes to the MK46 and Mk48 bipods which incorporates the same principles of design the ACB has.  Integration with the host weapon when stowed, Light weight, and Bomb proof.  It will most likely be a different animal all together, but will definately  have  a family resemblence : )

Quoted: It almost seemed that they were/are requesting that an entirely seperate bipod be produced. Like, maybe a lightweight version and then a heavier version for the SAW, etc...

Quoted: Sovereign, ... TD has been asked to come up with a better mouse trap when it comes to the MK46 and Mk48 bipods which incorporates the same principles of design the ACB has.  Integration with the host weapon when stowed, Light weight, and Bomb proof.  It will most likely be a different animal all together, but will definately  have  a family resemblence : )

Cool way to do it...Thanks all.

/S2

Any good news about availability yet?

Should be anyday now.
My understanding is the submissions to our "Uncle" are in...
In fact I believe the TD guys are taking a well deserved vacation...
Let's hope while they are away everything necessary to get this ball rolling in the civ. market's in place awaiting their return...

/S2

tag

Will this fit on YHM rails?

Quoted: Will this fit on YHM rails?

It should fit.  TD usually goes to great lengths to assure 1913 compliance.  A n added bennie of the design is it clamps, and not slides like their FPG design.  The clamping aspect will make it slightly more "forgiving" on out of spec. rails.  I have no reason to think YHM rails are out of spec., as I have no personal exp. w/ them, but if they are slightly, the TD should work w/ them...

/S2

Jeff from TangoDown was here in vacation ,few days ago  we met and went shooting together, so I had the chance to T&E his bipod , the last version .

The bipod's material is a new kind of "plastic" , really undestructible , rock solid , the bipod can swivel in windage and elevation easily allowing  the shooter to keep a big area under control without moving the bipod from the ground .

We shot about 100 rds , the bipod allows multiple shooting to different targets at different distances , from the far left to the far right simple swiveling the carbine without moving the shooter's body .

New bipods with shorter legs are inbound soon , I already ordered some for my SWSs and ARs , outstanding product !

PP out


P.S.: We also had amazing time together ,dining and drinking good wine , while talking abt .....guess what ?

grant, i know this is off topic but, the mount for the doctor optic, who makes them and will they fit on the jpoint?




meat

OK- now that TD's together again back in CONUS...he spoke very highly of you PP.  This is the most current intel. available...

From TD:

Good News, the polymer/synthetic/compound is finallized, tested and accepted...
The only wait now is actual production.  There's 2 aspects of production...the actual bipod (synthetic portion) and its mount, the machined steel portion.  The two portions require coordination between the shops producing them.  The polymer portion will be the eaiser of the 2 to produce in all reality...molds are easier once accurately and precisely set than CNC's are to run...accurately over the coure of a run.  Checks at beginning and end, if not middle of runs are needed...and then there's plating etc.  and that's just scratching the surface.
Good news is a very capable, well known and trusted machine shop is producing the mount/1913 clamp...same shop that runs their their sling swivel mounts...

Soon Very Soon...

PS these bipods will be produced only in Black and Coyote (...ahem, .mil request, ahem)...NO OD!!!  Not enough demand.

/S2

Quoted:...he spoke very highly of you PP.....

S2,
thanks , here #1 pic of me shooting with the new bipod , #1 image is better than #1.000 words !

PP out

Are we there yet?

I need a bipod before 5/11/05!  Going to a friend's range and we are going to shoot out to about 400 yds. and I want to put a Tango Down bipod on my rifle!

...whoa, whoa, whoa... uno minuto...

PP- Do you have any idea how much "hemming and hawing" it took me to get him to put a TD Bipod on the SIRs at SHOT '05????   (j/k JC)
Looks good.  Did you mount it out fwd. of the polymer section?  On the Portion of Al. rail that sits slightly closer to the centerline of the bore?  At SHOT the legs tucked up out of the way, along side the polymer HG and rail really nicely...


Nice work PP, oh you to TD...

/S2

Quoted:.......Did you mount it out fwd. of the polymer section?  On the Portion of Al. rail that sits slightly closer to the centerline of the bore?

Hi S2,

I have one ARMS #4 rail at 6 o'clock of my SIR , that's where I mounted the TD bipod easily , just  tighting it with an allen wrench , no pain at all  .

PP out

PP-

Did he leave it w/ you, or bring it back home?  If you have it would you mind trying on the fwd/extended portion on the lower HG and snapping a pic?

Thanks

/S2

Gentlemen,

First, I want to thank Pinco for his amazing hospitality. It was an honor to have him take us into his home, meet and dine with his family and tour his facilities. He graciously spoiled us the entire time we were in Tuscana. Plus, he's a helluva good shot. Thanks again, Brother!

The above picture illustrates a cool little trick you can do with the ACB-4. Just turn it around and mount it up against the mag well. That gives you a HUGE amount of fluid traverse (the pivot point is almost in the middle of the gun), with little body movement. Pinco had arranged for the range to opened for our use only that day, and we randomly marked targets at 50 yards in varying places across 8 lanes and Pinco proceeded to shoot speed drills on the targets. You can engage targets quickly and accurately like never before. Great for snipers who have to sweep a big area and anticipate running targets. You can also get lower than ever for depressed angle shots, such as behind roof peaks, etc.

With current and forthcoming barrel/optic technology, there is a trend towards 'supercarbines' that can perform CQB and take surgical shots within 300 yards. That's kinda in  SPR territory. Add a combat bipod that 'disappears' when performing door kicking, but can deploy rapidly for a distant head shot ..

What'd you two have to modify to get that TD product on a SIR?  

Quoted: Gentlemen, First, I want to thank Pinco for his amazing hospitality. It was an honor to have him take us into his home, meet and dine with his family and tour his facilities. He graciously spoiled us the entire time we were in Tuscana. Plus, he's a helluva good shot. Thanks again, Brother! .

Hi ARMRER,
it was an honor for me brother , you bet !

RASTAMON,
it was quite simple to attach it to the ARMS #4 rail I have at 6 o'clock on my SIR , the bipod has two Allen screws to do that .

PP out

Are they in production now?

Is it 50BMG proof? Looks good! Is it in production yet???

Will this fit if mounted in front of a M900A? on a short rail?

Put me down for one of these when it becomes available!!

I am getting ready for an OIF rotation and need to know if I could mount my Rheinmetal120mm on this if my T&E go out in my turret my my M1A1?


Just kidding about the second 1/2 of the sentence,
Any word on availability?

KILO OUT

edited because I can't spell German words correctly.

Quoted:..... my Rhinemetal 120mm ---

K.,
probably you mean "Rheinmetal 120mm M256 smooth bore cannon ?

Well , may be if the TD'd make a right size bipod it'd be good for that big stick too !  

PP out

Pinco,
that's what I get for trying to type too late at night with poor German spelling skills. For some damn reason I could not remember the nomenclature of the 120mm, my brain was stuck on M-68 (US) M7 (Brit) which was the 105mm first in the M1.
Thanks for the spelling lesson,
KILO OUT

PS, are these out yet? or do I have to wait until I go to OIF before I see one?

Gentlemen,

We are working as fast as possible on this project. Obviously, the Warfighter comes first. It is being tested on several new US Military weapon platforms, with final small details being adjusted. When those are locked down by the Military, we can throw the production switch. Hopefully we can supply the commercial market as well at  that point. I wish I could be more specific, timewise, but  those decisions are above my paygrade.

Best,

Jeff

Quoted:....Thanks for the spelling lesson....

Hey K.,
I was just kidding , no flame intended , OK ?
PP out

Quoted: Gentlemen, We are working as fast as possible on this project. Obviously, the Warfighter comes first. It is being tested on several new US Military weapon platforms, with final small details being adjusted. When those are locked down by the Military, we can throw the production switch. Hopefully we can supply the commercial market as well at  that point. I wish I could be more specific, timewise, but  those decisions are above my paygrade. Best, Jeff

Can you give us any details on what to expect with the bipod compared to the pre-production samples we've seen and heard about?

I am going to wait on upgrading my Harris until I see what you are offering.

Thanks,

Corey (who between this and the SOCOM flat earth furniture is going to be spending a lot of money at Tango Down this summer)

Quoted: Quoted:....Thanks for the spelling lesson.... Hey K., I was just kidding , no flame intended , OK ? PP out

PP
No flame taken, I was serious about the correction besides, I usually post while wearing my CVCU's (nomex) so flames don't bother me!. If I am wrong, I do not get offended when someone corrects me, I am still not too old to learn. My thanks was meant as a sincere thank you, not sarcasm; which I could see how it might have been received.

KILO OUT

Cory,

Changes so far from the unit we showed at SHOT 05 are:

-New uprated material for the inner/outer leg assemblies. This allows us to surpass the Army drop test  of 5' on concrete mounted to a 9lb. weapon. This material didn't exist a year ago.

-Finger ridges on the leg release buttons. They now have the appearance of the mag release button and/or forward assist. This will prevent fingers from slipping off the buttons when wet, etc.

-Simplified MS 1913 clamp assembly.

-Pre-tensioning in the traverse feature. Gives fluid traversing of the weapon.

-USSOCOM Flat Dark Earth finish, as well as black.