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Link Posted: 8/13/2004 1:42:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2004 9:50:42 PM EDT by jar3ds]
even though it looks weirder than the aug... FN's F2000



is a bullpup done right... it has an exjection 'shoot' holds spent rounds and then pushs them out away from the users face... it allows left handed shooting... if you take all the gagets off of the f2000 its just as light as the AUG...

i'd rather see one of these.... it already takes M16 mags

More Info Here...
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 2:26:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jar3ds:
even though it looks weirder than the aug... FN's F2000

world.guns.ru/assault/f2000_1.jpg

is a bullpup done right... it has an exjection 'shoot' holds spent rounds and then pushs them out away from the users face... it allows left handed shooting... if you take all the gagets off of the f2000 its just as light as the AUG...

i'd rather see one of these.... it already takes M16 mags

More Info Here...



I would like to see the FN too. I will buy a DSA AUG. I have a 20" Green AUG now and I think it is a great rifle. But I would like to get A2 DSA AUG so I can use different optics. Also I would like to see a .308 DSA AUG...I know it won't happen but I think that it would be a great deer rifle.

Speaking of FN, I heard that there was a rumor of a FN P90 with a 16" built in the US after the ban...anyone else know if there is any truth to a US P90?
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 3:21:41 PM EDT
we can only hope... the 5.7 round still makes me wonder though...
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 3:38:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2004 3:54:11 PM EDT by Master_Blaster]
Others who've tried it have posted here that the FN bullpup is "bull-poop", has problems w/ cases binding up in the ejection tube in certain situations, & is not the wondergun that some would've hoped; also said the trigger is lousy. Peronally, if I were in the market for one, I'd go for the Isreali Tavor:



I find the lack of ambidextrous capability to be a serious drawback to the basic design, but would still give kudos to FN for at least addressing the issue. In point of fact, when I look at modern bullpups (incl. the Tavor), I find it curious that an AR-style brass deflector isn't employed.
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 7:21:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By yfs200:
I spoke with the DSA reps at Camp Perry this weekend. DSA will be selling AUGs when 2 things happen.
1. The Ban expires.
2. I quote "we get the parts from the rich, young, asshole who is sitting on them".

They will be making the proper number of USA manufactured parts to build with Styer parts. They will be making 2 recievers. One that takes AUG mags, and one that takes M16 mags. He said the price will probably be around $1200-$1300. That's all I know and I hope I posted on the correct board. I seem to remember originally reading about the Augs here.




No Shit???

Put me down for one.. I have always wanted one but not for 3K+.....
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 7:46:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jar3ds:
even though it looks weirder than the aug... FN's F2000

world.guns.ru/assault/f2000_1.jpg

is a bullpup done right... it has an exjection 'shoot' holds spent rounds and then pushs them out away from the users face... it allows left handed shooting... if you take all the gagets off of the f2000 its just as light as the AUG...

i'd rather see one of these.... it already takes M16 mags

More Info Here...



That ejection tube is a recipe for trouble...

JAM-O-MATIC if a case gets stuck in there, and clearing it would be a bitch...

The 'best' solution to the bullpup ejection problem is BOTTOM EJECT (with the cases being spit out behind the mag, but noone makes one in a full rifle caliber....
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 7:48:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:
Others who've tried it have posted here that the FN bullpup is "bull-poop", has problems w/ cases binding up in the ejection tube in certain situations, & is not the wondergun that some would've hoped; also said the trigger is lousy. Peronally, if I were in the market for one, I'd go for the Isreali Tavor:

www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/small_arms/tavor/tar.jpg

I find the lack of ambidextrous capability to be a serious drawback to the basic design, but would still give kudos to FN for at least addressing the issue. In point of fact, when I look at modern bullpups (incl. the Tavor), I find it curious that an AR-style brass deflector isn't employed.



The brass deflector won't work.

It works on the AR because, as a full-sized rifle, the ejection port is IN FRONT of your face.

With a bullpup, even with the deflector it would eject straight into your cheek...
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 8:23:26 PM EDT
I'm surprised no one has commented on the AUG trigger.
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 9:50:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2004 9:51:17 PM EDT by jar3ds]
it isn't a match trigger.... but it gets the job done...

but agreed.. even unbroke-in AR stock triggers are better than the bullpup triggers... (sorry you m17 owners)

remind me of a very crappy glock trigger
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 7:13:52 AM EDT
The Aug is one of those gizmos that looks like a very cool idea when someone else is shooting it but (at least in my case) quickly looses its appeal when you actually run the gun yourself. The trigger is, not to put too sharp a point on it, poo-poo ka-ka. The standard factory optic is IMHO the worst of both worlds; close up and long range. Although I've been given to understand that current models do provide some flexibility in optic choices. As to the left hand-right hand stuff: Whichever way you prefer to swing, sooner or later you're going to need to go to your weak side; the alternative being to put yourself in an unenviable siutation. And with an Aug, weak side really, truly, deeply sucks. (and hurts.)

Mis dos centavos.

SD
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 9:35:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:
Others who've tried it have posted here that the FN bullpup is "bull-poop", has problems w/ cases binding up in the ejection tube in certain situations, & is not the wondergun that some would've hoped; also said the trigger is lousy.



Just imagine getting dirt, sand, mud, snow, or other debris in the ejectin tube. That just makes the problems inherent in that design feature appear even faster. The first time I saw that design, I knew it would be problematic.
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 9:56:27 AM EDT
For bullpup rifles. The seems to be the best of the bunch. The British had some problems with theirs the french FAMAS is said to be a good rifle but more countries use the AUG.

I think that "weak" hand shooting argument is lame. I know there are a lot of LE/Military guys on here, and a lot of compition shooters on AR15.com, but there are a lot of people like me Shooters and hunters....I do not see myself getting in a fire fight, and I do not see many others getting in a fire fight and having to use their weak hand. I think most people are like me and will buy a AUG because we are gun collectors and AUG look good in our collection and it is fun to shoot.

If I was a LE person, the AUG would make a great patrol rifle. It points like a shotgun, it is compact and with that 1.5 scope you are fast on the target and you can shoot with both eyes open.

Chris


Link Posted: 8/14/2004 10:02:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/14/2004 11:28:38 AM EDT by Suburban]
Problems with AUG
1. Trigger sucks, and there's not a damn thing you can do about it besides some polishing.
2. Mag changes are not that bad, but still slower than an AR
3. Not as versatile as an AR. There are not a whole lot of accessories for it. No way to attach a 3-point sling, etc.
4. The grip is too small for me, and there's nothing I can do about it
5. You can only adjust the scope with a special key, or I guess a small 2 pin wrench. Why they didn't make the adjustment dials with coin slots is beyond my comprehension.
... to name a few

I'm going to hold onto mine, but I like my AR-15 carbine a lot better. Really wish someone would make a good, durable view-through AR magazine though.
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 10:47:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Suburban:
Problems with AUG
1. Trigger sucks, and there's not a damn thing you can do about it besides some polishing.
2. Mag changes are not that bad, but still slower than an AR
3. Not as versatile as an AR. There are not a whole lot of accessories for it. No way to attach a 3-point sling, etc.
4. The grip is too small for me, and there's nothing I can do about it
5. You can only adjust the scope with a special key, or I guess a small 2 pin wrench. Why they didn't make the adjustment dials with coin slots is beyond my comprehension.

I'm going to hold onto mine, but I like my AR-15 carbine a lot better. Really wish someone would make a good, durable view-through AR magazine though.



The sling is a problem..I will give you that. I hate how the AUG will twists the sling when you are walking. The trigger is not that bad. It is a battle rifle, not a bench rifle. I think the trigger breaks at 7 or 8 pounds and it feels crisp to me....granted I would enjoy a 2 pound trigger.
If the AUG is a A2 then there are a lot of options for it just like the AR.
The scope can be adjusted with a paper clip. Pete at PJ Investments told me that when I wanted to order out a scope adjustment key.

Link Posted: 8/14/2004 2:35:12 PM EDT
I had a green aug, sold it to get a black one, sold that (and some other stuff) to get a full auto DLO 1919a4. I echo the other comments about the trigger, balance and mag changes. It is compact and cool to look at, I must say. I doubt that DSA will sell them cheap. My guess is they would have to be $2500 or more.
Link Posted: 8/16/2004 7:43:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By UZI4you:

The sling is a problem..I will give you that. I hate how the AUG will twists the sling when you are walking. The trigger is not that bad. It is a battle rifle, not a bench rifle. I think the trigger breaks at 7 or 8 pounds and it feels crisp to me....granted I would enjoy a 2 pound trigger.
If the AUG is a A2 then there are a lot of options for it just like the AR.
The scope can be adjusted with a paper clip. Pete at PJ Investments told me that when I wanted to order out a scope adjustment key.




A "battle rifle"?

To quote your own earlier post:

"I think that "weak" hand shooting argument is lame. I know there are a lot of LE/Military guys on here, and a lot of compition shooters on AR15.com, but there are a lot of people like me Shooters and hunters....I do not see myself getting in a fire fight, and I do not see many others getting in a fire fight and having to use their weak hand. I think most people are like me and will buy a AUG because we are gun collectors and AUG look good in our collection and it is fun to shoot."

The "weak hand" argument isn't lame.

When people are shooting _at_ you, trying to _kill_ you, having to stick your entire head and upper torso out from cover in order to use your rifle isn't some trifling issue. It's something that can get you _dead_. _Dead_ in the "I can't click to restart the video game" sense of the word.

The AUG is an adequate toy for gunshop commandos who have the extra money to spend on a new toy, and want to have something new and unique to show off at the range.

It's no "battle rifle." It's the choice of mostly third-rate militaries like Oman and Saudi Arabia and Austria; and the Austrians at least have the excuse of it being a home-grown design that influenced politicians looking to play the "buy local" card.

The only serious militaries that have bought the AUG are Australia and New Zealand. It speaks volumes that their elite troops use M16s.
Link Posted: 8/16/2004 8:45:57 PM EDT


The "weak hand" argument isn't lame.

When people are shooting _at_ you, trying to _kill_ you, having to stick your entire head and upper torso out from cover in order to use your rifle isn't some trifling issue. It's something that can get you _dead_. _Dead_ in the "I can't click to restart the video game" sense of the word.

The AUG is an adequate toy for gunshop commandos who have the extra money to spend on a new toy, and want to have something new and unique to show off at the range.

It's no "battle rifle." It's the choice of mostly third-rate militaries like Oman and Saudi Arabia and Austria; and the Austrians at least have the excuse of it being a home-grown design that influenced politicians looking to play the "buy local" card.

The only serious militaries that have bought the AUG are Australia and New Zealand. It speaks volumes that their elite troops use M16s.


AGC May I ask how many gun battles have you been in.... Better yet have you even shot an AUG? What I was saying was that the weak hand shooting is a lame arguemant for people who bash a AUG, FN2000 and pretty much and gun that is not the GREAT AR15. The fact is most of the people here are gun collectors who enjoy firearms and shooting. That is what most of the people use their weapons for. We are not talking about DSA making the full auto AUG which is class III and is a battle rifle. We are talking about DSA making a great semi auto for practical use. I do not see everyone on this site saying thank God I have my $600 AR build done.... Now I am going to war with it. B as in B and S as in S.

I know I am not going to be in a gun battle, but it is still wise to plan in case it happens.
Link Posted: 8/16/2004 9:29:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By UZI4you:
...I think that "weak" hand shooting argument is lame. I know there are a lot of LE/Military guys on here, and a lot of compition shooters on AR15.com, but there are a lot of people like me Shooters and hunters....I do not see myself getting in a fire fight, and I do not see many others getting in a fire fight and having to use their weak hand.



I find your assertion to be "lame" as well. Being the connoisseur of fine battle arms, I always nit-pick about features that I think are important & requisite for a battle-worthy arm to possess, regardless of some perceived "need" - a relative perception - for them. Having the capability to be employed weak-side is "weak" for those who don not value it. It's a valid consideration for others those who practice shooting both weak & strong side.
Link Posted: 8/16/2004 9:48:14 PM EDT
Any actual updates on a semi AUG?
Link Posted: 8/16/2004 10:16:49 PM EDT
I heard there was another player on the AUG deal, and that the papers are not signed yet. Could be wrong though. I will see if I can remember where I read it and get back here with any info.

kentlik
07, 08
Link Posted: 8/16/2004 10:45:50 PM EDT
How 'bout that G36.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 2:03:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jar3ds:
it isn't a match trigger.... but it gets the job done...

but agreed.. even unbroke-in AR stock triggers are better than the bullpup triggers... (sorry you m17 owners)

remind me of a very crappy glock trigger



Mine is pretty damn good for a plastic trigger, heavy, but little creep or take up. Quite "crisp" actually.

S.O.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 2:21:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Suburban:
Problems with AUG
1. Trigger sucks, and there's not a damn thing you can do about it besides some polishing.
2. Mag changes are not that bad, but still slower than an AR
3. Not as versatile as an AR. There are not a whole lot of accessories for it. No way to attach a 3-point sling, etc.
4. The grip is too small for me, and there's nothing I can do about it
5. You can only adjust the scope with a special key, or I guess a small 2 pin wrench. Why they didn't make the adjustment dials with coin slots is beyond my comprehension.
... to name a few

I'm going to hold onto mine, but I like my AR-15 carbine a lot better. Really wish someone would make a good, durable view-through AR magazine though.



They do make 3-point slings for the AUG.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 5:09:59 AM EDT
If I could dream for a bit here, I'd rather SIG produce the 550 series domestically. I don't think that is going to happen, but a 551 would be one fine weapon.

I use to have an AUG - sold it for about $4k. An OK gun and very unusual, but as many have noted the trigger sucks, lack of optic flexability (although on the newer A2 &A3s that's not a problem). Also weakside shooting is a problem, I think Giles Stock has a few ways to minimize this problem.

All in all, certianly not worth the $3-5k prebans are running, but for $1,200? I might buy one just for fun.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 6:34:10 AM EDT
Who is this "Rich, Young, Asshole"?

:)
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 7:39:16 AM EDT
I put a rail on my USR then added an Aimpoint. Have three point sling and ability to place whatever optic will fit on a weaver rail. Or is it picatinny? I use the original A2 sights. I cut off the web behind the pistol grip to help with ease of handling. Not a part that was necessary regarding importation contrary to what most think. I can drive a humvee over my USR and it would still fire. Maybe not too straight, but it would run, cannot say that about the AR series. I like the weight and ease of handlingdo to the lighter load better on the AR platform, but as for target aquisition, cleaning kit in butt stock full auto with a deeper pull, hands down the AUG/USR with original A2 sights.

Link Posted: 8/17/2004 7:53:30 AM EDT
Why did DSA wait for the AWB to expire? It does not have a folding stock? And a FS could have been changed to a muzzle brake. I live in MA which has it's own AWB. But I would love to get an AUG. Do you think I could get one?
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 11:38:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TheSaint2004:
Why did DSA wait for the AWB to expire? It does not have a folding stock? And a FS could have been changed to a muzzle brake. I live in MA which has it's own AWB. But I would love to get an AUG. Do you think I could get one?



The USR was the post ban AUG. But thanks to Bill Clinton he put out a executive order and had the USR and many sporterized weapons banned in 1997. The USR was different then the AUG because it had a thumbhole stock, no flash hider, and 9 round mag. The DSA AUG will have the classic AUG look and features. If MA has its own AWB then you might not be able to buy a AUG from DSA, but check into a USR or maybe DSA will make a USR for AWB states.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 12:20:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/17/2004 12:30:03 PM EDT by wittzo]

Originally Posted By Suburban:
Problems with AUG
1. Trigger sucks, and there's not a damn thing you can do about it besides some polishing.
........The internal parts on the one I was examining and stripping down were plastic. Plastic hammer, plastic trigger. It had metal springs and pins, but the major parts that could be tuned, were plastic. I didn't think you could polish those? I also remember that AUG was proud that the internals had a 50,000 round life. It sounded kind of low to me, compared with all those M-16's and AR's that people shoot 1000 rounds a week through.
2. Mag changes are not that bad, but still slower than an AR.
.......I'm not too thrilled about having to use an adaptor to use AR mags, what if I hit the wrong button and the adaptor falls out?..
3. Not as versatile as an AR. There are not a whole lot of accessories for it. No way to attach a 3-point sling, etc.
........No BUIS, no light mounts, no Weaver rails, etc. It has a forward pistol grip, but when it's folded to use as a forearm, your hand seems to be uncomfortaby close to a hot barrel.
4. The grip is too small for me, and there's nothing I can do about it.
........That could probably be addressed with some aftermarket stuff like some kind of stick on grip or a Hogue/inner tube type thing. I would not want to permanently mount anything on a $$ rifle, though.
5. You can only adjust the scope with a special key, or I guess a small 2 pin wrench. Why they didn't make the adjustment dials with coin slots is beyond my comprehension.... to name a few

I'm going to hold onto mine, but I like my AR-15 carbine a lot better. Really wish someone would make a good, durable view-through AR magazine though.
...........I don't like the AUG's clear plastic mags or plastic mags in general.They're either too brittle and might break when dropped too many times, or they are too flexible at the feed lips and can't hold the rounds under spring pressure. That happened too many times with our Ramline mags. We got rid of them ASAP



I almost bought an AUG, I had the money in my pocket. I had seen them on Miami Vice and in several scifi movies. The DEA, the Austrian Army, and the Australian Army was using them, so I thought they were good stuff. Then I handled one and stripped it down at the fun store. It was either pay $1000 for a rifle I couldn't "improve"or change in any way except for barrel length and handedness or $700 for a Colt HBAR I could do anything with. The Colt won. It hurt me to see that AUGs were selling for $2-3000 later on, but I'm happier with that dog of an HBAR I've had for 15 years. The AUG has a lot of good points, but I like the uncompromising qualities of the AR system.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 1:36:45 PM EDT
The DSA AUG will appeal to gun collectors mostly.

But you have to admit their 16" black carbine looks pretty short and slick.

The AUG is an old design too like the AR.

CRC
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 7:32:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By UZI4you:

AGC May I ask how many gun battles have you been in.... Better yet have you even shot an AUG? What I was saying was that the weak hand shooting is a lame arguemant for people who bash a AUG, FN2000 and pretty much and gun that is not the GREAT AR15. The fact is most of the people here are gun collectors who enjoy firearms and shooting. That is what most of the people use their weapons for. We are not talking about DSA making the full auto AUG which is class III and is a battle rifle. We are talking about DSA making a great semi auto for practical use. I do not see everyone on this site saying thank God I have my $600 AR build done.... Now I am going to war with it. B as in B and S as in S.

I know I am not going to be in a gun battle, but it is still wise to plan in case it happens.




Not enough "gun battles" to impress the video game crowd. But I've been involved in several near-shooting situations, and it makes a considerable impression on one when you face the reality of someone with a weapon who is possibly going to try to kill you or an innocent third party, and you have a weapon in your hands and have to decide whether or not to shoot them.

Having to expose your entire head and upper torso around cover with an AUG, instead of switching to the left shoulder---as you can do with almost any other rifle---and only having to expose a narrow slice of your head and left shoulder, makes the AUG anything _but_ a "battle rifle."

"Battle rifle" was your choice of terms. I won't argue with "neat toy for an afternoon of fun at the range," though I wouldn't pay the ridiculous prices asked for what's basically an AR-18 in a plastic wrapper.

I _don't_ know that I'm not going to be in a gun battle, and a personal weapon in my hands has saved me from injury or death once already, so the term "battle rifle" means something significantly more to me than "neat toy."

And yes, I've shot an AUG. On several occasions. Wasn't at all impressed. As others have mentioned: mushy trigger, mediocre sights, awkward handling. Some of the later versions seem to have reduced these issues, but the fact remains that the AUG is used almost exclusively by third-rate militaries; with the exceptions of Australia and New Zealand (who apparently bought it mostly on the basis of its adoption by Australia), and their elite forces, allowed to buy their own small arms, have ditched it in favor of the M16.

And, truth be told, I'm not a huge fan of the AR15. My personal preferences lie elsewhere. But an AR15 or M16 is what I've been issued for over 21 years now and I have confidence that if I ever have to use it for serious purposes it will work, and won't require me to do tactically unsound and unsafe things in the process.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 8:40:10 PM EDT
AGC I thank you for your service for 21 years. However I said that the weak hand shooting was weak because I do not like the trend that is on this site that any gun the is not a AR-15 and any handgun that is not a 1911 is total crap. That is why I felt the arguement about hiding for cover shooting left handed or right was small point....unless we are talking about the French, then they really have to worry for cover.
My father is left handed I am right. He owns a AUG as do I. I have shot is left handed AUG right handed. What I did was place the stocking hat that I was wearing over the ejection port. I fired of a couple rounds and the gun worked fine. So in a pinch one can shoot with a "weak" hand.

Now the AUG is not my favorite weapon I own. I am more of a HK fan, but I do not want others to discredit a weapon because it does not shoot well "weak handed" as a HK93 or AR-15. That is a pretty narrow view point of a battle rifle, Military weapon, Assault Weapon, Practical Rifle, Combat Weapon...pick a term that works for you. The AUG is a well built weapon used by many elite units around the world. So I think we need to allow people to expand their choices of firearms before bash a gun just because will look at it with a narrow viewpoint...or because a gun is different then a AR.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 9:22:48 PM EDT
Oh, one more problem... finding mag pouches that fit AUG magazines. If you can get the mags to fit at all, you will almost always have to put one less in each pouch than they were designed for. The ribbed plastic mags are thicker than AR-15 mags.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 10:41:37 PM EDT
Since the AUG is going to be a toy for rich, young assholes anyway, there is no hurry on the parts.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 1:24:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By UZI4you:
AGC I thank you for your service for 21 years. However I said that the weak hand shooting was weak because I do not like the trend that is on this site that any gun the is not a AR-15 and any handgun that is not a 1911 is total crap. That is why I felt the arguement about hiding for cover shooting left handed or right was small point....unless we are talking about the French, then they really have to worry for cover.
My father is left handed I am right. He owns a AUG as do I. I have shot is left handed AUG right handed. What I did was place the stocking hat that I was wearing over the ejection port. I fired of a couple rounds and the gun worked fine. So in a pinch one can shoot with a "weak" hand.

Now the AUG is not my favorite weapon I own. I am more of a HK fan, but I do not want others to discredit a weapon because it does not shoot well "weak handed" as a HK93 or AR-15. That is a pretty narrow view point of a battle rifle, Military weapon, Assault Weapon, Practical Rifle, Combat Weapon...pick a term that works for you. The AUG is a well built weapon used by many elite units around the world. So I think we need to allow people to expand their choices of firearms before bash a gun just because will look at it with a narrow viewpoint...or because a gun is different then a AR.



This really is a lost cause

nevermind
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 5:26:04 AM EDT

Originally Posted By UZI4you:
For bullpup rifles. The seems to be the best of the bunch. The British had some problems with theirs the french FAMAS is said to be a good rifle but more countries use the AUG.

I think that "weak" hand shooting argument is lame. I know there are a lot of LE/Military guys on here, and a lot of compition shooters on AR15.com, but there are a lot of people like me Shooters and hunters....I do not see myself getting in a fire fight, and I do not see many others getting in a fire fight and having to use their weak hand. I think most people are like me and will buy a AUG because we are gun collectors and AUG look good in our collection and it is fun to shoot.



Agreed. Every rifle in my safe does not need to be a SHTF weapon.



Link Posted: 8/18/2004 6:31:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/18/2004 6:34:40 AM EDT by 48thHighlander]
Alot of idiots posted here. I guess from reading this thread I should sell all of my rifles and have an AR15 with crap hanging off of it and be done with it. Thanks very much, but I only need one of those.

I buy rifles because they are different. Its nice to shoot something different. Nice to oogle a blond with big boobs instead of the brunette with regular boobs. It would be pretty boring to have a safe full of AR's as no doubt from the sounds of it, many around here do.

Let me begin by saying I enjoy tactical firearms matches. That said.............For the train as you fight crowd...........I am sorry you were beat up so many times in high school, but you can remove your tinfoil hat. Just because you own an AUG does not mean your mall security guard combat skills will be reduced. A couple of games of counter strike will fix you right back up and you will get your Jr. General rank back. By all means, if you shoot carbine matches or 3 gun with an AR, continue to do so. Nobody is saying you should take out the cardboard tango's with an AUG. Nobody has suggested you march into the mailstrom of war with an Aug, so I do not understand your gutteral rejection of a pro-gun US manufacturer bringing something new and interesting to market. So take your ninjitsu pants to the washer and rinse out the poo poo you left when you heard someone mention a rifle other than the AR15.

Sorry if I came off a bit harsh, but I just don't understand the attitude here. In days where the largest gun manufacturers have no interest in selling "AW's" to civvie sheeple, a pro-gun person like myself will encourage with my dollars the proliferation of any new projects to bring different guns to the American shooter. I think from the sounds of it, there is some serious snARberry going on.

If DSA can pull this off at a decent price, thier rifle will be highly successfull. Its not about, "I'd rather a sig 551", don't you see that you might have some choices, not one or the other. With the average gun dude attitue as I have seen demonstrated in this thread, I am not shure I would put my neck on the line to bring anything new or different to the market.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 6:41:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/18/2004 6:42:02 AM EDT by gs430]
48th....well said...

I hope DSA comes through with the US Made AUG's (especially for close to $1000...) Maybe they'll have it ready by the time I move out the PRK...
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 7:22:57 AM EDT
Get out of the PRK as fast as you can. But not until after you vote for GWB.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 7:23:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 48thHighlander:
B-O-O H-O-O



I guess you didn't bother to read the whole thread did you?

Several of us said we'd pass on the rifle because it doesn't fit our needs. Others asked why. We answered. Those that asked why, in actuality, had alterior motives. They own one and wanted a chance to argue about why their choice to own one is a good one. They aren't trying to argue because they think it's a good weapon, they're arguing because they are taking it personally (as you obviously have).

I don't think the AR is the best all around rifle. I think the FAL is. You and the other whiners just jumped to the conclusion that all the rest of us must love the AR over all others. I do like the AR better than the Aug. In that case why would I own an Aug? If you like having bragging rights, and/or just like standing still shooting different rifles, bully for you. If that's the case why do you get so offended when others simply point out that the rifle (1) isn't a good combat weapon and (2) isn't good for games either. If (1) and (2) don't apply to you, then what do you care?

You said you only need one AR "with crap hanging off it". That's fantastic. So do I. I'm working on having one M4-type and one SPR/SAM/Varmint type. In fact I'm working on only having two uppers & one lower. Between thos and my FAL, I'll have all I want/need in semi-auto centerfires.

What you're missing is that each of us buys guns for a purpose. Some for games, some for a perceived defensive need, some for collecting, some for work, etc. You sound like you're a collector that likes to go out and shoot your collection. There is nothing wrong with that. I either shoot competitions, or am practicing for competitions. I view the competitions as a good way to keep familiar with my firearms and test out gear for a (god forbid) situation where I'll need them to defend myself. There's nothing wrong with that either.

Link Posted: 8/18/2004 7:50:24 AM EDT
I just noticed "Steyr" is mispelt in the thread title.

Carry on.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 8:32:30 AM EDT
I want one just for fun.

Most people own alot more than 2-3 rifles, which can cover most any shtf scenario.

Not everything has to be ideal for combat for you to own it.

I own a Ruger 10/22. Wouldnt really want to take that into combat, but I still own it. I also own a couple of AK's. Not my bread and butter for shtf. They have a place for it, but I didnt purchase them with that intent. I bought them for fun at the range. Just as I would an AUG.

Its a very unique rifle, it shoots well, and its fun.

Thats all I need. My M4 has the rest covered :-)
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 8:34:45 AM EDT

I don't think the AR is the best all around rifle. I think the FAL is.


At least we agree on something have It will weigh as much as a loaded FAL without any of the punch or range of the FAL. Why? Because I can. Not because it is the best of the best. It will meet 2 criteria: look cool, and work.

Its funny, I was Infantry and later a Weapons Tech (Land) in the CDN Army. In that 5 years I never sat and discussed the particular shortcomings etc of any of the weapons other than grieving the loss of the C1. Since then, I have owned many of the rifles available to the American public, I have a much better idea of what the perfect rifle would be. I guess it being a hobby as opposed to a job you can appreciate the finer things. It did not matter in the military, because you had what they gave you and you made the most of it.

I have come to the conclusion that 1 rifle can't do it all with perfection. So I will remain content owning and exploring whatever I can get my hands on. I am sure those active duty SF types don't micro analyse their BUIS or Rail, but I do have the opportunity to do that now and draw my own conclusions. All rifle designs have certain features that make them desirable.

I would never begrudge or snub someone because they want a particular rifle. I would never discourage a manufacturer for bringing something new to market because it wasn't my ideal of a rifle. Companies like DSA should be held aloft on our shoulders. Investing in such a venture is like investing in Enron. At any moment some pinko liberal could pull the rug out from under them.

Link Posted: 8/18/2004 8:48:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 48thHighlander:
I would never begrudge or snub someone because they want a particular rifle.


Nor would I. I am glad to see that DSA is going to try to produce one. If I was still in the mindset of owning lots of guns I would undoubtedly be first in line. As I said in the beginning, I always wanted one as a kid after seeing them on Miami Vice. I'm just not into owning for the sake of owning anymore. Hell I've been selling off guns simply because I haven't shot them in well over a year (make that 3 years). I do understand that people enjoy shooting and owning a wide variety of firearms. I just have other hobbies that I like just as much, so I have to make compromises. The compromise here is that I need a gun to compete and defend myself with, and not much else (this applies to handguns & rifles). The Aug sucks for competition, and so it doesn't fit my needs.

The issue that came about was people asking why one rifle wasn't as combat worthy as another, and not liking the answers.

I am glad to hear that you appreciate the FAL as well. It lets me know you can't be COMPLETELY deluded.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 8:51:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Marksman14:
I own a Ruger 10/22.



I've got two of 'em (scoped & irons), as well as a bolt action .22 Marlin, and a Ruger MKII in .22LR. If I thought I could get more than a couple of dollars for them, and they weren't so damn good for teaching newbies, I'd dump them tomorrow. Other than taking newbies out I haven't shot any of these guns in at lease 4 years. They may not serve a combat purpose, but they serve a purpose.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 3:22:12 PM EDT
From Bonnie at DSArms:

We have received the rights to manufacture the AUG but we have no plans to begin as yet. We will try to keep you informed by our web site.
Bonnie
DSA


//

Asked about the AUG and 550. She said nothing about a 550 being produced.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 3:37:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TopCrest:

Originally Posted By knightone:

Originally Posted By norman74:
The Aug was my dream gun since I watched Miami Vice as a kid. But after watching people try to run courses of fire with them at various competitions I think they're pretty useless now.

With that said, if I was a "fill up the safe" kinda guy, I guess this would make a good way to fill that spot for less. And if it's made by DSA I would have no complaints.



What problems have you seen with the AUG?



try shooting weak side around a barricade



Never thought about that. It would probably place the brass on your jaw or cheek.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 4:52:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By yfs200:
I spoke with the DSA reps at Camp Perry this weekend. DSA will be selling AUGs when 2 things happen.
1. The Ban expires.
2. I quote "we get the parts from the rich, young, asshole who is sitting on them".

They will be making the proper number of USA manufactured parts to build with Styer parts. They will be making 2 recievers. One that takes AUG mags, and one that takes M16 mags. He said the price will probably be around $1200-$1300. That's all I know and I hope I posted on the correct board. I seem to remember originally reading about the Augs here.



One slight clarification on this post. The receivers are the same, it is the stock that changes to accept the M16 mag. They have 400 produced at this time and they are sitting on them very warmly. Came out of prototype molds of several years back. I think the price will be nearer to $1500-$1700.

Just my two cents...

Kentlik
07, 08, SOT
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 4:57:18 PM EDT
tag
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 5:06:18 PM EDT
Are these the same as the AUG A3 stocks that accept both mags or do they take one mag or the other?


Originally Posted By Kentlik:

Originally Posted By yfs200:
I spoke with the DSA reps at Camp Perry this weekend. DSA will be selling AUGs when 2 things happen.
1. The Ban expires.
2. I quote "we get the parts from the rich, young, asshole who is sitting on them".

They will be making the proper number of USA manufactured parts to build with Styer parts. They will be making 2 recievers. One that takes AUG mags, and one that takes M16 mags. He said the price will probably be around $1200-$1300. That's all I know and I hope I posted on the correct board. I seem to remember originally reading about the Augs here.



One slight clarification on this post. The receivers are the same, it is the stock that changes to accept the M16 mag. They have 400 produced at this time and they are sitting on them very warmly. Came out of prototype molds of several years back. I think the price will be nearer to $1500-$1700.

Just my two cents...

Kentlik
07, 08, SOT

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