The way I look at it is this way.  I am 32 now.  For many many years I wanted an AR-15.  The one and only one to have was the Colt.  When you thought AR-15 you thought Colt.  But since they have gone to so much trouble to make it as painful as possible to buy one of their weapons i.e cut off bayo lugs F.H and changing pins and whatnot.  So when it came time for me to purchase my first AR I went with Armalite.  I bought the Standard one that would be issed to a common grunt.  I have owned it for about 6 months and put about 1k rounds through it.  No problems here.  To each there own I guess.  

You don't own a Colt, do you?

Well, except for the M-16 (A1), 2 AR's, and more 1911's than I can remember, no. All of these, with the exception of an ancient 1911 given to me decades ago by my lawyer when I needed a sidearm real bad, have since been sold off and Colt products banned from my property. I have a zero tolerance policy concerning traitors. I'm funny that way.

Colt is still perceived as the HOLY GRAIL . ICONIC if you will . This prestige  matters to some people ; to others it does not .   ....................p.s.  FORD ?!??

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Quoted:


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eta - Oh yeah. The pony looks way better than the snake.
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Are'nt ponys for little girls? Colt is much like that little girls father.

Little girl (consumer): Daddy, I want a pony!

Father (Colt): No you can't have one.
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Is that the best you can do?

I'm sory, wich one was your earth shattering post?

  I was in Law Enforcement from the mid-80's until retirement in early 2000.  I dealt with most gun manufacturers over the years and always found colt to be the best.  I don't know how they treated the civilian sector but they were always great to us.  In the 90's we would get factory demos like the 6450, 6520 and finally the 6721, after a period of six-months to a year they would call and ask if any individualm officer wanteed to purchase the guns and sell them at a much reduced price usually in the 400 to 450 range, not bad by todays standards.  
  I've seen alot of talk in these posts about high prices for colts, yet when I was buying individual officer guns in the mid 90's colts prices were lower than Bushmaster and the competitors.  Bushmaster wouldn't send us a gun to evaluate without a pre-payment, up front for full purchase price no law enforcement discount's were available.
  As of last week the price of the 6920 for individual officer purchase was $855.00 and that should be the price for any dealer who purchased those guns form the distributor's inventory.  So stop bitching about colts prices, if the buyers are paying the price, the product will continue to sell.

Quoted: You don't own a Colt, do you? Well, except for the M-16 (A1), 2 AR's, and more 1911's than I can remember, no. All of these, with the exception of an ancient 1911 given to me decades ago by my lawyer when I needed a sidearm real bad, have since been sold off and Colt products banned from my property. I have a zero tolerance policy concerning traitors. I'm funny that way.

How does making a business decision and choosing their niche in the marketplace make them traitors?  Do you feel the same way about FN?  Why do you take it so personally?  Why can't people differentiate between personal feelings and product quality?  Why do people have to resort to calling Colt products junk just because they don't agree with Colt's business practices?  

Quoted: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quoted: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- eta - Oh yeah. The pony looks way better than the snake. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Are'nt ponys for little girls? Colt is much like that little girls father. Little girl (consumer): Daddy, I want a pony! Father (Colt): No you can't have one. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Is that the best you can do? I'm sory, wich one was your earth shattering post?

I've had several, but apparently I should have typed them in dumbass so you could read them.  

Quoted:   I was in Law Enforcement from the mid-80's until retirement in early 2000.  I dealt with most gun manufacturers over the years and always found colt to be the best.  I don't know how they treated the civilian sector but they were always great to us.  In the 90's we would get factory demos like the 6450, 6520 and finally the 6721, after a period of six-months to a year they would call and ask if any individualm officer wanteed to purchase the guns and sell them at a much reduced price usually in the 400 to 450 range, not bad by todays standards.     I've seen alot of talk in these posts about high prices for colts, yet when I was buying individual officer guns in the mid 90's colts prices were lower than Bushmaster and the competitors.  Bushmaster wouldn't send us a gun to evaluate without a pre-payment, up front for full purchase price no law enforcement discount's were available.   As of last week the price of the 6920 for individual officer purchase was $855.00 and that should be the price for any dealer who purchased those guns form the distributor's inventory.  So stop bitching about colts prices, if the buyers are paying the price, the product will continue to sell.

So Bushmaster doesn't support our men and women in blue?  Very interesting indeed.  Could it all just be about the money?

I'll say this Bushmaster didn't make it easy to test and evaluate their product in the end we ended up with Colt m-4's and Mp-5's  both HK and Colt were top-notch for providing products and information.

at my local store they usually carry plain jane 20" bushmasters for $779.  the same thing in a colt is $979. about 21% more...

my first colt HBAR (didnt know if i would be able to get one EVER again) i got just before the 94 ban and i paid WAY TOO MUCH.  why did i get the colt?  because the bushmasters were not very reliable (at the time), rra didnt exist, armalite was just thinking about coming back out with an AR15 and the only other choice was eagle arms or olympic arms if you could find one of the latter...

my last colt was $750 NIB with a hardcase.  not overpriced in MY book...

besides i  like the 1:7 that colt sells and not the 1:9 everyone else uses...

glen zediker likes the 1:7 and it works for me so thats what im going to go with...

and i ALSO ask, "and bushmaster fans are less zealous?"

david

Thats funny because the distributor near where I live NE, Pa. had both Colt and Bushmaster and the latter were more than the Colts by 30-40 dollars, its the dealers that jack the prices.  LE guns were only in the 600 in the late 90's before the last price increase which brought out the 6920 near the high 700's then 800 near the year 2000 any prices above those are dealer profit, anyone not believing this is full of it.  I still have many of the original invoices on these guns.  The 7.62x39 carbine colts were being given away at 600.00 in the year of 2000 due to lack of interest, check these out on the internet now for prices.

From a collector standpoint, Colts hold their value WAY better than the other brands, at least from what I've seen.  And I do think, as said previously, that there's something about the Colt history and mystique--Colts have been in the hands of US troops and other citizens since the 1840's or 1850's.   Many people are willing to pay for that, and for knowing that your AR came from the same place and some of the same machines that make M4s for our troops...

Will  

my first pistol that I got when I was 21 was a Colt 1911. After looking at  reviews and opinions, I decided to go with a Colt  (new rollmark model) because the general concensus was that they were the best out of the box 1911's, and they were right. My 1911 had (recently sold it with much regret, for financial reasons) an awesome slide-to-frame fit, that was tight but still just lose enough to give perfect reliability. It also had a terrific, crisp 4.5 lb trigger that I thought was better then my friend's kimber that had a custom trigger job done on it. To me, kimber's are ugly, and springfields have too many problems out of the box. The colts are the best looking and best functioning stock 1911's around. This is not Colt zeal, it is just based on my personal experience. Now as far as AR's go, I have no idea.

From what I was told at the last carbine course I took, Colt's bolts are better, and they end up being a little bit more reliable... Also I'm slightly biased knowing the CEO (Lt Gen Bill Keys USMC ret) and I can tell you that he's trying to stear the company to the civvie side also.... Don't take this as me making a press statement or anything but last I heard he wanted to work with civ's also on weapons... I've just only owned Colts (my first AR, a HBAR A2 pre ban and my M4 that I just got). They've both served me very well. I understand people's take that their customer service sucks... again take all of this with a grain of salt though.... i'm just a 22 year old kid that knows someone second hand...

back to your regularly scheduled post

-Roth

Quoted: Why on earth would someone start another of these threads? The last thing we needed was another Colt vs. Bushmaster disaster. This has been done over and over in the past and very little useful information ever comes out of them. Its a complete waste of time.

The same people on the same side.  Old news.

Quoted: Quoted: Why on earth would someone start another of these threads? The last thing we needed was another Colt vs. Bushmaster disaster. This has been done over and over in the past and very little useful information ever comes out of them. Its a complete waste of time. The same people on the same side.  Old news.

I was wondering when you'd come along.  You prefer RRA, right?  

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Why on earth would someone start another of these threads? The last thing we needed was another Colt vs. Bushmaster disaster. This has been done over and over in the past and very little useful information ever comes out of them. Its a complete waste of time. The same people on the same side.  Old news. I was wondering when you'd come along.  You prefer RRA, right?

See my post on page one expressing my dislike of RRA and their QC to date.

Edited to add:  I don't own a single factory rifle.  I have built all of mine from parts.  I use Colt parts when I can, Bushmaster most of the other time.  I don't trust anybody else assembling my rifles.  I've read plenty about Colts quality problems, including an armorer who was sick of having to tighten Colt M4 barrel nuts, because they come loose from the factory.  Colt is not immune from problems.

I only find one thing very funny, that is when Colt enthusiasts claim that they are the original and the rest are copies.  History shows that is not true.  You can't buy the title of original.

Let's see.....
4 AR-15s...
-one's a BM A1 done up by the American Historical Foundation. Never Fired. (inherited). Damn Pretty.
-one's a Colt Sporter II carbine. Shot only a few times, but have had extraction failures. (inherited)
-one's a 20" A4 that's part Colt, BM, RRA, and unknown. Runs 100%.
 I'm converting this into an M4-gery (put stock on tonight, bbl due in a couple weeks).
-one's an A2 lower waiting on a new upper (thinking 9mm). Even w/o the upper has about 3 manufacturer's parts in it.

My conclusion..... None are perfect, but if you mix parts from the best, you'll end up with the best. ;)

Brand loyalty is a result of experience. If you have a brand A and it breaks fast, but you've always had good luck with brand B, you'll tend to stick with brand B. Even if it's just luck, probability, whatever. So... I'll stick with Fords, Yamahas, and a mix of BM/RRA/Colt/Armalite, etc. h.gif

rvb


edited to add: I won't buy a colt rifle due to the fact I like to build my rifles... WTF is up w/ all the "wrong sized" parts??? No thanks.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Why on earth would someone start another of these threads? The last thing we needed was another Colt vs. Bushmaster disaster. This has been done over and over in the past and very little useful information ever comes out of them. Its a complete waste of time. The same people on the same side.  Old news. I was wondering when you'd come along.  You prefer RRA, right?   See my post on page one expressing my dislike of RRA and their QC to date. Edited to add:  I don't own a single factory rifle.  I have built all of mine from parts.  I use Colt parts when I can, Bushmaster most of the other time.  I don't trust anybody else assembling my rifles.  I've read plenty about Colts quality problems, including an armorer who was sick of having to tighten Colt M4 barrel nuts, because they come loose from the factory.  Colt is not immune from problems. I only find one thing very funny, that is when Colt enthusiasts claim that they are the original and the rest are copies.  History shows that is not true.  You can't buy the title of original.

I'm just messin' with ya.  You know that.  I've never understood the barrel nut thing.  How can a barrel nut turn enough to come loose with the gas tube holding it in place?

BTW, it's not about being immune.  It's about being consistent and having fewer problems and Colt wins that category hands down.  Their QC is better bar none.

Hey Bradd_D

Are you that tuff in person or just from the safety of your computer? I wager it is the latter.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Why on earth would someone start another of these threads? The last thing we needed was another Colt vs. Bushmaster disaster. This has been done over and over in the past and very little useful information ever comes out of them. Its a complete waste of time. The same people on the same side.  Old news. I was wondering when you'd come along.  You prefer RRA, right?   See my post on page one expressing my dislike of RRA and their QC to date. Edited to add:  I don't own a single factory rifle.  I have built all of mine from parts.  I use Colt parts when I can, Bushmaster most of the other time.  I don't trust anybody else assembling my rifles.  I've read plenty about Colts quality problems, including an armorer who was sick of having to tighten Colt M4 barrel nuts, because they come loose from the factory.  Colt is not immune from problems. I only find one thing very funny, that is when Colt enthusiasts claim that they are the original and the rest are copies.  History shows that is not true.  You can't buy the title of original. I'm just messin' with ya.  You know that.  I've never understood the barrel nut thing.  How can a barrel nut turn enough to come loose with the gas tube holding it in place?

They don't truly come loose and fall off, but the rattling of the barrel nut against the gas tube is irritating.  I've seen this on two rifles to date, one with a FF tube.  Mine don't rattle, but then again, I don't torque my barrel nuts, I tighten them.

Quoted: Hey Bradd_D Are you that tuff in person or just from the safety of your computer? I wager it is the latter.

Awww...did I strike a nerve, sweetie?  I gotta admit, though, it's better than your first attempt.  At least you've moved up to high school level.  

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Why on earth would someone start another of these threads? The last thing we needed was another Colt vs. Bushmaster disaster. This has been done over and over in the past and very little useful information ever comes out of them. Its a complete waste of time. The same people on the same side.  Old news. I was wondering when you'd come along.  You prefer RRA, right?   See my post on page one expressing my dislike of RRA and their QC to date. Edited to add:  I don't own a single factory rifle.  I have built all of mine from parts.  I use Colt parts when I can, Bushmaster most of the other time.  I don't trust anybody else assembling my rifles.  I've read plenty about Colts quality problems, including an armorer who was sick of having to tighten Colt M4 barrel nuts, because they come loose from the factory.  Colt is not immune from problems. I only find one thing very funny, that is when Colt enthusiasts claim that they are the original and the rest are copies.  History shows that is not true.  You can't buy the title of original. I'm just messin' with ya.  You know that.  I've never understood the barrel nut thing.  How can a barrel nut turn enough to come loose with the gas tube holding it in place? They don't truly come loose and fall off, but the rattling of the barrel nut against the gas tube is irritating.  I've seen this on two rifles to date, one with a FF tube.  Mine don't rattle, but then again, I don't torque my barrel nuts, I tighten them.

I've got to agree with ya there.  Barrel wrench only for me, too.

Do you think the "bad guys" care what you shoot them with?

Quoted: I Lke Colts. Good quality, mil spec, reliable and accurate. There is a reason why the military uses them for the past 40+ years.

1.  You think Colts are "milspec" ???  They have NEVER been milspec.  The Colt AR-15's were intentionally NOT "milspec" because Colt didnt care about the civilian market....

2.  The military has been using Colt for the last 40 years???  Well, there is that little thing about patents and patent rights.  Then... the military went to the lowest bidder, which is why the M16A2 is made by FN, NOT Colt.  I seriously doubt the military chooses Colt out of trust.  They go to the lowest bidder they can get the equipment they want.

My first AR15 was a Colt  XM177, It was a POS!!! I don't know what the problem with it was but it would not extract any round it fired no matter the manufacturer. I sold it and bought an Eagle Arms CAR15 and liked it a lot better.
I do own a Colt AR15 but it is a safe queen and has never been shot. It is also my wife's.
I have put 1000's of rounds through my Oly with out a problem. I have put 1000's of rounds through my RRA's with out a problem. And I have put 1000's of rounds through my home built Mega's and Ameetec's with out any problems. So as far as reliability with Colt being the best I say NAY!!!

horsey...  horsey, pretty...

as I look longingly at the Colt LE website with a spot of drool on my chin...

Oh, to own a pony.

Maybe they like colt's blue ass arab looking dome in Hartford.

Quoted:You know that.  I've never understood the barrel nut thing.  How can a barrel nut turn enough to come loose with the gas tube holding it in place? BTW, it's not about being immune.  It's about being consistent and having fewer problems and Colt wins that category hands down.  Their QC is better bar none.

Now this is truly funny.

Talk about denial...

The barrel nuts are loose because the semi-trained union monkeys at Colt didn't properly install them, and their matchless QC never caught it.

I own: 1 SGW, 1 BM, 2 EA J-15's 2 DPMS...I have been happy with all of these. I have also owned a Colt. that gun was one slick carbine. However...it had a sear block and could only take a Colt Bolt carrier.....as it was...I sold the gun...despite my screen name, I don't like Colt...their guns aren't Spec, they hate civilian sales...and generally speaking...the people who own em....are snobby about it. I say FUCK EM....one guy on here put it best...."if I own a Colt, can I post like an asshole too?" My .02 cents..

Also, people who own BM's are starting to get the same way...I like my BM...however I don;t think the gun is really any better than any of my other guns...they are just as relieable and in some cases...they are more accurate....aww-well.

Everyone, everywhere has a brand of anything they like and are loyal to.

When I was growing up, Chevy was the car to get and soup up. Had big fights with the Ford guys on how much better Chevys were. Loved to race them and show them at the track.

You can take any type of product, in any type of area, and one will rise to the top, and be proclaimed "the best". Right now in the AR style gun, Colt is that maker.

Yes! They are not without their flaws. No company is. Made by humans = not perfect.

I like the fact that other companies are running to best each other for our buisness.

Competition is good for everyone.

I have Colt and LMT. These, after years of playing with ARs, are what I find "IMHO" to be the best right now.

Do I think I am "snobby" for owning a Colt? No.  If Colt's are so bad, why are all the LEO guns on the EE selling out at record pace?

If you want a Colt, be a man and suck up the price difference. It makes no difference to me. I make enough money to buy the best. More for me!


For all the people whom support this addiction with ANY type/maker of their AR, this is for you!

We can all take a step back, and know we are brothers/sisters in this fight to keep and promote our love of firearms, just look at the AWB sunset.

I love my Colts, and I am proud to say it!

All this is silly this thread people sayin buy this gun and not that one cus I heard maybe this or that. you know what I like is GUNS big ones little ones mostly the automatic kind but bushy colt olys rugers what the f*ck ever I don't give a fu*k if its got a pussy barrel and it shoots I will fuck Shoot it, own it. Whatever guns are guns if it works that is all that matters why do people like 57 chevys? my mitsucrapy is a way better car but you don't see anyone collection the mofo's most people don't collect or look for knock offs even if they happen to be a superior product folks go for what they know and since Colt has been around for 150 years making guns for the army the police and the rest of the people in this country that is what we know. so what if most of the 45 1911's aren’t made by colt you say hey I got a 45 to someone they think of a colt you say ar15 they think colt you say airliner they think boeing you say ice tea the think of ICE-T oh whoa I've been listening to too much BodyCount Motherf@ckers  HA hA HA HA! Bitch!  btw I've got a colt it is very nice maybe not better but still very nice

BC BC BC BC mfer BC BC BC BItchhh! try to ban the AK I got ten of em stashed with a case of hand grenades motherf^cker body counts in the house!......OH i was just lurkin and jerkin

Quoted: Quoted:You know that.  I've never understood the barrel nut thing.  How can a barrel nut turn enough to come loose with the gas tube holding it in place? BTW, it's not about being immune.  It's about being consistent and having fewer problems and Colt wins that category hands down.  Their QC is better bar none. Now this is truly funny. Talk about denial... The barrel nuts are loose because the semi-trained union monkeys at Colt didn't properly install them, and their matchless QC never caught it.

Obviously, you struggled with reading comprehension in school.  I'm sorry.  I was asking a legitimate mechanical question, Darwin.  I don't understand how a barrel nut on any brand of gun could come loose when it is typically held pretty tight by the gas tube.  I s'pose it was asking a bit much to expect a cogent reply out of you, huh?  What with you being all bent out of shape with Colt and all.  Try taking some Paxil (like the whole bottle) and laying down for awhile (a long while).  As an aside, are the monkeys at Bushmaster that overtorque barrels, improperly stake gas keys, and paint the rifles purple the guys that couldn't get a job with Colt?

Quoted: Quoted: Why on earth would someone start another of these threads? The last thing we needed was another Colt vs. Bushmaster disaster. This has been done over and over in the past and very little useful information ever comes out of them. Its a complete waste of time. The same people on the same side.  Old news.

To you, I am sure it seems so --and probably is.
But for many, it is the essence of AR brand selection. Plus a lot of people enjoy the banter of "mine is better than yours" over and over.

Overdone? For many, but there are 10's of thousands of board users and many havent heard it all before and with the AWB ssunset it is a worhty and renewed argument. After all, a lot of rifles are being sold and decided on

More that can be said on the comparisons between mfgrs.? Sure

Quoted: Quoted: Someone please explain colt fans... and I ask that you not turn it into a flame war. They live in Indianapolis and wear blue and white...

Now what's all this talk about the "Bushmasters"?

What city do they play in, and why is their logo a snake?

Are they some AAA team?

Can't we all just get along?

Well, I can't comment on Colt stuff in the here and now, because the only all Colt piece I own is an SP1 carbine that I bought in 1978, and class 3'd and XM177E2'd in 1979. Back then Colt made all their own internal parts, which were stamped w/a "C" and a small number inside. I understand they contract out the innards now, and the pieces have other markings.

That XM clone has countless thousands of rounds thru it, both 5.56mm and .22 long rifle, and it's still my favorite. The disconnector wore out about 5 years ago, and I had to replace it when I started getting doubles. Prior to that, I'd had to replace the extractor spring (w/a Wolff HD piece), though I kept the original blue insert.

In the past 6 years I have built up civie clones of all the other type of M16s used by the US military over the years, and haven't felt the need to use any Colt lowers. I've got two by Rock River, one DPMS, one Bushie, and one Century, which is absolutely identical to  the Rock River pieces, with the same "CM" (Continental Machine) serial number prefix. Two of the uppers are Colt milsurp M16 and M16A1 pieces, with original type Colt barrels. The M16A2 clone has a Bushie barrel and an unknown mfr upper (Anchor Harvey forge markings).  The M4gery is Rock River top and bottom, and barrel.  The C7 clone has a Bushie barrel and a DPMS upper.

ALL OF THEM have Colt bolts and carriers. When I first started building, I made the mistake of buying a Rock River bolt, and took a chunk out of my finger from the sharp edges.  Since then I've seen a number of posts from guys who have had brass shavings from these aftermarket bolts tie up their rifle.  Colt stuff only from then on.

The same with internals. I've haunted the gun shows to acquire milsurp internals,grinding off full auto hammer and disconnector tails.  While theere are some non Colt small parts on my rifles, any time I get the chance to pick up a Colt piece, particularly mag catches and buffers, I grab it.   And yes, if you know what you're looking for. you CAN tell the difference.

There are any number of high quality uppers and lowers out there today, and Colt does no better than anyone else. For barrels, Bushie is the most consistent with all their standard types being 4150 steel anf chrome lined.  But for bolts, carriers, and small part internals, I'll go Colt every time.

Quoted: Quoted: Why on earth would someone start another of these threads? You'll note that Colt fans never start threads bashing other makers or their clients.

Tweak, I have to differ on this one. I have seen quite a few Oly and DPMS, and even Bushmaster bashing by some avowed Colt fans here.

Well, I can't comment on Colt stuff in the here and now, because the only all Colt piece I own is an SP1 carbine that I bought in 1978, and class 3'd and XM177E2'd in 1979. Back then Colt made all their own internal parts, which were stamped w/a "C" and a small number inside. I understand they contract out the innards now, and the pieces have other markings. That XM clone has countless thousands of rounds thru it, both 5.56mm and .22 long rifle, and it's still my favorite. The disconnector wore out about 5 years ago, and I had to replace it when I started getting doubles. Prior to that, I'd had to replace the extractor spring (w/a Wolff HD piece), though I kept the original blue insert. In the past 6 years I have built up civie clones of all the other type of M16s used by the US military over the years, and haven't felt the need to use any Colt lowers. I've got two by Rock River, one DPMS, one Bushie, and one Century, which is absolutely identical to the Rock River pieces, with the same "CM" (Continental Machine) serial number prefix. Two of the uppers are Colt milsurp M16 and M16A1 pieces, with original type Colt barrels. The M16A2 clone has a Bushie barrel and an unknown mfr upper (Anchor Harvey forge markings). The M4gery is Rock River top and bottom, and barrel. The C7 clone has a Bushie barrel and a DPMS upper. ALL OF THEM have Colt bolts and carriers. When I first started building, I made the mistake of buying a Rock River bolt, and took a chunk out of my finger from the sharp edges. Since then I've seen a number of posts from guys who have had brass shavings from these aftermarket bolts tie up their rifle. Colt stuff only from then on. The same with internals. I've haunted the gun shows to acquire milsurp internals,grinding off full auto hammer and disconnector tails. While theere are some non Colt small parts on my rifles, any time I get the chance to pick up a Colt piece, particularly mag catches and buffers, I grab it. And yes, if you know what you're looking for. you CAN tell the difference. There are any number of high quality uppers and lowers out there today, and Colt does no better than anyone else. For barrels, Bushie is the most consistent with all their standard types being 4150 steel anf chrome lined. But for bolts, carriers, and small part internals, I'll go Colt every time.

I was thinking about doing this, but Colt FCG parts wont fit a standard receiver due to pin size, will they?

Quoted: Colt is the Harley-Davidson of gun manufacturers.   The product's merits don't matter, it's all about image.

I think this says it best.
George
p.s.
I own a Colt and I'd really like to own a Harley

I have never regretted a Colt that I have purchased.  I have sold several, and all have retained their value better than most other brands for me.  I wish I could say that about Rugers.

Colt has a place in the history of this country.  Even "nongun" people recognize the brand name.  Granted, many of them think it involves Billie Dee Williams, but you get my drift!  I think the history of the company counts for something and it helps to add to the "value" of the firearms they produce.  In other words, it is a romantic attachment to the past.  Thank GOD we are arguing about which brand of AMERICAN product to buy.  It means we still make the best of something.

Colt's checkered history of labor problems, their half assed attempts at political expediency, their current ownership by a ??Iraqi Businessman?? and their undeniable periods of bad quality control have DEFINATELY hurt them.   I hoped Keyes could pull the company around, and I think it is ultimately possible.  Good luck to him!  He is going to need it!

I have an emotional attachment to guns and gun ownership.  Geez, I admitted it.  I get pissed off when I get lectured about my right to own firearms and the "real" meaning of the Second Amendment.  I see a shitload of emotion on this board everyday.  BUSHMASTER ROCKS YOU FUCKSTICK.  COLT RULES, SHITBIRD.  RRA IS NEXT TO GODLINESS YOU FUCKING ASSCLOWN...FUCK.  On and on.

Now, why do I continue to buy Colt products?  Cause I am an American with a romantic attachment to the past  who hasn't been bitten in the ass by a Colt product (yet).  Happy?  

P.S.
BUSHMASTER = ASSCLOWN

The claims by the big school instructors that Colt is the most reliable in their experience:

This is of course information and advice one should not take lightly. However, the probability theorists, using terms such as heteroskedastisity and multicolinearity, repeatedly caution us to be careful that what we are really measuring is the same thing which we are directly observing. That is; there is always a very real chance that what we are actually measuring is a related and parallel parameter.

For instance, let us suppose that a statistical experiment shows that Chevy’s are 62% more likely to roll over than Fords or Chrysler products. On its face, this looks pretty damning. But suppose that upon further investigation we discover that the Chevy’s used in the study were 90% represented by SUV’s whereas the other makes were pretty evenly represented by sedans, SUV’s, minivans, and sports models. See the problem with the initial conclusion?

To wit; Colt has something close to a monopoly on the Mil and LE markets. The classes at the big schools are, at least in my experience, heavily represented by Mil and LE students. Therefore, a disproportionate number of those Colts in a class are maintained by professional LE and Mil amorers; as opposed to some poor schlep equipped with only a hammer and a spare extractor spring. Any pro amorer will know enough to go over a rifle headed to a 1,200-rounds-in-five-days engagement with a fine tooth comb; and to change out (with taxpayer money) anything that looks suspect or is known to be a high-wear item. So, are we measuring the inherent reliability of the product itself or are we measuring the effectiveness of professional versus amateur maintenance programs?

And so, while the experiences of Pat Rogers, Giles Stock, Bill Jeans et al; are to be taken very seriously, one needs to be wary of taking this experience as being absolutely conclusive re; the competing products.

SD

Quoted: The claims by the big school instructors that Colt is the most reliable in their experience: This is of course information and advice one should not take lightly. However, the probability theorists, using terms such as heteroskedastisity and multicolinearity, repeatedly caution us to be careful that what we are really measuring is the same thing which we are directly observing. That is; there is always a very real chance that what we are actually measuring is a related and parallel parameter. For instance, let us suppose that a statistical experiment shows that Chevy’s are 62% more likely to roll over than Fords or Chrysler products. On its face, this looks pretty damning. But suppose that upon further investigation we discover that the Chevy’s used in the study were 90% represented by SUV’s whereas the other makes were pretty evenly represented by sedans, SUV’s, minivans, and sports models. See the problem with the initial conclusion? To wit; Colt has something close to a monopoly on the Mil and LE markets. The classes at the big schools are, at least in my experience, heavily represented by Mil and LE students. Therefore, a disproportionate number of those Colts in a class are maintained by professional LE and Mil amorers; as opposed to some poor schlep equipped with only a hammer and a spare extractor spring. Any pro amorer will know enough to go over a rifle headed to a 1,200-rounds-in-five-days engagement with a fine tooth comb; and to change out (with taxpayer money) anything that looks suspect or is known to be a high-wear item. So, are we measuring the inherent reliability of the product itself or are we measuring the effectiveness of professional versus amateur maintenance programs? And so, while the experiences of Pat Rogers, Giles Stock, Bill Jeans et al; are to be taken very seriously, one needs to be wary of taking this experience as being absolutely conclusive re; the competing products. SD

The Dremel, you forgot the Dremel!!!!  Where would we be without the Dremel!!!!

I believe that you are more right than wrong in your entire statement.  

I will continue to build my rifles with Colt barrels and bolts, if available.  If not, Bushmaster barrels are an equal alternative.  I also try to use Colt LPK parts when I can.  The barrel and bolt are the heart of the rifle and, honestly parts like the upper and lower receivers are just parts holders or guide tubes that are just along for the ride.  So it doesn't matter one bit if you have a pony, snake, buck, grizzly, atomic symbol or whatever on your lower and it doesn't matter if you have C MB, C AF, keyhole, cardinal or whatever on your upper if you put the rifle together properly and maintain it properly.

Quoted: The claims by the big school instructors that Colt is the most reliable in their experience: This is of course information and advice one should not take lightly. However, the probability theorists, using terms such as heteroskedastisity and multicolinearity, repeatedly caution us to be careful that what we are really measuring is the same thing which we are directly observing. That is; there is always a very real chance that what we are actually measuring is a related and parallel parameter. For instance, let us suppose that a statistical experiment shows that Chevy’s are 62% more likely to roll over than Fords or Chrysler products. On its face, this looks pretty damning. But suppose that upon further investigation we discover that the Chevy’s used in the study were 90% represented by SUV’s whereas the other makes were pretty evenly represented by sedans, SUV’s, minivans, and sports models. See the problem with the initial conclusion? To wit; Colt has something close to a monopoly on the Mil and LE markets. The classes at the big schools are, at least in my experience, heavily represented by Mil and LE students. Therefore, a disproportionate number of those Colts in a class are maintained by professional LE and Mil amorers; as opposed to some poor schlep equipped with only a hammer and a spare extractor spring. Any pro amorer will know enough to go over a rifle headed to a 1,200-rounds-in-five-days engagement with a fine tooth comb; and to change out (with taxpayer money) anything that looks suspect or is known to be a high-wear item. So, are we measuring the inherent reliability of the product itself or are we measuring the effectiveness of professional versus amateur maintenance programs? And so, while the experiences of Pat Rogers, Giles Stock, Bill Jeans et al; are to be taken very seriously, one needs to be wary of taking this experience as being absolutely conclusive re; the competing products. SD

You bring up a very valid point.  It's nice that someone can present an opposing view without being immature and half-witted.  My personal change to Colt was simply because of my own experience with Bushmaster products and services, my view of Bushmaster's business practices, and the experience put forth by some of the professionals you listed above.  It was also a result of research that indicated that Colt employs more stringent standards with regards to their parts.  For example, there is a thread running in the Bushmaster forum where someone asked if Bushmaster magnetic particle tests and proof fires each bolt and barrel per the prints.  The thread has been up for a month and still has no reply from Bushmaster even though Bushmaster has logged in as recently as 9/10.  Colt magnetic particle tests and proof fires each bolt and barrel and keeps records of these tests.  Bushmaster also uses carbine buffer tubes and front sight bases not compatible with aftermarket stocks and rear sights.  These things matter more to me than being able to put a match trigger or an RDIAS in my combat carbine.  Bushmaster also continues to have problems with overtorqued barrels and improperly staked gas keys.  I've seen both many times on my guns and my friend's guns.  I feel like they rely on their customer base for QC and are more concerned about quantity than quality.  In my opinion, Colt and Bushmaster are the top two choices right now and I've leaned toward a preference for Colt.  I feel Colt is the best.    

Quoted: I will continue to build my rifles with Colt barrels and bolts, if available.  If not, Bushmaster barrels are an equal alternative.  I also try to use Colt LPK parts when I can.  The barrel and bolt are the heart of the rifle and, honestly parts like the upper and lower receivers are just parts holders or guide tubes that are just along for the ride.  So it doesn't matter one bit if you have a pony, snake, buck, grizzly, atomic symbol or whatever on your lower and it doesn't matter if you have C MB, C AF, keyhole, cardinal or whatever on your upper if you put the rifle together properly and maintain it properly.

I have to agree here.  My standard build, if not all Colt, is RRA receivers and Colt barrels and internals.  

Quoted: Well, I can't comment on Colt stuff in the here and now, because the only all Colt piece I own is an SP1 carbine that I bought in 1978, and class 3'd and XM177E2'd in 1979. Back then Colt made all their own internal parts, which were stamped w/a "C" and a small number inside. I understand they contract out the innards now, and the pieces have other markings. That XM clone has countless thousands of rounds thru it, both 5.56mm and .22 long rifle, and it's still my favorite. The disconnector wore out about 5 years ago, and I had to replace it when I started getting doubles. Prior to that, I'd had to replace the extractor spring (w/a Wolff HD piece), though I kept the original blue insert. In the past 6 years I have built up civie clones of all the other type of M16s used by the US military over the years, and haven't felt the need to use any Colt lowers. I've got two by Rock River, one DPMS, one Bushie, and one Century, which is absolutely identical to the Rock River pieces, with the same "CM" (Continental Machine) serial number prefix. Two of the uppers are Colt milsurp M16 and M16A1 pieces, with original type Colt barrels. The M16A2 clone has a Bushie barrel and an unknown mfr upper (Anchor Harvey forge markings). The M4gery is Rock River top and bottom, and barrel. The C7 clone has a Bushie barrel and a DPMS upper. ALL OF THEM have Colt bolts and carriers. When I first started building, I made the mistake of buying a Rock River bolt, and took a chunk out of my finger from the sharp edges. Since then I've seen a number of posts from guys who have had brass shavings from these aftermarket bolts tie up their rifle. Colt stuff only from then on. The same with internals. I've haunted the gun shows to acquire milsurp internals,grinding off full auto hammer and disconnector tails. While theere are some non Colt small parts on my rifles, any time I get the chance to pick up a Colt piece, particularly mag catches and buffers, I grab it. And yes, if you know what you're looking for. you CAN tell the difference. There are any number of high quality uppers and lowers out there today, and Colt does no better than anyone else. For barrels, Bushie is the most consistent with all their standard types being 4150 steel anf chrome lined. But for bolts, carriers, and small part internals, I'll go Colt every time. I was thinking about doing this, but Colt FCG parts wont fit a standard receiver due to pin size, will they?

Small pin Colt FCG parts are a bit harder to find, but they are available.  I've got a set in my favorite RRA lower.  I got the set here

Quoted: I don't understand how a barrel nut on any brand of gun could come loose when it is typically held pretty tight by the gas tube.

I believe what he was saying is, the barrel nut didn't "become" loose after a while, it came loose "from the factory", i.e. loose on day 1 because someone didn't tighten it fully before installing the gas tube, etc.