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Posted: 3/30/2005 12:47:26 PM EDT
[#1]
+1, I have heard that it is almost as good as the phantom and the vortex, but have never seen a test. |
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Posted: 3/30/2005 12:48:40 PM EDT
[#2]
I don't have one. Someone send me one and I will test it.
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Posted: 3/30/2005 8:15:53 PM EDT
[#3]
Well, I'm content with the performance of the mini Vortex.
Robert, I dont know if you received my IM, but it stated there's a letter heading your direction. It'll have all the necessary info. Thx again for doing this. |
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Posted: 3/30/2005 8:21:58 PM EDT
[#4]
Also, I wonder. How much of the flash can we really see with the naked eye. I know visually with eyes, you cant tell the difference between the Phantom and Vortex, but you can in pictures.
Also, is the USGI the same as the A2? Or are they completely different? |
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Posted: 3/30/2005 8:37:05 PM EDT
[#5]
IMs get deleted automaticlly when I read them. Looks like AR15.com tries to save space. I have no IMs from you anymore. But oh yeah, I remember you are sending a letter. Thanks. I could easily see the difference with my eyes. Some lite up the room, others did not. The mini-vortex was amazing how well it worked for the length. We will see if a 3-prong matches it. A2 is USGI. |
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Posted: 3/30/2005 8:38:01 PM EDT
[#6]
Someone is giving me a 3-prong to test. It would be sweet if it worked as well as the cut-down Vortex.
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Posted: 3/30/2005 9:14:53 PM EDT
[#7]
rsilvers, thank you for all your time and effort. These tests results are very interesting.
I found your 16" A2 tests rather accurately depicted what I see when I shoot at night. But I can't confirm your other photos so I have a question. Does it appear to you that your pictures consistently accurately represent what you see? If not, is it consistently different (example: they all have less/more flash when seen in real life) and could you describe the difference to us? Thank you again and I always look forward to tests, they're the best captures of muzzle flash I've seen. |
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Posted: 3/31/2005 10:50:50 PM EDT
[#8]
Weird. What's up with the huge difference between the first A2 and the 2nd one? It's like night and day there.
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Posted: 3/31/2005 11:01:38 PM EDT
[#9]
shorty barrels flash alot more. |
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Posted: 3/31/2005 11:09:47 PM EDT
[#10]
Yes, and I appretiate the Vortex now that I see how hugely well it works on an 11.5 inch barrel.
I have a triangular now. I will test it as soon as tomorrow. |
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Posted: 3/31/2005 11:33:11 PM EDT
[#11]
It's already on there. It's the black detachable piece at the end. 
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Posted: 3/31/2005 11:33:14 PM EDT
[#12]
+1 |
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Posted: 4/1/2005 12:34:55 PM EDT
[#13]
More tests:
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Posted: 4/1/2005 12:40:37 PM EDT
[#14]
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Posted: 4/1/2005 12:42:28 PM EDT
[#15]
Damn good photography!
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Posted: 4/1/2005 12:45:14 PM EDT
[#16]
The 3 prong is no better than the USGI. I was always under the impression it worked better, but had the downside of snagging. It is no better. And cannot compare to the shortened Vortex that I was lent.
I will be using Phantoms or Vortex from now on, except on collectable rifles which will be original. |
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Posted: 4/1/2005 1:24:16 PM EDT
[#17]
Thank you very much for posting these awesome pics!!
 I wonder if you open up the slots on the experimental one, would it help suppress flash better than if they're so closely spaced? |
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Posted: 4/1/2005 1:26:02 PM EDT
[#18]
Gee whiz! That three prong's credibility just went out the window and phantom should get a contract with the major rifle companies. There's no reason to get a 16 inch when I can get a 14.5 with a permanent phantom. Thank you so much for these great tests.
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Posted: 4/1/2005 1:27:07 PM EDT
[#19]
It just proves that the A2, A1 birdcages work better on longer barrels.
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Posted: 4/1/2005 1:29:49 PM EDT
[#20]
You are welcome. You know, I would get a 16 inch with a non-perm Phantom for two reasons: 1. More velocity == longer range to fraggin' 2. Being able to take off the muzzle device allows servicing the gas system. I agree a 7 inch rail looks dorky with a 16 inch barrel, but that is why there are 9.5 inch rails. |
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Posted: 4/5/2005 9:04:53 AM EDT
[#21]
Excellent thread! This is one of the things that make it worth donating to forums like this.
Just a couple questions/comments 1. It would be interesting to see if the Model 601 AR15/XM16E1/M16 Flash Suppressor fares any better than the 3-prong tested. Repros are available for $25 from Total Silence, Inc.  I'm not affiliated with Total Silence in any way. Haven't even bought anything from them yet, but the owner answered some questions regarding a build I am working on--good guy. 2. It would also be interesting to see the difference between barrels of the same length with different profiles (e.g., 16" superlight versus 16" M4 or 20" pencil or government profile versus heavy or bull). I understand flash hiders work as a result of barrel harmonics. If that is correct, then a given flash hider should be more effective on a light barrel than on a heavy one. |
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Posted: 4/5/2005 9:35:52 AM EDT
[#22]
Holy shit, are you shooting in your house?!?!
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Posted: 4/5/2005 10:54:28 AM EDT
[#23]
OH SO taged!
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Posted: 4/5/2005 11:36:49 AM EDT
[#24]
meh...i guess the 3 prong is pretty bad but it's still my fav on SP1s and A1s...not like i'll need my SP1 for a combat situation anytime soon anyway
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Posted: 4/5/2005 1:55:20 PM EDT
[#25]
Could we see the three prong on the 20" gun, compared with the A2 and others? Thanks.
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Posted: 4/5/2005 2:21:20 PM EDT
[#26]
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Posted: 4/5/2005 3:00:30 PM EDT
[#27]
I think the real purpose of the design was to create backpressure to make it more reliable. It reduced sound about 1db -- which is nothing. I would be curious what it did for flash.
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Posted: 4/9/2005 8:50:48 AM EDT
[#28]
TSI has XM information on thier website. Total Silence Inc. |
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Posted: 4/9/2005 10:48:11 AM EDT
[#29]
This is one of the best threads of the year. Thank you.
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Posted: 4/10/2005 12:46:06 AM EDT
[#30]
well i went to sight in my new acog thats on my bm 14.5 w/ izzy flashhider yesterday and am very dissapointed with the izzy fh
at about 4pm with cloudy but still bright skies outside, using xm193 and q3131a i was seeing muzzle flash through the ta31f like you wouldnt believe. compared to my phantom 5c1 equipped ar that i was also shooting saturday it was louder, had more muzzle flash and just plain sucked! shortly the barrel will be taken off and sent to adco for removal and insatllation of either the phantom or the vortex but more than likely the phantom since i like them better |
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Posted: 4/10/2005 1:04:32 AM EDT
[#31]
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Posted: 4/10/2005 1:35:05 AM EDT
[#32]
From the picture looks like the Vortex produced less sparks than the Phantom!
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Posted: 4/10/2005 12:27:01 PM EDT
[#33]
TAG
This certainly convinced me to replace my A2 for a Phantom, even though it is longer. |
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Posted: 4/10/2005 12:38:32 PM EDT
[#34]
Uh huh 
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Posted: 4/10/2005 12:48:01 PM EDT
[#35]
Thank you for this excellent thread!
TAG Bob |
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Posted: 4/10/2005 1:07:27 PM EDT
[#36]
I have a
that looks like this http://www.sogarmory.com/productImages/5620_3.jpg What is lost/gained from the angled tines vs. straight like mine? |
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Posted: 4/10/2005 1:59:43 PM EDT
[#37]
In the tests on page 3, the third unit looks like a straight tine model. For that matter, so is the first unit. It appears that the angled tines are needed. |
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Posted: 4/10/2005 2:12:38 PM EDT
[#38]
I noticed that but mine looks exactly the same as the vortex except for the tines. It doesn't look at all like the straight tine version tested.
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Posted: 4/10/2005 3:41:10 PM EDT
[#39]
These are really awesome pics. Thanks for sharing, very informative and excellent photography.
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Posted: 4/10/2005 3:48:43 PM EDT
[#40]
Send me it and I will test it. That experimental one in my test was like a Vortex but straight, and it did not work well. Maybe yours would work well -- it would be interesting to find out. |
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Posted: 4/10/2005 4:07:56 PM EDT
[#41]
Tag.
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Posted: 4/10/2005 4:13:04 PM EDT
[#42]
rsilvers: Have you tested the Phoenix? Slightly different design. And thank you for your time and efforts. This is a very interesting series of tests. |
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Posted: 4/10/2005 5:09:36 PM EDT
[#43]
rsilvers....i will send mine to test. email sent
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Posted: 4/10/2005 5:31:59 PM EDT
[#44]
tag
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Posted: 4/10/2005 5:45:52 PM EDT
[#45]
very cool to actually see the difference.
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Posted: 4/10/2005 5:49:24 PM EDT
[#46]
I have not tested a Phoenix, but if someone sends me one I will. It looks like it would work.
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Posted: 4/10/2005 6:26:08 PM EDT
[#47]
So, would you definitely say that the two best are the Vortex and Phantom? I am looking for one for my M4
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Posted: 4/10/2005 10:51:48 PM EDT
[#48]
A. Great thread - should be made a sticky
B. Like "Gloftoe" said in a earlier thread "Holy sh*t, are you shooting in your house or garage"? C. Thanks "Rsilvers" for your research and tests |
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Posted: 4/10/2005 11:45:24 PM EDT
[#49]
Top quality thread.
But, have you been shooting in the house again? Better hope the wife doesn't find out! |
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Posted: 4/11/2005 8:56:50 AM EDT
[#50]
Anyone have an MSTN QC Brake they could send? Or maybe MSTN might send one if we ask nicely? I've heard that even though it is a brake it also does suppress flash somewhat and I'd like to see how it does. Also a KKF A3FSMS would be neat, I've always wondered if it was as good as the Phantoms or somewhere between it and the A2. I might have both to send eventually but it could be quite awhile.
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