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Posted: 9/26/2016 11:53:12 PM EDT
I won a LaRue PredatAR barrel (thanks Mark!!) and then purchased a gas block and a few other items from them to get my upper finished. Anyway as I'm getting ready to attach the barrel to the upper receiver I realize I forgot to put the barrel nut on. No big deal right? Wrong. The red loctite that comes with the Larue gas block is stronger than anything I've ever come across in the world of thread locking adhesives. Anything using a small sized Allen wrench will be permanently attached!!
Multiple Allen wrenches, 3 drill bits, 2 easy outs, a hole in my face (bit broke and lodged in my cheek) and a chewed up LaRue gas block later that mother fucker is still attached. Not one of the three screws have budged. I've built lots of AR's and this is the worst mistake I've made. I've never seen anything like it. I don't have a drill press so I'll be taking it to my father in laws shop in a couple weeks and take a drill press to it. I seriously have no idea what else to do. Any suggestions would be great. In the meantime I'll order another gas block from LaRue as I've made a mess of the one I have.  .
To add insult to my injury this occurred during tonight's debate. I need a drink. |
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Posted: 9/27/2016 12:11:44 AM EDT
[#1]
Did you hit it with the heat gun and or propane torch first?
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Posted: 9/27/2016 12:17:18 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Did you hit it with the heat gun and or propane torch first? This. Red threadlockers are removable with heat. |
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Posted: 9/27/2016 12:55:59 AM EDT
[#3]
The heat gun was the first thing I tried. I got the gas block pretty hot before I tried removing the screws. Allen wrenches just twist or strip out. Maybe I just didn't get it hot enough. At this point I'm just going drill out the screws on a press. I was just kind of surprised at how well that stuff holds. I'm confident it would never have come loose on its own.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 1:06:47 AM EDT
[#4]
I had to remove one of those gas blocks lately. That red loctite Larue gives you broke around 300 degrees for me.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 1:15:35 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The heat gun was the first thing I tried. I got the gas block pretty hot before I tried removing the screws. Allen wrenches just twist or strip out. Maybe I just didn't get it hot enough. At this point I'm just going drill out the screws on a press. I was just kind of surprised at how well that stuff holds. I'm confident it would never have come loose on its own. Propane torch 15-25 seconds will make short work of red thread lockers, for future reference. |
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Posted: 9/27/2016 8:37:00 AM EDT
[#6]
According to Loctite a person needs to heat the part to approximately 500 DEGF.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 9:14:46 AM EDT
[#7]
GB is toast... just cut the screw section out with a dremel... carefully. Not that a nick on the barrel affects how it shoots in any way. Far easier than trying to get it to sit right in a press.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 9:33:14 AM EDT
[#8]
Sorry to hear that OP. I too went with a Larue GB for my free barrel (thanks Larue Tactical) but I didn't use the locktight.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 9:43:32 AM EDT
[#9]
I did the same thing, except I only left off the spacer for their rail.
I used a blow dryer. No issues. |
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Posted: 9/27/2016 3:01:06 PM EDT
[#10]
Thanks for the red loctite education! I'm certain my second goof up was not heating it enough. Lesson learned. That stuff is no joke.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 8:30:11 PM EDT
[#11]
Propane Torch? GTFO...
Use a soldering iron or wood burner and hold it on the screws. The screws will heat up and melt the loctite. |
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Posted: 9/27/2016 9:55:04 PM EDT
[#12]
I learned a horrible lesson with red loctite as well. I stick to blue now.
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Posted: 9/27/2016 10:24:48 PM EDT
[#13]
I'm not sure which thradlocker they send it with, but it wouldn't surprise me if its the 450 degree version.
I normally just stick with blue. Though I would use the high temp red if I planned on using it for high volume fire. |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 2:34:09 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Propane Torch? GTFO... Use a soldering iron or wood burner and hold it on the screws. The screws will heat up and melt the loctite. Thank you, but I prefer it my way. I've used a propane torch on countless stubborn gas blocks screws and barrel nuts, amongst other things. A few seconds and they come off. |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 8:05:18 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thank you, but I prefer it my way. I've used a propane torch on countless stubborn gas blocks screws and barrel nuts, amongst other things. A few seconds and they come off. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Propane Torch? GTFO... Use a soldering iron or wood burner and hold it on the screws. The screws will heat up and melt the loctite. Thank you, but I prefer it my way. I've used a propane torch on countless stubborn gas blocks screws and barrel nuts, amongst other things. A few seconds and they come off. I suppose it wouldn't harm anything, but if you can avoid open flames... I would. |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 8:17:22 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Propane torch 15-25 seconds will make short work of red thread lockers, for future reference. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The heat gun was the first thing I tried. I got the gas block pretty hot before I tried removing the screws. Allen wrenches just twist or strip out. Maybe I just didn't get it hot enough. At this point I'm just going drill out the screws on a press. I was just kind of surprised at how well that stuff holds. I'm confident it would never have come loose on its own. Propane torch 15-25 seconds will make short work of red thread lockers, for future reference. Yep. It's all I use for red loctite. A butane soldering iron will also work for small parts (grub screws, etc.) |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 8:39:50 AM EDT
[#17]
On small screws a soldering iron works wonders for getting the heat to exactly the right spot to melt the Loc-Tite. You can often see it melt and start to squeeze out some.
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Posted: 9/28/2016 8:41:51 AM EDT
[#18]
I have a pencil butane torch that works great for that. Focused flame on the screw for 20-30 secs will break thread locker every time.
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Posted: 9/28/2016 8:48:10 AM EDT
[#19]
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Posted: 9/28/2016 10:32:01 AM EDT
[#20]
I always assemble uppers without Loctite. Once I have shot them and are confident the gun is how I want it I use high heat red Loctite on the screws.
The high heat red Loctite is removable but you have to heat it up. I use a propane torch and keep heating until I can turn the screws. Sounds like you already stripped out the screw so you have a few solutions. 1. Cut the block and remove. Obviously the block is now scrap metal. 2. Find an Easy Out that fits the hole. Heat the block until you can remove the screws with the Easy Out. 3. Carefully drill out the screws. If you use heat and left hand drill bits you may actually spin the screw out. When drilling use a mill or drill press. Go slow. Since the barrel is dimpled you don't have to worry too much about marking the barrel. If you are not capable of doing this in your home shop visit a machine shop or gunsmith. No offense but since you stripped out the screws I am not sure you have the ability to do this without ruining anything further. |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 11:05:27 AM EDT
[#21]
Get on the dot com and find a machine shop that does EDM screw extraction.
I had one removed from a High Standard Victor barrel a few years ago in Houston, they charged about $15. I would give you the name of the place but i can't find the invoice. I'm sure you can find one who can remove the screws and save the gas block without making it look like a trash pit. may have been these people. http://www.houstonedm.com/plungeedm.html |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 11:16:28 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The heat gun was the first thing I tried. IME a heat gun is not sufficiently hot to cook off red threadlocking compound. You need a propane torch at a minimum and I prefer a MAPP torch for more heat with a shorter amount of application time. |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 12:00:30 PM EDT
[#23]
I took a torch to it last night. Several drill bits and a couple of shredded easy outs later I got one of the three screws out and I think another may have backed out enough to clear the barrel. The third screw still has a broken piece of the wrench still stuck in it. It may have backed out a bit as the GB moves about a mm back and forth over the barrel.
It took me a couple of hours to get that much done. I'm really trying to save the block (they aren't cheap). Is it possible to add too much heat with the torch? Could I damage my barrel? Going to try again tonight. |
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Posted: 9/28/2016 8:17:39 PM EDT
[#24]
It'll likely take a propane torch.
Red loctite should almost require a permit to use... ETA: Your barrel should be fine. Put the heat to the block as much as you can. One costs more to replace than the other.... |
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Posted: 9/29/2016 12:05:20 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It'll likely take a propane torch. Red loctite should almost require a permit to use... ETA: Your barrel should be fine. Put the heat to the block as much as you can. One costs more to replace than the other.... Thanks. After another couple hours of fighting it I said screw it and cut it off.  Going to order another GB from LaRue today. I doubt I'll ever use the red loctite again. Blue (or none) should work just fine for a GB with 3 screws and 3 dimples in barrel. 
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Posted: 9/29/2016 2:32:10 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thanks. After another couple hours of fighting it I said screw it and cut it off. Going to order another GB from LaRue today. I doubt I'll ever use the red loctite again. Blue (or none) should work just fine for a GB with 3 screws and 3 dimples in barrel. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
It'll likely take a propane torch. Red loctite should almost require a permit to use... ETA: Your barrel should be fine. Put the heat to the block as much as you can. One costs more to replace than the other.... Thanks. After another couple hours of fighting it I said screw it and cut it off. Going to order another GB from LaRue today. I doubt I'll ever use the red loctite again. Blue (or none) should work just fine for a GB with 3 screws and 3 dimples in barrel. You can lead a horse to water, but you shouldn't have to stick your head up his ass and suck to make him drink. |
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Posted: 9/29/2016 6:05:39 PM EDT
[#27]
Red Loctite is what you should use. Don't apply it until after you have confirmed everything fits and works. Then remove one screw at a time and apply a tiny bit to each screw. Use a toothpick.
If you have to remove it heat it with a propane or MAPP gas torch. When it is "unlocked" the screws will turn with slight resistance. Once cooled they will lock again. Like I said I build my guns and once I am happy with them I Loctite the screws. Until then I use nothing. Blue Loctite is wasting your time. The heat required to remove blue is much lower than red. Blue will loosen from normal shooting. |
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Posted: 9/29/2016 6:33:23 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Red Loctite is what you should use. Don't apply it until after you have confirmed everything fits and works. Then remove one screw at a time and apply a tiny bit to each screw. Use a toothpick. If you have to remove it heat it with a propane or MAPP gas torch. When it is "unlocked" the screws will turn with slight resistance. Once cooled they will lock again. Like I said I build my guns and once I am happy with them I Loctite the screws. Until then I use nothing. Blue Loctite is wasting your time. The heat required to remove blue is much lower than red. Blue will loosen from normal shooting. Makes sense. I admit I did put on a lot of the red stuff. Definitely more than I needed. Thanks. |
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Posted: 10/3/2016 9:09:55 AM EDT
[#29]
9mm: Applying a torch anywhere near a quality barrel would give me the willies. Barrel blanks are carefully heat treated and should not be messed with. I'd rather use a cut off wheel and scrap the existing gas block. My practice is to use blue locktite on gas block screws. Yes, it degrades a little bit from operating temperatures, but not enough to keep it from doing its job, even after removing and reinstalling the screws several times. - CW
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Posted: 10/3/2016 11:08:31 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
9mm: Applying a torch anywhere near a quality barrel would give me the willies. We're talking about briefly using a propane or MAPP torch on the gas block, not an oxy/acetylene cutting torch on the barrel. It'll be okay. |
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Posted: 10/3/2016 2:25:57 PM EDT
[#31]
Okay.
I was looking at some stuff on LaRue's website today (ordering more parts to finish this build) and noticed that a week ago someone left a review of this GB and had the same issues I did!!! LOL!! Who was it? Fess up!
I'm just glad I'm not the only one is all. 
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Posted: 10/4/2016 11:09:10 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I had to remove one of those gas blocks lately. That red loctite Larue gives you broke around 300 degrees for me. How does that heat affect the barrel integrity? |
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Posted: 10/6/2016 9:01:01 PM EDT
[#33]
Lesson learned... never use that red shit again.
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Posted: 10/7/2016 8:17:28 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
...snip... Blue Loctite is wasting your time. The heat required to remove blue is much lower than red. Blue will loosen from normal shooting. |
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Posted: 10/7/2016 8:22:27 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nonsense. I use "blue" threadlocker (medium strength) on gas block screws on all 4 of my AR rifles. Not only don't they come loose from normal shooting, hundreds of rounds each, but I find I can remove the screws (e.g., to change barrels) without any heat at all and reinstall them without replacing the threadlocker. The old, slightly degraded threadlocker keeps right on working, good as new. As I mentioned before, I avoid applying excessive heat to a heat treated barrel. - CW Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
...snip... Blue Loctite is wasting your time. The heat required to remove blue is much lower than red. Blue will loosen from normal shooting. I have experienced the same as chasw. Gas block gets quite hot, but the set screws have never come loose. |
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Posted: 10/7/2016 9:54:16 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How does that heat affect the barrel integrity? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I had to remove one of those gas blocks lately. That red loctite Larue gives you broke around 300 degrees for me. How does that heat affect the barrel integrity? How hot does the whole barrel get when shooting? I wouldn't think hitting it with a torch for a few seconds would affect much. |
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