Review of the pitbull originally posted by tactrat at: http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=420619&page=4

Just got my pitbull last night and mounted it on my S&W MP-15 IRC. Here are some initial thoughts. This thing is beefy. If it fails you could use it effectively as an impact weapon. Field of view is huge and I am not exaggerating. Its the largest FOV I have ever used, much larger than an aimpoint or Eotech. Glass is what you expect from IOR, great. The reticle is clean with the 3 moa center dot the only portion of the reticle being illuminated. I don't know what battery life is going to be yet and it was not listed in the paperwork. Yesterday was cloudy and the illuminated dot was fully visible, don't know if it will be in full sun yet. The invert horseshoe in the reticle is thinner than what is pictured on the IOR website, on mine anyway. I liked it, as it made for a cleaner reticle. Mounted it in the high steel rings (waiting for the alloy QD's). I never heard back from ADM on the dimensions of their 35mm recon mount so I don't know if that will work. The ocular will clear a Troy follding BUIS with the high rings and I did not need an extended rail to get proper eye relief, and I shoot NTCH with glasses. I have a Troy folding front sight. With the sight up and the scope on 1x, you notice it. On 4x you don't. It appears to be a true 1x. I did not notice any difference in target size on 1x. You can only use it at 1 or 4, in between is blurry. I wish the mag ring lever was larger, but its better than not having one at all, and the ring travel between 1 and 4 is short. Doing dry CQB and room clearing drills, target acquisition is very fast. I'll have to get the shot timer out to see if I am as fast with the pitbull as I am with an aimpoint. Without live fire testing to be sure, I like the pitbull better than an aimpoint with magnifyer. I did notice slight blurring at the edges of the field of view on 4x when I first tried it but it seemed to go away when I adjusted my eye relief. I think my glasses may also have had something to do with this because when I looked through the scope without them I did not notice it. I'll have to do some more checking and let some others look through the scope to be sure, but as I said, it went away when I fine tuned my eye relief.

So far I'm impressed with it. Its a little beefier than what I imagined, but it is short. Slightly longer than an aimpoint and much shorter than an aimpoint with magnifyer. Yea, it's heavy, but I really didn't notice the extra weight since all of it centers above the rail and doesn't proturde forward over the barrel. Hopefully I'll get to sight it in this afternoon (if its not raining) and get some live fire time with it. I'll post more then.






The lines in the reticle are 1/2 moa thick at 4X. The center dot is 3moa. I wear glasses and have no problem picking up any part of the reticle during rapid target acquisition at CQB ranges and I have to wear glasses now and am just shy of 40. My eye seems naturally drawn to the dot. The reticel is alot simpler than the Burris but I am partial to a clean reticle on a working optic and save the more technical reticles for my bolt guns used at a 1000. The pics can also be decieveing because the field of view is so large. You can see alot of realestate through the scope. The pics don't do the reticle justice, sorry they suck. I was pretty proud of my photography skills when looking at them on the computer at 10 megapixels taken with my wife' s D-90. Didn't realize you can't email them at that setting. I will try and change the camera settings and see what happens. Still haven't had time for the range and its driving me nuts. Been keeping my rig loaded and ready should some spare time arise in the envening. My final verdict isn't in yet, but so far, I like what I see. Thanks again to uglyduck for posting the pics.

Finally got a chance to take the pitbull to the range today. WOW, really liking this optic. The more time I spend with it, the more I like it. I was originaly a little nervous with the weight and CQB range capability. No more. Shot at ranges from 15-450 yds. Zeroed the scope at 100 yds. With my handloads (55 vmax @ 3000 fps - 16" bbl) I was able get groups at 1moa or less at 100 yds and under (centering the 3moa dot on an orange 4moa sticky) and 1.5 moa from 200-450 (as long as I did my part). The glass is very clear and crisp and helped alot with the accuracy at longer ranges. Head shots at 200 yds were easy with the 3moa dot on the IPSC steel (LV steel med man 25x15). It was sunny today and the illum dot was visible. It is subdued and not bright like an aimpoint, but you could see it. It helped alot with speed at 15-25 yds because my eye was drawn to it a little faster than black only. The HUGE field of view made engagements very fast at the closer ranges and while moving and the amount of ground I could see around the 450 yd target was surprising. Comparing speed to my aimpoint, I was as fast or damn close to it. The reticle is set for 62gr NATO rounds. My loads impacted a touch high (on the LV steel) at 300 and 400 yds using the corresponding range marks on the reticle. I was limited to 450 yds and couldn't stretch to 500. I used the 500 yd range line and dialed 1/2 mil down and was dead on. MOA dials would have been easier for me to use, but the the scope repeats very well. I didn't do a precise box test but I did move the impacts around with the knobs and it always retruned to zero.

I like my aimpoint but felt very limited by it when I tried to engage targets at longer range and I was never crazy about the magnifyers. The pitbull does a good job at both. I have not tried alot of low mag scopes, but of those I tried (Millet DMS, Luppy, Trijicon) I didn't like the longer length and narrow field of view and I'm not a fan of the fixed power, narrow view and short eye relief of the ACOGs . I as I have stated before, the pitbull is heavy, but it did not take me long to get used to the extra weight. This optic is not for everyone I suppose and other folks opinion may vary, but I've been pretty happy with it so far. It's not the perfect do-all optic, I haven't seen one made yet, but it does do a good job for me on a wide range of taskings. Wish I had one of these when I was breaking things while one of Uncle Sam's Misguided Children.

Review of the pitbull originaly posted by modus at: http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=420619&page=4

I just got mine played a few minutes with it. Built like a tank as in seems indestructible but I guess it should be at 23 OZ without rings. Rings are very beefy too at least as heavy duty as burris xtreme probably more.. I'd feel comfortable dropping my rifle 10ft on concrete and not damaging this optic. Knobs are big, about the size of a quarter in diameter maybe bigger and about 3/4 inch tall & click just perfect not too tight not too soft. The reticule lines are much thinner than pic shows but still visible. The Reticule is also not horse shoe like pics I've seen but half round. You wont see red dot in full sunlight on max settings so just leave it off so at least you got a black dot. I'm fast but not as fast as with aimpoint. Need to practice more with eye relief tomorrow. This scope looks a bit rushed on the paperwork side with 8x11 sheets of paper for manual but it did come in a nice green box with good packaging. I'm not sure what other reviewer meant by it's 1 or 4 x as it's variable 1 to 4x. Anyway It's a keeper and can't wait to get some time in on her this week.

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I dropped SWFA an email just the other day asking if they would be coming out with a 1-4 power scope.  They stated that they were and also that it should be out by early 2010.  It seems that their SS line of scopes gets good reviews from what I have read.

I'm kinda holding out til after the holidays before getting a low power scope and was just wondering if it would be worth waiting on the supposedly coming out SS 1-4 scope.

I have read also that Vortex is working on one also.  They sound like a pretty good company.

Right now my budget would be around $600 or less so what are the best options?   I really like the Burris XTR and if SWFA comes out with a 1-4 scope would consider it also.

I have added the March Tactical 1-10x scope to the table. This scope is a Japanese import only available through Kelbly's Inc. which is a benchrest shooters specialty supplier. I will be adding at least one more scope soon, when the maker releases it. I did not ask them if I could divulge this scopes existence before that. You will not have to wait long though. It is being released at the SHOT this year.

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Review of the Pride Fowler CQLR Originally posted by steve––oh on tacticalunderground.us (post is somewhat redacted because steve––oh is not the most mature fellow)
Original post may be viewed here

He drove up Scottsdale Gun Club and brought the new Pride Fowler 1-4 AR scope - and I got to check it out. It's got an illuminated rangefinding reticle, and it's construction reminded me a lot of the Schmidt and Bender scope.

I was lucky enough to put several magazines through this scope at various ranges, and tink around with one of the only 2 of these scopes in the US right now. Pretty cool.

At 1x, the scope isn't quite a true 1x like an aimpoint or an eotech, but it's close enough. It was very comfortable to shoot with both eyes open, very quick acquiring. I only had the illumination turned up about halfway, which tells me that the scope could be used at full illumation with no problems outside in the bright AZ sun or elsewhere.

At 4x, the scope is still quick to use, but the reticle becomes bigger and you can make out the rangefinding features. One of the things that I though was cool is the eye relief is more forgiving than on my 4x ACOGs.
The reticle has the notches for various bullet drops, and on one side of the vertical crosshair is the range # in hundred of yards (4, 6, etc) and on the right side next to the vertical crosshair is a bracket for each #, that is I think 10 moa at that range. In essence, if somebody's head fits in the bracket, that is the corresponding range. I like this feature also more than my ACOGs because the ACOG has the drop listed, but no really quick means to determine the range. So say you're staring at a target through your scope, and you can't tell how many yards away it is, use the bracket - there you go. So simple even meansteve could figure it out.

Here's a few pictures.
The scope.

in use.



Posted by Chad (the scopes owner) on the same thread
Since Steve––oh has dropped the ball on posting the reticle pics for the CQLR:


The ranging system is based on using 9"-10" tgt(human head), can also use an object of similar size. It is a quick system and accuracy will vary by shooter, object size etc. MOA are 'shooter MOA'=1"(IPHY), not 1.047".

@ 100yds the tgt will fill or be larger than the 9MOA circle.
@ 200yds the tgt will fill about half the 9MOA circle
@ 300yds the tgt will be covered by the 3MOA dot

@400, 500 and 600yds the tgt will fill the 'box' on the right side of the reticle.

Photo is 400yds, hard to see but there is a 10" paper plate in the 400 'box':


200yds, steel 'bowling pin' about 26" tall by 12" wide, 5"X5" head:

Review of the Horus Talon 1-4x24 CQB taken from M4Carbine.net written by paulosantos
Original post can be viewed here
pics are take from Horus site since none of the ones in this original review post were live


Horus Talon 1-4x24 CQB Scope:

SPECIFICATIONS:
Power: 1-4x24 (True 1x).
Length: 9.75”
Weight: 15.9oz.
Field of View at 100m: 86.28’-24.6’
Eye Relief: 4.3”-3.53”
Tube Diameter: 30mm.
Objective: 24mm.
Tube: 1 Piece.
Exterior Finish: Anodized Matt Black.
Reticle: Front Focal Plane H-48 Reticle.
Adjustment: 1 Click = ½ MOA.
Waterproof: 2 Meters.
Illumination: 11 Positions.
Night vision Capable: Yes.
Daytime Visible Reticle: No.


THE H-48 RETICLE: (Taken from the Horus Catalog)
1. Close Range: The Horus Talon presents a bold “Ghost Ring” with a central dot. When engaging targets at close range, the rifleman should use 1x, which provides maximum field of view. In this scenario, the Bold Ghost Ring visually becomes a very large aiming dot. The central dot basically disappears. Once target is in the field of view, the rifleman instantly places the bold circle on the target and fires.
2. Mid-Range: When using the Horus Talon as a Mid-Range reticle, the rifleman places the optic on 3x or 4x. The Bold Ghost Ring allows the rifleman’s eye to be quickly centered naturally on the Aiming Dot. When shooting from 1 to 200 meters, simply place the target inside the Ghost Ring and fire. When time permits, for more precise shot placement, the Aiming Dot is used.
3. Long Range: When Long Range engagement is required, the rifleman moves the power ring to 4x. The Horus Reticle appears to be a small “Christmas Tree”, which provides accurate holdovers for extended ranges.
4. Lead Markers: The Horus Talon also features “Lead Markers” on the main horizontal cross hair which provides the rifleman with the tool to engage moving targets. The numbers on the Lead markers represent the speed of the target as follows:
4 = 4 MPH the speed of a man fast walking.
8 = 8 MPH the speed of a man running.
12 = 12 MPH the speed of a man sprinting.
16 = 16 MPH the speed of an APC.

(Note: Horus is coming out with a variation of the H-48 Reticle, which they call the H-47 Reticle. It is basically the same as the H-48, except that it has a central targeting cross instead of the central dot, plus it features a thinner Ghost Ring. If it had been available, I would have preferred the H-47 reticle since it is even more precise than the H-48 since it has a ½ Mil Mark between the center cross and the 1 Mil Mark.).

INTRO:
I wanted a new scope for my new 6.8 REM SPC upper and I wanted a 1x4 scope. I wanted a multi-purpose scope that was capable of clearing rooms at 1x and the added magnification for extended ranges. I also wanted a reticle with BDC but I did not want it to be caliber specific. I have always been intrigued with the Horus Talon concept, but I was always afraid to take the plunge because it always got so-so reviews.

INTITAL THOUGHTS:
When I first took it out of the package, I was impressed with how good it looked. It is relatively light and short compared to some other scopes. The H-48 reticle was exactly what I thought it would be like. At 1x, the reticle is very similar to the EOTech reticle, and it is a true 1x. At 4x, the reticle gets magnified and the “Christmas Tree” becomes visible and provides the holdovers for extended ranges. The center dot is approximately 6 MOA in size. Some people will say that the reticle appears cluttered, but it is a personal thing. Since it is exactly what I wanted, I have no complaints. Remember, you are supposed to look through the reticle, not at it. The reticle is not daytime visible, but it isn’t something that I was high on since I didn’t want an optic that relied on batteries. The quality of the glass is on par with the Leupold Scopes.

All the turrets have nice positive clicks. The illumination turret has an off position and it goes from 1-11. The first couple positions are for Night Vision. When illuminated, the entire reticle lights up, except the “Christmas Tree” BDC. It doesn’t have an off position in between each click, which would have been nice. The magnification power ring has a little knob on it which makes it easy to change the magnification. The Horus Talon also features an adjustable diopter like the Leupold CQT. What I like the most is the design of the rear housing. It is a flat shape, unlike the IOR scopes, which makes it very easy to put on Butler Creek Covers on it.

MOUNTING:
Since I like to shoot nose to charging handle, I decided to use the Larue SPR-E to mount the Horus Talon. My first complaint about the scope is the eye relief. I have been so spoiled with my IOR scopes since they have a fixed eye relief, so this took a little getting used to. At 4x, I can shoot nose-to-charging-handle. But when on 1x, I have to move back some because the eye relief is 4.3”. It actually isn’t as bad as I thought especially when standing up because it is actually more comfortable with my head a little further away. I just have to get used to it, which I already feel comfortable with.

POSITIVES:
1. True 1x.
2. Size.
3. Cost. (Low to mid $800.00.).
4. Field of View.
5. Reticle.

NEGATIVES:
1. Reticle not visible in sunlight.
2. Illumination Turret does not have off position in between clicks.
3. Reticle can be busy to some people.

ACCESSORIES:
The Horus Talon also came with bikini covers, which have a clear lens on each side so you can use without taking off the covers. I still went with the Butler Creek Flip-Up Covers as a matter of preference.

Included with the Horus Talon was the Horus Digital Aiming Software CD. I installed the PC version of the ATRAG software on my computer and the Palm version on my TREO 650 cell phone and they both work great.

CONCLUSION:
I really like this scope. I’ve had other variable scopes in the past and I currently have the Leupold CQT, which I really like. If Leupold made the CQT FFP with the H-47 or H-48 reticle, it would be awesome. IS this scope for everyone? No. If you don’t like a cluttered reticle and if you must have a daytime lit reticle, this isn’t for you. In my opinion, this is the best 1x4 scope for the price. The Short Dot is the best variable scope, but at nearly twice the price, I’ll keep my Horus Talon.

h48 reticle 1x


h48 in Larue spr on a rifle


closeup of 1/10 mill turrets

Review comparing USO SN-4S, Horus Talon, Trijicon Acupoint (1.5x model not the one in this thread), and the S&B short dot (non zenith I believe). Originally posted by C4IGrant on M4carbine.net
Original post can be viewed here


I have the privilege of having the USO SN-4, Trijicon Accupoint, Horus Talon and the S&B Short Dot in my possession. I have spent some time with each of these optics and have come to some conclusions about which is the best. Here is a three up and three down review of each:

USO SN-4

Up
1. Chevron in circle reticle
2. Glass quality
3. Ranging capability


Down
1. Cost
2. Weight
3. Illumination not visible in full sun

Trijicon Accupoint

Up
1. Cost
2. Triangle reticle
3. Eye Relief

Down
1. Not 30mm
2. No ranging
3. FOV

Horus Talon

Up
1. Cost
2. FOV
3. Ranging reticle

Down
1. Illumination not visible in full sun
2. Reticle very busy
3.

S&B Short Dot

Up
1. FOV
2. Controls (pull out on knobs to turn & release to lock again)
3. Illumination visible in full sun

Down
1. Cost
2. Weight
3. Reticle not visible on 1X (not necessarily bad)

Only the Accupoint and S&B have visible illumintation in full sun. This gives them a big advantage IMHO. The Talon is just as good as SN-4 for almost half the price. The Accupoint still remains the best bang for the buck.

The S&B is now my new favorite. The first 6 postions on the illumination dial are for NV. Position 7 gives you a visible dot on a cloudy day or indoors. Postion 8-11 are visible in full sun. The great thing about the illumination dial is that you don't have to go back to 0 to turn the dot off. Just go between a number and the dot shuts off!

On 1X the reticle really isn't all the visible. I at first found this to be a negative, but then began to think about it. If your running on 1X your most likely in a CQB environment and would be using the illuminated dot. The fact that you don't have the black reticle cluttering up the glass is a good thing IMHO. In 2-4X the reticle is precise and useable. The windage and elevation knobs feel precise and I like that you pull them up and then turn to make adjustments. This does away with the need to have caps over them (smart).





S&B on 1X


S&B on 1X with illumination


S&B on 4X with illumination

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Konus M30 added to the table

Here is a review of the Konus originally posted by snpr9696 here

Hello everyone. I going to attempt a mini review of the Konus M30 1-4X24 CQB scope.
This scope has a purchase price of $219.99 and after shipping came to $227.50 from Midway USA. The one thing i noticed when purchasing this optic is that the manufacturers website lists the model number different from some of the online websites. So I wasn't completely sure if the pictured scope was actually the one i would receive. With all that aside let me give you my intended purpose for this optic. I am a user of Nightforce, Leupold, Nikon, Zeiss, and Trijicon ACOGs. I also own a Horus Hawk which I reviewed sometime back. This optic was intended to go on a 16" AR .223 and "well not replace the ACOG TA31F" but give me a variable optic instead of a fixed. I didn't not want to spend alot for this project so this scope fell within budget.

Upon opening the Konus box I received one Konus optic (the right one), a set of flip caps similar to Falcon menace type caps. Warranty card and Multi-language standard for all Konus M30 type scopes intruction booklet. Also a cleaning cloth. Once I unwrapped the scope from the bubble wrap I noticed it to be very well made and extremely sturdy. The finish was consistant of Leupold Matte Finish perhapes a touch more glossy. The scope has some decent weight which could be a plus or a negative depending how you look at it. KonusPro M30 1-4X24 was written on the objective area of the optic in gold lettering. The ocular area has a focus ring along with a lock ring to ensure the scopes focus does not come out of wack. It shows the usual marking +0- on the bell.
I found the power ring to be consistantly smooth through out with indication marking for 1x 1.5x 2x 2.5x 3x 3.5x and finally 4x. The scope is a one peice tube design which no doubt will add to its durability.

On to the turrets.....Im impressed. Some folks do not like lockable turrets and will look elsewhere due to this optic having them. This is my first optic with them and so far i like them. I see this being an advantage for those who use this optic for work and bang it around in a tactical rifle bag in the back of a trunk all day. Once locked they don't move however they do have allen key set screws to zero out your knobs as well. The mechining on the turrets themselves are nicely done, sort of a Mark 4 type. One for elevation and one for windage as well as an 11 position reostat for the illuminated dot reticle which also houses the battery. The turrets I found to be very nice. Positive tactile feedback and gave an audible click. The one thing that threw me off however is the indication reads 1 click = 1/2 MOA. This would be fine on a scope such as this but the odd thing is that 8 hash marks are represented between each designated number such as (1IIIIIII2IIIIIII3) which would be more indicative of 1 click = 1/8 MOA. I have not mounted or attempted a track with this scope as of yet to see what the representation actually does equal. One nice thing Ifound is the revolution of each turret is marked with horizontal hash marks as well. Also the standard Up and Down as well as Left and Rght markings are displayed.



On to the Glass.....From a distance a green coating is observed and the Konus site related that they are fully multi-coated optics. One look through the glass and i found the scope to be very clear. Konus has been getting a reputation for having nice glass so this did not suprise me that much. Color rendition and clarity are on par with a more expensive scope and the image displayed is crisp on through to the edge. The reticle is what they call a 30/30 but is best described as a duplex type with a break in the center where a dot is observed. This dot illuminated blue but this i found to be completely usless in daylight even overcast as you can see in the pictures. While inside the dot can be seen in a dark room it also give offa blue halo inside the scope which probably would be annoying. The issue that i noticed is at 1x - 2.5x i get a little fisheye effect which is not easliy seen unles you move the scope such as in a scanning method. The higher powers correct this. If I were to judge the glass I would say it was around a Leupold Vari X II territory. Decent enough for this project of mine. The optic also has an anti-cant level bubble in the lower 1/8th of the bottom portion of the reticle area





Once again this is a mini first impression review. I have not yet field tested this optic yet. I will be using a Burris Mount for this when it arrives from SWFA.
Pros that i can see:
1. Lockable turrets for trunk monkey use
2. Price for experimenting with this type of set up to see if you what to buy one of the big boys in the future.
3. Glass is decent enough for use evryday.
4. Turret feedback is positive in feel and sound (hopefully the representations are correct).
5. Finish if scope is nicely done.

Cons:
1. Fisheye observed at low powers when scanning with the optic
2. Blue illumination is dismal and useless
3. Bubble level. Not really a negative but it really isn't needed on a CQB optic and for me its just one more thing that could possibly break given time.
4. Folks may not like the target type Turrets on a CQB optic.
All in all I do not feel disappointed in this purchase.

On the Konus how forgiving is it on eye relief and head placement/cheek weld?
As an example I handled a  Millet/DMS once and found it not real forgiving for me.
Thanks.

I have the same question- trying to decide between:
Nikon Monarch African Series Rifle Scope 1-4x 20mm German #4 Reticle; Matte Mfr #: 8446 Wt: 12 oz, and
Weaver Classic V-Series Rifle Scope 1-3x 20mm Dual-X Reticle- Matte Tube Diam.: 1" Mfr #: 849400 Wt: 8.5 oz

Looks like the Nikon is about $100. more than the Weaver. And a few ounces heavier. Anyone compared these two?

I intend to make a concerted effort to look at as many of the scopes of this type that I can at SHOT, and take some notes.

So if there is anything specific I should check out for the group let me know.

This:

http://www.vortextactical.com/product/vortex-viper-pst-1-4x24-riflescope-with-tmcq-moa-reticle

Is the illumation daylight vissible with that viper scope ???

I checked out your website and this looks like a good scope.  What is the difference between the 2 reticles?

Great thread! I'd really like to see a detailed review, w/reticle pics, of the Trijicon TR24. It not needing batteries seems like a solid point, although I'm sure it's limited in daylight.

My review of the U.S. Optics SN-4s

I sit here at the table on my back porch with my Zeiss 4.5-14x, my Leupold CQ/T, and now a nice shiny U.S. Optics SN-4s. I had not planned to buy this scope. I had determined that I would only buy a scope with an acceptable ranging and bullet-drop reticle from one of a very few makers I had enough trust in. While U.S. Optics is on that list, none of their reticles fit the bill. The closest is their JPJ1, but it is quite fatally flawed. The drop numbers are not even close to being right for M855 or M193. It also centers its close quarters circle on an odd 2moa dot that is 2.21moa above the 100-yard zero. Any close quarters shots would be well below the 100-yard zero, so this circle is decidedly in the wrong place and the dot in the middle of it has no use at all since no aiming point lies above the 100-yard zero. No scope maker I find acceptable currently has a reticle I find acceptable. However, when this U.S. Optics came around used at the price I got it for, I couldn’t say no. It has a circle dot reticle that does not really do ranging or bullet-drop, but it is my favorite close quarters reticle. I figured:  I’ll buy it, see how it stacks up to the CQ/T, and keep the one I think most worthy, price not withstanding.

This brings us back to the table on my back porch. I have timed things so that the sun will set over the course of the next half hour and I will get to observe how the scopes fare over that time.

My initial impressions of the U.S. Optics scope are as follows. It has a heavy imposing scope that appears very rugged and well constructed. The adjustments are well sized and have an adjustable zero indicator. They have nice aluminum caps and feel smooth to adjust with nice positive tactile clicks. Unfortunately, they are in 5/8” increments. Perhaps worse than this, they appear to be labeled in MOA but are not. Each 5/8” increment is exactly half of each labeled increment. This means that the labeled increments occur every 1¼ inch but are labeled 1,2,3 etc. It is my opinion that even if these adjustments track true and exact they are next to useless for windage and drop compensation since their increments are very difficult to count by for the user. You would need a calculator or pen and paper to calculate your dope. This is a very detrimental feature in this scope that should have never come to pass. It almost appears to me that the intention was to make ½ inch increments but someone messed up a calculation somewhere. Further inspection of the scope reveals a nice adjustable diopter that is smooth but stiff, just as you would want. The power ring is also smooth. It moves much easier than the diopter and can only be faulted for having a very long throw going from 1-4 power.

Now, looking through the optic I see that U.S. Optics deserves its reputation for clarity. This scope is remarkably clear. It is significantly better than the Zeiss, which, in comparison, now seems hazy. It is also obviously better than the CQ/T. In fact, with them sitting side by side I’m not sure that I could go back to a CQ/T knowing how much better the U.S. Optics is. A slight curvature of field is noted at 1x but it does not seem to be great enough to cause a problem. None is noted at 4x. No chromatic aberration is noted at either power. This impresses me, though it is not really vital for a combat optic. This scope is a dream to look through for the user. If you were stuck observing an enemy encampment (such as a nest of groundhogs) all day this scope would not drive your eyes batty. The only true problem I saw optically with this scope was at 1x. Though the scope is quite forgiving regarding head position side to side, it is not at all forgiving with head position forward and backward. I am not sure why this is and I find it very surprising. All other 1x power scopes I have looked through are very forgiving forward and backward at 1x, but his one allows almost no head movement if one desires to have a full image. This is a major problem for close quarters use and given that is the primary purpose of a 1-4x scope, I find this disturbing.

The illumination of the reticle is not usable in full light (reticle appears black) but does show up in low light environments fine. The illumination is not quite as bright as the CQ/T. Like the CQ/T, the SN-4s does not seem to suffer from internal reflection of the illumination causing red haze or glaring. In fact, it is even better than the CQ/T in this regard. As has been mentioned before by others, the front of this scope does light up like a Christmas tree when the scope is illuminated. I expect this is due to the front focal plane design. It is probably advisable if you do not want to give your position away to use a kill flash. The illumination knob is smooth with nice tactile stops at each setting. On a further note, the scope that I have has red illumination. This is notable because red is one of the colors the human eye does the worst job at detecting. It takes a great deal of red light to be perceived by the human eye. Green, on the other hand, is perceived much easier by the eye. Because of this, a scope with green illumination of the same brightness as a red illuminated scope will be perceived much brighter. I mention this because U.S. Optics also offers a green rheostat at no additional cost. Assuming each rheostat has the same amount of power, the green would appear much brighter. I would recommend that color for this scope for any users who desire to use illumination during daylight hours.

The sun is going down now and I wait for the scopes to begin to fail.  The Leupold, not surprisingly, begins to fail first. Its tiny 14mm objective lens requires a great deal of light to get the job done. It will begin to appear less than clear at 3x well before you really start to notice it getting darker out. Next, the U.S. Optics gives way to the failing light and begins to appear fuzzy and lackluster. It appears that size does matter as the 42mm Zeiss not surprisingly holds out the longest.

Lastly, I would like to mention the reticle. Note that this section only applies to the circle dot that U.S. Optics uses. They have many other reticles that may perform much better. At 4x this reticle works fine, though as previously mentioned it has no features that help with ranging or drop compensation. Unfortunately, being an FFP scope the reticle shrinks to 1/4th the size at 1x that it is at 4x. This is because everything in the scope is 1/4th the size. The reticle stays the same size relative to the target. None of this would be a problem except that at 1x the reticle is simply to small to be very quick with. The aim-point becomes almost unnoticeable as you move the rifle around to engage targets. Though illumination can help, it is not bright enough to be useful in daylight. This basically leaves the user with a black red dot type sight. I would not choose this reticle for any purpose.

In conclusion, the U.S. Optics SN-4s is a scope of remarkable clarity that appears to be quite well constructed, if heavy. Unfortunately, its adjustments are in odd and difficult to use increments. It also offers extremely limited front to back head movement at 1x. Lastly, I do not find any of its reticles ideal, although I think the pick of the litter is the circle chevron. I would also recommend the green rheostat, as it will make better use of the limited power afforded to illuminate the scope.

Scope on a 16” carbine

Reticle at 1x no illumination

Reticle at 1x illumination to max

Reticle at 4x no illumination

Reticle at 4x illumination to max


Next week I will be adding a review of the march 1-10x scope. The folks at Kelbly were nice enough to hook me up with one to review. I will update the table at that point to add the vortex optic which is either new or somehow escaped my attention to this point.

Sam, thanks for posting that pic.  Do you have any other pics of the ret.. perhaps in daylight?  

Okay...so far this looks like a winner... I'm crossing my fingers...  any additonal pics, detail, etc. when you get the chance will be very much anticipated.  Thanks.

Does this qualify?

Recently I was able to spend some time on the range with the new Leupold CQBSS optic.  The new CQBSS is a front focal plane 1.1 x 8 power optic built on a 34 mm tube using a Horus 27 illuminated dot reticle. The CQBSS was specifically designed for law enforcement and military use, which is very obvious by its robust and well designed features.  The windage and elevation adjustment dials are large with a pinch release style locking adjustment system to allow quick and secure adjustments even with gloves. The dials also have built-in zero stops. The windage and elevation reticle adjustments are .10 mil per click. The illuminated dot was also visible during bright sunlight. The power adjustment ring is a large and knurled bezel so you do not have to hunt for it.  A nice feature of this scope is that when the power adjustment is on 1.1 the Horus reticle all but disappears and the only thing you see is a horizontal reticle line with an illuminated red dot in the middle.

Once the scope was mounted I dry fired it around the building to see how the illuminated reticle worked indoors. The reticle worked as expected indoors and the clarity of the glass was outstanding. I found the large brightness adjustment dial has clean discernable clicks at every level of adjustment. After a couple of days I was finally able to get out to the range to see what I could get out of this optic. Because of other activity on the range, I was only able to get it back to 100 yards so I was limited on distance which was disappointing.  Once on the range I zeroed the CQBSS at 100 yards. The zeroing process was made easy by the pinch style locking windage and elevation dials with this style of adjustment dials it eliminates the need for a multi-tool or coin to make the adjustments. The adjustment dials are very easy to adjust and when released are locked in place without having to worry about them moving when the dial is brushed against gear or other items.After obtaining a solid zero I made several windage and elevation adjustments only to find the reticle to track perfectly which was no surprise.  Once I finished checking the tracking of the reticle I started working my way in to the 7 yard line.  While on the range I was able to shoot a few slow fire drills and a few rapid fire drills as I worked my way across the range.  During the course of shooting with the scope I adjusted the power of the scope several times so I could get a feel for the front focal plane optic as this is the first time I have used a front focal plane optic. When I was able to get in close where I could service several targets during rapid fire drills this scope really showed how versatile and fast it actually can be.  When at the 7 yard line with the scope set on 1.1 power and shooting with both eyes open it was amazing how fast you could transition from target to target. I think the reason for this is because it is very close to being very close to a true 1x optic. The red dot reticle is suppose to be a 5 moa dot however, when the power is set on 1.1 it appears to be 2 moa or smaller. The dot appears so small that it’s tough to acquire during multi target speed drills.   Since this was a gen 1 version, there were some issues with the dot reticle. The dot reticle was not quite a refined as it should be and it was a bit small on 1.1x. The dot in the gen 2 is suppose to be a 10 moa dot so there will be a very noticeable difference in the size of the dot on the 1.1 power setting but, it will not be overwhelming. The gen 2 version of the CQBSS is currently in production in small numbers for testing. Look for an update once I get my hands on the gen 2 version to confirm what changes have been made.


I think this optic has a lot to offer to the LE and military community because it is so versatile with its wide range power, ease of power adjustment, ease of elevation and windage adjustments and its reticle.  Hopefully this optic will be made available by Leupold in the near future and should be displayed at the SHOT Show.
















Reticle on 1.1x




Higher power setting






Link to my post concerning this optic.

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My review of the March 1-10x Tactical scope

Today was somewhat of a departure for me in my normal review process. Instead of sitting all my scopes on the table of my back porch to compare them, I packed them up and headed a few hours north to the Kelbly compound. For those of you who are in no way involved in the bench rest world, the Kelbly’s are builders of bench rest rifles. They have extensive manufacturing capacity and can fully manufacture stocks, triggers, actions, and rings onsite. Of course, they also have gunsmithing facilities to assemble and chamber the pieces as well. The Kelbly compound is truly a wonderland for a tinkerer such as myself.

It seems every serious shooter, regardless of discipline, is always in search of a better optic. For the bench rest shooter this comes down to a search for an optic with better glass, better zero hold through the zoom range, more longevity, and truer adjustments. To this end, Kelbly has become the North American distributor for March scopes by Deon. Deon is a small-scale scope designer and manufacturer out of Japan. In fact, they make less than 1200 scopes per year. Additionally, they sell some of their designs to other makers. They are as much about design as manufacturing. Deon has become a dominant player in the world of bench rest and now is making forays in to the tactical world. Today’s scope, the March 1-10x tactical, is one such foray.

My initial impression of the scope with it in my hand is that it feels very refined. The overall appearance is pleasing and attractive. Somehow everything looks in proportion to everything else. It’s almost like an artist was consulted on how large the adjustments and eyepiece should be and how everything should be styled. Speaking of the adjustments, they would best be described as sniper styled. They are ¼ MOA click adjustments that are labeled every MOA. Each rotation is 25 MOA and the total adjustment travel is an almost excessive 200 MOA. Indicator markings exist for each full turn of the adjustments. The elevation adjustment even has an adjustable zero stop. Both elevation and windage have adjustable zero indicators. The adjustment knobs rotate smoothly with nice positive clicks. On the left-hand side of the scope is a very interesting combination knob that serves as both a side focus parallax adjustment and the illumination control. Parallax adjusts from 10 yards to infinity and is marked at 10 yards, 100 yards, and infinity. There is very little space on the dial between 100 yards and infinity so don’t expect to be particularly precise when correcting for parallax. The power selector ring is located directly in front of the eyepiece and is labeled at each power from 1-10. I was happy to find that it is a fairly short throw:  going from 1-10 is just about 180 degrees. The ring is stiff but smooth. Though contoured for grip, it is stiff enough and small enough that it’s a bit dicey with wet gloves, so it is probably a good candidate for an R&R racing throw lever. Rotating the eyepiece functions as the diopter adjustment and it does have a locking ring to preserve the setting once this is accomplished.

Now the fun part begins. I head out into the icy cold to do the optical evaluation. As you can see in the photos, there are 8 inches of snow on the ground today. I set all the scopes to be compared on one of Kelbly’s cement shooting benches side by side. For 1x comparison I have my Leupold CQ/T. For comparison at 10x I have my Zeiss conquest 4.5-14x and my brother’s US Optics SN-3 T-pal 5-25x. The first thing that strikes me when doing my optical critique of the March scope is how little forgiveness the scope has for head position at 10x. I had wondered what a 2.4mm exit pupil would feel like when using the scope. I can now confirm it is small. There is little variation in head position that will result in an image for the user. By contrast, the Zeiss and USO are much more lenient. Clarity wise, the March does not match either the Zeiss or the USO, though it is really pretty close to the Zeiss. The USO is in another league here. This is not to say that the March has poor clarity; I would not say that at all. The March has good usable clarity at 10x power. It just can’t beat the two quality full size sniper scopes. If you were expecting that miracle you will be disappointed. I took more time at 10x to note some other aspects of the image. I did not notice any significant curvature of field or chromatic aberration. This surprised me as I figured that with a scope pushing the envelope as much as this one is doing, something would have to give. The March has a very small field of view at 10x power. Perhaps the small field of view helped prevent these other optical problems. At 1x, the March easily bests the CQ/T in clarity, especially towards the edge of the field of view. Interestingly, when you turn the March up to 3x power to compare it to the CQT, their clarity becomes so close at the center of the image that it took three trips outside, warming up in between, to determine that the March is slightly better. Again, towards the edge of the image the March easily bests the CQ/T.  I have no idea why anyone would use the March at 3x when it goes 1-10x, but I thought the comparison interesting anyway. At 1x, the March continues to display no noticeable curvature of field or chromatic aberration. At this power, March is not nearly as forgiving with regard to head position as the CQ/T, though I do believe it is more forgiving than the 6.8mm exit pupil would suggest. This 6.8mm statistic is, in fact, not mentioned directly in the March literature and I am not completely convinced that it is accurate. If I were to guess, I would guess 10mm on the 1x exit pupil.

I next evaluate the illumination of the March scope. As I mentioned earlier, the March scope combines the illumination and parallax adjustment on one knob. Turning the knob changes the parallax whereas pushing a rubber button on the side of the knob controls the illumination. There are 4 settings for the illumination as well as an ‘off’ setting. You simply push the button several times to cycle through them. Should you leave the illumination on, it turns off on its own in an hour. Those of you who desire daylight visible illumination will be disappointed. The highest setting is not even close to being visible by day (reticle appears black even when illuminated in daylight.) Similarly, the lowest setting is probably a bit bright for use in a very dark environment since it was still visible in the lighted room I was in. Perhaps the most interesting note on the illumination was how completely consistent it was across the crosshair.  Most illuminated reticles show some bleeding of the illumination off the edges of the reticle or have somewhat blotchy illumination on the reticle. This is not the case on the March. It is crisp. Nor is there ambient glare of the illumination in the scope. Only the reticle is illuminated. No evil clouds of reflected red haze.

The March 1-10x scope currently comes with one reticle option in the illuminated model. They call this reticle the MTR-2. It is a second focal plane MOA ladder style reticle. At 10x each major division is 10 moa and each minor division is 2 MOA. Since it is a second focal plane scope at 5x, this is doubled to 20 MOA and 4 MOA. These are shooters MOAs where 1 MOA is equal to exactly 1 inch at 100 yards, not 1 inch and change. Generally, I hate seeing mil or MOA ladders in a 1-(n) power scope. In the case of this particular scope, I have more mixed feelings. On the one hand, it is a 10x scope with sniper styled turrets. It could be argued that it is a sniper scope and should have a sniper reticle. On the other hand, it is a 1x scope that can be used in close quarters with both eyes opened for speed. It could be argued that this scope needs a close quarters reticle that allows for rapid target acquisition. Perhaps some sort of hybrid reticle could be constructed to better reflect the nature of this scope. Of course if I were to have my pick, that hybrid reticle would include bullet drop and rapid ranging features. I personally have come to the general opinion that I do not want to see a mil or MOA ladder reticle in any tactical scope, sniper or close quarters. I simply do not believe mathematical calculations are a good use of time when someone is shooting at you.

On the whole, the March 1-10x Tactical scope is a difficult scope to categorize completely. Is it a sniper scope that scales for close combat or a close combat scope that scales for sniping? The 1-10x powered range is mind-boggling, but it does come at a price. The field of view is limited at high power and the exit pupil is limited at both high and low powers. The clarity, though acceptable, is not on par with other smaller power range scopes at this and even greatly less cost. Clearly some sacrifices had to be made for a 10x increase in magnification range. Despite these sacrifices, the scope is significantly better at close quarters than I expected it to be. When I read that this scope a MOA ladder reticle and a 6.8mm exit pupil, I thought it would not be passable as a close quarters scope. That is not the case. It is by no means an excellent close quarters scope, but it is much better than you would think. The reticle is thick enough that you can keep from losing it most of the time as you move positions and engage multiple targets. Similarly, the exit pupil, while not ideal, is not so small at 1x that you constantly lose it provided you have a solid cheek weld. However, if you don’t have an adjustable cheek piece on your rifle you would probably be screwed, as your lousy chin weld is not going to get the job done. In the urban sniper environment that is increasingly becoming a reality for our troops, a 10x sniper scope that can be scaled down to 1x for close engagements is a valuable product. This scope is a jack-of-all-trades and even though it masters none, I found no fatal flaws in its design. That is something I certainly cannot say for all of the other scopes I have reviewed. If you can get past the cost and the 5-year warranty, you will find a very capable and unique optic in the March 1-10x.

March 1-10x with box and paperwork

March 1-10x on the bench with the reference scopes

March at 1x no illumination 100 yards to target

March at 10x no illumination 100 yards to target

March at 1x indoor with illumination set to max

The March 1-10x scope mounted on my AR


Please direct your discussion of this scope here as the purpose of this thread is to post reviews not discuss the reviews.
Thank you.

Table has been updated to include the new Premier Reticles 1.1-8x. Its not on their website yet but you folks at Shot show will get to see it in person.

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The March looks promising, but with out day light vis reticule its a no go for me.

double tap

My review of the new Korean GRSC 1-4x scope from Ed Verdugo

Today I have in my hands for review a GRSC 1-4x scope from Ed Verdugo. We’ll get to the scope shortly, but first a few words about Ed and how this scope came to exist. Ed is a former Special Forces operator who, since retiring from the armed forces and becoming a fireman, has dedicated much of his hobby time to improving our war-fighters’ gear. No doubt you have seen (and probably used) one of the many receiver endplate sling attachment points he invented. You have probably also used a sling that borrows at least a few of his innovations in that department. A few years ago, Ed became interested in improving our troops’ sighting systems. He designed, and has subsequently improved upon, a combat reticle. He has since attempted to have that reticle included in a combat-worthy scope, with varying degrees of success. At least three scopes on the review table at the beginning of this thread have all or part of Ed’s reticle design in them. This particular scope is one that not only has Ed’s reticle, but also is manufactured for and sold through Ed at GRSC. He has put much of his own treasure on the line to bring such a scope to pass. For a guy with seven kids and an ex-wife, that cannot have been easy. It is notable that this is the second scope Ed has had manufactured using his reticle and more models from different manufacturers are likely to come. Originally there was an unsatisfactory Chinese GRSC scope made by Millet for Ed. The one I am reviewing here is a Korean manufactured scope just now entering production. Though the scopes use very similar reticles and appear superficially similar, they are not at all the same scope. Completely different companies were used in their manufacture and the Korean version is of substantially better quality.

As is noted in many of my other reviews, few 1-(n) power optics have a reticle that realistically offers a high speed and high hit probability over that full range of engagement distances. A 5.56mm assault rifle is a very effective close quarters tool, but is also effective out to a full 800 yards. This is provided the user knows how far the target is and where to point the gun. Many optics use close quarters reticles like circle dots that are fast up close but limited to an effective range of 400 or less yards. Other optics use mil dot type reticles that are not particularly fast up close or at range. Though capable of estimating the range of targets, mil dots require mathematical calculations to accomplish this. They further require the user to adjust the turrets to compensate for range and drop once the calculations have been made. Though this might be a serviceable, if needlessly laborious, procedure when engaging targets that are unaware of the user’s presence, it is not a viable option when the targets have already engaged the user. No one is going to pull out his calculator in a firefight. To be honest, I am no longer convinced that mil dots even have a place in sniper scopes, let alone in close quarters optics. I believe that the mil dot is a once innovative but now antiquated idea that persists largely due to lack of creativity on the part of manufacturers and lack of knowledge on the part of the consumer.

The reticle in this GRSC scope is one of the few reticles designed to accommodate both close quarters and long-range engagements and is available in the 1-4x scope class. It has features for snapshooting, ranging, bullet drop, windage, and moving target leads. Allow me to walk you though the functions so that you will understand how it works. Please refer to the close up image of the reticle (below) while reading this section. I promise it is not that complicated and is well worth understanding. The large central horseshoe that surrounds the 100-yard zero point has an inside diameter of 10 MOA. This corresponds to the size of a human head at 100 yards and serves to range that distance. The horseshoe is a massive 4 MOA thick. This is so that when dialed down to 1x, it will appear as a dot for close quarters combat. This scope is front focal plane so as you decrease power the reticle appears progressively smaller to the user. Ideally, this dot would be illuminated brightly enough to be used in daylight. Below the 100-yard zero you will see a series of dashed lines and circles labeled 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8. Each circle has an inside diameter of 10 inches at the yardage it corresponds to; with line 4 being 400 yards and so on. Aiming points and ranging circles exist for 10 as well as 300 – 800 yards. These aiming points are based on the bullet drop of an M855 cartridge fired from a 14.5” barreled M4. You will also notice that at each 100-yard increment from 400 yards on, there is a dashed line. Each dash and each gap are equal to 10 inches at the corresponding range. This allows you not only to range larger objects, but also to compensate for windage and moving target leads. Since our number system is base 10 it is particularly easy to count the correct amount of dashes from center to account for windage or target lead. By now you have noticed that almost every feature in the scope is based on 10 inches at the appropriate range. For this reason, I like to refer to this reticle as Ed’s ‘base 10 reticle’. There are also a few other less relevant features on the scope that you may be wondering about. The dots to the right and left of the horseshoe are, in fact, mil dots. They are mostly there to level the scope during mounting and to ensure level hold of the rifle. There are also dots down the vertical centerline of the scope between 100-yard drop increments. They are to aid you when firing at targets substantially between ranges and are not positioned at any particularly important division points.


For the assessment of this unique reticle I have made up a special target. On it I have placed properly sized circles and correctly spaced drop lines to assess how true to the specs the reticle’s features actually are. Since this scope is designed to have bullet drop, windage, and moving target lead compensated for with the reticle instead of with the adjustments, it is vital that the reticle dimensions are to spec. At this point, I have already compared the GRSC’s spec drop numbers to several references for the M855 cartridge and I am confident that if the reticle dimensions are in reality as they are on paper, this reticle will be an excellent design with regards to both bullet drop and ranging. Following my testing, I can confirm that the reticle’s actual dimensions are absolutely spot-on to the specifications. This reticle quickly and easily allows the user to assess the range of a target and compensate for drop, windage, and moving target leads. This is, of course, providing you know the windage and moving target velocity.

At close quarters outside, the reticle is not as fast as one would hope though. The reason for this is that when dialed down in power, the horseshoe becomes small so as to be used as a red dot. Unfortunately, the illumination is just not bright enough to illuminate the reticle in that capacity under full sunlight. The scope is quite fast in “red dot mode” indoors where the illumination is easily viewed, but outside it is a little slower than ideal. That is not to say that this scope is by any means unusable for close quarters outside on a sunny day. It is quite useable; it just could be a little faster if the illumination was brighter or the reticle was either larger or just second focal plane. All in all though, this is the best reticle I have encountered thus far in my reviews and not by a small margin either. No other reticle is capable of even half of what this one can do.

Now onto that physical description of the scope: The first thing I notice about the GRSC when fondling it is that the adjustment caps each have a battery stored inside. Brilliant! We all know that ultimately CR2032 batteries don’t last that long in any scope. Having one in each cap gives you a nice, theoretically dry, safe place to store the little buggers where they will always be on hand. I say ‘theoretically dry’ because I notice a seam in the cap separating the threading from the cap body. There are gaps in the glue attaching the two and I can see through the gaps.  Since the o-ring on the scope body is small and interfaces only with the threaded portion that is glued to the cap, these caps are not watertight. This may be a problem for this scope, as I do not know if the adjustments themselves are sealed. I think a wise man would add some silicone caulk strategically around the interface of the cap and the thread to ensure that it is watertight. (Note: new production GRSC scopes do not have the H20 leaking battery storing caps. Then current caps are one piece and do not leak but they also don't hold a battery.)  As for the adjustments themselves, they are very low profile 1/2 MOA click adjustments. I do not believe that they have a movable zero indicator, though I am not positive on this point.  The movement of the knobs is smooth and the clicks are quite audible as well as tactile. The knobs are not knurled at all and slippery hands will not get the job done. The adjustments appear to have four turns at 24” a turn, for a total of 96 MOA. No indicator exists for what turn you are on. Also, the adjustments are labeled every four clicks, but each click is designated as 1/2 MOA. I suspect the labeling is incorrect. All this being said, these are not turrets designed for dialing in your dope to correct for drop and windage. The reticle in this scope does that so their being slippery and mislabeled is not a functional issue.

In order to test the mechanical properties of a scope such as the accuracy, repeatability, and independence of the adjustments I will be performing a box test and a power change test. These tests will be done using may Lothar Walther barreled Spikes .22lr upper. This gives me the data desired without the time and expense of making up match .223 hand loads. In the first target you will see a simple box test. For those of you not familiar with box tests, A box test is performed in the following manner: Zero the scope and shoot the first group. For the second group, you move your adjustments a specified distance (in this case 4 inches at 25 yards) to the right, but you still aim at the original point. For the next group, you move the adjustments the same distance down, but again shoot at the original aim point. You then adjust back left to shoot and finally back up for the final group. The result should be a square box on the target with the last group on top of the first. This test will determine not only if your scope properly returns to zero but also if it's adjustments (right/left and up/down) operate independently of each other (i.e. adjusting left does not also adjust slightly down or up). I also used this test to asses whether the adjustments were moving the point of aim the amount that they claimed to be (i.e. 1/4 MOA adjustments move the point of aim 1/4 MOA and not 3/8 or some other amount).

The target below was fired at 25 yards with the scope set to 4x. The point of aim for all groups is marked as well as the adjusted point of aim (where the rifle should be pointing following each adjustment). Ideally the groups at each point should have the same relation to this adjusted aim point as the first group had to the original aim point.



This box test reveals that the adjustments on the GRSC are independent (ie. the elevation adjustment has no effect on the windage and vise versa) and repeatable (messing with them and then bringing them back to zero will, in fact, bring them back to zero). However, the adjustments are not perfectly accurate 1/2 moa adjustments. Rather, the windage adjustment is about .625" per click and the elevation is about .5625". While this is by no means perfect it is not really particularly relevant on a scope that contains a ranging / bullet drop compensating reticle as you only really use the adjustments for initial zeroing and not to compensate for range and windage in the field. Also, to put it in perspective, my Zeiss victory displayed similar difficulty in adjustment accuracy at more than twice the price.

This next target is a power adjustment target. On the target each group represents a group fired at one of the two power extremes of the scope. No changes are made to the scope's adjustments when firing these groups. Each group is fired using the upper left corner of the respective boxes as the point of aim. A properly performing scope should show the same relative position of the center of each group to its target box. A scope whose point of impact shifts when the power is changed will show a corresponding shift in the group relative to the aim point.



Unfortunately, the GRSC scope shows some shift in aim point when the power is adjusted. By my measurements about 1/2 inches at 25yards or 2moa, again, similar to my Zeiss. While it would be ideal to show no power shift I don't believe that 2moa is really a deal breaker.

Next, let us discuss the illumination controls. As usual, the illumination is located opposite the windage knob on this scope. Ed specified the illumination scheme himself and it is as follows. There are 3 red and 3 green settings. Between every setting there is an ‘off’ position. The settings are arranged such that equal brightness of opposite illumination colors are adjacent. The knob moves smoothly with nice positive indexes. The battery is located in the knob under an o-ring sealed cap as has become the common arrangement. This scope has a non-rotating eyepiece so the power ring that is located just in front of the eyepiece rotates on its own. This power ring is a big juicy affair that is easily gripped with gloves or wet hands. It is a little gravely on rotation and the 4x stop is a little off from the marking. Throw of the power ring is 180 degrees. The diopter is located at the back of the eyepiece. It is silky smooth, sufficiently stiff, and well labeled.  It has several turns of adjustment.

I am back to the comfy table on my back porch for this optical assessment and although snow still coats the ground, it is not blowing sideways at me at 15 degrees Fahrenheit. It is instead 40 degrees, windless, and overcast. Today I will be comparing the GRSC scope to the normal lineup of my 1-3x Leupold CQ/T and my 4.5-14x Zeiss Conquest. With both scopes set to 3x, the resolution of the CQ/T and the GRSC have very similar clarity at the center of the field of view with perhaps a slight edge to the GRSC. The CQ/T displays much more curvature of field so as you move out in the image the GRSC quickly becomes the significantly clearer scope. Additionally, in the low light the Leupold demonstrates a nasty brown-tinted image whereas the GRSC’s image appears properly hued. Both scopes display slight chromatic aberration, but it is not particularly distracting. When powered down to 1x, the Leupold becomes the slightly clearer of the two scopes, though still demonstrating a nasty brown cast. The Leupold must again be suffering low light problems with its 14mm objective at 3x. At 1x, both scopes display only mild curvature of field and chromatic aberration. Neither optical distortion is problematic for either scope. Currently on the table, I have no entry for the GRSC field of view at either magnification. This scope is very new (the GRSC I have is of new Korean manufacture and is different from the original Chinese Millet versions). From hands-on experience, I estimate the field of view to be about 20% less than that of the CQ/T. This ratio holds at 1 and 3 powers. With regard to exit pupil, the Leupold appears to have more forgiveness as to how much you can move your head without losing image. That being said, I do not find the GRSC problematic in this regard. I next compared the GRSC at 4 power to the Zeiss at 4.5 power. It is unfortunate that my Zeiss does not go down to 4 power for better comparisons. Even so, it is my judgment that the Zeiss is significantly clearer than the GRSC, though the GRSC has a much better field of view. Overall, the clarity of the optics in the GRSC are pretty good. They are certainly significantly better than would be expected in a scope at its modest price point.

On the whole, I am impressed with the quality and features on this scope. At its modest $350 price point it offers a reticle better than any other scope on the market and glass that, though not superlative by any means, is better than I would have expected for that price and objectively pretty good. I will continue to use this scope to test its durability as well as report on the field testing that Ed informs me is ongoing. Furthermore, I anticipate reviewing other scopes with this reticle that are currently in the pipeline. Like the March tactical scope available through Kelbly’s I last reviewed, this scope is only available through one supplier. These scopes can be obtained exclusively from Ed at www.GRSC.com.


The GRSC scope on a 16” carbine. The mount is a Bobro.


The GRSC scope next to the Leupold CQ/T and the Zeiss Conquest on my testing table.


The special target I made to determine the reticles features were properly sized. The target is calibrated to be set at 50 yards. For instance, the circle labeled 100 is 5” in diameter.


The GRSC scope at 4x with no illumination. Target is at 50 yards.


The GRSC scope at 4x with Red illumination at full power. Target is at 50 yards.


The GRSC scope at 4x with Green illumination at full power. Target is at 50 yards.


The GRSC scope at 1x with no illumination. Target is at 50 yards.


The GRSC scope at 1x with Red illumination at full power. Target is at 50 yards.


The GRSC scope at 1x with Green illumination at full power. Target is at 50 yards.

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Here's another 1-4x that didn't seem to make the list:
Vector Optics 1-4x

You can find these from various sellers for around $200.  The specs are:

Price: $200
Battery: CR2032
Magnification: 1-4x
Length: 10"
Weight: 22oz
Eye Relief: 5-4" measured (specs say 4.9-3.5")
Field of View (ft@100yds): 95 on 1x   24 on 4x
Exit Pupil: 6.0-16.5 mm
Tube: 30mm
Objective Lens Dia: 24mm
Ocular Lens Dia: 34mm

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that this is probably the best scope for the money in its price range.  It has very clear glass (better than my DMS-1) and brighter illumination.  Additionally, in low light, cranking up the illumination doesn't wash out the reticule (unlike the DMS-1).  The scope is a little heavy, but makes up for it by being short and having red and green illumination.  If you look at picture #5, you can see that 1x magnification is very close to actually being 1x, although you pay for it with a bit of distortion for things that are close up (the railing is about 7' from the scope, the house is about 50'). I tried to take a picture with lots of vertical and horizontal things going on so you can get a good idea of the distortion, especially around the edges.  The turrets are big, very "clicky", and easy to adjust even with heavy gloves, and can be reset to zero by loosening the allens recessed in the crown.  It comes with lens caps that are only marginally terrible, and scope rings that are completely terrible.  This is a "first focal plane" scope, so the crosshairs get bigger with magnification; this may or may not be a plus, depending on your preferences.  









––––––––4x green––––––––––––––––––––––––-4x red–––––––––––––––––– red@night–––––––––––––––––– dead kitty

The SHOT show brought new competitors into this category.  Once again I looked at a lot of optics and failed to take sufficient notes.  I need a press pass so I can take photos of everything and offer proper coverage.

The forthcoming S&B 1-8x is superb especially with the "Close Combat" setting which is very competitive for 1x usability.  About the only serious functional complaint I have with this scope is the narrow exit pupil.

Both of the Vortex scopes were excellent at 1x, seemed to have excellent optical quality and usable illumination.  The reticles could have used a little work IMO, but they were functional.

The Premier Reticles 1-8x is a really interesting optic with excellent 1x performance.

I was a bit disappointed in the Leupold.  It had a couple serious quirks (like the giant dot at magnification) which I'm not sure will really be able to be overcome.

One choice that's been out there a long time with little notice is the Kahles 1-4x.  It has a FFP reticle with duplex crosshairs and an illuminated circle dot.  The 1x performance is excellent and the optical quality is superb.  I'm not sure what the current price point is but I'd suspect its not competitive though which is a shame.  With a couple tweaks to the reticle design and at a competitive price it would be a great option.

The Swarovski 1-6x is still an excellent scope.  I just wish it had a more versatile reticle.

LaRue Stealth lower
Rock River parts kit
Wolff spring kit
Magpul MIAD
Geissele DMR trigger
Magpul UBR butt stock
Enidine hydraulic buffer + Wolff buffer spring
LaRue Stealth billet upper w.M4 feed ramps
Young National Match M16 bolt carrier
LMT enhanced bolt
Badger Gen.2 tactical latch on CMT charge handle
Denny's Guns 18" Krieger 1/7.7 stainless SPR barrel mid-gas
LaRue low profile gas block
LaRue SPR scope mount
Nightforce NXS 1-4x24 scope Zero Stop turrets & FC reticle
Troy front and rear BUIS's
Vickers padded sling
GG&G front sling mount
DD HD QD swivels
Surefire FH556-212A flash hider

Crystal clear glass with Nightforce NXS!

AC

<Off-topic posts removed - Z>

Thank you Gamma762 for the shot report. I will be adding the new S&B and Leupold to the table as soon as I can get numbers on them. I thought the Kahles was discontinued. Since you saw it at shot that is obviously not the case. Perhaps they should discontinue the jobs of some folks in marketing. I have spoken with the folks at Premier Reticles as well as the folks at Vortex and I will be reviewing both companies scopes in the not to distant future. I'm not sure yet which Vortex model, possibly both. The Premier and the Vortex scopes are very intriguing products. I hope they appear as good in person as they do on paper. That's the trick though isn't it.

I will look into the Vector and decide whether or not it makes the cut reputation wise. chibajoe makes a good point about the Millet DMS-1 Perhaps I should have never added that optic. It really is pretty low quality.

I need to get off my ass and call some of the scope companies whose products are still missing most of their statistics in my table. I've been pretty good at tracking down the numbers when it is a scope I find intriguing but i have not made much effort on the ones I have no interest in. That being said I have checked the web for all the scopes in the table so its not like those companies have made much effort either.

Small remark from my side,i was looking at the review on page 3 where the Meopta Kdot and the TR24 are compared.
I have a Meopta and a friend of mine just got his TR24 ,so i wanted to take a closer look.
I found that with the TR24 your eyerelief changes when you adjust the power from 1-4 quite a bit ,is this normal with the TR24 ??

Thanks for the hard work.  I'm really looking forward to your thoughts on the new Vortex.  

great thread, thank you everybody for your contributions

Anyone get there hands on the new Vortex 1-4 power scope yet?  I see that SWFA has them on their website.  It really looks pretty promising and would like to drop the coin on one but would like to read some more reviews on the actual production models.