This came across the PD wire today....

Sworn Personnel:

Earlier this week in the Detective Division the question arose regarding the carrying of a concealed weapon by a member of the US Military without a license to carry a pistol.  Members of the division had stopped a subject who was carrying a weapon concealed and who advised that as a member of the military and under OCGA §16-11-130 he was exempt from the license requirements.  After research was conducted regarding the code section the subject is correct.

Concerns were raised as to whether this exemption was true and if it applied only to military personnel who were acting in the scope of their duties (the firearm here was privately owned and the subject was not acting in any capacity as a member of the armed forces).  There are two exemption statutes in Georgia Code that deal with members of the armed forces and weapons.  The first is § 16- 11-124, which is an exemption for possession of dangerous weapons.  Subsection (2) of this code exempts a member of the National Guard or armed forces from 16-11-123, the unlawful possession of firearms or weapons.  The code states “A member of the National Guard or of the Armed Forces of the United States to wit: the army, navy, marine corps, air force, or coast guard who while serving therein, possesses such firearm in the line of duty.”  This code section seems to make the military serviceman exempt from the unlawful possession of a firearm only if possession occurs in the scope of their duties.  However, this exemption applies only to Part 2, of Article 4, of Chapter 11, dealing with the possession of dangerous weapons. According to the code section dangerous weapons are any sawed-off shotgun, sawed-off rifle, machine gun, dangerous weapon, or silencers.  Commonly owned pistols or rifles are not considered dangerous weapons under this code section.

The code section that deals with exemption of a military service member carrying a concealed weapon is 16-11-130.  Subsection (3) exempts “Persons in the military service of the state or of the United States” from Code Section 16-11-126 through 16-11-128.  These are sections that concern carrying a concealed weapon, carrying on school property or functions, and carrying without a license.  The code section does not state whether the exemption extends to servicemen in the course of their duties.  Former case law suggested that the exemption applied only to performance of official duties (Talley v. State, 129 Ga. App. 479 (1973)).  However, since that case the statute has been revised.  According to the Office of the Attorney General of the State of Georgia “Under Georgia law, active duty military personnel are exempt from the requirements of a firearm permit.  The exemption is not limited to the performance of military duty.” 1997 Ops. Att’y Gen. No. U97-13.  The opinion continues to state that exemption for military personnel is the same as that for peace officers in Georgia.  This means that the limits placed on licensed firearm permits (public gatherings, schools, places where alcohol is served) do not apply to members of armed services.  The only limit that is placed on the service member is that they must be on active duty.  It should be noted that while this is only an opinion by the Attorney General, it is based on a very clear statute, and is likely solid law.


Sincerely,
   xxxxxxxx
EDIT:
FYI - I am not endorsing all military that read this to start packing....it's simply something  informative for those that were not clear on the matter or who wanted to start or had questions about concealed carry and the military.

I heard the same was true of personel that were honerably discharged.  Is that true?

This only indicates ACTIVE......so I guess not, if I was guessing.

The only real objection I would have is being allowed to carry in places a license holder is not allowed to carry.

I'm with ya....especially the "were alcohol is served" one, yikes!

Quoted: I'm with ya....especially the "were alcohol is served" one, yikes!

Being former military I know how scary that is.  

Quoted: I'm with ya....especially the "were alcohol is served" one, yikes!

how do you figure?  The entire idea of not carrying where alcohol is served is absurd.  i can understand not carrying and drinking, but not carrying anywhere alcohol is served?  You mean to tell me that I shouldnt be able to carry to Chilis for an afternoon lunch simply because booze is on the menu?  Man can not live by Wendys alone.

ETA I'm not telling anone here about this.  If they wanted to carry they would have a license to do so.  The last thing I need is PVTs and LTs walking around "strapped' because they think they can or that its cool.

Quoted: Quoted: I'm with ya....especially the "were alcohol is served" one, yikes! how do you figure?  The entire idea of not carrying where alcohol is served is absurd.  i can understand not carrying and drinking, but not carrying anywhere alcohol is served?  You mean to tell me that I shouldnt be able to carry to Chilis for an afternoon lunch simply because booze is on the menu?  Man can not live by Wendys alone. ETA I'm not telling anone here about this.  If they wanted to carry they would have a license to do so.  The last thing I need is PVTs and LTs walking around "strapped' because they think they can or that its cool.

Every citizen should be able to go armed anywhere. There are plenty of laws to punish someone if they do something stupid and carry laws do not affect criminals at all. Only law abiding citizens are punished unConstituionally by gun laws.

I was being a little humorous....you know military...alcohol? Kinda like cops and alcohol....the majority wouldn't have a problem.

I am not sure that I agree that this statute only exempts military members on active duty.  The statute itself does not differentiate between active duty and reservists.  There is no Georgia case law on that aspect of the statute.  Only the AG's opinion, which is not binding law on any court, differentiates active and reserve.  Generally, the first place a court looks for the meaning of a statute is at the plain text of the statute.  To the extent that there is ambiguity in the statute, the basic rules of statutory construction direct that the statute is to be construed AGAINST the drafter.

And if you look at the other classes of individuals excluded and policies in play behind the statute, it seems to me that they go in favor of including reservists.  Notwithstanding all of that, most any attorney should be able to make a good argument that any differentiation between active and reservists today is nominal.

Quoted: I am not sure that I agree that this statute only exempts military members on active duty.  The statute itself does not differentiate between active duty and reservists.  There is no Georgia case law on that aspect of the statute.  Only the AG's opinion, which is not binding law on any court, differentiates active and reserve.

The AG was not really differentiating between active and reserve.  He was simply answering the question he was asked, which was limited to members on active duty.  He did not express any opinion on anybody else.

Quoted: This came across the PD wire today....

kncook,  I do not suppose you could let me know privately which agency this is, could you?  GCO is actively pursuing an issue involving a run-in with one of our members who is in the military service, and this knowledge may help in determining our tact.

Thanks.

It's worth noting that even though this is the law, if you are discovered carrying a gun in a place where it is prohibited for CCW holders, you are probably going to jail.

When I was on recruiting duty, I gave this law a very close read and it was vague enough to leave some doubt about what places were prohibitted.

It seems to me(and my local LE agencies) that it provides an exemption for a CCW permit but does not allow you to carry a gun everywhere.

Quoted: It's worth noting that even though this is the law, if you are discovered carrying a gun in a place where it is prohibited for CCW holders, you are probably going to jail. When I was on recruiting duty, I gave this law a very close read and it was vague enough to leave some doubt about what places were prohibitted. It seems to me(and my local LE agencies) that it provides an exemption for a CCW permit but does not allow you to carry a gun everywhere.

Joker, it is the exact same exemption afforded to peace officers in this state.  They are not any different, so I am not sure what is vague, unless of course you think police officers can be arrested for carrying in those same places and that Georgia peace officers are only "exempt for a CCW permit but . . . not allow[ed] to carry a gun everywhere."

The statute quite clearly exempts certain persons (more than just military and police) from 16-11-126 through 16-11-128.  It just gives a list of the people.  Police and military are both in the same list (among the other people in that same list).  So how could they be different?

Here is the statute if you would like to read it again.

For reference, 126 is the law that requires one to have a license to carry concealed, 127 is the public gatherings law, 127.1 is the school law, 127.2 is the nuclear power plant law, and 128 is the law that requires one to have a license even if carrying openly.  Please study it again and let me know what you think.

And to fulfill O.C.G.A. § 16-11-128, just go to the DNR website and purchase a hunting license and keep it in your wallet and open carry.  Just make sure you can substantiate that you are going hunting....wouldn't try and do it outside of established hunting season dates :)

WTF is this:

Concealed Weapons: are defined as any bludgeon (asp baton, nun chucks, ect), metal knuckles, firearm (this means ANY firearm capable of being concealed, not just handguns), knife designed for the purpose of offense and defense (swords, ballistic knives, knives with blades longer than 2 inches), or any other dangerous or deadly weapon or instrument that is not carried in an open manner and fully exposed to view. For weapons to be considered not to be concealed, they must be carried in some type of holster, scabbard, or sheath that is NOT to be hidden or covered up by the person's clothing or in the person's pockets. Weapons MUST be able to visible through ordinary observation - this is commonly known as being able to view the weapon from at least 3 different viewing angles.

Is this correct?  Who carries a knife under 2 inches?  That means I'm carrying two illegal knives right now.

 I wonder how the AG would consider those military personnel who have criminal backgrounds with regards to this CCW exemption?  I know I have worked a few cases with military personnel who had things in their criminal histories which would exempt them from being able to obtain a CCW in Georgia.

Quoted: WTF is this: Concealed Weapons: are defined as any bludgeon (asp baton, nun chucks, ect), metal knuckles, firearm (this means ANY firearm capable of being concealed, not just handguns), knife designed for the purpose of offense and defense (swords, ballistic knives, knives with blades longer than 2 inches), or any other dangerous or deadly weapon or instrument that is not carried in an open manner and fully exposed to view. For weapons to be considered not to be concealed, they must be carried in some type of holster, scabbard, or sheath that is NOT to be hidden or covered up by the person's clothing or in the person's pockets. Weapons MUST be able to visible through ordinary observation - this is commonly known as being able to view the weapon from at least 3 different viewing angles. Is this correct?  Who carries a knife under 2 inches?  That means I'm carrying two illegal knives right now.

Where did you get that from?  3 inches is what i have seen somewhere.

O.C.G.A. § 16-11-127.1

  (2) "Weapon" means and includes any pistol, revolver, or any weapon designed or intended to propel a missile of any kind, or any dirk, bowie knife, switchblade knife, ballistic knife, any other knife having a blade of two or more inches, straight-edge razor, razor blade, spring stick, metal knucks, blackjack, any bat, club, or other bludgeon-type weapon, or any flailing instrument consisting of two or more rigid parts connected in such a manner as to allow them to swing freely, which may be known as a nun chahka, nun chuck, nunchaku, shuriken, or fighting chain, or any disc, of whatever configuration, having at least two points or pointed blades which is designed to be thrown or propelled and which may be known as a throwing star or oriental dart, or any weapon of like kind, and any stun gun or taser as defined in subsection (a) of Code Section 16-11-106. This paragraph excludes any of these instruments used for classroom work authorized by the teacher.

Quoted: I heard the same was true of personel that were honerably discharged.  Is that true?

That would be news to me.  If that exemption existed, I would be all over that.  It does not seem to apply to honorably discharged military veterans but does seem to apply to retired law enforcement officers.

Quoted: This came across the PD wire today.... Sworn Personnel: Earlier this week in the Detective Division the question arose regarding the carrying of a concealed weapon by a member of the US Military without a license to carry a pistol.  Members of the division had stopped a subject who was carrying a weapon concealed and who advised that as a member of the military and under OCGA §16-11-130 he was exempt from the license requirements.  After research was conducted regarding the code section the subject is correct. Concerns were raised as to whether this exemption was true and if it applied only to military personnel who were acting in the scope of their duties (the firearm here was privately owned and the subject was not acting in any capacity as a member of the armed forces).  There are two exemption statutes in Georgia Code that deal with members of the armed forces and weapons.  The first is § 16- 11-124, which is an exemption for possession of dangerous weapons.  Subsection (2) of this code exempts a member of the National Guard or armed forces from 16-11-123, the unlawful possession of firearms or weapons.  The code states “A member of the National Guard or of the Armed Forces of the United States to wit: the army, navy, marine corps, air force, or coast guard who while serving therein, possesses such firearm in the line of duty.”  This code section seems to make the military serviceman exempt from the unlawful possession of a firearm only if possession occurs in the scope of their duties.  However, this exemption applies only to Part 2, of Article 4, of Chapter 11, dealing with the possession of dangerous weapons. According to the code section dangerous weapons are any sawed-off shotgun, sawed-off rifle, machine gun, dangerous weapon, or silencers.  Commonly owned pistols or rifles are not considered dangerous weapons under this code section. The code section that deals with exemption of a military service member carrying a concealed weapon is 16-11-130.  Subsection (3) exempts “Persons in the military service of the state or of the United States” from Code Section 16-11-126 through 16-11-128.  These are sections that concern carrying a concealed weapon, carrying on school property or functions, and carrying without a license.  The code section does not state whether the exemption extends to servicemen in the course of their duties.  Former case law suggested that the exemption applied only to performance of official duties (Talley v. State, 129 Ga. App. 479 (1973)).  However, since that case the statute has been revised.  According to the Office of the Attorney General of the State of Georgia “Under Georgia law, active duty military personnel are exempt from the requirements of a firearm permit.  The exemption is not limited to the performance of military duty.” 1997 Ops. Att’y Gen. No. U97-13.  The opinion continues to state that exemption for military personnel is the same as that for peace officers in Georgia.  This means that the limits placed on licensed firearm permits (public gatherings, schools, places where alcohol is served) do not apply to members of armed services.  The only limit that is placed on the service member is that they must be on active duty.  It should be noted that while this is only an opinion by the Attorney General, it is based on a very clear statute, and is likely solid law. Sincerely,    xxxxxxxx EDIT: FYI - I am not endorsing all military that read this to start packing....it's simply something  informative for those that were not clear on the matter or who wanted to start or had questions about concealed carry and the military.

I always thought it was only in the line of duty, but everything I can find in several code sections and the AG's opinion seem to indicate that military personnel are excempt.

Interesting.

Quoted: And to fulfill O.C.G.A. § 16-11-128, just go to the DNR website and purchase a hunting license and keep it in your wallet and open carry.  Just make sure you can substantiate that you are going hunting....wouldn't try and do it outside of established hunting season dates :)

(a) A person commits the offense of carrying a pistol without a license when he has or carries on or about his person, outside of his home, motor vehicle, or place of business, any pistol or revolver without having on his person a valid license issued by the judge of the probate court of the county in which he resides, provided that no permit shall be required for persons with a valid hunting or fishing license on their person or for persons not required by law to have hunting licenses who are engaged in legal hunting, fishing, or sport shooting when the persons have the permission of the owner of the land on which the activities are being conducted; provided, further, that the pistol or revolver, whenever loaded, shall be carried only in an open and fully exposed manner.

It would seem that unless you are on "the land on which the activities are being conducted", having a hunting or fishing license would not suffice.

I might be wrong, but that seems to be the key.

Quoted: Quoted: And to fulfill O.C.G.A. § 16-11-128, just go to the DNR website and purchase a hunting license and keep it in your wallet and open carry.  Just make sure you can substantiate that you are going hunting....wouldn't try and do it outside of established hunting season dates :) (a) A person commits the offense of carrying a pistol without a license when he has or carries on or about his person, outside of his home, motor vehicle, or place of business, any pistol or revolver without having on his person a valid license issued by the judge of the probate court of the county in which he resides, provided that no permit shall be required for persons with a valid hunting or fishing license on their person or for persons not required by law to have hunting licenses who are engaged in legal hunting, fishing, or sport shooting when the persons have the permission of the owner of the land on which the activities are being conducted; provided, further, that the pistol or revolver, whenever loaded, shall be carried only in an open and fully exposed manner. It would seem that unless you are on "the land on which the activities are being conducted", having a hunting or fishing license would not suffice. I might be wrong, but that seems to be the key.

I took the part you highlighted to mean permission to go hunting, not packing while hunting.   But you are right that it might mean the latter.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: And to fulfill O.C.G.A. § 16-11-128, just go to the DNR website and purchase a hunting license and keep it in your wallet and open carry.  Just make sure you can substantiate that you are going hunting....wouldn't try and do it outside of established hunting season dates :) (a) A person commits the offense of carrying a pistol without a license when he has or carries on or about his person, outside of his home, motor vehicle, or place of business, any pistol or revolver without having on his person a valid license issued by the judge of the probate court of the county in which he resides, provided that no permit shall be required for persons with a valid hunting or fishing license on their person or for persons not required by law to have hunting licenses who are engaged in legal hunting, fishing, or sport shooting when the persons have the permission of the owner of the land on which the activities are being conducted; provided, further, that the pistol or revolver, whenever loaded, shall be carried only in an open and fully exposed manner. It would seem that unless you are on "the land on which the activities are being conducted", having a hunting or fishing license would not suffice. I might be wrong, but that seems to be the key. I took the part you highlighted to mean permission to go hunting, not packing while hunting.   But you are right that it might mean the latter.

I took it as permission to go hunting as well, but it seems to indicate that you must be on that land, for hunting, with the landowner's permission, before you go packing without a license.

Come to think of it, when you are on your own property, you can carry in a holster whether you have a license or not, so I would imagine that if you have friends over, you could allow them to carry while on your land as well.  That may not be so, but it seems to be the what the law says.

You can carry openly in any non-prohibited area without a license anyway.

Nevermind

Quoted: You can carry openly in any non-prohibited area without a license anyway.

O.C.G.A. § 16-11-128
Carrying pistol without license


  (a) A person commits the offense of carrying a pistol without a license when he has or carries on or about his person, outside of his home, motor vehicle, or place of business, any pistol or revolver without having on his person a valid license issued by the judge of the probate court of the county in which he resides, provided that no permit shall be required for persons with a valid hunting or fishing license on their person or for persons not required by law to have hunting licenses who are engaged in legal hunting, fishing, or sport shooting when the persons have the permission of the owner of the land on which the activities are being conducted; provided, further, that the pistol or revolver, whenever loaded, shall be carried only in an open and fully exposed manner.

(b) Upon conviction of the offense of carrying a pistol without a license, a person shall be punished as follows:

  (1) For the first offense, he shall be guilty of a misdemeanor; and

  (2) For the second offense, and for any subsequent offense, he is guilty of a felony, and, upon conviction thereof, shall be imprisoned for not less than one year nor more than five years.

(c) On and after October 1, 1996, a person licensed to carry a handgun in any state whose laws recognize and give effect within such state to a license issued pursuant to this part shall be authorized to carry a handgun in this state, but only while the licensee is not a resident of this state; provided, however, that such licenseholder shall carry the handgun in compliance with the laws of this state.

Quoted: You can carry openly in any non-prohibited area without a license anyway.

Uh, no.

Quoted: Quoted: You can carry openly in any non-prohibited area without a license anyway. Uh, no.

+1  Just let me have my video camera ready while you cruise by that cop on the street with you Glock, err I mean plastic, on your hip in plain view.

Quoted: You can carry openly in any non-prohibited area without a license anyway.

You should hang out here for a while before carrying.

It got changed sometime between the mid-90's, when I first got active in Georgia gun rights, to several years ago.  It USED to specify only when carrying for duty purposes, but that language was dropped.

My bad......got confused on that one.....was thinking something different.

Doesn't apply to me anyway.....so no worries.

Quoted: Quoted: I heard the same was true of personel that were honerably discharged.  Is that true? That would be news to me.  If that exemption existed, I would be all over that.  It does not seem to apply to honorably discharged military veterans but does seem to apply to retired law enforcement officers.

I was specifically told no 6 yrs ago when discharged.  I'm sure many of us were in, shall we say a "transient" state while active, meaning my home of record was X, but I had a driver's license from Y by nature of duty station.  Same reason we were property tax exempt, etc.
I was told once I was discharged and entered into the free world, had to actually pay taxes, etc. my home of record became where I hung my hat and I was subject to all applicable laws as a civilian.

Quoted: O.C.G.A. § 16-11-127.1   (2) "Weapon" means and includes any pistol, revolver, or any weapon designed or intended to propel a missile of any kind, or any dirk, bowie knife, switchblade knife, ballistic knife, any other knife having a blade of two or more inches . . .

SGTCap, that is the school law, so it does not have any application outside of a School Safety Zone.

So I guess kids can have razor knives?

Quoted: And to fulfill O.C.G.A. § 16-11-128, just go to the DNR website and purchase a hunting license and keep it in your wallet and open carry.  Just make sure you can substantiate that you are going hunting....wouldn't try and do it outside of established hunting season dates :)

Or a Fishing License

Quoted: Quoted: And to fulfill O.C.G.A. § 16-11-128, just go to the DNR website and purchase a hunting license and keep it in your wallet and open carry.  Just make sure you can substantiate that you are going hunting....wouldn't try and do it outside of established hunting season dates :) Or a Fishing License

Still a big no.

was this a GCIC admin msg?  are you fucking kidding me?

fuck, hate to admit this in public, all the fucking cop bashers will rain on my parade, Im a local pd dick (that's old school slang for DETECTIVE for you pepsi generation cop bashers)  and and a 21 year AIRBORNE RANGER wounded combat veteran army reservist.  Ive been telling all my military buddies, (only have a few cop friends, and they're all previous military) about this exemption for years.  your da/sg will lose the case if you charge JOE (old school slang for a service member i.e. G.I. Joe)  with violating 16-11-126, A slick JAG lawyer from Ft. Mac/GANG JAG would come into court and make your assifer look stupid on the stand.  

if your officers knew 16-11-126, etc., you could get a lot of shitheads off the street.  it's in the details, stupid!  working near SWATS, we put it to a lot of good use.

as a citizen first, Soldier second, and cop third, fuck your jurisdiction for even trying to fuck over Joe!  the O.C.G.A. is clear, got a military ID that is good, i.e. not expired, its the same as a CCW, he/she is a NON-Felon citizen who's trained to carry a gun.  

how about I ship you some fucking robbery, burglary, meth/crack head geek monsters from my jurisdiction to hook up instead.  what a waste of fucking time.  I rue the day I leave CID.   Friends ask me why I carry a Ga. carry permit with my LE creds.   In case I run into Barney in your jurisdiction.  

I'll give you another dirty little military entitlement secret, stop GANG/USAR Joe for speeding on his way to Battle Assembly and guess what?  Ga. law exempts him from the charge when to and from Drill/Battle Assembly.  

If I was a road dog supervisor in your jurisdiction and caught one of ya'll at the waffle house without his nose in a code buck (look at the listed fines rookie) while waiting for his fat pills, it'd be real ruff come evaluation time.  

Who does ya'll legal updates?  Let me drop off some GAPOST basic mandate PORT manuals for ya'll to keep in roll call.  the subject in question has been clarified in there.  

that flag waving in front of your PD is there thanks to a US service member.  

FYI - I am not endorsing all military that read this to start packing...

arent you glad your taking an ass chewing from a cop rather than a cop basher, non veteran hippie/yuppie democrat loser?  

Umm...ok , I guess that was for me (I guess....kinda confusing though)......I don't see how I was bashing military by telling them they could/can carry. No, not GCIC admin msg, inter-departmental. I'm still not clear if your talking about my original post or something or someone else's????

Ok....I might see what your getting at. The service member was stopped for another (real) offense and was discovered to be carrying a concealed weapon...not by Zone officers, but by "dicks" following up on a separate matter.....the entire investigation was not divulged to everyone on the internet for obvious reasons. A large military installation is on our jurisdiction and we have many officers that are military....one is an active AF OSI inv.....the last thing we have time to do is harass "joe". We already have the crack head, armed robbery, dope boy calls holding.....

My family is Mil....and my brother is an Airborne Linguist sitting out in Nebraska somewhere.