With a lot of talk of people going to the SIG556R these days (the SIG556 is sometimes touted as an upgraded AK), I'm curious.  I'm not ready to abandon my AKs yet, but I do sometimes wonder if it is worth investing well over $1000 for an AK when a SIG556 is not much more expensive, if not cheaper.  

Anyway, what I'm curious about is
(i) reliability
(ii) weight/handling.

I know the SIG556 had some issues 1 or 2 years ago, but have the bugs been worked out?  I would be more interested in the 5.56 version than the 7.62.  (Actually, I wish they made a 5.45, but they don't ).

I don't want this to devolve into a flame war anything like that, I just want straight facts.  How much does the SIG556R weigh, and is there a reason to prefer it over the AK?

I wonder why people spend 1K on an AK. My M10 out the door for under $550 has been rockin. Now I am working with a $4 can of high temp paint to make her look better. As for the sig I'm sure its a fine gun but the AK has a track record no rifle in the world can touch.

The SIG556R is front heavy. Around 7lbs without a mag, but all the weight is in the front. Barrel is nitrided. Receiver is aluminium with steel inserts so the steel magazines don't chew the lower receiver to pieces. Bugs seemed to have been worked out, but it's still a little hit or miss depending on model, and lacks a track record of reliability.

I don't know how it would perform if run very hard or in adverse conditions. Sig customer service sucks, so remember you're marrying the in-laws too when you buy one. Make sure you buy the newer version with the Swiss stock rather than the US Sig designed abomination. Also, it doesn't come with good iron sights and are given a less than stellar red dot suitable only for .22's, so you have to consider the cost of new sights as well.

I've shot 1.5-3MOA at 100 yards consistently with steel cased in 5 shot groups. If I benched it, it might get close to 1MOA, but I don't have the testing under my belt to prove it. Did not have a jam in the one I had the chance of shooting, but the owner said it was a little picky before it "broke in", whatever that means.

Would I take it over a good AK? No.

The drake summed it up nicely.  It's the answer to a question no one asked.  IMHO the SCAR is a better AK variant than the 556R .

This was my first impression when I felt the gun. Hated the feel of it. My interest in this weapon ended right there.

Been an AK owner/collector for more than 20 years...

I prefer the SIG.

SIG's customer service is second to none. You have a problem, they email you a FEDEX shipping label.

The SIG 55X series performs excellent in adverse weather conditions. The 55X series have been fielded  for more than two decades.

Sure, I have my gripes with SIG, but I don't expect to see $500.00+Swiss made sights on a $1000.00 rifle either. There are options out there, and will be more options coming in the near future as far as sights go.

SIG may have hit a few bumps in the road with their earlier 556 models, but SIG listened, and got 'em right.

Hell, I've sent ARSENAL AK's back for warranty work, and I had to pay the shipping!

That was also my first impression when handling it. A steel barrel in the front, and aluminium and plastic in the back does not make a balanced rifle. If you portioned the rifle equally into thirds, the balance point was in the 1/3 point closest to the barrel. Bringing it up from the resting position didn't feel natural, causing me to compensate for the momentum. Holding it shouldered for extended periods would probably become cumbersome for those that are recreational shooters.

Only time will tell how the 556R performs long term. At this point, I am not convinced. Too much history of issues to just ignore and accept on faith. AKs may have canted sights and loose gas blocks but good golly they run 100% of the time. Military grade and field tested parts for the AK vs. Sig 556R rifle made for civilian semi-auto crowd. It's not even in the same category.

Agreed.
The Sig rifles we have here are not in the same league as the military issue rifles. We can't use their track record of excellence for the rifles built here in the US.

I want to like the SIG and they are supposed to have worked out the issues from their originally run... But I keep hearing of issues.

Sure, some have had issues...I can say the same about the various AK's and manufactures as well. Though I wouldn't necessarily suggest that there is a long history of issues with the SIG. Some early models had canted rails, and there was an issue with the trunnion not being to spec where the bolt carrier got slightly peened. In reference to the 556R, SIG has since corrected the issues, and it too is a fine rifle.

Tell me, what is the difference between what you say is the Military grade SIG 55X and the civilian model that are not in the same category? The only thing I can think of, the semi doesn't have the 3rd position.

Having an ambi and easily manipulated selector lever, longer sight radius, better sights, a BHO, a rail to mount optics, a side folding stock, ETC, are all things that make the AK come up short. IF these features are important to you.

The barrels are nitride treated, the receiver like the Swiss model, is welded not only to the inner steel rails, but to the trunnion as well, the newest Swiss models also incorporate an alloy lower, (The US models have a forged 7075 lower) the gas system is the same, as is the majority of parts. There are some parts that are unique to the 556R.

I'm not going to suggest that every rifle that SIG produces is going to be perfect, but the same can be said about all manufactures.

There's other 7.62X39 models coming from SIG as well.

I still like AK's, but I'd opt for the SIG if it came down to only one.

Had a Sig556.  Ran fine but the fit and finish was horrible.   Furniture was cheap.   To cheap for a $1000 rifle.  Oh but you can pay even more money and get a decent stock that probably should have come on it to begin with.  Really?  
To heavy for what it does especially in 556.   More complicated to clean especially compared to an AK.   I don't like the aluminum/metal mix at all in their pistols or rifles.  Sold mine and got a converted Saiga and I am much happier.

I wish I knew what all the differences are between a Swiss made Sig 55x and the Exeter 556R. I think we can agree that swiss manufacturing process is a lot better than anything Exeter can put out. The Swiss also cater to a different type of operator - military vs. Sig Exeter civilian. Do you really think the Swiss army would field Exeter made Sigs?. It's designed to cater to the AK semi-auto crowd and Sig used them for field testing. Not exactly a receipe for quality. It's a well established fact that the earlier generations of 556Rs had some serious issues - cant handle steel cased ammo, soft aluminum receiver vs steel AK mags to cite specifics. I even read about Sig voiding warranty if you use steel cased ammo. This is after they said they have this cool new Sig 556R chambered to fire cheap 7.62x39 ammo and it's gonna be awesome. We all know what happened. They realized after actual field testers (those unfortunate enough to buy the early gens) that the 556R had issues. Really?

So they came out with a next generation a few months ago. How did they test this? Any documented test on how the reliability of the rifle fared after 1000 rounds? 5000 rounds, 30k rounds? Any submersion and sand tests? How are those screwed on rails holding up? Even Gabe S. recommends removing those screws and putting red Loctite on them because they tend to get loose with use.

Note that I am specific to the 556R. I have Sig guns too and this is not a bashing of Sig as a company. I think they have other good products. I'm just not convinced the 556R is one of them - at least not at this time and certainly not for the platform it intended to improve.

+1. I don't like Sigs in general, but the 556R remains an untested rifle. Too many unknowns for me to comfortably commit to purchase one.

That MAC video on the 556R was enough to scare me away from the platform.
Did you guys see that one?

I did. I was expecting a lot more from the Sig in that video. Very disappointed. Granted, that was the first gen. Supposedly the bugs are fixed, but I'm still not sold after handling and shooting one.

Let's ask Gabe Suarez what he thinks on warrior talk!!!

In all seriousness, I have no idea how the Sig is... My converted Saiga works great though...

Has Military Arms Channel done a review on this Sig?

I think the american sig rifles are good rifles, they have been tested, police forces have adopted the 556 model in fully automatic and have been pleased with its performance for 10 years.. Personally for the price I think the scar has been a huge dissapointment for me because I have wanted one for a long time but its just got too many problems and cheap construction for me to put the money down yet.

Yes. The rifle was basically a heap of crap(was the 556R that he tested).
He used to have 2 videos, but I can only find the second one.
http://youtu.be/nrObcZb_CCI

I love the original Sig 55X series rifles, but am not impressed with the new 556 rifles. I would probably go with an Arsenal AK over the new Sig rifles. I recently picked up an Arsenal 106UR Krinkov and SBR'ed it. It's a very light and handy rifle and has been reliable and accurate. I'm really loving the little Krinkov I checked out the new Sig 551-A1 SBR which looks a lot like the 552 which I liked, but the quality is no where near the original. It also feels a lot heavier which was a major turn off.

by all accounts i've heard the sig is a giant piece of overpriced shit

I fingered one and this was my impression.  I am sure the real ones are nice but I was not impressed.

Not the same rifle... QC is night and day between the 2.

Thats what turned me off.

That rifle (and many others from reviews I've seen) should never have left their factory. There is no excuse for that crap, even in a Gen1 platform. I'll keep my 7.62x39 rifles as the tried and true AKs.

If I need something more modular, I'll grab an AR.

How do you know this? Have you held one? My friend thats a cop let me shoot his fully 556 as well as a bushmaster and it seemed the same as the semi auto 556 at shooters to me but maybe alittle better fit and finish I guess.

Yes I have... Next question.

Just because rifles share features does not put it in the same family.  the 556R is a 556R, the AK is well an AK.  I prefer an AK.  I had the first version of the 556R and I hated it, I have 11 AK's

your last statement is an opinion because EACH part can be agrued back and fourth (as it has for the 1000 times in the past) as to why one is superior or inferior. "ALL THINGS THAT MAKE AK COME UP SHORT"???
OK....


The only feature that the Sig has is the last roung BHO. and thats a preference as well.

I got the newer model of the sig 556. Its ok. I like it, but it sits in the closet 99% of the time

That's simply not true. An ambi safety, longer sight radius and rail are ALL objectively better things. Folding stock I'll give you, but the others are options that are better in every way then the alternative (ie: right side only safety, short sight radius and no rail).

There are AKs and AK variants with long sight radius and ambidextrous safety....

yes it is. Just like HWI posted above, there are different AK type variants that have longer sight separation then a traditional 16 inch barrel Kalashnikov which has 15 inch sight separation. How about my 2 RPK-74? Their sight separation is almost 23 inches compared to the 18 inch sight separation on the Sig.
How about my Krebs Vepr 16' carbine Match right with Krebs Custom sight of 21 inch sight separation?

but that ambi safety is the deal breaker i guess....how the hell did i operate my Kalashnikovs for years withot this feature...i do not know.

There are also a few AK variants with a ready rail which is a part of the dustcover.

So, basically, if you upgrade the hell out of your higher-end AK, you can get something that works almost as well as a new-gen 556R for more money? Not exactly the most compelling argument I've ever read.

I love my five AKs as much as the next man, but I'm not blind as to their faults. For a platform developed in 1947, it's holding up well, but not perfectly.

How do you know that? Has it been through some serious field testing?

I guess I'll throw in my 2 cents.  I have owned and sold the original Sig 556 and 556 Classic. I also own several Arsenal's from both Bulgaria and Izhmash so I have a good understanding of the pros and cons.

1. The Sig 550, 551, and 552 are tested and issued to what I would consider a "militia". I have no doubts about Swiss quality from the Schmidt-Rubin 1911, K31, PE57, and Sig 55X rifles.  However, the "combat record" of the above rifles have never been proven even though they are quality rifles. I am currently wearing a Tag Heuer Carrera watch, I happen to like all things Swiss.

2. The AK is an assault rifle and I find the sight radius is sufficient for what it is designed for. In my opinion, a long sight radius are best applied to guys that like to fire at long distance targets,  i.e. target shooting.

3. The percieved lack of ergos on an AK can be overcome by training and getting used to the design. Like the M14's we all love and admire, ergos are simliar and I never had a problem with my MK21 SSR.

4. The Sig 556R is front heavy and a reliable range toy, all the bells and whistles do not compensate for the bad reports from previous years.

5. This hobby is not cheap, if you spend $$$ on a TWS rail or a RS Regulate 30mm mount, Krebs lever, Solar Tactical Mfer, etc. you will have a rifle suited to your needs. The heart and soul of your rifle remains true to the famous Kalashnikov design that has been proven over numerous battles and decades.

Has half the shit you'd need to hang off your AK to make it feature-equivalent to a 556R been through some serious field-testing? I'm thinking not.

I don't hang shit off my AK except maybe a red dot and a 2-point sling. I have an AR too and it only has a red dot and a MS3 sling. The more shit, the more weight and the less other shit I can carry, like ammo and mags. Does having shit doodads on rifles make for a better shooter? I see it as more shit that can go wrong. I keep mine as simple and clutter free as I could without compromising effectiveness. At some point, all that shit that hangs off your rifle just becomes more of a liability.

Curious though, what other shit do you see hanging off your 556R?

The 556R is a $1000+ rifle that doesn't even come with decent iron sights. Instead it comes with a garbage red dot. Please tell me why I have to pay extra for iron sights on a rifle costing over 1k.