Primary Arms 4X Compact Scope-Thumbs Up!

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Posted: 9/29/2009 3:00:58 PM EDT

Check the pics on Page three

After looking at these for a week I placed an order for one last Friday nite. It arrived Monday afternoon! Talk about fast shipping!

I have not shot with it yet so everything is based on my observations and initial impressions after mounting it.

The scope is very well made and seems solid, very solild. This is NOT a cheap POS Aifsoft copy! The glass is very bright and clear. It does not have that bluish tint that you usually get with optics in this price range. The reticle is very similar to an ACOG TAO1NSN and the field of view is huge. The reticle is very fine but I like it that way. The reticle is also illuminated and works great in VERY bright light. It has 11 settings and works very well in low light and does not bloom or create shadows inside the tube. I live at 7,000ft of elevation in Colorado and we get our share of bright sun and the red illumination was visible under all of the conditions I tested in today. I even looked as close to the sun as I dare with it and the red illumination was still bright red and never washed out. When the reticle is not lit it can be hard to pic up against a busy background like trees and bushes but when turned on the bright red reticle stands out like a champ! This reticle should really do well on a range against some steel or paper targets. I have no idea how long the battery will last and I honestly do not care. I will buy some spares and keep them with the rifle. The reticle is not ideal for close in ranges but it would work in a pinch if you had it turned on.

The three rails on the scope at 9-12-3 o'clock are removable. I could see maybe adding a mini red dot to it at some point for close in work. The rails on the side I would just remove.

Its not an ACOG and I don't think it claims to be. Optics in that category have their use and users and they work very well. The Primary Arms 4X compact scope fills a role and does it very well. The price of this optic is so good that you almost have to buy one just to try it out!

I hope to try it out this weekend.

Posted: 9/29/2009 4:19:40 PM EDT

[#1]

How is the quality of the mount? Are the crossbolts even with one another?

Posted: 9/29/2009 4:43:30 PM EDT

[#2]

Forgot the mount. It is also a similar to an ACOG mount. The crossbolts are slightly offset. The rear one sits slightly lower and will sit in one of your rail slots. The front crossbolt sits almost flush with the bottom of the mount. The bolts also have a split washer/spring thingy on them (think delta ring) to help keep them tight. They feel very solid and have no wiggle. I mounted it had tight and then gave them a 1/4 turn with a box wrench. It aint going anywhere.

It is not able to be mounted into a carry handle on an AR.

Posted: 9/29/2009 6:49:47 PM EDT

[#3]

I just finished running an Appleseed with one of these, and it performed perfectly. I'll post a full report in the classified thread shortly. But the basic gist is I got my Rifleman patch, and the scope proved perfect for quick target acquisition and precision work.

Posted: 9/29/2009 8:02:21 PM EDT

[#4]

Wow, looks good at least... and for 100 Might have to do it

Posted: 9/29/2009 10:31:00 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
Forgot the mount. It is also a similar to an ACOG mount. The crossbolts are slightly offset. The rear one sits slightly lower and will sit in one of your rail slots. The front crossbolt sits almost flush with the bottom of the mount. The bolts also have a split washer/spring thingy on them (think delta ring) to help keep them tight. They feel very solid and have no wiggle. I mounted it had tight and then gave them a 1/4 turn with a box wrench. It aint going anywhere.

It is not able to be mounted into a carry handle on an AR.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that's intentional to make them compatible with weaver rails in addition to picatinny rails.

Posted: 9/30/2009 5:39:21 AM EDT

[#6]

I believe so also. The ACOGS I have handled seem to have the same design of offset cross bolts if I remember correctly.

Posted: 9/30/2009 1:12:14 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
After looking at these for a week I placed an order for one last Friday nite. It arrived Monday afternoon! Talk about fast shipping!

I have not shot with it yet so everything is based on my observations and initial impressions after mounting it.

The scope is very well made and seems solid, very solild. This is NOT cheap POS Aifsoft copy! The glass is very bright and clear. It does not have that bluish tint that you usually get with optics in this price range. The reticle is very similar to an ACOG TAO1NSN and the field of view is huge. The reticle is very fine but I like it that way. The reticle is also illuminated and works great in VERY bright light. It has 11 settings and works very well in low light and does not bloom or create shadows inside the tube. I live at 7,000ft of elevation in Colorado and we get our share of bright sun and the red illumination was visible under all of the conditions I tested in today. I even looked as close to the sun as I dare with it and the red illumination was still bright red and never washed out. When the reticle is not lit it can be hard to pic up against a busy background like trees and bushes but when turned on the bright red reticle stands out like a champ! This reticle should really do well on a range against some steel or paper targets. I have no idea how long the battery will last and I honestly do not care. I will buy some spares and keep them with the rifle. The reticle is not ideal for close in ranges but it would work in a pinch if you had it turned on.

The three rails on the scope at 9-12-3 o'clock are removable. I could see maybe adding a mini red dot to it at some point for close in work. The rails on the side I would just remove.

Its not an ACOG and I don't think it claims to be. Optics in that category have their use and users and they work very well. The Primary Arms 4X compact scope fills a role and does it very well. The price of this optic is so good that you almost have to buy one just to try it out!

I hope to try it out this weekend.

What model # is this ?

God bless
Wyr

Posted: 9/30/2009 1:37:21 PM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:

Quoted:
After looking at these for a week I placed an order for one last Friday nite. It arrived Monday afternoon! Talk about fast shipping!

I have not shot with it yet so everything is based on my observations and initial impressions after mounting it.

The scope is very well made and seems solid, very solild. This is NOT cheap POS Aifsoft copy! The glass is very bright and clear. It does not have that bluish tint that you usually get with optics in this price range. The reticle is very similar to an ACOG TAO1NSN and the field of view is huge. The reticle is very fine but I like it that way. The reticle is also illuminated and works great in VERY bright light. It has 11 settings and works very well in low light and does not bloom or create shadows inside the tube. I live at 7,000ft of elevation in Colorado and we get our share of bright sun and the red illumination was visible under all of the conditions I tested in today. I even looked as close to the sun as I dare with it and the red illumination was still bright red and never washed out. When the reticle is not lit it can be hard to pic up against a busy background like trees and bushes but when turned on the bright red reticle stands out like a champ! This reticle should really do well on a range against some steel or paper targets. I have no idea how long the battery will last and I honestly do not care. I will buy some spares and keep them with the rifle. The reticle is not ideal for close in ranges but it would work in a pinch if you had it turned on.

The three rails on the scope at 9-12-3 o'clock are removable. I could see maybe adding a mini red dot to it at some point for close in work. The rails on the side I would just remove.

Its not an ACOG and I don't think it claims to be. Optics in that category have their use and users and they work very well. The Primary Arms 4X compact scope fills a role and does it very well. The price of this optic is so good that you almost have to buy one just to try it out!

I hope to try it out this weekend.

What model # is this ?

God bless
Wyr

Model # PA F4X

Posted: 10/1/2009 7:11:37 AM EDT

[#9]

I think I have to find a Doctor Optic micro relex type site to add to this scope. The rail on the top of the scope is begging for something like this. I just need Primary Arms to make one now. I am not adding a $300 Dr. Optic to a $100 scope.

One of the less expensive models from Victor might work perfectly or from time to time the Tasco models show up on the EE here and there.

Posted: 10/1/2009 8:24:07 AM EDT

[#10]

I just ordered one myself.
My son will be going deer hunting for the first time this year, and the 4x will be going on his AR.
Hope it works out.

Posted: 10/1/2009 2:00:28 PM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Forgot the mount. It is also a similar to an ACOG mount. The crossbolts are slightly offset. The rear one sits slightly lower and will sit in one of your rail slots. The front crossbolt sits almost flush with the bottom of the mount. The bolts also have a split washer/spring thingy on them (think delta ring) to help keep them tight. They feel very solid and have no wiggle. I mounted it had tight and then gave them a 1/4 turn with a box wrench. It aint going anywhere.

It is not able to be mounted into a carry handle on an AR.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that's intentional to make them compatible with weaver rails in addition to picatinny rails.

Correct.

Posted: 10/1/2009 4:00:35 PM EDT

[#12]

Looks like a real nice optic! Does anyone know of a similar size / price scope with a mildot or bdc? Lost track of the hours I've spent chasing around the web looking.

Posted: 10/1/2009 5:18:55 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
Looks like a real nice optic! Does anyone know of a similar size / price scope with a mildot or bdc? Lost track of the hours I've spent chasing around the web looking.

Maybe the mythical Burris 3X32 AR tactical site. It is more $ but it has what you are looking for. I was interested in buying one but they are vaporware until recently. I found this and could not be happier.

Posted: 10/1/2009 5:28:49 PM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
Looks like a real nice optic! Does anyone know of a similar size / price scope with a mildot or bdc? Lost track of the hours I've spent chasing around the web looking.

The PA is a BDC calibrated for 62gr 5.56.

Posted: 10/1/2009 5:30:42 PM EDT

[#15]

Questions for Primary Arms:

1. What barrel length / bullet weight is this calibrated for?

2. Water resistance / fog proof tested?

Scope looks REALLY promising, please someone do a torture test on this and report back...

Posted: 10/1/2009 9:36:09 PM EDT

[#16]

Well , went and ordered one tonight.Also looked at the Burris and might have to buy another AR carbine just to try that one too!
Going to try it on an FAL so I'll give it a torture test without trying hard. Thanks guys , I didn't see the reticle pics the first time through.

Posted: 10/1/2009 9:49:01 PM EDT

[#17]

Awesome job on the reticle pics, Fuzz! Marsh, if you'd make this thing with an ACOG bottom-end so I could stick it in an LT-100 and run it with irons, I'd be all over it!

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Posted: 10/2/2009 3:03:48 AM EDT

[#18]

I also placed an order for this scope Thursday. I e-mailed PA they had them in stock. I had a AR 332 on order with SWFA as of Jan. cancelled that.

Posted: 10/2/2009 3:42:58 AM EDT

[#19]

So this is another "Sure it won't stand up to serious use like the real scope that it looks like, but it's better than the airsoft scopes even though it sure looks like an airsoft scope" from China? Big demand for chinese stuff that looks like the real thing but is only good for looking like you bought an expensive scope when fooling around at the range.

Posted: 10/2/2009 6:03:43 AM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
So this is another "Sure it won't stand up to serious use like the real scope that it looks like, but it's better than the airsoft scopes even though it sure looks like an airsoft scope" from China? Big demand for chinese stuff that looks like the real thing but is only good for looking like you bought an expensive scope when fooling around at the range.

1: I don’t see anyone post that it didn’t stand up to serious use. It might not stand up to a war zone but if you consider serious use a 1,000 round weekend it will do just fine.

2: I have addressed your looks like an Airsoft comment before and referenced posts with photos pointing out the internal difference. You seem to ignore the posts from users that say I had one of the other products in this price range and there is a noticeable different in the PA products. No one is saying they are as good as the premium brands but in another thread about this product someone posted the glass is clearer without the yellow tint you usually see in the lower process optics. That is because these have better coating on the lens. If I were selling these for $300, like some companies are trying to do, and saying they are as good as an Agoc that would be different. It is a serviceable optic for that will fill the needs and wants for a lot of people and I stand behind them.

3: I doubt that many people are buying them because they want people to think it is a Acog. They are buying them because they want to experience a compact fixed power scope with a wide field of view and a decent reticle.

I have offered to send you one of my 1-4X to try out since you have a bad experience with an imported 1-4X. Because of that you seem concluded all 1-4X scopes scope imported from China are crap. The offer still stands.

Posted: 10/2/2009 6:24:02 AM EDT

[#21]

Serious use being a euphemism for defending one's self or family, training to do the same, surviving harsh climates and hard knocks.

If someone wants a scope to go shoot for fun I just don't see the appeal of one of these v. some of the traditional scopes from major manufacturers with good reputations that you can get for maybe $ 200. I am guessing that it looks like an acog/aimpoint is part of the appeal but I don't understand why that is of interest to anyone.

Not that it matters what I think. I met a guy who had one of those flare launchers that looks like a grenade launcher attached to his bushmaster. I could not for the life of me understand why that would be fun. It didn't, to my mind, DO anything fun and the fact that it looked like a real grenade launcher seemed to me to be more likely to make you a source of derision than admiration.

The guy pulled out some flares, popped a few off, started a small brush fire that had to be distinguished and looked as happy as a cat with a saucer of milk the whole time. I guess whatever floats your boat.

As far as testing stuff. I told the saga of the Mueller 1-4 "tactical" scope that I got suckered into testing. I spent more time going back and forth to the post office than I did "testing." Besides how much does one guy's test prove? Not that I don't think these are fun threads to read, but I could buy an Oly and take it to Blackwater with no problems. Unfortunately none of us really have the time and money to do testing of large representative samples of guns or optics. I suppose after there are X number of any item on the market for a year or two there is some degree of reasonable feedback.

It is very polite of you to offer though, thanks. I still have the last lower end scope that I bought to test sitting on my window sill

Oh as far as the Made in China stuff. I have gone through many made in china scopes with a bad result every time. After awhile it's kind of like telling me that THIS stripper is the nice one with the heart of gold who is only working her way through medical school.

Obviously China has flooded the US with tons of stuff and obviously they can make some stuff. I bought a Spyderco Tenancious knife wanting to hate it. But although it wasn't the greatest knife around-it dulled a bit quicker than better steels and tended to pick up surface rust-it was easy to sharpen, well designed (not that the chinese had anything to do with that) and for $ 35 is probably more than enough knife for 99% of people.

Posted: 10/2/2009 6:40:27 AM EDT

[#22]

I got one of these from the very first batch. I like it, it works, and it's all I need. I go to the range to shoot paper and clay/ steel and fool around with my buds. The optics I have recieved from Marshall have all been top-notch ( 3 as of now). No, they aren't high-dollar and name brand, but I persoannly don't need something like that. I need something that will work when I need it to, and someone to stand behind it if it don't. Marshall does that. I have NEVER seen faster shipping or better customer service from ANYONE, bar - none.

I understand your point Aimless, but there are those of us that are internet commandos and don't need the high dollar stuff. We just need something that works right at a good price. Primary Arms stuff fits that bill. I have put about 100 rds of 5.556 through my AR with the 4X so far and ut still holds zero. Time will tell if it will forever, but I have confidence from the other purchases I've made.

Posted: 10/2/2009 6:54:23 AM EDT

[#23]

I have no problem with that at all

If you are realistic about what you are going to use it for and are having fun then that's great!

There are cowboy shooters at one range I belong to. Not my thing but they sure look like they are having the time of their life.

Posted: 10/2/2009 6:56:35 AM EDT

[#24]

Ok, ok, if you absolutely need someone to test one out for you I could send you my APO/AE and I will accept a "sample" of your product to put a couple hundred or thousand rounds through at the next range.

Quoted:

Quoted:
So this is another "Sure it won't stand up to serious use like the real scope that it looks like, but it's better than the airsoft scopes even though it sure looks like an airsoft scope" from China? Big demand for chinese stuff that looks like the real thing but is only good for looking like you bought an expensive scope when fooling around at the range.

1: I don’t see anyone post that it didn’t stand up to serious use. It might not stand up to a war zone but if you consider serious use a 1,000 round weekend it will do just fine.

2: I have addressed your looks like an Airsoft comment before and referenced posts with photos pointing out the internal difference. You seem to ignore the posts from users that say I had one of the other products in this price range and there is a noticeable different in the PA products. No one is saying they are as good as the premium brands but in another thread about this product someone posted the glass is clearer without the yellow tint you usually see in the lower process optics. That is because these have better coating on the lens. If I were selling these for $300, like some companies are trying to do, and saying they are as good as an Agoc that would be different. It is a serviceable optic for that will fill the needs and wants for a lot of people and I stand behind them.

3: I doubt that many people are buying them because they want people to think it is a Acog. They are buying them because they want to experience a compact fixed power scope with a wide field of view and a decent reticle.

I have offered to send you one of my 1-4X to try out since you have a bad experience with an imported 1-4X. Because of that you seem concluded all 1-4X scopes scope imported from China are crap. The offer still stands.

Posted: 10/2/2009 7:09:28 AM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:

There are cowboy shooters at one range I belong to. Not my thing but they sure look like they are having the time of their life.

I've seen some of that myself, and yea, it looks like a hoot!

Some of those guys are pretty damn good, too.

Posted: 10/2/2009 7:40:13 AM EDT

[#26]

Aimless, what are the $200 alternatives you refer to? Having just seen this, I wouldn't mind one for my range toy(s).

Posted: 10/2/2009 8:05:21 AM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Aimless, what are the $200 alternatives you refer to? Having just seen this, I wouldn't mind one for my range toy(s).

I'm not Aimless, but take a look at the Burris 4x20 Timberline.

You can find it for ~ $145.00 to $160.00

It has a standard, unlit, reticule.

As has been said, if you like look alikes fine, go fot it, because at the end of the day it is your money.

Posted: 10/2/2009 8:14:10 AM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:

Aimless, what are the $200 alternatives you refer to? Having just seen this, I wouldn't mind one for my range toy(s).

http://www.samplelist.com/default.aspx?display_num=10&mfg_selection=13&prod_type=-1&hide_sold=false

simmons 1.5-5 with lit reticle. Probably made in the phillipines? There were some diamond reticle 1-4 shotgun scopes that were popular as cheap three gun scopes about 4-5 years ago. I think it was the Simmons. I have one with the unlit reticle somewhere.

If you just want a scope for plinking the Bushnell elite 3200 10x is a good value

http://swfa.com/Bushnell-10x40-Elite-3200-Rifle-Scope-P242.aspx

I think you can find them for a little less if you look around, but I like SWFA

$ 250 for a used Aimpoint 9000

http://www.samplelist.com/default.aspx?display_num=10&mfg_selection=19&prod_type=-1&hide_sold=false

The Bushnell version of the eotec used to be a good deal, but that seems to be around $ 300 now. I have an old one I bought used here that I have on a shotgun. Has held up fine even if it lacks the eotec cage and supposedly is not as water proof.

spot seems to hold up well from what I have seen here, no personal experience

http://www.mountsplus.com/miva/merchant.mvc?page=MSP/PROD/all/SPO-MK3-NR3

Posted: 10/2/2009 8:32:23 AM EDT

[#29]

There's your answer to why anyone would want one. None of those fit the compact magnified optic category. Some people are looking for a low mag (3-4x) optic (not reflex or red dot) that they can mount on the limited real estate available on the AR or in my case, an FAL. I already have a Mk4 and a couple of Nikons and all of them are too long to mount w/o a cantilever mount. In my experience the cheap mounts don't hold up (PEPR in my case, ended up selling 2 and have issues with the one I've kept) and I can't justify $200 for a GG&G or Larue for the toy guns. I've been looking for something sort of like this that isn't so much of a tube to look through but still allows for magnification and easy mounting.

Posted: 10/2/2009 9:21:56 AM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
There's your answer to why anyone would want one. None of those fit the compact magnified optic category. Some people are looking for a low mag (3-4x) optic (not reflex or red dot) that they can mount on the limited real estate available on the AR or in my case, an FAL. I already have a Mk4 and a couple of Nikons and all of them are too long to mount w/o a cantilever mount. In my experience the cheap mounts don't hold up (PEPR in my case, ended up selling 2 and have issues with the one I've kept) and I can't justify $200 for a GG&G or Larue for the toy guns. I've been looking for something sort of like this that isn't so much of a tube to look through but still allows for magnification and easy mounting.

The closest thing from a "major" manufacturer is a fixed 3X that sell for three times the price.

As far as the other items listed.

1: The closest thing to my 1-4X from a "major manufacturer' is also made in China and sells for twice as much.

2: The Bushnell 10X is a great scope. High quality made in Japan. Will handle a 50BMG. That is why I stock them and sell them for $189.99

3: If you are going to spend $250+ for a used Aimpoint or the Bushnell holographic you might conceder the new EOTech XPS. That is their latest design and we have them for $409

3: Wouldn't the SPOT be considered a Aimpoint look-a-like? It gets good reviews but is it worth twice the price of the PA because it is made in Korea not China?

Posted: 10/2/2009 12:35:41 PM EDT

[#31]

Aside from the kinda cheesy looking accessory rails, (don't use them or else

) this is a pretty decent compact optic. My WAG is that it will suffer failures statistically not much worse than any other decent quality optic out there that costs more. It can't be called a piece of Chicom garbage until a bunch of users put some rounds through them and who knows, it may stand up to a warzone too. As a test I swapped the base out for one of them LaRue knockoff ACOG (RCO) mounts from you know

where. It doesn't seat fully but does make contact with both sides of the rail channel for a solid connection to the base. The bolt pattern is different, hence why I used a Knock Off ( I ain't driillin no holes in my Larues

) and needed to drill a rear hole to mate the parts. Nice.

Posted: 10/2/2009 12:54:46 PM EDT

[#32]

According to the Mounts Plus website:

From the user manual, page 15:

Warranty and Disclaimer:

There is no warranty, representation or condition of any kind for S.P.O.T. Products; And any warranty expressed or implied is specifically excluded and disclaimed...

Why would you buy an optic with NO warranty at all, over one that comes with a one-year (or more) warranty?

Posted: 10/2/2009 1:18:10 PM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:

According to the Mounts Plus website:

From the user manual, page 15:
Warranty and Disclaimer:
There is no warranty, representation or condition of any kind for S.P.O.T. Products; And any warranty expressed or implied is specifically excluded and disclaimed...

Why would you buy an optic with NO warranty at all, over one that comes with a one-year (or more) warranty?

Oly has a lifetime warranty. My frankenguns have no warranty.

More seriously, do you guys really pay that much attention to warranties when buying scopes? I have no idea what the warranty is on my aimpoint or leupolds. I had a Springfield Armory scope that broke. I sent it back under warranty. A few shots and it broke again. I asked if I could get a credit instead for whatever, 1911 mags, hats, a crate of Springfield Armory pens. Nope but they would keep fixing it every time it broke. So what? They weren't paying the shipping and it's really not that much fun to keep remounting and removing the same scope over and over. I threw that scope out also. (notice a theme here)

Posted: 10/2/2009 1:30:44 PM EDT

[#34]

I ordered two, as I mentioned earlier ... both have been excellent so far. One mounted on a 20" AR was used for an Appleseed event - I was the only person there who scored a Rifleman

That was just last weekend, since then I've ran another 250 or so rounds through it. The Zero hasn't budged, it's performed perfectly. I put the other one on a 16" 6.8SPC AR. I've put 120 rounds through that rifle with the scope mounted, and again it's performed perfectly on that rifle.

I could mount one up to my 300WSM bolt gun for an abuse test, but I expect it wouldn't be a problem. The scope feels very solidly built, and the reticle is excellent ... as is the illumination. Not sure what else to say? I bought 2, love them, and will likely buy more. I like the size and weight, love the quality of the glass and reticle, and it certainly feels as solid as any of my other much more expensive optics.

Posted: 10/2/2009 1:46:44 PM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:

I ordered two, as I mentioned earlier ... both have been excellent so far. One mounted on a 20" AR was used for an Appleseed event - I was the only person there who scored a Rifleman

That was just last weekend, since then I've ran another 250 or so rounds through it. The Zero hasn't budged, it's performed perfectly. I put the other one on a 16" 6.8SPC AR. I've put 120 rounds through that rifle with the scope mounted, and again it's performed perfectly on that rifle.

I could mount one up to my 300WSM bolt gun for an abuse test, but I expect it wouldn't be a problem. The scope feels very solidly built, and the reticle is excellent ... as is the illumination. Not sure what else to say? I bought 2, love them, and will likely buy more. I like the size and weight, love the quality of the glass and reticle, and it certainly feels as solid as any of my other much more expensive optics.

Oh come on, do it

Posted: 10/2/2009 1:48:00 PM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Aimless, what are the $200 alternatives you refer to? Having just seen this, I wouldn't mind one for my range toy(s).

http://www.samplelist.com/default.aspx?display_num=10&mfg_selection=13&prod_type=-1&hide_sold=false

simmons 1.5-5 with lit reticle. Probably made in the phillipines? There were some diamond reticle 1-4 shotgun scopes that were popular as cheap three gun scopes about 4-5 years ago. I think it was the Simmons. I have one with the unlit reticle somewhere.

If you just want a scope for plinking the Bushnell elite 3200 10x is a good value
http://swfa.com/Bushnell-10x40-Elite-3200-Rifle-Scope-P242.aspx

I think you can find them for a little less if you look around, but I like SWFA

$ 250 for a used Aimpoint 9000
http://www.samplelist.com/default.aspx?display_num=10&mfg_selection=19&prod_type=-1&hide_sold=false

The Bushnell version of the eotec used to be a good deal, but that seems to be around $ 300 now. I have an old one I bought used here that I have on a shotgun. Has held up fine even if it lacks the eotec cage and supposedly is not as water proof.

spot seems to hold up well from what I have seen here, no personal experience
http://www.mountsplus.com/miva/merchant.mvc?page=MSP/PROD/all/SPO-MK3-NR3

SPOT red dots, due hold up very well. i did tell my brother about this 4x32 scope that's being talked about on this thread, he 's in the market for a great range scope, after all you guys input, i think it fits the bill.

Posted: 10/2/2009 2:35:20 PM EDT

[#37]

For me the choice to buy was an easy one to make. I had read many threads about Marshall and his legendary service and the quality of his products. The next factor for me was my shooting habits. Not being LEO/MIL or even a competivie shooter I just could not justify spending the $ currently on something in the price range of an ACOG or CQT or IOR. The Millet DMS was considered but then I had to buy rings or to make it work properly a Larue mount or something similar. That all adds up to some serious $ very fast. The 4X compact was perfect for my application and more importantly my continued good relations with my wife.

I have an Eotech and a Nikon Monarch and a Leupold on my other rifles and I am glad that I own them and I appreciate the quality of each of them.

I had recently purchased another AR and after being disapointed with my eyes and iron sites I wanted/needed something with some magnification but buying an ACOG or something similar just wasn't justifiable to me. Other guys might have made a different choice and thats cool.

Bottom line is I think this optic is going to work well for me and as it happened it appears to be better than expected!

Be safe and have fun.

Posted: 10/3/2009 12:08:57 AM EDT

[#38]

oops

Posted: 10/3/2009 8:45:55 PM EDT

[#39]

Anyone address the water resistance of the scope?

Really want to find out if the scope will handle the elements and weather/temp. extremes...

Posted: 10/3/2009 8:59:12 PM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:
Anyone address the water resistance of the scope?

Really want to find out if the scope will handle the elements and weather/temp. extremes...

It is waterproof tested at 2 meters.

They are nitrogen purged to be fog resistant.

Temp. extreme? I have done high heat testing on the red dots that get mounted to a AK gas tube rail but heat should not be a issue with a top rail mounted scope.

Posted: 10/4/2009 5:32:54 AM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:

Quoted:
There's your answer to why anyone would want one. None of those fit the compact magnified optic category. Some people are looking for a low mag (3-4x) optic (not reflex or red dot) that they can mount on the limited real estate available on the AR or in my case, an FAL. I already have a Mk4 and a couple of Nikons and all of them are too long to mount w/o a cantilever mount. In my experience the cheap mounts don't hold up (PEPR in my case, ended up selling 2 and have issues with the one I've kept) and I can't justify $200 for a GG&G or Larue for the toy guns. I've been looking for something sort of like this that isn't so much of a tube to look through but still allows for magnification and easy mounting.

The closest thing from a "major" manufacturer is a fixed 3X that sell for three times the price.

As far as the other items listed.

3: If you are going to spend $250+ for a used Aimpoint or the Bushnell holographic you might conceder the new EOTech XPS. That is their latest design and we have them for $409

I already have an EO and I can't stand how it chews through batteries even when "off." Does the XPS still suffer from this? I have to admit that I like the EO form as a reflex better than anything else out there and mine has taken a beating (I tried to sell it for $300 with a GG&G mount and got laughed at because it's SO ugly). Noe that they're shorted with side bottons, they're much better, but the battery issue has me waiting.

Posted: 10/4/2009 6:44:25 AM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:

Quoted:

3: If you are going to spend $250+ for a used Aimpoint or the Bushnell holographic you might conceder the new EOTech XPS. That is their latest design and we have them for $409

I already have an EO and I can't stand how it chews through batteries even when "off." Does the XPS still suffer from this? I have to admit that I like the EO form as a reflex better than anything else out there and mine has taken a beating (I tried to sell it for $300 with a GG&G mount and got laughed at because it's SO ugly). Noe that they're shorted with side bottons, they're much better, but the battery issue has me waiting.

The XPS is too new to be 100% sure but at SHOT last year the factory people from EOTech were very upfront that they knew they had lost some confidence in the market and the XPS design was the answer. The CR123s also have longer shelf the the N and AAs. I have not run across any posted problems.

Posted: 10/9/2009 11:06:40 AM EDT

[#43]

Can the rails be removed from this scope?

Posted: 10/9/2009 11:10:36 AM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:
Can the rails be removed from this scope?

The pics on page one are without the rails. unfortunately we are now out of stock. Next order is not due until January.

Posted: 10/9/2009 11:42:21 AM EDT

[#45]

Got mine and it seems great!
A little more eye relief would be nice. That's my only complaint.

Posted: 10/9/2009 3:59:53 PM EDT

[#46]

Had mine out twice now.About 150 rds .308 from a FAL. Only gripe is the reticle gets lost on cluttered back grounds but can be seen well enough when lit to the highest settings. Not sure what battery life is going to be , but at least it uses common and cheap 2032's.
Anyone who wants a compact scope for a FAL that even lets you use the carry handle needs to check this out.
BTW: has anyone figured out exactly what the click adjustments are on this?

Posted: 10/9/2009 6:50:12 PM EDT

[#47]

Quoted:
Got mine and it seems great!
A little more eye relief would be nice. That's my only complaint.

I got one this week, and haven't had a chance to take it to the range, but tend to agree with this. It looks like a great scope at a great price, but I do wish I could move it a little farther forward on the rail.

Posted: 10/10/2009 9:44:21 AM EDT

[#48]

Quoted:
Had mine out twice now.About 150 rds .308 from a FAL. Only gripe is the reticle gets lost on cluttered back grounds but can be seen well enough when lit to the highest settings. Not sure what battery life is going to be , but at least it uses common and cheap 2032's.
Anyone who wants a compact scope for a FAL that even lets you use the carry handle needs to check this out.
BTW: has anyone figured out exactly what the click adjustments are on this?

From my experience it seems that the adjustments are 1/4".

I have ran about 200 rounds through it on my STAG AR and it works great. The 4X was great and I enjoyed shooting it out to 200 yards with no problems.

No grips at all. Two suggestions for a later revision I would like to see.
1. Chevron reticle would be nice or eliminate the 200m stadia line. Would help clear up the clutter a bit.
2. Raise the height of the mount just a tad. I put some YHM risers under mine for a quick check and I liked the height but hated how it looked. I might have to had a GG&G accucam base to it to raise it up and get quick release for it.