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Posted: 10/26/2009 10:59:47 AM EDT
Hey guys, new to  the forum but I've been lurking and trying to learn as much as I can. I've searched for this multiple times and while I picked up some info, like I don't think I want a chrome lined barrel, and krieger seems to be tops, but I don't think I've gotten a clear answer on my question so..

I'm building my first AR, and I'm trying to choose a barrel. This one will be for punching paper and more importantly, hunting coyotes. I want it to be fairly lightweight and handy, and am shooting for 1moa accuracy, less if possible. I know that the trigger is a big part of this, but for now my question focuses on barrel selection. I'm not going to be shooting lots of rounds downrange, so I don't think I need the longevity of a chrome lined barrel over the accuracy of a non CL barrel. I'm thinking something in the 18"-20" length, light to medium weight, would work well for me.

What kind of options should I be looking into? I don't think I need to go Krieger to achieve these results, and don't want to spend quite that much money. I've looked at some of the WOA barrels, and they seem to be decent. I wish I could've gotten in on the Superior barrel birthday deal but didn't have the cash at the time. Are there any other barrels worth taking a look at? $300 dollar range is what I'm thinking, matched bolt would be a plus.

Again, sorry if this has been covered but I spent a couple hours this weekend searching and didn't see what I was looking for, please forgive my newieness if I missed it. Thanks in advance guys.
Link Posted: 10/26/2009 11:38:18 AM EDT
[#1]
SuperiorBarrels.com  Built 2 starting there.  Best I've ever had, bar none. I shit you not.




Link Posted: 10/26/2009 11:41:28 AM EDT
[#2]
1MOA is nothing special as far as barrels and ARs nowadays.

Off the rack RRA with their stainless barrel and a free float handguard should meet that.  Depending on exactly what you're looking for you could go with something custom or semi custom with a slightly lighter and/or shorter barrel, different handguards, maybe something like a melonited CMV steel barrel, etc etc.  Just depends on what your budget is and your preference in accessories.  Optics and a good optics mount will be important to dependable accuracy performance as well as poor lighting conditions etc.

Link Posted: 10/26/2009 3:32:03 PM EDT
[#3]
You could go with an olympic arms barrel.  Their standard barrels are supposed to have 1/2 moa accuracy and thier stainless ultra match have 1/4 moa accuracy.  You can get a new standard barrel in 20" for about $225 from olyarms.com.
Link Posted: 10/26/2009 7:26:35 PM EDT
[#4]
SuperiorBarrels.com Built 2 starting there. Best I've ever had, bar none. I shit you not.
 

Boy you ain't kidding.  My 16in superior barrel is a tack driver!  Great barrel!

If you don't go that route White Oak Armament has great barrels in my opinion.
Link Posted: 10/26/2009 11:04:20 PM EDT
[#5]
Thanks guys, the Oly is high on my list right now, thinking one of the 20" standards would probably fit the bill. Anyone know the weight on the 20" bull vs the standard? Not sure if I want to gain the weight on it, but also don't want the front sight gas block that comes on the standard, as I plan to go with a low profile and free float with a flat top upper.

Fishhunt223, curious where you got the info for the standard barrels getting 1/2moa and ultra match barrels getting 1/4moa. I scoured their site and they only mentioned this - "Every barrel that we manufacture is of Match grade quality. In other words, with all of our rifles, regardless of type you should be able to achieve around 1" groups at 100 yards, using a good factory Match ammo or custom hand loads. This even includes our 16" guns."
Link Posted: 10/27/2009 2:06:37 PM EDT
[#6]
This one will be for punching paper and more importantly, hunting coyotes

A lot depends on "where" and "how" you hunt your coyotes...

I grew up in northern WI hunting heavy woods and swamps where shots didn't come all that often
and when they did they came up quick and in heavy cover..

I like a light wt rifle because it gets carried more than shot

If I had longer shots out in the open and hunted from a blind then I would tailor my rifle/scope to the situation best as I could.

Link Posted: 10/27/2009 5:55:01 PM EDT
[#7]
I saw that info on there just a couple of weeks ago but now I cant seem to find it.  But if you do a google search for olympic arms accuracy all of the info will come back the same and most of the people who have shot the barrels agree without a doubt.  You might do a little shopping around online, I have seen barrels on other websites for a little cheaper than from olympic and you dont have to mess around with the wait times.
Link Posted: 10/27/2009 10:21:28 PM EDT
[#8]
Ok guys, I think I've gotten some solid info here and thanks to all for that! I think the Olympic standard is the barrel I want to go with, now the final question...  I was originally thinking 18-20" lightweight... but now I'm arguing with myself between the 20" and the 16"l. I was thinking 18" standard would be a good medium, lightweight, handy, and as I understand I can use a rifle length gas system. Also I'm not sure how the velocity of any factory rounds would be affected by the 4" difference, especially out of a gas operated gun which is new territory for me. If anyone could shed some light on that for me I think I have my answer!
Link Posted: 10/28/2009 6:38:38 AM EDT
[#9]
I dont think if you actually intend to shoot the rifle much you should concern yourself with price on the barrel too much.  You will spend MUCH more on quality ammo to get the accuracy out of the gun than  $100 difference in one barrel vs a slightly more accurate one.  Your first ammo purchase of good match ammo instead of FMJ will exceed that amount, not to mention the money spent on the ammo the barrel will use for the rest of its life.

If you can buy PRVI 75 and get the same accuracy as the $100 cheaper barrel that requires Federal GMM to shoot the same size groups the more expensive barrel is the cheaper option in the long run. Just somehting else to consider...
Link Posted: 10/28/2009 7:20:13 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
Ok guys, I think I've gotten some solid info here and thanks to all for that! I think the Olympic standard is the barrel I want to go with, now the final question...  I was originally thinking 18-20" lightweight... but now I'm arguing with myself between the 20" and the 16"l. I was thinking 18" standard would be a good medium, lightweight, handy, and as I understand I can use a rifle length gas system. Also I'm not sure how the velocity of any factory rounds would be affected by the 4" difference, especially out of a gas operated gun which is new territory for me. If anyone could shed some light on that for me I think I have my answer!


I have been trying to decide the same thing with my current build.  I think I have decided on the 16" just becuase it will make the rifle a little lighter for those long hikes and i can swing it faster(I hate it when I call in a double and cant get the second shot off before the dog turns and runs).  I dont plan on taking super long 400 plus yard shots so I dont think the added fps will be a big deal to me.


Link Posted: 10/28/2009 10:26:17 PM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
Ok guys, I think I've gotten some solid info here and thanks to all for that! I think the Olympic standard is the barrel I want to go with, now the final question...  I was originally thinking 18-20" lightweight... but now I'm arguing with myself between the 20" and the 16"l. I was thinking 18" standard would be a good medium, lightweight, handy, and as I understand I can use a rifle length gas system. Also I'm not sure how the velocity of any factory rounds would be affected by the 4" difference, especially out of a gas operated gun which is new territory for me. If anyone could shed some light on that for me I think I have my answer!


I've got a 20" Oly that's waiting to go to ADCO for shortening to 18". The extra 2" doesn't do much from a practical sense and I'm hoping the heavy profile barrel will balance a little better for general use. Besides, I've got a surplus of 20" barrels right now and the Oly has the post-ban groove near the muzzle that needs to go anyway.
Link Posted: 10/28/2009 11:20:20 PM EDT
[#12]
Link Posted: 10/29/2009 11:19:58 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
What makes a good barrel? A good advertisement or a good product?
Any one with a borescope can see the difference between a normal production barrel with chatter marks inside and a true lapped match grade barrel.
This is a list of true match grade barrels, not 3 gun match but benchrest match, Douglas XX could be added as a minimum match barrel.
If the barrels aren't on this list they aren't used by the best shooters to compete with and aren't considered real match barrels.
http://www.6mmbr.com/barrels.html
Watch the video at the top of the page showing the difference between production and match grade barrels.

Most don't need match grade barrels but, don't be fooled by a good advertisement, anyone guaranteeing 1/4" groups is yanking your chain....the one attached to your wallet.

Noveske's barrels are Pac Nor
MSTN uses Douglas among others
PRI uses Douglas
We use Pac Nor, Hart, Krieger and Douglas
WOA uses some Shilen now
Compass Lake uses some Douglas
RGW has used Hart among others.



Have you ever shot one?  Dont take my word for the accuracy, ill post some links to oly arms reviews.  Most of these are for the rifles themselves but since the barrel is probably has the most influence on accuracy, you can expect similair resulsts if you use high quality components along with the barrel.


http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4694
http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4694
http://www.the-armory.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/product57.html

Here is a quote from the last link
If you are searching for accuracy the UM-1 is recommended. It comes with our renowned Ultramatch broach cut stainless steel barrel chambered with minimum SAAMI reamers made by Clymer for optimum accuracy potential. We’ve seen ¼” groups and smaller when used with the proper load, bullets, and barrel. This is the rifle SWAT Magazine called “the most accurate AR target rifle ever made.” The UM-1 comes standard with bull barrel and picatinny gas block. Also available as a completely assembled, headspaced, and test fired upper receiver unit
Link Posted: 10/29/2009 3:23:52 PM EDT
[#14]
Link Posted: 10/29/2009 4:17:11 PM EDT
[#15]







Quoted:
Quoted:






Quoted:



What makes a good barrel? A good advertisement or a good product?



Any one with a borescope can see the difference between a normal production barrel with chatter marks inside and a true lapped match grade barrel.



This is a list of true match grade barrels, not 3 gun match but benchrest match, Douglas XX could be added as a minimum match barrel.



If the barrels aren't on this list they aren't used by the best shooters to compete with and aren't considered real match barrels.



http://www.6mmbr.com/barrels.html



Watch the video at the top of the page showing the difference between production and match grade barrels.
Most don't need match grade barrels but, don't be fooled by a good advertisement, anyone guaranteeing 1/4" groups is yanking your chain....the one attached to your wallet.
Noveske's barrels are Pac Nor



MSTN uses Douglas among others



PRI uses Douglas



We use Pac Nor, Hart, Krieger and Douglas



WOA uses some Shilen now



Compass Lake uses some Douglas



RGW has used Hart among others.

Have you ever shot one?  Dont take my word for the accuracy, ill post some links to oly arms reviews.  Most of these are for the rifles themselves but since the barrel is probably has the most influence on accuracy, you can expect similair resulsts if you use high quality components along with the barrel.
http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4694



http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4694



http://www.the-armory.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/product57.html
Here is a quote from the last link



If you are searching for accuracy the UM-1 is recommended. It comes with our renowned Ultramatch broach cut stainless steel barrel chambered with minimum SAAMI reamers made by Clymer for optimum accuracy potential. We’ve seen ¼” groups and smaller when used with the proper load, bullets, and barrel. This is the rifle SWAT Magazine called “the most accurate AR target rifle ever made.” The UM-1 comes standard with bull barrel and picatinny gas block. Also available as a completely assembled, headspaced, and test fired upper receiver unit




I really don't care what you buy, it will not effect me one bit just hate to see people mislead.



I owned one back in the early 90s for about 6 months sold it to buy a Douglas barrel chambered by Derick Martin at Accuracy speaks.



I have a 25wssm SUM  and a .243 wssm CM now along with 6 or 7 Kriegers, about 12 Pac Nors and a few Harts.



I sold close to  200 custom AR15 barrels last year, 90 % were Pac Nor.



I am not saying they aren't accurate enough for most(especially if  the owner is using factory ammo), just saying they aren't considered a match barrel by the comp crowd unless some use them for highpower.



Look at the bench rest match results and see if you can find anyone using one.



6mmBR is a no BS site, full of good solid info not erronet rumors.







This guy is absolutely, totally correct. And Lothar Walther is another manufacturers that is behind the curtain on a lot of these brands also.
There is so much hype and mis-information in the marketplace about the latest greatest state of the art barrel. Its all hogwash. A lot of the brands that people are purchasing are nothing special, and the technology on some of them deemed as the newest craze has been around since the 60s.
Double chrome lining is a play on words. Hard blue was a mess, the first batch did not go well. Cold hammer forged barrels can be matched by other technologies providing its done correctly, and yet its the latest rave?
You guys do know there are barrel technologies out there that exceed 49,000 rounds with amazing accuracy right, AR15 barrels? And still hold an outstanding MOA.
But the above posted is right, Pac Nor, Douglas, Krieger, Lilja, and Lothar Walther are behind the illusion of most of these other brands. Spend about a good 2 days, two fulls days, calling companies and you will see exactly whats really going. You will see who is behind almost every company represented here. Most roads lead back to 4 main manufacturers.
And in many cases going to the originating source clears up a lot of VERY bad information, and can save you money when you really see what your getting.
I mean I have heard it all in the last 16 hours of research: hammer forged, cold hammer forged, chrome lined, stainless, cryo treated, ion bonded, and a myriad of others.
Stop buying into the hype, its just a marketing game.
 
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