How many rounds of ammo did you USE during any hurricane or riot related event that you went through?   This goes for Hurricane Andrew, any other hurricanes, riots, natural disasters, war zones, etc. Thanks,

Writer

507 rounds.  

I only actually shot seven, but I gave a 500 round can of 5.56 to local PD when they came around asking if we had any to spare.  They said they'd give it back after things got normal, but they never did.  

Shane

You mean local PD was that desperate for ammo to "borrow" it off the local populace? Really?

Sounds like some real world experience on how much ammo to keep on hand. Just a thought.

Writer

Quoted: You mean local PD was that desperate for ammo to "borrow" it off the local populace? Really?

Absolutely...

Quoted: 507 rounds.   I only actually shot seven, but I gave a 500 round can of 5.56 to local PD when they came around asking if we had any to spare.  They said they'd give it back after things got normal, but they never did.   Shane

How 'bout when the police put the ammo to use by disarming, uh, people like yourself??

did you hear about  any Gun Confiscation After Katrina


Gun Confiscation After Katrina

Quoted: 507 rounds.   I only actually shot seven, but I gave a 500 round can of 5.56 to local PD when they came around asking if we had any to spare.  They said they'd give it back after things got normal, but they never did.   Shane

Curious... What were the circumstances in which you fired? If you don't mind answering were you popping a few off into the air to say stay away from my house or was your life in danger? Don't mean to intrude I am just curious...

Quoted: Quoted: 507 rounds.   I only actually shot seven, but I gave a 500 round can of 5.56 to local PD when they came around asking if we had any to spare.  They said they'd give it back after things got normal, but they never did.   Shane Curious... What were the circumstances in which you fired? If you don't mind answering were you popping a few off into the air to say stay away from my house or was your life in danger? Don't mean to intrude I am just curious...

I'm curious too. What circumstances made you need/feel the need to fire your weapon?

Mine was boring.  30+ days without power, and nary a shot fired.

Well, I did go to the range near the end and shot some 22, but I am sure that isn't what you were talking about

Doc

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: 507 rounds.   I only actually shot seven, but I gave a 500 round can of 5.56 to local PD when they came around asking if we had any to spare.  They said they'd give it back after things got normal, but they never did.   Shane Curious... What were the circumstances in which you fired? If you don't mind answering were you popping a few off into the air to say stay away from my house or was your life in danger? Don't mean to intrude I am just curious... I'm curious too. What circumstances made you need/feel the need to fire your weapon?

I was thinking when I read the OP that this sounded like the start of a debate.  Are you researching for a book?  Looking for support to a working thesis?

No, I'm simply curious and wanting to know more about when one might have to shoot in a bad situation.

i used over 6 k in 7.92 and over 3 k in x51nato  in hurricane charlie......

i had to move mid cane due to the roof being sheared off..


you didnt state how it was used

Quoted: Quoted: 507 rounds.   I only actually shot seven, but I gave a 500 round can of 5.56 to local PD when they came around asking if we had any to spare.  They said they'd give it back after things got normal, but they never did.   Shane Curious... What were the circumstances in which you fired? If you don't mind answering were you popping a few off into the air to say stay away from my house or was your life in danger? Don't mean to intrude I am just curious...

I gotta hear this.

0 rounds fired after Katrina. I have 1 neighbor who took a shot at a looter trying to break into his shed. He claimed that he missed intentionally because he was unsure of the legal consequences. I had some SOB slash the window screen of one of my kids' rooms but the dogs got him before anything else happened.
   

Bump due to interesting topic.  Inquiring minds want to know.  

You mean local PD was that desperate for ammo to "borrow" it off the local populace? Really? Sounds like some real world experience on how much ammo to keep on hand. Just a thought.

Many local jurisdictions gave supplies to Orleans and St. Bernard parishes (counties) early on.  As time went on, everyone was short.  When asking about this later, I found out that local PDs don't stock nearly as much ammo as I had thought would be reasonable.  They do stock it at the range, but all that ammo was under water in many places.

I only shoot a few calibers.  9mm, .45, .223 (5.56), 12ga, .308, .30-06.  My reasoning beind that is that I can go into most rural dime stores and buy those, while .40, 10mm, etc, is impossible to find.  Local PD issues .40, and they were *out*, and it wasn't like you could get a delivery.  Nobody could go out and buy it because the infrastructure that could *pay* for it, was non-functional.  They cleaned out the local gun shops, but evidently local gun shops don't stock all that much ammo either.  

Turns out that I was right.  There was plenty of 9mm and .45 to be had.  No .40 anywhere.  Not much 5.56 to be had either.  Lots of shot shells.  Much later it finally dawned on me to find out what they were using so much ammo on, and I was told that the #1 thing was snakes.  Officers were literally emptying their guns trying to shoot snakes!

Snakes!?  Gads, man!  Get a STICK!  

I now talk about this in my classes...  

Shane

How 'bout when the police put the ammo to use by disarming, uh, people like yourself??

I wouldn't give ammo to those guys if I thought they would do such a thing.  That was in Orleans, not where I was.  Local PD was very supportive of us, and were glad that we were there.  Our street became a 'safe zone' where LEO would come at any time of the day or night to make a pit stop, grab a drink, or have a sandwich or whatever we managed to have on the stove at the time.  

Shane

did you hear about  any Gun Confiscation After Katrina

Yes, immediately.  I heard the announcement when it was made that they were going to pick up all the guns.  I was at that moment *really* thankful that I didn't live in Orleans Parish, which is completely run by libtards.  I live in Jefferson Parish, where we are not nearly so afflicted with that particular disease.  

Mayor Johnson, in Harahan, where I am, actually got on the radio and encouraged every ablebodied man and woman to lock, load, and see to their own security.  

He won reelection completely unopposed...

Shane

Quoted: You mean local PD was that desperate for ammo to "borrow" it off the local populace? Really? .   .  Much later it finally dawned on me to find out what they were using so much ammo on, and I was told that the #1 thing was snakes.  Officers were literally emptying their guns trying to shoot snakes! Snakes!?  Gads, man!  Get a STICK!   I now talk about this in my classes...   Shane

I read on another board that the poilce were evacuating people and shooting their pets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Curious... What were the circumstances in which you fired? If you don't mind answering were you popping a few off into the air to say stay away from my house or was your life in danger? Don't mean to intrude I am just curious...

Nothing glorious or even particularly exciting.  1 was a warning shot.  Six were to dispatch stray critters (not snakes...2 dogs, 1 cat, 3 raccoons).  I was the only person in my neighborhood to fire any shots at all, and whenever something needed shooting, I was called for.  The neighbors are kind of squeamish or something.  Lived in the city too long...  

I did enjoy the warning shot.  I was on night watch at the end of the block.  Mr. Bonnin had blocked the ends of the street with cars, and set us all on a watch schedule.  Mr. Bonnin is a WWII vet who has no uncertain ideas about what to do when the zombies rise...  A car of suspicious nature pulled up, and I had my Mossberg abomination on a sling loaded with 3" slugs.  (Bonnin eventually made me quit dicking with the shotgun and get my rifle 'like a real man'...but I like the slugs for penetrating vehicles...)  As the car rolled up, I got a grip on the weapon, stepped behind one of the vehicles for cover, and the car turned when I hit them with the light.  Four young males meeting the 'looter' description were in the car, and the driver started a conversation with me.  

"Yo!  What you got the street blocked fo?"

"You guys don't live in this neighborhood, do you?"

"Yo! What you got a gun fo?  You lookin' to shoot somebody?  You think we scared of that?  You shit ain't even loaded!"

Since I was tired of the conversation, and it wasn't going to go anywhere but down hill, I pulled the trigger and sent a slug into the grass just to the left of me, cycled the gun, and pointed it at the car.  The drivers eyes went buggy and he hit the gas.  I did hear, "MOTHER F**KER IS CRAZY!"  

The shot served several purposes.  It cut out the bullshit, stopped them from continuing to talk themselves into doing something, and let me immediately gague how far these guys wanted to go.  The next one was going into the car if they wanted to play.  More importantly, though, it served as a signal and in less than 30 seconds, I had other armed men to support me.  

Mr. Bonnin thought I should have just shot them, but he has issues...

Our particular area went back to normal fairly quicly.  30 days after the storm, I went back to work.  We still had night watch because Mr. Bonnin was convinced that we would be surrounded by attacking zombies during the night.  Within 60 days after the storm, those persons not used to walking around armed put their weapons away.  People just didn't see the need.  Crime was WAY down, not that we have that much crime to begin with.  Some people miss the lesson, though.

The largest problem post Katrina wasn't food or water or gas - it was what to do with garbage.  

Shane

I read on another board that the poilce were evacuating people and shooting their pets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, that happened too.  People who were unprepared to evacuate themselves suddenly found themselves at the mercy of being evacuated either by government or by relief organizations.  They will not take pets on those busses.  The coordination of that was very poor.  Eventually folks were faced with a choice - either stay with their pets and continue to live in unlivable conditions with no food, water, etc., or they could leave the pet and get on the bus.  

After that, though, you've got all these stray animals running around.  Added to that are the stray animals that people abandoned when they evacuated in the first place.  Without anyone to feed them, these critters quickly exhibited pack behavior.  In the absence of the ability to care for them, it was kinder to shoot them than to let them starve or succumb to each other.  It was also a public safety and public health issue.  

I shot two stray dogs myself, and it sucks and it's sad.  That's the reality of the situation, though.  

Shane

Mr. Bonnin for president.


Go shake his hand for me sometime, and I'd shake yours if I meet you Shane.

Well done.

"Mr. Bonnin thought I should have just shot them, but he has issues..."

I think I like Mr. Bonnin!

I'm in St. Tammany Parish (Madisonville), and never fired a round.

I toted my 1911 wherever I went, and was never hassled by bad guys, or good guys for that matter.

Mr. Bonnin for president. Go shake his hand for me sometime, and I'd shake yours if I meet you Shane. Well done.

I shake his hand every chance I get.  I never thought much of the old kook living across the way, but I knew he was a WWII vet.  I had made it my business to know all the neighbors up and down the street when we moved in some years ago, and it was pretty obvious that Mr. Bonnin was the 'boss' of the street.  He'd wander over from time to time and say, "So and so needs help with such and such.", and you were to understand that meant that you are now assigned to do the helping.  This arrangement worked well even before the storm.  He also demanded a key to the house, and I pretty much told him to go stuff himself.  After he explained why he wanted it, I finally gave him one.

I took my wife and two young daughters to Houston when we evacuated, and I came back after leaving them with family.  I was kind of suprised to find that Mr. Bonnin had blocked the street with cars on either end, and was dutifully patrolling up and down the block in his WWII uniform carrying his M1 carbine.  I pulled up and got out of the car (no way through) and he came up to me.  He didn't waste time on pleasantries, but immediately demanded, "WHERE IS YOUR RIFLE, BOY!?"  Being 37, I was kind of shocked, but anybody who makes it to 89 or so can call me 'boy', I guess.  "It's in the truck..."  

"Why isn't it in your hand!?"

"Uh..."

"Is it even loaded!?"

"Uh...  Yes!"

"Well, that's something then."

He gave me the keys to move one of the vehicles and get through.  I was the first able-bodied person to return.  I had dropped off a bunch of stuff to local PD that I managed to scavenge in Houston, then came straight home.  My house was pretty tore up.  We lost half the roof and had some water from that.  No flooding, thankfully.  After I surveyed the damage, Mr. Bonnin came around to inform me that I was now on patrol and he was going to have a shower and a nap.  

"How long have you been on patrol, Mr. Bonnin?"

"Since the storm.  Three days and nights.  No help from you younguns!"

Ouch...  So, I was on patrol.  When he came back from his nap, he had a whistle.  He says, "You go work on your house.  When you hear this whistle, you grab your rifle and your ammo bag, and you come running."  So, I go work on my house...  30 minutes later, the whistle blows.  I grab the shotgun, grab the ammo bag, and sprint to the street.  Bonnin is there.  No bad guys.

"What took you so long?"

"I was on the roof."

"Move faster....and what in God's name is THAT!?", he asks, pointing to the shotgun.

"Shotgun."  (Mind you, no ordinary shotgun.  Mossberg 500 done out with Knoxx stock, ported barrel, rail with EoTech mounted on it.  I can put 3" slugs into a tight hole at 50 yards all day.  Very tacticool.  I'm also good with it...)

"Damn, son!  We're not hunting ducks out here!  Bring your God damned rifle next time!"

"Uh...so what's the emergency?  Why did you blow the whistle?"

"The emergency is that you are a disaster!"

First night, I was on patrol.  I say, "Do I get the whistle now?"  He just looked at me like I had cursed his mother and didn't say anything.  That night another neighbor came in and was kind of suprised to find that his boat and trailer were being used to block the street.  

"What is my boat doing in the middle of the street?"

"Talk to Bonnin."  

"Oh."

Bonnin had us really trained those next few days.  He'd blow that damn whistle three times a day, and all of us would hit the street within 30 seconds.  Most of us could hit the street in less than 20.  At some point I was pouring myself a glass of rootbeer when Bonnin blew the whistle.  When I got to the street, I noticed my pants were wet below the knee.  When I came back inside, I found that I had just dropped the glass and pitcher right in the middle of the floor without a second thought.  

After a few weeks, Bonnin let us move the cars and let normal traffic through on the street.  We still had standing watch on the corners all day and all night.  Eventually we had regular LE patrols, and Bonnin let us go to just standing watch at night.  We have never entirely stopped the practice, and one of us is always on patrol in a ten block area from 10PM to 6AM every night.  

This wasn't my first SHTF, but it was the first time it happened to me in my home town.  I learned a lot.  Security is a high priority, but not the biggest concern.  You're trying to fix the house, and clean up, and stay fed and hydrated.  You're also trying to help neighbors and otherwise coordinate news and communications.  The #1 issue we had was what to do with garbage.  Everybody lost everything in their freezers and refridgerators and guess who Mr. Bonnin detailed to go around and clean refridgerators in all the houses where folks were still gone?  Not only did I have to do mine, I had to do a LOT of them.  (Bonnin has keys to all the houses...)  All of this sat out in cans on the curb.  You're supposed to bury it, but that's way too much work.  We got trash service on day 41, but it was becoming a health and safety issue.  The raccoons I shot were all trying to get into garbage.  We were afraid to burn anything because there was no reliable fire service in case something went wrong...  

Most of it is boring and tedious.  I have a lot of training.  I'm a trainer myself.  Having to do it all day and night, though, gets old quick.  

Shane

You're going to miss that old guy when he's gone.  Who gets to be the old coot when he moves on?

J.

Quoted: "Mr. Bonnin thought I should have just shot them, but he has issues..." I think I like Mr. Bonnin!

That's what I was thinking.  I don't even know this Mr. Bonnin but I like him already.

Wish I had a Mr. Bonnin in my neighborhood.  All I have are yuppies who invest more time into buying shiny beads, luxury cars and entertainment toys then preparing for a disaster.  

I'd trade all of them and a few single mommies on the next block for just 1 Mr. Bonnin.

Nice!, any homes for sale on your street?

You're going to miss that old guy when he's gone.  Who gets to be the old coot when he moves on?

Probably the bus driver that lives next to him...  Eventually *I* will be the old coot, and then I'll get a whistle...  I like my neighborhood, and we have the active engagement of the neighbors into a unified community.  That takes a lot of work, and there is some loss of privacy because everyone in my neighborhood knows everyone else's business.  When you go out of town, everybody knows.  Your house is watched, your mail is collected, your papers get taken in.  If anybody sees something strange, they know which contact numbers to call.  You don't make it very far in my neighborhood without someone checking you out.  If you live in my neighborhood and you live alone, you never go more than 24 hours without being checked on.  If you live in my neighborhood you can't go cold, hungry, lonely, or helpless.  A branch can't fall in your yard without some kid dragging it over to the trash pile.  If somebody's kid does something stupid, the parents know within 10 minutes.  When a neighbor was having a trouble pregnancy and the husband was having to take care of her, their grass got cut, their pool got cleaned, the roof got fixed, their oil got changed, the gas tank got filled, meals got cooked, and their house got cleaned.  The kid is cute.

All of this just kind of happens without much prompting.  Mr. Bonnin may come around and mention something, or someone may call, but mostly we just check on one another.  News gets around.  I talk to my neighbors on either side of me every day.  Usually twice a day.  It's not a long conversation, just a 'hello' and such.  In this neighborhood, it has been that way for a long time.

In my old neighborhood, everyone was very private and nobody talked to anyone else.  It took me *years* to have any kind of relationship with some of the neighbors, and even then there were people living on my street that I had never met.  Mrs. Johnson, a few doors down from me was an old widow who had been in the hospital.  My neighbor Mark and I decided to go cut her grass one Saturday because it was getting really high.  We went over and started edging the lawn when Mrs. Johnson came out and wanted to know why we were TRESPASSING on her property.  We explained that we were just trying to do a neighborly turn.  She threatened to call the police.  

I guess we know what'll happen to *her* when the zombies rise...

Shane

ShaneS, great story! I'm grinning ear to ear. He reminds me a friend of mine that died a cancer a few years ago. Crabby old coot but it was mostly an act, He was hoot just the same

Quoted: did you hear about  any Gun Confiscation After Katrina Yes, immediately.  I heard the announcement when it was made that they were going to pick up all the guns.  I was at that moment *really* thankful that I didn't live in Orleans Parish, which is completely run by libtards.  I live in Jefferson Parish, where we are not nearly so afflicted with that particular disease.   Mayor Johnson, in Harahan, where I am, actually got on the radio and encouraged every ablebodied man and woman to lock, load, and see to their own security.   He won reelection completely unopposed... Shane

When we were returning the day after the storm, we would literally have to check in with the residents every few blocks or so going down Jefferson Hwy. They didnt know us. And they wanted to know why we were in the area. We'd tell them we were just getting back, and that was that. Never had any problems, it was just a "I see you and I see that you see me seeing you..." kinda situation. We offered cases of food and water to whom ever we met, but most refused saying they had enough. But they did partake in the 6 pack beers. On opposite, most of the New Orleans residents that stayed, grabbed the food and water and were trying to pay us in cigarettes, dip, and beer. very odd...

Eventually *I* will be the old coot, and then I'll get a whistle...

Just another one of life's goals, isn't it?    The trick is you gotta live long enough to get that whistle.  And you have to have the younger guys convinced you're tougher than they'll ever be.

J.

Quoted: Quoted: You mean local PD was that desperate for ammo to "borrow" it off the local populace? Really? .   .  Much later it finally dawned on me to find out what they were using so much ammo on, and I was told that the #1 thing was snakes.  Officers were literally emptying their guns trying to shoot snakes! Snakes!?  Gads, man!  Get a STICK!   I now talk about this in my classes...   Shane I read on another board that the poilce were evacuating people and shooting their pets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It wasnt meant to be cruel, but many police shot dogs they came upon (no owners around) because those animals were a huge danger to public safety. An abandoned dog is no less threatening than a wolf. Those police are being tried right now in St. Bernard parish. They are saying they had orders by the SBSO, but the Sheriff's Office isnt backing them up. Not sure how this one has or will play out.

I have some pics of dogs eating dead people after Katrina if anyone needs proof there was a problem. Hard times lead to hard choices, and abdicating hard choices leads to even worse ones.

Seems to me that 55 gallon drums would burn garbage if you could cobble up a decent grate to keep sparks and embers down. Not an instant solution, but the grills from barbeques could do the job and withstand the heat. Gas grills could be cannibalized after the bottled gas ran out, and hardwired gas grill grates could be used immediately. Make sure to cut vent holes near the bottom of the drum or it won't burn right. You can burn shit and wet garbage with an accelerant, but you get into tradeoffs using fuel that way. Use common sense and watch the wind on burn days.

More tradeoffs if you're capping obvious threats before they initiate hostilities. I think the CO needs to make sure his people don't hesitate when the situation demands lethal force, but at the same time, I probably wouldn't shoot to kill myself until someone made an overt move or failed to heed such an obvious warning. Once SHTF, an unnecessary clan war is just an additional hassle. Yes, they'll probably just go loot and terrorize somewhere else, but recognizing that you can't secure a whole city is really the only way to hold the much smaller area that you do have a chance to defend.

Thumbs up to Shane and Mr. Bonnin, nice work.

Quoted: Quoted: "Damn, son!  We're not hunting ducks out here!  Bring your God damned rifle next time!" "Uh...so what's the emergency?  Why did you blow the whistle?" "The emergency is that you are a disaster!"  I like this Bonnin dude!  We need a guy like that for our neighborhood. Sounds like the 'Gunny' from Lights Out.

That's what I thought .

When I bought my house, my neighbor, Bob, was just like that. Korean war vet. brought me into his home and talked politics, guns, and about making sure I got my "edumacation." He told me stories about the neighborhood and the time he held a "damned hippy that broked" into his house at gun point until the police "got outa the damned cawfee shop" to give him a hand. He also showed me his collection of AR's and garands. Funny guy, I asked him if they were preban and he said, "If that bubba from arkansaas wants 'em, he can come and get 'em. "

He passed on two years after I moved in. I miss the guy. His daughter got his place through the courts (he disliked her and left her out of the will) and sued me once she moved in because I took down part of my fence when I was working on some landscaping and she thought it was her fence .

Wow, excellent thread.

Quoted: The largest problem post Katrina wasn't food or water or gas - it was what to do with garbage.   Shane

Sounds like your warning shot took care of the garbage.

Excellent stories, Shane.  Nice to hear about a neighborhood taking care of itself like that.

SHANE S,

   Damn man, where the hell in Harahan are you? I live on Soniat Ave. (the street that the Tastee Donuts is on).

   

this is great stuff

Quoted: Nice!, any homes for sale on your street?

You wish!  I only got this one because I have a good friend down the street who knew the man I bought the house from.  He mentioned that he would be moving in 6 months after his house was ready across the lake.  I happened to hear this rumor, and I also happened to see him shortly thereafter.  I told him, "If you want to sell that house, I'll buy it from you."  We talked price, and I shook his hand.  

He said, "Don't you want to see inside?"  

"Uh...  Yeah, I guess so..."

Shane

Just another one of life's goals, isn't it?    The trick is you gotta live long enough to get that whistle.  And you have to have the younger guys convinced you're tougher than they'll ever be.

Yeah, I'm taking good notes.  

Shane

When we were returning the day after the storm, we would literally have to check in with the residents every few blocks or so going down Jefferson Hwy. They didnt know us. And they wanted to know why we were in the area. We'd tell them we were just getting back, and that was that. Never had any problems, it was just a "I see you and I see that you see me seeing you..." kinda situation. We offered cases of food and water to whom ever we met, but most refused saying they had enough. But they did partake in the 6 pack beers. On opposite, most of the New Orleans residents that stayed, grabbed the food and water and were trying to pay us in cigarettes, dip, and beer. very odd...

The difference in mindset between the adjacent communities is very stark sometimes.  I am *really* glad I was not in Orleans Parish...  

If you came down Jefferson Highway, you had to have seen this:



That was on Jefferson not too far from me.  That was another group that must have its act together.

Shane

Originally Posted By ShaneS; "Move faster....and what in God's name is THAT!?", he asks, pointing to the shotgun. "Shotgun." (Mind you, no ordinary shotgun. Mossberg 500 done out with Knoxx stock, ported barrel, rail with EoTech mounted on it. I can put 3" slugs into a tight hole at 50 yards all day. Very tacticool. I'm also good with it...) "Damn, son! We're not hunting ducks out here! Bring your God damned rifle next time!"

For Mr. Bonnin!

I have some pics of dogs eating dead people after Katrina if anyone needs proof there was a problem. Hard times lead to hard choices, and abdicating hard choices leads to even worse ones.

I'd like to see those.  I took a lot of pictures, and I've seen a lot of pictures, but I don't think I've seen any like that.  I still want to cobble together a 'lessons learned' power point presentation some day.

Seems to me that 55 gallon drums would burn garbage if you could cobble up a decent grate to keep sparks and embers down. Not an instant solution, but the grills from barbeques could do the job and withstand the heat. Gas grills could be cannibalized after the bottled gas ran out, and hardwired gas grill grates could be used immediately. Make sure to cut vent holes near the bottom of the drum or it won't burn right. You can burn shit and wet garbage with an accelerant, but you get into tradeoffs using fuel that way. Use common sense and watch the wind on burn days.

We were going to have to do something like that eventually.  We had managed to get some drums, and there were a few metal trash cans around.  We had plenty of wood to burn, so fuel wasn't much of a problem.  We had so much else to do, though, that it wasn't high on the priority list.  We also had news that the trash service would return fairly quickly, so rather than spend resources on it, we just waited it out.  If it had gone past 60 days, we'd have worked to bury some stuff and burn other stuff.  We also had decent water pressure, sewer service, and electricity within the first week here.  That was *very* lucky.

More tradeoffs if you're capping obvious threats before they initiate hostilities. I think the CO needs to make sure his people don't hesitate when the situation demands lethal force, but at the same time, I probably wouldn't shoot to kill myself until someone made an overt move or failed to heed such an obvious warning. Once SHTF, an unnecessary clan war is just an additional hassle. Yes, they'll probably just go loot and terrorize somewhere else, but recognizing that you can't secure a whole city is really the only way to hold the much smaller area that you do have a chance to defend.

Our chief priority - as Bonnin made very clear - was perimeter security.  Nobody crosses the barriers.  "If anybody tries to cross the barrier, kill them."  If he could have surrounded us with a high wall and barbed wire, he'd have done it.  I thought it was a good strategy.  

The chief thing that went through my mind when I was confronted with the troublemakers wasn't the law, or my life, or their lives, but the fact that if I did have to kill them, it would mean unwanted attention.  I'd become the white boy who shot up them brothers, and this would be the neighborhood where that happened.  What I wanted most was for them to go away - which is what I got.  As I understand it, nobody in Harahan had very much trouble with anybody at all because none of those type of cruisers got any traction with any of the citizens here.  Everyone was ready to deal with trouble head on.  I really like this town...

Thumbs up to Shane and Mr. Bonnin, nice work.

Thanks!

Shane

Quoted: SHANE S,    Damn man, where the hell in Harahan are you? I live on Soniat Ave. (the street that the Tastee Donuts is on).

I'm right across Colonial Club from you.  Right off Harris.

Shane

Quoted: Curious... What were the circumstances in which you fired? If you don't mind answering were you popping a few off into the air to say stay away from my house or was your life in danger? Don't mean to intrude I am just curious... Nothing glorious or even particularly exciting.  1 was a warning shot.  Six were to dispatch stray critters (not snakes...2 dogs, 1 cat, 3 raccoons).  I was the only person in my neighborhood to fire any shots at all, and whenever something needed shooting, I was called for.  The neighbors are kind of squeamish or something.  Lived in the city too long...   I did enjoy the warning shot.  I was on night watch at the end of the block.  Mr. Bonnin had blocked the ends of the street with cars, and set us all on a watch schedule.  Mr. Bonnin is a WWII vet who has no uncertain ideas about what to do when the zombies rise...  A car of suspicious nature pulled up, and I had my Mossberg abomination on a sling loaded with 3" slugs.  (Bonnin eventually made me quit dicking with the shotgun and get my rifle 'like a real man'...but I like the slugs for penetrating vehicles...)  As the car rolled up, I got a grip on the weapon, stepped behind one of the vehicles for cover, and the car turned when I hit them with the light.  Four young males meeting the 'looter' description were in the car, and the driver started a conversation with me.   "Yo!  What you got the street blocked fo?" "You guys don't live in this neighborhood, do you?" "Yo! What you got a gun fo?  You lookin' to shoot somebody?  You think we scared of that?  You shit ain't even loaded!" Since I was tired of the conversation, and it wasn't going to go anywhere but down hill, I pulled the trigger and sent a slug into the grass just to the left of me, cycled the gun, and pointed it at the car.  The drivers eyes went buggy and he hit the gas.  I did hear, "MOTHER F**KER IS CRAZY!"   The shot served several purposes.  It cut out the bullshit, stopped them from continuing to talk themselves into doing something, and let me immediately gague how far these guys wanted to go.  The next one was going into the car if they wanted to play.  More importantly, though, it served as a signal and in less than 30 seconds, I had other armed men to support me.   Mr. Bonnin thought I should have just shot them, but he has issues... I think you should have at least...After 30 years in NOLA & Old Met I know EXACTLY the Scum you were confronted with...You would have made Harry Lee a very happy Man--GOD bless him RIP Our particular area went back to normal fairly quicly.  30 days after the storm, I went back to work.  We still had night watch because Mr. Bonnin was convinced that we would be surrounded by attacking zombies during the night.  Within 60 days after the storm, those persons not used to walking around armed put their weapons away.  People just didn't see the need.  Crime was WAY down, not that we have that much crime to begin with.  Some people miss the lesson, though. The largest problem post Katrina wasn't food or water or gas - it was what to do with garbage.   Shane

Quoted: I have some pics of dogs eating dead people after Katrina if anyone needs proof there was a problem. Hard times lead to hard choices, and abdicating hard choices leads to even worse ones. I'd like to see those.  I took a lot of pictures, and I've seen a lot of pictures, but I don't think I've seen any like that.  I still want to cobble together a 'lessons learned' power point presentation some day. Seems to me that 55 gallon drums would burn garbage if you could cobble up a decent grate to keep sparks and embers down. Not an instant solution, but the grills from barbeques could do the job and withstand the heat. Gas grills could be cannibalized after the bottled gas ran out, and hardwired gas grill grates could be used immediately. Make sure to cut vent holes near the bottom of the drum or it won't burn right. You can burn shit and wet garbage with an accelerant, but you get into tradeoffs using fuel that way. Use common sense and watch the wind on burn days. We were going to have to do something like that eventually.  We had managed to get some drums, and there were a few metal trash cans around.  We had plenty of wood to burn, so fuel wasn't much of a problem.  We had so much else to do, though, that it wasn't high on the priority list.  We also had news that the trash service would return fairly quickly, so rather than spend resources on it, we just waited it out.  If it had gone past 60 days, we'd have worked to bury some stuff and burn other stuff.  We also had decent water pressure, sewer service, and electricity within the first week here.  That was *very* lucky. More tradeoffs if you're capping obvious threats before they initiate hostilities. I think the CO needs to make sure his people don't hesitate when the situation demands lethal force, but at the same time, I probably wouldn't shoot to kill myself until someone made an overt move or failed to heed such an obvious warning. Once SHTF, an unnecessary clan war is just an additional hassle. Yes, they'll probably just go loot and terrorize somewhere else, but recognizing that you can't secure a whole city is really the only way to hold the much smaller area that you do have a chance to defend. Our chief priority - as Bonnin made very clear - was perimeter security.  Nobody crosses the barriers.  "If anybody tries to cross the barrier, kill them."  If he could have surrounded us with a high wall and barbed wire, he'd have done it.  I thought it was a good strategy.   The chief thing that went through my mind when I was confronted with the troublemakers wasn't the law, or my life, or their lives, but the fact that if I did have to kill them, it would mean unwanted attention.  I'd become the white boy who shot up them brothers, and this would be the neighborhood where that happened.  What I wanted most was for them to go away - which is what I got.  As I understand it, nobody in Harahan had very much trouble with anybody at all because none of those type of cruisers got any traction with any of the citizens here.  Everyone was ready to deal with trouble head on.  I really like this town... Thumbs up to Shane and Mr. Bonnin, nice work. Thanks! Shane

Alot of those Bodies were just "Disapearing" seewhati'msaying...

BTW:

Good job, Shane!

Quoted: Mayor Johnson, in Harahan, where I am, actually got on the radio and encouraged every ablebodied man and woman to lock, load, and see to their own security.   He won reelection completely unopposed... Shane

Do you think this guy might want to be president someday??