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Posted: 11/21/2008 5:47:01 AM EDT
[#1]
figures......
it'll be another gun that gets tossed to the .mil that they won't buy, and the customer base thats dying for it can't buy it. 
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Posted: 11/21/2008 5:51:24 AM EDT
[#2]
Stick with the AR15s boys, let them play with their tonka toys.
Seriously, what the hell? It is the HK bandwagon bug I think. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 5:52:19 AM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
Stick with the AR15s boys, let them play with their tonka toys. Seriously, what the hell? It is the HK bandwagon bug I think. Shrug, I guess it is too much to ask for something new and different to have in my safe to show people are have fun with at the range. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 5:52:31 AM EDT
[#4]
I don't know why the fuck they're even bothering. Either Colt, FN, or HK is going to win that contest, in that likely order, no matter how much better the other candidates are. Even if the Masada somehow DID manage to pull it off, the Army would find some way to screw Bushmaster/Magpul..
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Posted: 11/21/2008 5:53:20 AM EDT
[#5]
This is my surprised face ––––>
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Posted: 11/21/2008 5:54:03 AM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
Stick with the AR15s boys, let them play with their tonka toys. Seriously, what the hell? It is the HK bandwagon bug I think. this fuck it its all bells and whistles anyway.. it still shoots the same damn round that every other AR and AR style rifle and every other rifle chambered for this round shoots.. buy more ammo |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 5:56:32 AM EDT
[#7]
^^ I thought the ACR was going to be multi-caliber?
ETA, as to the original post: FFFFFFffffffffffffffuuuuuuuuUUUUUUUUUUUUUUuuuuuuuuuuuuu |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 5:57:19 AM EDT
[#8]
What in blue hell does that vague statement mean?
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Posted: 11/21/2008 5:58:14 AM EDT
[#9]
GRRRRR.
tears down bagman poster and rolls it up... |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:01:51 AM EDT
[#10]
Quoted: What in blue hell does that vague statement mean? The Masada/ACR/whatever the heck they are calling it has (IMNSHO) long been in the realm of vaporware, that statement is just the confirmation. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:02:14 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
What in blue hell does that vague statement mean? Well for me it means I can spend the $1,800 I had sitting in the gunsafe on other things. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:07:17 AM EDT
[#12]
WTF?
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:12:38 AM EDT
[#13]
This rifle's like Duke Nukem Forever; I'll be able to retire before it comes out
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:15:55 AM EDT
[#14]
I'm sure the results of the election, and the fact that the product would more than likely have a limited life. They probably figured it wasn't enough time to either produce, sell, or do both before being legislated out of existence.
RIP |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:19:53 AM EDT
[#15]
Quoted:
This rifle's like Duke Nukem Forever; I'll be able to retire before it comes out "I've got balls of steeeeeeel" |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:22:05 AM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
What in blue hell does that vague statement mean? that's what I'm saying |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:24:45 AM EDT
[#17]
Fuck the ACR.
Robinson 
LWRC 
POF 
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:24:55 AM EDT
[#18]
Fuck'em, keep it.
I'll buy another AR. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:27:05 AM EDT
[#19]
Does this mean more UBRs can be built and shipped?
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:29:12 AM EDT
[#20]
Bushmaster: "hey, my foot! I think I'll shoot it!"
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:31:16 AM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:
Fuck the ACR. Robinson http://www.onpointsupply.com/images/robinson_arms_xcr_1.gif http://www.onpointsupply.com/images/robinson_arms_xcr_2.gif I do have 2 of those, but I was still looking forward to the ACR. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:32:35 AM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
Quoted:
This rifle's like Duke Nukem Forever; I'll be able to retire before it comes out "I've got balls of steeeeeeel" NSFW http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IE3KdcTgrno |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:34:23 AM EDT
[#23]
Quoted: Yup....it's largely political. Unless you have the $$$ for lobbying .mil and important .gov folks with hookers and blow, and a job when they get out, you are fighting a steep uphill battle.I don't know why the fuck they're even bothering. Either Colt, FN, or HK is going to win that contest, in that likely order, no matter how much better the other candidates are. Even if the Masada somehow DID manage to pull it off, the Army would find some way to screw Bushmaster/Magpul.. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:37:08 AM EDT
[#24]
Bushmaster/Remington thinks the ACR is strong enough to put forward as a M4 replacement. They believe any delay in public release this causes is worth the risk involved. Trust me they are aware of the new administration and possiable laws that might be inacted.
With Bushmaster/Remington you have a large company planning to spend millions on setting up volume production on a new rifle just when the Military is looking for a service rifle replacement. It makes sense to see what feedback the military has prior to committing to production. Industry/Technology Day for the Future Improved Carbine Individual Weapon System (FICIWS) was held last week. Bushmaster/Remington was invited and demoed two, Gen three, ACRs. So the feedback has already started. Those wishing for an accelerated timeline for civilian release should call or email Bushmaster/Remington. Also the longer an AWB is averted the better chance we have for a release. For those still interested here is a Gen 3 version running through it's paces at an advanced course this week. 
This ACR did over 1000 rounds in under 20 minutes as a demo at the end of the course. Here is a youtube video of the end of the test... ACR Gen 3 -Youtube That is one hot gas block! |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:39:24 AM EDT
[#25]
*Edit - Disregard, this post is now obsolete.
So the design of the rifle was a complete failure, and they now have to redesign it before it can compete? So ACR = XM8, basically? Why am I not surprised that yet another wonder product turned out to be vaporware BS? 
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:39:27 AM EDT
[#26]
LOL thats a good rage...
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:42:08 AM EDT
[#27]
Quoted: Personally I prefer your PDR concept... |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:48:07 AM EDT
[#28]
Quoted:
*Edit - Disregard, this post is now obsolete. So the design of the rifle was a complete failure, and they now have to redesign it before it can compete? So ACR = XM8, basically? Why am I not surprised that yet another wonder product turned out to be vaporware BS?  Actually as demoed in the video the ACR runs quite well. The issue is that Bushmaster wants to find out if there are any details that would disqualify the ACR from the M4 replacement competition PRIOR to them spending millions setting up production. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:55:06 AM EDT
[#29]
Quoted: I'm no production manager, but if the item is still not anywhere near production, this thing is still a ways, if ever, from being produced. Quoted: *Edit - Disregard, this post is now obsolete. So the design of the rifle was a complete failure, and they now have to redesign it before it can compete? So ACR = XM8, basically? Why am I not surprised that yet another wonder product turned out to be vaporware BS? Actually as demoed in the video the ACR runs quite well. The issue is that Bushmaster wants to find out if there are any details that would disqualify the ACR from the M4 replacement competition PRIOR to them spending millions setting up production. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:56:13 AM EDT
[#30]
Quoted:
Bushmaster/Remington thinks the ACR is strong enough to put forward as a M4 replacement. They believe any delay in public release this causes is worth the risk involved. Trust me they are aware of the new administration and possiable laws that might be inacted. With Bushmaster/Remington you have a large company planning to spend millions on setting up volume production on a new rifle just when the Military is looking for a service rifle replacement. It makes sense to see what feedback the military has prior to committing to production. Industry/Technology Day for the Future Improved Carbine Individual Weapon System (FICIWS) was held last week. Bushmaster/Remington was invited and demoed two, Gen three, ACRs. So the feedback has already started. Those wishing for an accelerated timeline for civilian release should call or email Bushmaster/Remington. Also the longer an AWB is averted the better chance we have for a release. For those still interested here is a Gen 3 version running through it's paces at an advanced course this week. http://www.magpul.com/pics/acr_shoot.jpg This ACR did over 1000 rounds in under 20 minutes as a demo at the end of the course. Here is a youtube video of the end of the test... ACR Gen 3 -Youtube That is one hot gas block! You could tell the first guy shooting in the vid was really used to using AR-15s. Everytime he did a mag change he tried to hit the bolt release where it would be on an AR-15. 
Second guy really knew how to work the weapon, mag changes went very smooth for him. 
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Posted: 11/21/2008 6:56:37 AM EDT
[#31]
Unfortunately, knowing how these things work, Colt will win the new contract, regardless of how good/bad their offering is. It will be a "gimme" to keep Leiberman happy and voting with the Dems, since Colt is based out of CT.
Yes, I am cynical. 
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:03:20 AM EDT
[#32]
Quoted:
Quoted:
*Edit - Disregard, this post is now obsolete. So the design of the rifle was a complete failure, and they now have to redesign it before it can compete? So ACR = XM8, basically? Why am I not surprised that yet another wonder product turned out to be vaporware BS? Actually as demoed in the video the ACR runs quite well. The issue is that Bushmaster wants to find out if there are any details that would disqualify the ACR from the M4 replacement competition PRIOR to them spending millions setting up production. So basically, Bushmaster is not satisfied that the weapon system is good enough for production yet, even though it runs like a Swiss clock. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:08:10 AM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm no production manager, but if the item is still not anywhere near production, this thing is still a ways, if ever, from being produced.
Actually as demoed in the video the ACR runs quite well. The issue is that Bushmaster wants to find out if there are any details that would disqualify the ACR from the M4 replacement competition PRIOR to them spending millions setting up production. Yep With Bushmaster/Remington you have a large company planning to spend millions on setting up volume production on a new rifle just when the Military is looking for a service rifle replacement. It makes sense to see what feedback the military has prior to committing to production. Planning on setting up production. If they're still in the planning stage they then don't have the machines, don't have the line, don't have the inevitable bugs of new production worked out, don't have any additional people that might be needed, etc. etc. etc. And since they're redesigning the gun, I bet there will have to be changes made to any of the plans that currently exist. So, 2010, 2011? |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:09:18 AM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm no production manager, but if the item is still not anywhere near production, this thing is still a ways, if ever, from being produced.
Quoted:
*Edit - Disregard, this post is now obsolete. So the design of the rifle was a complete failure, and they now have to redesign it before it can compete? So ACR = XM8, basically? Why am I not surprised that yet another wonder product turned out to be vaporware BS? Actually as demoed in the video the ACR runs quite well. The issue is that Bushmaster wants to find out if there are any details that would disqualify the ACR from the M4 replacement competition PRIOR to them spending millions setting up production. Production tooling such as Dies and Injection molds are completed. The rifle shownin the picture is a completely Bushmaster built and assembled gun with the excepting of the polymer parts that were supplied by Magpul. What Bushmaster wants to do is to get as much information from the military as to the requirements of the M4 replacement so they can include testing and any changes required into a production line PRIOR to setting up the production/inspection pipeline. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:10:41 AM EDT
[#35]
Quoted:
Production tooling such as Dies and Injection molds are completed. The rifle shownin the picture is a completely Bushmaster built and assembled gun with the excepting of the polymer parts that were supplied by Magpul. What Bushmaster wants to do is to get as much information from the military as to the requirements of the M4 replacement so they can include testing and any changes required into a production line PRIOR to setting up the production/inspection pipeline. That makes sense from their perspective, but as you can see in this thread there is the potential for a large pitchforks and torches response to that decision. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:11:17 AM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
*Edit - Disregard, this post is now obsolete. So the design of the rifle was a complete failure, and they now have to redesign it before it can compete? So ACR = XM8, basically? Why am I not surprised that yet another wonder product turned out to be vaporware BS? Actually as demoed in the video the ACR runs quite well. The issue is that Bushmaster wants to find out if there are any details that would disqualify the ACR from the M4 replacement competition PRIOR to them spending millions setting up production. So basically, Bushmaster is not satisfied that the weapon system is good enough for production yet, even though it runs like a Swiss clock. Sounds kinda like those t-mags we've all seen pics of and been waiting forever for! Guess I'm off to figure out what to spend the ACR fund on instead... |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:11:22 AM EDT
[#37]
I knew there would be delays once Bushmaster took over. They want Colt's contract, and they figured the only way to do it was with a new rifle.
Magpul probably would of released by now, although production numbers probably wouldn't of been as high. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:12:17 AM EDT
[#38]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
*Edit - Disregard, this post is now obsolete. So the design of the rifle was a complete failure, and they now have to redesign it before it can compete? So ACR = XM8, basically? Why am I not surprised that yet another wonder product turned out to be vaporware BS? Actually as demoed in the video the ACR runs quite well. The issue is that Bushmaster wants to find out if there are any details that would disqualify the ACR from the M4 replacement competition PRIOR to them spending millions setting up production. So basically, Bushmaster is not satisfied that the weapon system is good enough for production yet, even though it runs like a Swiss clock. Please see my above post. The issue is they do not know what specifics the M4 replacement will be tested for in terms of form, function etc. They might have to include or remove some feature to allow it to compete. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:14:56 AM EDT
[#39]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm no production manager, but if the item is still not anywhere near production, this thing is still a ways, if ever, from being produced.
Quoted:
*Edit - Disregard, this post is now obsolete. So the design of the rifle was a complete failure, and they now have to redesign it before it can compete? So ACR = XM8, basically? Why am I not surprised that yet another wonder product turned out to be vaporware BS? Actually as demoed in the video the ACR runs quite well. The issue is that Bushmaster wants to find out if there are any details that would disqualify the ACR from the M4 replacement competition PRIOR to them spending millions setting up production. Production tooling such as Dies and Injection molds are completed. The rifle shownin the picture is a completely Bushmaster built and assembled gun with the excepting of the polymer parts that were supplied by Magpul. What Bushmaster wants to do is to get as much information from the military as to the requirements of the M4 replacement so they can include testing and any changes required into a production line PRIOR to setting up the production/inspection pipeline. So basically, the weapon system is good-to-go, but Bushmaster doesn't know what the .mil wants the M4 replacement to be capable of, so production is waiting just in case the .mil says the replacement weapon has to toast bread and pick up satellite radio, too. ;) The ACR is a great weapon system. As long as it's as or more rugged than the M4, I doubt anything would need to be changed. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:15:59 AM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Production tooling such as Dies and Injection molds are completed. The rifle shownin the picture is a completely Bushmaster built and assembled gun with the excepting of the polymer parts that were supplied by Magpul. What Bushmaster wants to do is to get as much information from the military as to the requirements of the M4 replacement so they can include testing and any changes required into a production line PRIOR to setting up the production/inspection pipeline. That makes sense from their perspective, but as you can see in this thread there is the potential for a large pitchforks and torches response to that decision. That is fine. We spent our own money on this project, no taxpayers funds were used, so we are the ones with the most to lose. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:16:17 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
*Edit - Disregard, this post is now obsolete. So the design of the rifle was a complete failure, and they now have to redesign it before it can compete? So ACR = XM8, basically? Why am I not surprised that yet another wonder product turned out to be vaporware BS? Actually as demoed in the video the ACR runs quite well. The issue is that Bushmaster wants to find out if there are any details that would disqualify the ACR from the M4 replacement competition PRIOR to them spending millions setting up production. So basically, Bushmaster is not satisfied that the weapon system is good enough for production yet, even though it runs like a Swiss clock. Please see my above post. The issue is they do not know what specifics the M4 replacement will be tested for in terms of form, function etc. They might have to include or remove some feature to allow it to compete. I hear what you're saying, you're going to have a lot of unhappy people regardless.
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:16:56 AM EDT
[#42]
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:17:37 AM EDT
[#43]
So why not start cranking out lowers for the public? At Least we can get in on the fun that way....
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:20:23 AM EDT
[#44]
will be available to select customers in 2009.
I read that as "Military and LE only". meh it became vaporware the minute MagPul signed off the project. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:21:26 AM EDT
[#45]
Quoted:
So why not start cranking out lowers for the public? At Least we can get in on the fun that way.... With the ACR, it's the upper receiver that is serialized. |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:22:27 AM EDT
[#46]
I was hoping to pick one up. Hopefully they will be released within the next year.
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:25:13 AM EDT
[#47]
Well, if by some miracle they aren't banned, and they do in fact make it to market (not holding my breath anymore) I will pick one up as my college graduation present to myself. However, I am almost positive now that I will never see a civilian ACR on the market. Looks like my roommate was right...
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:27:16 AM EDT
[#48]
The .mil writes a requirement for the test. If there is one thing one your entry that isn't in the requirement your entry (no matter how good it is) is disqualified.
It makes complete sense to wait for the requirement list to see if there are any minor changes to make your entry fit the round hole. Here's to hoping for a successful entry and production available to civilians in the future. yak |
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:30:18 AM EDT
[#49]
any chance you guys (Magpul) will send the Mossoud to a more civilian friendly company like RRA soon?
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Posted: 11/21/2008 7:33:42 AM EDT
[#50]
First the billet lower, now this.
I think I'll just use the cash I had saved up to buy a Sig 556 and take some wear and tear off my 550.
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