Dear AR15.COM,

I am already pissed off at the terrorists (whoever they are) that attacked America on Tuesday.  However, as I read the posts on this board, it depresses me.  While some here show restraint, others offer hatred and desire for mass destruction of anyone remotely involved in this heineous act.  It seems the majority have already decided that the Afganistani's are responsible and need to be punished with all out war.

I'm not sure what is an appropriate response by our government.  What level of retribution is right?  Is Afganistan responsible?  Is it appropriate to bomb Afganistan?   Should innocent citizens there be killed because of the actions of their govt?  The Taliban is not an elected group to my knowledge.  

If we bomb Kabul, I won't dance in the street.  it will further depress me.  Even if I decide to myself this is an appropriate response to prevent future terrorism, the deaths of innocents won't be a joyful event.

I don't have the answers.  I do want our government to act in a manner that will reduce or prevent further acts of terrorism on Americans.  If those acts require military action - so be it.  But I won't  celebrate the death of innocents of any color or background.

James

[size=3][b]E X A C T L Y[/b][/size=3]

While I understand how someone could come to form your particular point of view let me remind you that the very definition of war itself includes non-combattants being killed.

War is unkind, ugly and very dark.  

Did the terrorists mind attacking an area heavily populated with our "innocents"?

[b]NO![/b]

Did the terrorists care for the lives of the men, women and children on board those aircraft?

[b]NO![/b]

I personally will not rejoice over the dying of innocent peoples in any circumstances.

But, in trusting that our military will take every precaution to ensure that innocents do not die I will gladly accept the fact that the nature of the attacks will cause a certain number of civilian casualties.

Anyone who even remotely had/has anything to do with Bin Laden is not innocent.

Any country who knowingly allows him sanctuary is not innocent and will unfortunately pay a part of their price in the lives of their citizens.

And, in my narrow minded view of this world, anyone who does not cooperate with the US is also guilty of having the blood of all those people from all over the world on their hands as well.

We cannot and we must not loose sight of our objective here:  Bin Laden and his followers must die.

And for what its worth.............I too am angry beyond words and quite depressed as well.

My first concern though goes to those who may have survived and the fireman, police and other rescue workers and secondly to those they left behind.

... sure, a clean 1200 yard, single shot from a Barrett .50 cal. M82A1 through Assman bin Losers forehead would be grand. But he isn't gonna allow that and he isn't the only problem.

OHMIGOD!  we're beginning to agree more than we disagree.   hmmmm.  anybody checked Hell lately?  they must be passing out the parkas.  [:D]

No shit!

Yes if they were even remotely involved in this.  No for citizens of this or any other country not involved.

So what are we supposed to do?  Try to say, "It's all gonna be all right."?

No, in order to end this depression, we (I say 'we' because I have felt just as you have) must come to grips with who we are at war with.  A Cult.  Not the Religion of Islam, the Cult of Islam.  There is a large, distinct difference that I know, related to me by many who I know that have been to the Middle East.  It's like California going up against the Klu Klux Klan.

With this knowledge, we must then go on to consider how to get rid of this Cult.  It's not pretty, but it has been done before.

I'll point out Germany as an example.  In the 1970's there was an influx of terrorism in that country that had lasted for the previous 12 years.  Finally they got sick of it, and decided to finish it and the terrorists once and for all.

They completely restricted immigration.  Now they are criticized for this, but you do have to realize that with any form of Immigration comes both people and their problems.

They broke the rules.  They did not announce what they were going to do, nor did they ask for a country's permission to do it - they just waited until known terrorists and known terrorist brokers messed up just once, and blew them all to **** with extreme prejiduce.

Lastly, they cut off funding.  Ever look at the price of gas in Germany?  Not exactly cheep.  They do not have the political connections to Saudi Arabia that the US has, and so they do not contribute to the possible (probable?) "terrorist fund" that Saudi Arabia has.

Coming to grips that these measures will not be pretty, and above all that they will take several years to impliment, will help get rid of the depression and feelings of "what are we going to do now?" that we (or at least I) have.  Be prepared to wait 6 months before the first measures, either economic or military, are executed.  Be prepared for a two year limited war.  I know that both Collin Powell and Norman Schwarzkopf know this is true - they have said it and implied it.

Even if we did know who did this, we have to build up our Military.  Since the Clintion admin. first took hold, we have cut the budget of the military many times.  It will take time, but it will happen.

We can't win in the short run - that's part of the terrorist plan.  We can win in the long run - that's why they are banking on short memories and short attention spans of Americans.  Now let's pick up our attitudes and elongate our memories.  

And be patient.

Thanks all for remaining civil.  We are Americans and we CAN disagree.

For myself, I do not wish to see any invasion of Afganistan.  I do not think they are directly responsible.  Their crime is sheltering shitbags like Bin Laden.  For that crime, you don't kill thousands of civilians.  There is a suitable punishment, which I hope our govt can figure out.  Perhaps surgical strikes against some members of the govt that approve of people like Bin Laden.  I don't know.

For the people actually responsible for the terrorism, there is only one punishment.  But, we need to get them without having to murder thousands of innocents to do so.

We all want vengeance.  But vengeance on the wrong people is false, and worse than no vengeance.

James

Guys,
Did the afghani people [b]vote[/b] to have the taliban as their government?  No. How can we hold a whole country responsible for the acts of a government that siezed power? The people of Germany and Japan and Italy deserved what they got in WWII because the were not merely tacitly approving of the course, they were actively involved. This contrasts greatly with the majority of Afghani people.

-CK

And who is the threat?

Muslims, Arabs? who? What if next week we find out it was the Germans. Should my family and me fear for our safety because of our last name.    The lines are not easily drawn.

-CK