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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:37:28 PM EDT
[#1]
i would trust an athiest before i would trust someone who based their decisions on what they think is "god's will" or "what will serve god best" and i'm not sure what you mean by "cafeteria morals." religion doesnt have a monopoly on morals, they just like to think they do. there are some values that transcend religious boundaries, and they all focus on not imposing your will to the detriment of others. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:37:46 PM EDT
[#2]
I hold no contempt for you based on your views as an atheist. But would I encourage my daughter to marry you? Absolutely not. Why not? Well, does it make sense to encourage people with utterly different philosophies on life to marry? Absolutely not. There are enough conflicts in a marriage without piling them up before the marriage begins.
Stalin? Mao? Pol Pot? You really want to pull at that thread?? |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:39:37 PM EDT
[#3]
Those people didn't kill people for atheism. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:40:55 PM EDT
[#4]
Don't be silly, many many many people in this country believe in a God and are horrible people. You can't judge someone on thier religion or lack there of but rather what they are like as an individual. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:41:29 PM EDT
[#5]
you're right, i was probably premature to call you ignorant on the subject, however, i do strongly disagree with you on the agenda issue. i don't think athiests have an agenda any more than any other religion. muslims definately have an agenda, as do christians, jews, and anyother religion. it's just that if you are part of a group you do not see their agenda. i'll agree there are athiests out there with an agenda, same as any others. personally i am not offended by someone's beliefs, though i do get highly offended when they do not respect mine. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:50:25 PM EDT
[#6]
Baloney. The original quote was "atheists are not blowing up things and beheading people". ' The point of which was to try and blame all the violence we currently see in the news on religious people and to assume a smug sense of moral superiority by lumping the guy who will be going to church tomorrow morning and serving the elderly with the head chopping lunatics in Iraq. A tactic that is utterly rediculous and insufferably puerile. History demonstrates that some of the most inhuman treatment of people came at the hands of people who recognized no god, namely guys like Stalin, Mao, etcetera. Thus Tannerite's trite attempt at moral superiority falls flat on its face. And now suddenly the definition has changed to "well....they weren't killing in the name of atheism!". That too is either a lie or the product of ignorance. Care to guess how many Christian missionaries and ministers and followers have been killed in Communist China? Russia? Why were these people killed? Why were ANY of the people killed by these brutal regimes? To promote the power of the state and to crush the dissent of anyone who opposed the states power, regardless of the reason they opposed it. If tjhe state was not your God, then the state would crush you. So YES, they WERE killing in the name of atheism, in the name of denying any power greater than their own. If you want to play pin-the-attrocity-on-the-belief-system, we can go round and round all night. Name a philosophy or an idea and I guarantee we can find violent monsters who claimed it, and absolute saints that claimed it. So cut this nonsense out already. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:53:44 PM EDT
[#7]
From a telephone sampling of more than 2,000 households, university researchers found that Americans rate atheists below Muslims, recent immigrants, gays and lesbians and other minority groups in “sharing their vision of American society.” Atheists are also the minority group most Americans are least willing to allow their children to marry.
Thats funny I rate Muslims below atheists. If I had kids I rather them marry a atheist more then anything. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:54:05 PM EDT
[#8]
i believe that this wording satisfies both sides of the argument? |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:54:55 PM EDT
[#9]
I'd like to know where gun-owners rank in such a study (IF it IS a real study, that is).
All I know is that around my parts, we're a pretty damn unpopular minority, and atheism seems to be the state-mandated religion - guess where I reside? (granted it's mainly due to naivety, which is quickly corrected using the right methods, not everyone can be reached and/or talked some sense into) |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 5:57:52 PM EDT
[#10]
Your analogy in not logical. One can absolutely group people/places/things into a group for NOT believing in something. For example, one arfcom specific : people that believe in the 2nd amendment and the people that don't believe in it. The people that don't believe in it are definately in a group. not picking on ya, just pointing out your flawed logic 
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Posted: 3/25/2006 6:02:30 PM EDT
[#11]
One's religious ideology, or lack thereof, has no more to do with his capacity to perpetrate evil than does his astrological sign.
In other news, according to a laundromat survey conducted by Dr. Skane Jarbunkle of East Surinam State Polytechnic, parents would rather their daughters (and sons as well) marry the man below than an atheist, not because he is religious, but because he recently saved 6 metric ASSLOADS of money on his car insurance by switching to Geico!  
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Posted: 3/25/2006 6:17:03 PM EDT
[#12]
First off, NT stated last i checked, athiests are not blowing up things and beheading people.... He did not add "in the name of atheism." So his point is simply false. People who were atheists have in fact slaughtered between 100 and 200 million people just in the last 100 years. Secondly, many millions of those were killed BECAUSE they were not athiests. Behind the Iron Curtain and in China and elsewhere (Cuba, North Korea, Cambodia, Vietnam etc.) people of faith were indeed being rounded up, tortured, shot, sent to the Gulag, etc. all in the name of atheism. Benjamin Franklin once quiped that one of America's better qualities was that "ahteism is unkown there" and that a person could live a good long life without ever "having to meet an atheist." (He also added "or infidel" but that would just get him called "taliban" by some of the publikly edjumecated here). |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 6:25:41 PM EDT
[#13]
I am an athiest, I believe in science and logic. I don't base any of it on faith but on observations, if something cannont be explained I will try to find an explanation. I would never try and talk someone out of their religion, it is a choice they would have to make on their own. I do find it highly offencive when they try and push their religion on me or even assume that I believe the same thing they do. Morally you don't need a god to tell you how to act, treat people with respect and dignity and you will be ok. I am always friendly when talking to people unless they give me a reason to not be friendly. I see alot of religios people who treat other people far worse just for being different than them. By no means am I saying that every person that believes in one religion or another are like that, far from it. Some of the best people I know are religious, but do I think that religion made then the good people? No. It would be their parents and a choice they have made on their own. That being said I also see many athiests that treat other people like dirt for believing in something. Treat people with respect and how you would want to be treated if the roles were reversed and everyone would be much happier
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Posted: 3/25/2006 6:32:37 PM EDT
[#14]
couldnt have said it better myself. i agree 100% |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:10:38 PM EDT
[#15]
I was clearly talking about believing in the existence of something, I even gave examples. Your comparison to the 2nd amendment is whether someone agrees with it or not. Even anti-firearm people still know that the 2nd exists, they just want to get rid of it. Next time you try to say someone has flawed logic, please think about your own post first as to not make a fool out of yourself, thank you  P.S. I guess you are also in a group with child molesters and terrorists since, like them, you do not believe in Unicorns, correct? |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:19:39 PM EDT
[#16]
Atheism is a logical fallacy.
You cannot disprove the existence of G*d anymore than you can prove that G*d exists. Best you can do is be Agnostic. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:25:39 PM EDT
[#17]
 You don't have to have proof of something to believe in it. On the other hand, you don't have to have the ability to disprove something to not believe in it. The only fallacy here is your post. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:29:23 PM EDT
[#18]
edited to show it goes both ways |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:29:50 PM EDT
[#19]
I'm also an atheist, and I have no agenda. I don't object to the pledge of allegiance, nor do I object to most religions  . Religion is just useless for me.
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:30:51 PM EDT
[#20]
Know why people hate atheists?
Cause they're so fucking tedious. If my daughter married an atheist I'd have to listen to him hooting about wonderfully liberated and superior he is for the rest of my life. yeah, you're not encumbered by superstition, you're manly enough to go it alone, you're in control of your life we get it already now STFU PS - Anyone who thinks Hitler killed jews because they offended his Christian beliefs doesn't have much understanding of nazis or european culture. Hitler was not a Christian, he tipped his hat once in a while toward Christians when he wanted their support. He often complained about Christians, he thought they were too soft. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:31:35 PM EDT
[#21]
I will go with logic, thank you very much.
ETA: Agnostic here. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:32:10 PM EDT
[#22]
No it is not. Faith: Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence. I do not believe in God or any religion because there is no logical proof or material evidence. Therefore, my lack of belief is not by definition "faith". If someone writes a book, and starts a religion based on it, and I choose not to practice said religion, I do not have faith in it. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:33:15 PM EDT
[#23]
This is false. Religion is not the only source of morals, nor it is always the best source. For example, I can say that I like the morals of Christianity more than Islam. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:33:16 PM EDT
[#24]
meaning? if by "logic" you mean that you aspire all that is unknown to a supernatural being, and reject hard evidence that may contradict your belief that a supernatural being did the event in question? if that's your definition of logic, i will steer clear of that |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:33:19 PM EDT
[#25]
Now I am a Christian, and I get to hear people of all religions talk about how much better their chosen faith it. However, atheists usually don't talk about religion or faith at all. You are just using that as a way to bash atheists, you know it's not fact, you just choose to not follow in Christ's footsteps. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:37:50 PM EDT
[#26]
Study it sometime. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:37:53 PM EDT
[#27]
yes, my life's ambition is to bash atheists.  atheists are acting that way in this very thread. so i guess it is fact. don't try so hard, pal |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:37:54 PM EDT
[#28]
Here is why I, personally, find atheists so fucking annoying.
Blind Faith in a supreme being, an arbiter of right and wrong = silly and superstitious Blind Faith in nothing, a meaningless life, where "human rationality" is key = enlightened. I don't put much stock in their opinions anyhow - most of them are my fellow college students, people angry at God, people who seek to justify their own immorality, or liberals. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:39:43 PM EDT
[#29]
A quick look at your history shows a VERY large portion of your posts bash atheists, so I guess some might consider that your life's ambition... |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:41:52 PM EDT
[#30]
i got plenty of time to study religious "logic" in my 13 years of catholic school. nothing inspires athiests quite like catholic school |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:42:53 PM EDT
[#31]
That does not describe atheism. Please explain how not believing in a supreme being is a "blind faith". I choose not to believe in what I see as an elaborate work of fiction. Religions are not based on science, but that is not the say they are not without merit. I wont get into that here though. Believing in something without any scientific proof is faith. Not believing anything is not a faith. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:45:48 PM EDT
[#32]
try as people might, they can't lump athiests into one general group. athiests span every strata of society. to say that athiests believe in a "meaningless life" is dead wrong. that's all i believe in is to lead the most meaningful life as i can, and personally, i think people who dedicate their life to "doing god's will" are not getting as much meaning out of life as they can, but again, that's my opinion YMMV |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:46:22 PM EDT
[#33]
some of you forget that atheists and religious types both fall into two categories:
1. decent folk 2. fucking annoying types that get in your face about your (lack of) religion a lot of people are revealing themselves to be #2, which isn't surprising considering the subject of the thread |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:46:54 PM EDT
[#34]
Life is what YOU make of it, religious or not. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:50:49 PM EDT
[#35]
 The belief of a lack of a belief is a belief in itself. What you said amounts to saying "There are no certainties in life" That in itself is a certainty. Not believing in anything is having faith that there is nothing to believe in. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 8:55:59 PM EDT
[#36]
Well, I am a Christian, believe in the Bible, Christ's propitiation for my sin, etc...
I could care less if you're an Athiest. God calls who He wills, and that's that (yes, I'm also a Calvinist). Doesn't mean you're not a stand up guy, just someone God's chosen to leave in sin... Sound's cold, but thats the way I see it. Unless the Holy Spirit enables you to come to faith, you're not coming. BTW: Unlike most Christians, because you haven't been called, I don't expect you to accept or have a Judeo-Christian moral conscience. Animals do what they're programmed to do for the most part... That last line was meant to be tongue-in-cheek, for you ultra sensitive types...
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:00:07 PM EDT
[#37]
Mor people have been killed in the name of god than for any other reason. Religion will end all of mankind because people so foolishly need to believe in something that they will kill for it. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:02:05 PM EDT
[#38]
There are plenty of certainties in life. Science is that which can be replicated. You are right that you can't say with 100 percent certainty that there is no supreme being. It's foolish to think that. But "religion" to me is believing in a certain set of ideals and myths. Take the bible for example. It's a book written by many people over a long period of time. I see it as no more than a fiction book. Anyone can write a book and get a religious following, there are plenty of people who will blindly believe what he or she wrote is true. They will then tell their kids that it's true, and if they don't believe it, they will go to hell. That's a great way to get followers. I do not believe in a supreme being, but I can't say with 100% certaintity that there is not one. However, I can say with 100 percent certainty that the events described in the bible did not take place. Same with all the other "holy books" out there. There is no scientific evidence to support it. And the lack of consistency in all of them reveal that religion was primitive man's attempt to explain the environment around them (before scientific explanations were possible). In my opinion, it all comes down to "heaven or hell". If there was no promise of eternal happiness or torment, most people would not feel the need to follow a particular religion. They wouldn't teach their kids about the religion, the kids would learn science as usual, and there would be no conflict between the two. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:14:30 PM EDT
[#39]
that's a really good point. i'd love to see how many people would follow religion if there werent a promise of something after death. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:18:23 PM EDT
[#40]
In before this is moved to the religion forum.
I'm agnostic; I wonder how we rate on that scale? Probably about the same as atheists. I once had a teacher (Buddhist, if I remember correctly, but it was hippy-Buddhism) say (not specifically directed at me, but at the class) that she could respect anybody who decided what to believe, but she couldn't respect agnostics. She very quickly backpeddled when I mentioned I was agnostic, but I brought it up every time she gave me a bad grade. That made her really mad, too. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:24:57 PM EDT
[#41]
So from what I have gathered in this thread, science is the new religion of the athiest. How many of you "athiests" are currently in college? How many of you are studying "science". What is your field of study? This should be interesting...
Edit: I've read a lot of hatred toward religious people from "athiests" in this thread. I've read you hate their symbolism. You say you are 100% positive that nothing in the bible ever happened. But then say that you can't be 100% sure there is no God. That's very interesting... |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:27:47 PM EDT
[#42]
i am currently in college. some of the science courses i have taken that have direct contradictions to the religious dogma that i learned in catholic high school: Biology Anthropology Geology if there's one thing i have learned from studying science: THE REAL ANSWER IS ALWAYS OUT THERE! if we don't know now, we will eventually know. just because the question can't be answered right now, it does not mean that the answer is not out there, or that the answer is supernatural. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:29:52 PM EDT
[#43]
Please do not call science a "religion". That is probably the most blatant oxymoron that I have ever heard. I am currently in college, and I am studying science. My intended major is engineering. Religion has always conflicted with science, but gradually accepts scientific explanations of natural phenomena. Example: everything orbits the earth. This was the belief the Catholic church fiercly held on to for a long time. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:31:26 PM EDT
[#44]
<----not in college, no college science classes taken. eta: I do not belong to a religion. I didn't "join" atheism. I simply don't believe in gods because I see no convincing reason to believe that any of them exist. I do not subscribe to any set of beliefs other than my own so it is silly to say that I belong to a religion that doesn't exist. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:31:40 PM EDT
[#45]
What year are you? Must be freshman or sophomore if you aren't studying in your major yet. Edit: You and your "athiest" friends are using science just like a religion. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck... |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:33:07 PM EDT
[#46]
Sophomore. It's really hard to study my major when I have 3 more math classes to take before I can even take any of the classes. 
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:36:05 PM EDT
[#47]
I don't know what "friends" you are referring to, but I do not do this. I just don't like it when people get attacked for supporting the sciences. Without science (which goes against religion), you wouldn't be typing this right now. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:38:29 PM EDT
[#48]
I am a science person also. I have a BS degree in engineering and worked on a masters for 2.5 years. In your science classes, did you ever learn anything that disproved the existance of a God? I'm not talking about debunking mythology. I'm talking about disproving a God's existance. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:40:01 PM EDT
[#49]
You have a set of beliefs your follow. You made a conscious decision to follow them. Yes, you did "join" atheism. |
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Posted: 3/25/2006 9:40:06 PM EDT
[#50]
I disagree with your statement. Science, unlike religion, has verifiable results, which doesn't require faith. |
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