There are allways two sides of the story...

and this kind of divisive behavior yields us what?

and on this issue, i'm afraid there are not two sides.  there is only one.  one is right and the other is definitely not.  there cannot be truth to both.  regardless of which side you believe is right.

okay, knee-jerk reaction being re-evaluated.  should Dacon merely be bonding with other non-Christians on this board, i apologize for jumping the gun.  i do not believe however that this is the sole reason for this post.  hence, my original response.  to each his own, yes.  but it works both ways.  let us not bring up our own for the sake of minimizing the other.

if his intent was to determine what the leanings were of those members who did NOT respond to the "who loves Jesus"  thread, then i applaud his curiosity.  but if it wasn't, i cannot think of a reason for bringing up this topic other than to stir up trouble.  that is what i meant in my original post.

So, it's not divisive to say "Who loves Jesus?" but it's divisive to say "Who doesn't?"
I suggest you look up the word "hypocricy" in the dictionary.

My question is,

why give [i]some[/i] a chance who have shown thier behaviorial trends...

but shirk Jesus???

I mean, what did Jesus ever do so wrong?

McUzi, don't drink and type.

So....lets see, the antis cheer and capitalize whenever they see disention in the ranks. So glad to see you doing your part to start a pissing contest. If you dissagree,fine. say so. It is your right to have a differing opinion right or wrong.
I've got a great idea! Let's move on.

I've got a great question! Why didn't you post this on the "Sound off if you love Jesus" thread too?
Just one more person that should look up the "H" word.

Yes,

Lets move along...

BTW Praise Jesus...

I am certainly not ashamed to speak up for what I beleive in.................but.................arguing over it is pointless.

More importantly in our case is the question of why in the world would you start a topic of this nature?

I agree with Phoenix5.  

Because someone else felt free to start the thread "Sound off if you love Jesus." Does ANYONE remember that thread?
My GOD (if you'll pardon the expression), don't you people have any sense of shame?  Basically what you're saying is, it's perfectly all right to start a thread celebrating YOUR belief, but not all right to start a thread for those that express a different opinion.
I am sorely disappointed in the lack of perspective that some of you show.

It's the way you named your topic, It's just gonna cause conflicts

Whew ARlady!!

Glad you re-evaluated your position!!

You were starting to sound REAL REAL SCARY!!!


To Dacon....

FELLOW ATHIEST REPORTING IN!!!


Keep the faithlessness!!!!!

I don't love Jesus, he flaked on me so I had to hire Jose, my new landscaper. [;)]


[rolleyes]

I do not have a problem with Christ.  I do have a problem with most of the Christains that I meet, at least the ones who put their piety on constant public display.  They seem to have a (God given?) talent for consistently hiding behind Christ's robes and at the same time unerringly avoiding his footsteps.  When someone starts telling me about how righteous they are, I merely nod and make a mental note, DO NOT TRUST!

To reply to the question of the thread, I don't love Jesus in the same way I love my family, but I do appreciate the value in his teachings.
I do think that Paul twisted a lot of what Jesus said to match his own prejudices.
As laid out by Jesus and the very first Christians, Christianity was plainly a religion for the opressed, downtrodden and enslaved.  Paul took it and tried to make it a religion that would fit the ruling class as well as the ruled, and later the established church would try to turn it into a religion that firmly enforced the notion of a ruling nobility and a ruled peasantry that should accept its place.
Frankly, it's a scenario that's been seen with every reformer and every religion that grew out of their teachings.
It always starts with a reformer railing against the inequities and nonsenical teachings of the established religion, and basically preaching the same thing: that God loves us and we should love Him and treat others as we would like to be treated.  Then, sometimes even before the reformer dies, the religion he begins is co-opted by an established priesthood and turned into something just as regimented and unequal as the one he overthrew.
So, to quote Winston Zedimor from Ghostbusters, "I like Jesus' style..."
But I don't love him except in the sense that I "love" Thomas Jefferson, John Locke and Carl Sagan...I love their ideas.

I guess it's a "don't ask don't tell" type thing huh? Are people who are "openly" atheist not worthy of helping the fight? I'm paralleling to the homo issues because it seems to me "typical" right wingers will always show their true colors whenever these things come up. They'd like to cut up the bill of rights just as much as klinton would...just different parts. I see it and I consider myself one of you (right-winger). The libs/antis cheer and capitalize more when they see an opportunity to point out the backwoods intolerant redneck attitude they are always telling everyone about.

I don't see how the poster started a pissing match anymore than a topic like "Chevy Tahoe owners sound off" or "350sbc vs. 351w" I'll tell you what I see, I see a topic certain people don't like and this is their way of telling everyone how wrong they are. The original Jesus topic also, I saw it up for a few days, didn't even open it, [b]because it wasn't there for me[/b]. So if you do love Jesus why did you open this one? That insecure in your beliefs you gotta check up on the enemy? Now that I go back and open the original Jesus topic I don't see any atheist infiltrators doing they're own little brand of proseletyzing in there. So why the double standard? I know Rikwriter isn't the only one who sees it.

Would it be alright if we had any gay members and one of them decided to start a topic "sound off if your gay" I don't like how some of them like to make everyone know they're gay and in your face about in public, but other members have discussed and even started topics about their sex-lives so...I'd say it would be perfectly permissable and acceptable. Seeing as we have precedents set by other members that a persons sex-life can be talked about here. See what I mean yet?

As for Jesus, don't know the guy. From what I know of him he was a very good example of how to live your life in a selfless good way. I would like to say that I try to be like him, but that doesn't mean I don't screw up some times or that I need to believe in supernatural stuff.

All of us atheists are just waiting for the right Christian to come along and we'll finally convert.

Goatboy,

I used to pester my minister in Bible study about that same question.  He never could give me a satisfactory answer.. the Bible considers all creatures to be lesser to man and, from what he explained, devoid of a soul [i]but[/i] it doesn't specify what happens to them after they die.

Personally, I love the poem "The Rainbow Bridge."  I have loved and lost a lot of animals doing the work I do with stray and abused creatures... I would like to think it'll be a huge reunion when I cross over. [:)]


The Rainbow Bridge
inspired by a Norse legend

By the edge of a woods, at the foot of a hill,
Is a lush, green meadow where time stands still.
Where the friends of man and woman do run,
When their time on earth is over and done.

For here, between this world and the next,
Is a place where each beloved creature finds rest.
On this golden land, they wait and they play,
Till the Rainbow Bridge they cross over one day.

No more do they suffer, in pain or in sadness,
For here they are whole, their lives filled with gladness.
Their limbs are restored, their health renewed,
Their bodies have healed, with strength imbued.

They romp through the grass, without even a care,
Until one day they start, and sniff at the air.
All ears prick forward, eyes dart front and back,
Then all of a sudden, one breaks from the pack.

For just at that instant, their eyes have met;
Together again, both person and pet.
So they run to each other, these friends from long past,
The time of their parting is over at last.

The sadness they felt while they were apart,
Has turned into joy once more in each heart.
They embrace with a love that will last forever,
And then, side-by-side, they cross over… together.

As Jews don't believe in Jesus the Savior, I can accurately declare that most semites "Don't Love Jesus".  I would also think any other non-gentile religious folks on this board (however few there might be) would feel the same way, so in the spirit of non-dissention, I say let these non-Christians love/not love whoever they wish.

As for us Christians, however, I would HOPE that you would love Jesus...otherwise, you're not too much of a Christian after all [=\]

[brown]Evil Jewbroni~[/brown]

Oops I looked closer and I was completely wrong about that, ok now for the atheists. Are you that insecure in your beliefs you need to belittle those of others? Try and hold yourself to a higher standard even if you are like me and don't think anyones watching you trying to decide where to send you when you're done on earth.  You'll at least make more friends in the short time here on earth which we believe is ALL WE HAVE.

I am cool with Jesus, I just have a problem with all these people who say they speak for him.

Somehow I doubt Jesus speaks through Benny Hinn and Jerry Falwell.

In fact if the devil was here on earth, I believe he would take the form of a well dressed TV evangelist, like that Crystal Cathederal guy.

what was so scary about my post?

Duffypoo, which part of my post are you referring to the intolerance?  the first?  re-read my first post in this thread.  i qualify my statement.

if it's my second, think about it.  it has absolutely nothing to do with intolerance.  there either is God/Jesus/Holy Spirit or there is not.  there cannot be two sides to this story.  you can choose to believe that one side is true and the other is not, or vice versa.  but the reality is that only one of them CAN be true.  

and for all of you spouting that so many of us are lacking in the tolerance area, let me ask you a few questions:

where do you stand on abortion?
where do you stand on your RKBA?
where do you stand on government's role in your life?
where do you stand on education?

how much tolerance is there in your life for the other side of these issues?  i'll be the first to admit i'm fairly intolerant of a lot of things, most on that list.  religion is not one of them.  but there is a fine line between tolerating another person's differences and not believing that they are right.  as a Christian, any non-Christian belief is wrong.  but i have no problem tolerating that other beliefs exist and that people practice them.  i don't have to agree to tolerate.

for every non-Christian on this board who complains that Christians have no tolerance because they don't let up or they believe that people with other opinions are wrong, how many of you have said the same thing about antis?  how many have said that anyone who wants to take my guns away is wrong?  or that there is no "sensible" gun control, it's all and infringement on the 2nd amendment.  everyone should be raising his hand here.  i have.  and i'm proud of it.

Christians are operating under the same motivation:  they believe their side is the correct one and will support it, sometimes to the very end.  would you do any less for your RKBA?  i think not.  why do you expect Christians to do anything less for their religion?  that is the true hypocrisy on this board.

Several times in my lifetime, I tried to be Christian, to accept Christianity, Jesus, and God. For one reason or another, I just couldn’t buy into what other people believed. In this world, where EVERYBODY lies, I refuse to take another persons word on Christianity. The only person who I know will never lie to me… is me - I cannot lie to myself. I looked deep into my heart and decided to say a prayer, to pray to be given something to believe in. I did not ask for a miracle or any such thing, I only asked for truth.  I have never received an answer. It sure was not a lot to ask…

Tyler

sorry cant resist
sorry for the crappy pic i took it off a cafepress shop
[img]http://images.cafepress.com/zoom/97745_zoom.jpg[/img]

i want that shirt tick off the radical religiest extrimists [:D]-

Yada yada yada... I didn't read all of that other crap you guys wrote..

but I [b]don't[/b] love Jesus. So what?

I've been to church twice in my life, and they were both because I was obligated to go. Believe me, I didn't want to.

I personally think that we are no different from all other animals, we die, and rot in the ground. Just like fluffy, the poor little bunny rabbit.

I think that someone/someones were bored one day, and came up with this whole God/Lord/Jesus/Whatever thing. It was, and [b]IS[/b] just a way of explaining things that we can't understand, or do not know the answer to.

Plain and simple.

Just like the "Greek Gods". We all think that's silly, like Zeus throwing lightening down from the sky. It was simply just away to explain things that they could not understand.

Now that we have scientists, we can explain that. Some day, well will be able to explain our origin (monkeys), and realize that there is no God, no life after death, no nothing. You die, get eaten by bugs, that's it.


You will realize it is all a waste of time, when your time comes.


Fat Tire


---


FREE CAPTAIN OBVIOUS

Once again I am RIGHT !

Hat off to RikWriter the only one who understood the point.

I am not anti....anybody or anything.  As YOU hold your RIGHTS  high and "God forbide" some one mentiones the "2nd" to be abolished and imposes HIS views on YOU and you catch fire, YOU on the other hand are not willing to compromise with anything different and WANT to impose YOUR views on others. If ever will be a revolution and YOU win, will you put against the wall the ones that are different than YOU?
If this would be the future I better keep what I have now...

That attitude is the reason I am an atheist. We all talk about a "Tyrannical Government" but look at history to see what the christians have done to advance their agenda!

the questions were rhetorical in nature, and unlike you, a lot of people on this board feel far more strongly about the issues than do you.

my point was that there are some issues that people feel so strongly about that anything else is just plain wrong.  and to say that Christians are _______ (insert whatever word or phrase comes to mind) because they'll do the same thing for their belief is both hypocritical and intolerant, all things that Christians have been accused of being.

on a more personal note:  i will not lose my life protesting.  i will however gladly give my life for a cause.  living to fight another day is crap.  because the fight will never happen.  living to fight another day means always running away from something.  how can you fight if you're running away?  two very different things.  i'm pretty practical and pragmatic too.  but there always  comes a time when practicality and pragmatism are not enough.  it's often the quickest way to lose whatever it is you value most.

You hit it right on the head w/o even meaning to SS109.

Nowhere in the bible does it say to go forth as do Binny Hinn and Jerry Falwell, Jim Baker and the Crystal Cathedral folks.  It does say though that there are false prophets and that Satan uses these to try and distort the real things of God.  It also says that satan is on the earth roaming as a roaring lion seeking those whom he may devour.

Beware of these evangelists.  They are not from God.

Of course, those who do not beleive in God or satan should have no problem with any of them.......right?

hoeftjl, i think you must have misunderstood my  point.  i was not saying that only christianity is right.  i was saying that either christianity is right or it is not.  there cannot be truth to Jesus is the Son of God [i]and[/i] Jesus is not the Son of God.  Actually, my argument applies to any religion.  there either is or there is not a God.  there either is or there is not Allah.  there either is or is not_________(insert deity of choice).

there [b]ARE NOT[/b] two sides to the story in this sense.  there are people who believe two different things.  but only one group can be right.

that is what i meant.

and i'm sick of the double speak.  it's okay for all of us to "advance our agenda" of 2nd amendment rights because we're all convinced that our side is the right one.  but let us belong to some other group that some members don't agree with, and doing the same damn thing is intolerant and hypocritical?  

Dacon, i fully qualified my statement.  but turns out i was right.  you were baiting members of this board.  you couldn't care less what we really think.  you just wanted to catch us in some perceived hypocrisy so you could proclaim yourself "right".  well, congratulations.  do you want a cookie?

You need only ask with a sincere heart for the Lord to save you and acknowledge that you are a sinner that needs forgiveness.

The bible says that Jesus stands at our hearts door and knocks and that any man that will hear His voice and open the door that He will enter in and that you shall be with each other.

Christianity, as portrayed by the world in general, is a farse, a charade and a lie.

Keeping you eyes on man will only lend you disappointments and dispair.  Keeping your eyes on the Lord will yeild light, wisdom and understanding and most of all forgiveness in your heart for those around you.

No promises of angelic church members, no promise that once saved you no longer sin, no promise that you won't experience tragedy or other catastrophes in your life.  Only a promise of peace and salvation.

It has taken me 34 years to finally understand that my friend.  I am no different than you.  

If God can save me, and if God can continue to forgive me, which He has then He can do the same for you.

It is all about what is inside you not what you see outside you.  That is the devils twist on the whole thing.  People tend to focus on man, not on God.

Ask.....Ask....Ask.....it is that easy.

This is a god damn discussion board - it's the whole idea.

i am only 26 years old, but i've learned that there are three types of personalities that people have.  those who agree with you on a particular issue, those who may not agree with you-but yet respect those differences and don't wish to antagonize.  and then there are those people who don't agree with you and some how take pleasure in getting a rise out of all of those that they seek to offend.  

the peron who started this thread and various other contributors (who i won't mention) clearly want to antagonize those of us who are Christians.  This thread would be the same as someone saying "who doesn't like queers?".  when you make a statement and target a group by asking who doesn't like them, well you are not trying to start a rational discussion, but rather agrivate and antagonize that given group.

you might not have acepted Christ and you may not believe in Him (which is only your problem).  But what was the point, aside from trying to get a rise from us Christians, to starting a thread with that topic?

you know i really feel a sense of sadness for those of you that have not accepted Christ into your lives.  i'm not a very good evangalist (and an even worse speller) but i'd hope that all yall whom haven't accepted Christ at least keep an open heart.  there are those who are lost and will forever be lost, they rejoice in denouncing Christ.  i'd hope that all that are unsure about Christ just don't close the door to your heart or turn Christ away when He comes to you.  

sloth  

It is the good God fearing christians like ARLady that make me more secure in my non-beliefs. You do not find religious hypocrites out side of those that claim to be christians because it is impossible.
Someone that claims to be a christian but does not treat their fellow man right or is judgmental of them bases on their beliefs is not what one would call a christian.
A self professed non-christian can not judge a person bases on their lack of beliefs or attempt to qualify their own actions bases on what is writen in the bible. They treat their fellow man the way they do bases on their own beliefs.
Give me a person that does not believe any day to know someone that is honest with their own feelings.

The planet has had people make up Gods to appease the great volcano. Various people have prayed to the Gods of the sun and the rain to raise their crops. Anything that people do not understand they make up a God to make it all feel better and make themselves feel warm and fuzzy about it. The bible is the ultimate make believe. It covers everything so we don't have to have a seperate God for every little thing in the world. One God for all your problems and this one even takes care of you after the crops fail, the volvano fries your ass and the rains don't come. This one takes care of your eternal soul so you don't have to worry about that either. The very reason so many people only get religion after they learn they are dying or a loved one dies. They need to think that they don't simple go in the ground and the worms eat them. They can not except death as an end so they have a God to take care of that for them. Hell, it is a multibillion dollar a year industry and one that has been perpetrated in myth since time began.
Now some of you will feel sorry for me, pray for me and wonder what I will do when I find I'm worng and have to answer for my sins and non-belief. Well, it is like this folks; I know how I've lived my life and I know I've done what I could with what I've had to work with. So in the very damn unlikely event that I die and get to meet God He will have some fucking questions to answer to me about my life instead me trying to explain to him. Ultimately in the end if Heaven is populated with the so called christians I've met on earth I would rather spend eternity in Hell any way. Listening to a bunch and self rightous, pompous, holyier than thou bastards all day would be the ultimate Hell.
I would not have even bothered replying to this shit had ARLady not taken up her bible and bitched about someone starting the damn topic.

Oh and a PS. Joseph was an idiot to believe that bullshit story that Mary fed him about how she got knocked up.

Joseph could have done anything he wanted to.

In fact, Jewish law provided for him to give Mary a decree of divorce for what could have been alleged as her infidelity if he so desired.

Prophecy stated that the Messiah would be born of a virgin.

You believe not and you ask not and you have not.

All of which changes nothing. Mary comes home and tell Joseph I'm knocked up and the all mighty God is the father. I wonder how many other women of the time used this excuse.
"[i]Really mother I haven't been out screwin'. God got me knocked up and your grandson is going to be the Messiah."[/i] Imagine their pride. Sheeeeeeeet.
And you are right I ask not....and I do not want shit from the christian myth. Go spread your fantasy world some times else.

Well, whatever!

At least you don't have to worry about not having a lane all to yourself on the wide road you are on.

Since this topic degenerated in to "how pure the Christians are" then answear my questions:

- Why do you carry a weapon. Are you ready to kill another human being ?
- Why defend yourself. You supposed to turn the other cheek to be hit.
- If you do it how do you redeam your act to GOD ?
- Did you break any Commendments ? (I broke 11 of them)
- If the times comes to raise arms would you fight side by side with ME?
- If YOUR army is based on Christians ONLY  do you start the Cruciades again?
- Did you baptized your AR15 ? A true Christian has his weapon blessed and baptized.
- If you are afraid of Demons do you carry a sidearm in the Church?

Remind me again, what was the point[?]

[>:/]