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Posted: 11/9/2015 2:28:02 AM EDT
What would it look like? For me, I would start with the scope. A fixed 4.5 power 34mm with a size adjustable circular reticle. 1/4 MOA click target knobs and adjustable parallax. Then for the rifle I guess I'd just do a standard A2 NM flat top, with 20 inch barrel and the standard flash hider. I'd ditch the front sight and just have a low pro gas block. Not sure on the butt stock? How about you guys?
Link Posted: 11/9/2015 9:52:00 AM EDT
[#1]


Also do not park in handicap spots



Link Posted: 11/9/2015 10:00:28 AM EDT
[#2]
Does anyone make a fixed 4.5x with 34mm tube?
Link Posted: 11/9/2015 10:46:59 AM EDT
[#3]
Unless the rules are final, wait. There are a number of nice scopes that have 4.5x at the bottom of the adjustment range. That may be legal. Maybe not.

I'm looking forward to seeing what shows up on the line. The same folks will win regardless.
Link Posted: 11/9/2015 11:50:32 AM EDT
[#4]
I'll be waiting for the final rules, but given the perfect scope doesn't exist yet I would start with a Leupold VX-R 1.25-4x20, FireDot

Flattop upper, side charging, no front-site, UBR stock, Whiteoak match float tube, adjustable front sling mounting point.
Link Posted: 11/9/2015 1:48:33 PM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:
Unless the rules are final, wait...
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I think that is good advice.
Link Posted: 11/25/2015 3:17:15 PM EDT
[#6]
A posting on the CMP website says that the weight restriction is gone. No weight restriction for any service rifle either scoped or iron sights.
Link Posted: 11/25/2015 4:10:32 PM EDT
[#7]
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Quoted:
A posting on the CMP website says that the weight restriction is gone. No weight restriction for any service rifle either scoped or iron sights.
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Do you have a link? I'm having trouble finding that.
Link Posted: 11/25/2015 11:01:25 PM EDT
[#8]
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 1:00:57 AM EDT
[#9]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


Me gusta.



 
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 9:44:57 AM EDT
[#10]
Having read G.A's letter on the changes to the rules governing Service Rifle, just about anything goes as long as it's AR like? I'm thinking on using a MegaArms ambi lower with an integrated rightside bolt catch. I'm not interested in reaching over the scope to close the bolt in prone slow fire. I have one on my NRA Match Rifle and it's the slick setup with a charging handle bolt. I could also use a Phase 5 extended bolt release if I didn't have the cash.  



Goodby Service Rifle, it was nice to know you!

B

Link Posted: 11/26/2015 9:47:53 AM EDT
[#11]
Attendance issues? Why the free for all for DMR?
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 10:03:19 AM EDT
[#12]
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Quoted:
Attendance issues? Why the free for all for DMR?
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Sometimes people need to justify their own existence by fixing things that are not broke. They have cracked open the rulebook and crossed out all the sections that the non-participants bitched about.

B
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 10:30:25 AM EDT
[#13]
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 10:35:18 AM EDT
[#14]
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 11:04:15 AM EDT
[#15]
I hope you are right, but based on what was written in Gary's article I interpret it to mean I can use an ambi lower.

Specifically he states:

“an M16 U. S. Service Rifle or a similar AR15 type commercial rifle that is derived from the M16 service rifle design” and there will be far fewer specific restrictions.  2016 restrictions will simply require M16/AR15-type rifles that:

Are chambered for the 5.56 x 45 mm (.223) NATO cartridge.
Are designed or modified for semi-automatic fire only.
Have either a gas-impingement system or a piston-operated gas system.
Have a barrel that is no longer than 20 inches, with or without a flash suppressor (16” barrels are permitted).
Use one upper receiver and barrel for the entire match.
Have a trigger pull of at least 4.5 pounds.
Use standard service magazines or commercial equivalents that do not contain added weights.
Have a fixed or collapsible butt-stock that may vary in length and even be adjusted between firing stages. Butt-plates or cheek-pieces may not, however, be adjustable.
Have a standard A1 or A2 pistol grip.



I don't see any prohibition on an ambi lower, use an extended bolt catch or a requirement that it be a forged receiver. Obviously his article is not the rulebook, but based on what Gary wrote, I'm thinking they are going to blast the rules apart.

B
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 11:22:43 AM EDT
[#16]
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 3:05:12 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I think these  changes reflect pressure from a few angles but it also appears to be an attempt to attract a younger audience that might not have the interest in buying a dedicated A2 configuration to try their hand at the game.
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They could always "try their hand at the game" with the rifle they have (NRA in Match category), but that isn't enough for some.  

I do not expect this to increase participation.  For me, I've shot my last NTI.  They are removing the one thing I liked about SR over MR.

The younger audience is hard to attract because it is not a run-n-gun tacticool game like Call of Duty,  not because the rules restrict the hardware.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 3:24:35 PM EDT
[#18]
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 3:36:37 PM EDT
[#19]
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Quoted:

Then stick a fork in this discipline, it's over when us dinosaurs age out.
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Possibly, but if it was actually marketed by the two sanctioning bodies, instead of them trying wild rule changes, that might change.  As it stands, neither party wants
to spend the money on that.  Changing the rules to "do something" is free... to them.

Golf is in the same boat, by the way.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:02:28 PM EDT
[#20]
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:05:07 PM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Attendance issues? Why the free for all for DMR?
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It more closely matches the rifles currently in service than an M16-A2 lookalike.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:06:20 PM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Then stick a fork in this discipline, it's over when us dinosaurs age out.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:

The younger audience is hard to attract because it is not a run-n-gun tacticool game like Call of Duty,  not because the rules restrict the hardware.


Then stick a fork in this discipline, it's over when us dinosaurs age out.

That started with the "remain in position" change, IMO.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:10:18 PM EDT
[#23]
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Quoted:

I know, but I don't care about golf.
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Anything that takes a lot of time outside is declining.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:11:49 PM EDT
[#24]
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Quoted:

It more closely matches the rifles currently in service than an M16-A2 lookalike.
View Quote


That would be an M4 with an ACOG.  That's not only what the new rules appear to allow, but pretty much
anything.  Including piston uppers.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:17:43 PM EDT
[#25]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Keep in mind that release is already somewhat dated even though it's only a few weeks old.  It's also just the basic outline of the rules proposal.   Some things have already been changed since that announcement, most significantly they have already done away with the 11.5lb weight restriction.



I would caution anyone building an optics rifle PRIOR to the official rules being published, we really don't know how it's all going to flesh out until it's written in stone.  I would suggest that a standard M16A4, like currently legal, will be certainly legal moving forward so adding a scope base and a 4.5X scope to that rifle will clearly fall within the rules, anything outside of that is speculative at this point.
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Someone mentioned it a day or so ago, but I haven't found a link.



 
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:23:42 PM EDT
[#26]
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Quoted:

That started with the "remain in position" change, IMO.
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We use to lock and load while standing up for the rapids. I remember when there were no chamber flags. I think it started with chamber flags.

B
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:23:49 PM EDT
[#27]
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:27:00 PM EDT
[#28]
Have you all seen that Keystone Accuracy is offering optic ready Service Rifles with a detachable front sight. That was one I never saw coming. I would have thought that would be a requirement.

The faster they can end the speculation by publishing the actual rules, the happier I'll be.

B
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 4:28:20 PM EDT
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Mark Johnson posted something on the CMP forum to that affect.
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Here is the link.

B

EDIT: FIXED LINK
Link Posted: 11/30/2015 11:25:23 PM EDT
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:...That being said I have put a rifle together and although it is easier to see it's not easier to shoot.  I was concerned that something would be lost when sight alignment was taken out of the equation, it has always been a core tenet of marksmanship.  Interestingly enough I have found head position is more critical with the scope than it ever was with the irons so that aspect of the shooting process is different but certainly no easier.  It's been interesting if nothing else.
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Thanks for your seasoned impression. When High-Masters speak, people should listen. I have shot many ARs with scopes from position and my opinion is the same, even with a 4.5 power scope, it's not going to be easy. You are just introducing a new set of problems that need to be resolved by the individual shooter. I embrace change, otherwise we would still be shooting Trapdoor Springfields and nobody wants that, well nobody still living anyway. I'll be on the line with my new scoped service rifle, that is for sure.
Link Posted: 12/1/2015 3:55:40 PM EDT
[#31]
Link Posted: 12/2/2015 12:46:48 AM EDT
[#32]
Same as a conventional smallbore league with people shooting scopes and irons and most of them are shooting at least 14X if they have a scope. Many a time that some Junior that only shoots Irons cleans everyone's clock. The scores are going to go up quite a bit on average IMO, but someone may still be hot with irons and give everyone a run for their money.

Here is the other thing I want to know, will the NRA allow M110s to have a 4.5X optic for long range Service Rifle?

B




Link Posted: 12/2/2015 8:23:50 PM EDT
[#33]
We were talking about this at a local match this weekend. The problem with scope usage was parallax most 4x scopes are set at 75-100 yards and is not adjustable.
Link Posted: 12/2/2015 9:31:35 PM EDT
[#34]
Link Posted: 3/17/2016 6:02:38 AM EDT
[#35]
Link Posted: 3/26/2016 9:21:59 PM EDT
[#36]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The parallax issue isn't as bad as it might seem.  If you have good head position you won't have a problem with parallax set at 100 yards.  Some companies like Leupold, let you custom order fixed parallax settings on many of their scopes, I did with the VX-R I ordered.  I had mine set for 200 yards.  

Now that I better understand parallax the error is significantly worse at shorter ranges and becomes less and less as the distance gets further.
View Quote


Good to know. I've been looking for a service rifle scope so it looks like I'll go Leupold.
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