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Posted: 11/1/2014 11:07:19 PM EDT
The class was pretty good. I know taking a class here and there and dabbling a bit in martial arts doesn't make a person proficient. What is does make me, in this regard, is humbled.

If you are a close quarters weapon fighting guru, feel free to contribute. If you already know these things, terrific. This is an honest assessment of my thoughts after the class and I hope this causes others to consider the same, if they have not already done so. Feel free to add/contribute/ask questions.

What I usually take away from classes and training are some thoughts about how I do things, more than the specific skills taught in the class. If you don't practice those fine skills, they will be lost, but thinking about how I train, how I carry my gear, and how I handle altercations stays with me.

Dealing with someone grabbing your (blue) gun is not something for which most of us normally train. I know 99% of the time I'm at the range or dry firing in the garage, not thinking about someone trying to disarm me and how I'd react. Same with trying to disarm someone who has a striking object, knife or gun. There is more to it than just grabbing the weapon.

The other things I really took away from the class are how close most altercations typically are. Someone with a knife can do an incredible amount of damage in a hurry if they are in close. As much as I enjoy shooting IDPA or hitting the range, this class has encouraged me to start training more with 5 yards, within 3 yards even. I need to practice shooting one handed more (including weak hand), shooting from the ground and shooting "tucked in", not arms fully extended.

Finally, the other style of hand to hand fighting that I've trained for (beginning level MMA, mostly boxing and grappling), emphasizes clinches and other very close in fighting. Also the pace is wildly different. Fighting someone with boxing gloves on a mat for 5 minutes or practicing hip tosses and other judo throws are very different from some junkie ambushing me on the street with a knife within just a few feet. We did a lot of drills to essentially knock the weapon away/redirect it and create some distance. This again was very different than trying to grapple. Just a totally different skill set and different pace.

I'm a pretty good shot and am decent at basic grappling, striking and wrestling. The immediate explosive action required to disarm, deflect or avoid a weapon when responding to a close quarters armed attack is really sitting with me tonight.
Link Posted: 11/1/2014 11:34:45 PM EDT
[#1]
At least your learning.. we have no classes around me so i just try to stay Sharp and pay attention to my surroundings. i always have a weapon within reach be it a knife or gun or baseball bat. a lot of screwed up people out there though so always gotta watch your back.
Link Posted: 11/1/2014 11:43:22 PM EDT
[#2]
Then there is the strategy of avoiding the conflict all together.

Once committed to a decisive engagement:  violence of action.

Old but excellent post:  Street Robberies and You.
Link Posted: 11/2/2014 2:44:49 AM EDT
[#3]
Good post OP
Link Posted: 11/2/2014 6:23:02 AM EDT
[#4]
Link Posted: 11/13/2014 11:45:09 PM EDT
[#5]
I think the blending of the martial skill of firearms manipulation with the martial skill of unarmed combat and edge weapons is the biggest missing piece out there in the tactical world right now.

For some reason you don't see the instructors really mix that much between those worlds.  I think the defensive community right now is really kind of silo'ed off that way.  

Is it about getting the pistol out into a close contact shooting position to fire quickly or about first deflecting attack and creating distance through a strike to bring the pistol into play?  Probably depends on what the attacker is using right?  Then we're running into escalation of force issues where you might be based on your state's law exceeding your right to self defense by turning what 12 jurors in a climate controlled court room will see as excessive use of force aka manslaughter.  

If I'm integrating a block or a strike into the drawing and firing of the pistol am I doing it in a way that doesn't risk that body part I'm extending (to whatever degree whether it's an outward elbow, a full strike, or whatever combo) being shot by myself during the struggle?  When is the knife better to deploy than the pistol and how do I best use it to get me to a point where I can bring the pistol into effective position? What about integrating less lethal with retention to keep the encounter from going to lethal, because chances are good it's just a "simple" assault and not one that would be classified as deadly.  If the guys a similar size, age, and unarmed I have to be careful about "jumping the guy" into the encounter and yet I absolutely cannot risk losing control of my weapon.  

Real tough to find people who can instructor in a way to help deal with those issues right now. Have awesome specialists in the various combatives right now, but not a lot of cross discipline guys.

Link Posted: 11/14/2014 3:43:51 PM EDT
[#6]
Link Posted: 11/14/2014 10:49:19 PM EDT
[#7]
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Quoted:


That's why we started running classes with two instructors, one who excels at teaching CQB skills and the other with martial arts skills.

Some years ago we ran classes with Randy Cain and Steve Tarani (handgun) and Randy Cain and Ben Salas (carbine). Best classes I ever attended. Problem is it gets expensive to cover the fees of two top notch instructors and so it is thus extremely difficult to achieve adequate enrollment.
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Quoted:
Quoted:Real tough to find people who can instructor in a way to help deal with those issues right now. Have awesome specialists in the various combatives right now, but not a lot of cross discipline guys.


That's why we started running classes with two instructors, one who excels at teaching CQB skills and the other with martial arts skills.

Some years ago we ran classes with Randy Cain and Steve Tarani (handgun) and Randy Cain and Ben Salas (carbine). Best classes I ever attended. Problem is it gets expensive to cover the fees of two top notch instructors and so it is thus extremely difficult to achieve adequate enrollment.


If you don't mind me asking what did you guys end up charging for those classes?

Link Posted: 11/15/2014 10:54:22 AM EDT
[#8]
Link Posted: 11/16/2014 9:50:05 PM EDT
[#9]
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Quoted:


IIRC it was $500+ but one way to keep costs down is to achieve enrollment of 16+ students. A number that doesn't distort the instructor / student ratio but can help reduce the price of the course. Bear in mind that this type of class will require prerequisites and attract a more serious clientele so the instructor / student ratio isn't as critical when the student body is a "switched on" group of people.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:Real tough to find people who can instructor in a way to help deal with those issues right now. Have awesome specialists in the various combatives right now, but not a lot of cross discipline guys.


That's why we started running classes with two instructors, one who excels at teaching CQB skills and the other with martial arts skills.

Some years ago we ran classes with Randy Cain and Steve Tarani (handgun) and Randy Cain and Ben Salas (carbine). Best classes I ever attended. Problem is it gets expensive to cover the fees of two top notch instructors and so it is thus extremely difficult to achieve adequate enrollment.


If you don't mind me asking what did you guys end up charging for those classes?



IIRC it was $500+ but one way to keep costs down is to achieve enrollment of 16+ students. A number that doesn't distort the instructor / student ratio but can help reduce the price of the course. Bear in mind that this type of class will require prerequisites and attract a more serious clientele so the instructor / student ratio isn't as critical when the student body is a "switched on" group of people.



That's really fair and worth it especially considering you're getting cross discipline instructors for the course.  

Although since my wife and I do these trainings together I wouldn't mind there being a "couple's discount." haha
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