New York Compliant AR ???

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - New York Compliant AR ??? (Page 1 of 3)

Posted: 5/3/2016 9:38:19 PM EDT

Might be moving back to NY from a free state. None of my ARs pass muster under the SAFE act. There are posts all over the web but many seem to conflict with Cuomo's own website.

I have one that might pass with just a grip swap OR fixing magazine. DPMS 308 w/24" target bbl, fixed stock no banned features except grip and magazine.

Better to go fixed mag and keep grip or vice versa ?

Ideas on appropriate products that pass muster would be appreciated (can't trust all makers claims)

Thanks in advance.

Posted: 5/3/2016 5:19:20 PM EDT

[#1]

You have my sympathies.

Posted: 5/3/2016 5:50:18 PM EDT

[#2]

You may have better luck posting this in the NY Home Town Forum. I have a feeling it may get moved there anyways.

Posted: 5/3/2016 6:53:50 PM EDT

[#3]

The problem, and maybe the whole plan with the Safe Act is,
it's written very ambiguously, and open to many different interpretations.
The best part is the State Police or any other State official will not say if any of
the solutions that people have thought of are compliant with the law,
so it's impossible to tell. There are companies selling Ar-15s as
"New York Complient" but it's up to the individual Police person
to say whether you are legal or not. I know several Troopers and they tell me it's
hard for even them to know what is legal and illegal.

Don't move back to NYS ! It sucks here and is full of gun grabber liberals.
I'm out of here as soon as my parents leave.

Posted: 5/3/2016 7:51:37 PM EDT

[#4]

You can put on a spur in your case and will be fine

Posted: 5/3/2016 8:25:40 PM EDT

[#5]

Why not get an ARES SCR lower, will take a standard upper.

Posted: 5/3/2016 8:38:51 PM EDT

[#6]

Can you move to VT or PA and commute to NYS?

The Ares SCR appears to be one of the few non-abortions available.

Posted: 5/3/2016 8:45:59 PM EDT

[#7]

Featurless or fixed mag(and all the features)...only options. Brake is also a feature regardless if it is pinned/welded

10 round mags period...no grandfathering of anything

Posted: 5/3/2016 11:46:27 PM EDT

[#8]

Well guys after 15 years out West, I have many good memories but given the facts and proximity to family NE upstate is the best option. ARs are nice but not my whole life.

The comments are nice but no real answers yet, so I'll be more specific:

Who has had experience with spur grips ? Comments ?

Appears there are kits to fix a magazine that can be undone should things change.

Who has had experience with them ? Comments ?

Don't view fixed mag as a huge disadvantage off the bench (usually single load anyway) or even on rifle for deliberate hunting. Of all the big game taken over 55+ years, only one Whitetail and one Antelope was shot more than once, even those were not necessary as either a 12 bore deerslug or a 130 gr 270 through both lungs are fatal.

Thanks.

Posted: 5/4/2016 3:16:03 AM EDT

[#9]

Being behind enemy lines in the PRK, I have built a few featureless rifles. The laws in Kali are similar to the Safe Act, but not exactly.

That being said -- You can work with a different (compliant) grip.......but making a fighting rifle into a non-removable magazine is a YYYYUUUUUGE mistake.

I've tried running bullet button'd rifles.....and it just sucks. You'll be shot while you're trying to change mags. A locked mag is the most dangerous feature I've ever encountered in a firearm.

My advice is to do whatever you have to do to keep a standard mag release, and live with whatever else is required.

Posted: 5/4/2016 5:18:18 AM EDT

[#10]

Quote History

Quoted:

Well guys after 15 years out West, I have many good memories but given the facts and proximity to family NE upstate is the best option. ARs are nice but not my whole life.

The comments are nice but no real answers yet, so I'll be more specific:

Who has had experience with spur grips ? Comments ?

Appears there are kits to fix a magazine that can be undone should things change.

Who has had experience with them ? Comments ?

Don't view fixed mag as a huge disadvantage off the bench (usually single load anyway) or even on rifle for deliberate hunting. Of all the big game taken over 55+ years, only one Whitetail and one Antelope was shot more than once, even those were not necessary as either a 12 bore deerslug or a 130 gr 270 through both lungs are fatal.

Thanks.

View Quote

If it can be undone you can go to prison

Posted: 5/4/2016 6:17:40 AM EDT

[#11]

I just switched to bolt action Mossberg MVPs.

Can still use my .223 and .308 ammo in 10 round AR-15 and AR-10 magazines without all of the potential legal hassle.

Posted: 5/4/2016 9:40:19 AM EDT

[#12]

Leave all banned features on the lower. Build an upper with a side charging handle, with no gas tube.

Posted: 5/4/2016 10:39:57 AM EDT

[#13]

Quote History

Quoted:
If it can be undone you can go to prison

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
Well guys after 15 years out West, I have many good memories but given the facts and proximity to family NE upstate is the best option. ARs are nice but not my whole life.

The comments are nice but no real answers yet, so I'll be more specific:

Who has had experience with spur grips ? Comments ?

Appears there are kits to fix a magazine that can be undone should things change.

Who has had experience with them ? Comments ?

Don't view fixed mag as a huge disadvantage off the bench (usually single load anyway) or even on rifle for deliberate hunting. Of all the big game taken over 55+ years, only one Whitetail and one Antelope was shot more than once, even those were not necessary as either a 12 bore deerslug or a 130 gr 270 through both lungs are fatal.

Thanks.

If it can be undone you can go to prison

Almost ALL guns can be "undone" and modified to take a detachable mag pretty easily...or modified to take a pistol grip or muzzle device or other evil features.

Posted: 5/4/2016 11:07:32 AM EDT

[#14]

I am in NY and was VERY specific....USE THE SPUR providing you have no other features and according to you, you do not. No telescoping stock, no bayonet lug, no muzzle device and with the SPUR no worry about the pistol grip...Not sure what part of my earlier post was not specific enough for you? The spur sucks but sucks less than fixed mag. Plus you can't do fixed mag if it can be easily converted back

Posted: 5/4/2016 12:11:50 PM EDT

[#15]

Quote History

Quoted:
I am in NY and was VERY specific....USE THE SPUR providing you have no other features and according to you, you do not. No telescoping stock, no bayonet lug, no muzzle device and with the SPUR no worry about the pistol grip...Not sure what part of my earlier post was not specific enough for you? The spur sucks but sucks less than fixed mag. Plus you can't do fixed mag if it can be easily converted back

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After having tried the spur myself, I switched to the Thordsen stock. Just a matter of personal preference, but I felt like it gave me a little more control when manipulating the weapon.

As others have noted, if you have a detachable mag, you can't have any other features.

The real problem with this whole mess is that at some point it's going to have to be up to a court somewhere to decide - somebody is going to have to get arrested and prove that their rifle is compliant, because the state police gun unit can't/won't give interpretations for specific workarounds.

Posted: 5/4/2016 1:08:57 PM EDT

[#16]

Yeah I have rifle with the thorsden stock, would not choose the spur over that

Posted: 5/4/2016 1:30:49 PM EDT

[#17]

I tired a few different grips and the Thorsden as well....ultimately I decided on a home made Kydex 'fin' attached to a standard grip. The fact that it is 'screwed on' may not pass Safe Act muster, but it's good-to-go in Kali. I found it far more natural (using a sporter style grip) than any of the commercial options.

Posted: 5/4/2016 1:42:09 PM EDT

[#18]

Quote History

Quoted:
Yeah I have rifle with the thorsden stock, would not choose the spur over that

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I don't own (and have not shot with) either, however I handled each at a gun show, and I have to agree with the above.

The thorsden seemed okay. If I gave enough of a shit to try and stay legal anymore, I'd probably go for one. The spur was absolutely a non-starter for me. Couldn't hold the gun properly at all. Super uncomfortable to try and grip the rifle.

Posted: 5/4/2016 1:47:34 PM EDT

[#19]

Quote History

Quoted:
I am in NY and was VERY specific....USE THE SPUR providing you have no other features and according to you, you do not. No telescoping stock, no bayonet lug, no muzzle device and with the SPUR no worry about the pistol grip...Not sure what part of my earlier post was not specific enough for you? The spur sucks but sucks less than fixed mag. Plus you can't do fixed mag if it can be easily converted back

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So M1 Garands and SKSs are illegal? Both can easily be converted to take detachable mags.

I'm not sure where this myth comes from.

Where in the law does it say the fixed mag has to be permanent? If you replace the mag release with a bolt and washer, you no longer have a gun with a detachable mag. Nothing in the law requires it be permenant...because that would outlaw ALL guns. Nothing is permanent on a gun...

ANY gun can pretty easily be modified to take a detachable mag...even if it has a fixed mag. Hell an M1 garand or an SKS can be converted to take a detachable mag...Easily.

Hell you could make any semi auto gun into full auto pretty easily...does that mean all semi autos are banned because they COULD be converted?

Posted: 5/4/2016 2:12:15 PM EDT

[#20]

Not much help so far.

What about this device ? What crieria does it fail to meet (if any) thanks

http://www.ammoland.com/2014/04/armaglock-how-to-installation-guide/#axzz47iATzhne

Posted: 5/4/2016 2:50:33 PM EDT

[#21]

Quote History

Quoted:
Not much help so far.

What about this device ? What crieria does it fail to meet (if any) thanks

http://www.ammoland.com/2014/04/armaglock-how-to-installation-guide/#axzz47iATzhne

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Not much help so far? There are several varied responses. Bye.

Posted: 5/4/2016 3:43:38 PM EDT

[#22]

Soapbox responses are not responsive to the question.

I have read both the SAFE act and the penal code.

What is clear that any and all modifications that are reversible, open the door for zelots to hang you out.

Pinned/screwed and glued "fixed" magazines can all be undone. Even a spot welded one could have the welds cut.

However changing an illegal part to a legal one appears to pass muster.

IMHO only the spur or better yet (as a legal opinion has been rendered) the Thordsen stock is the way to go.

Posted: 5/4/2016 3:59:49 PM EDT

[#23]

Quote History

Quoted:
Soapbox responses are not responsive to the question.

I have read both the SAFE act and the penal code.

What is clear that any and all modifications that are reversible, open the door for zelots to hang you out.

Pinned/screwed and glued "fixed" magazines can all be undone. Even a spot welded one could have the welds cut.

However changing an illegal part to a legal one appears to pass muster.

IMHO only the spur or better yet (as a legal opinion has been rendered) the Thordsen stock is the way to go.

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You've read both the unsafe act and the penal code, and it sounds like you've made up your mind.

so why are you asking us if you've already decided?

and where in the law says that the gun has to be permanently modified to have a fixed mag??

If so, all of our garands and sks rifles are AWs, since they can be converted to take a detachable mag easily.

If you swap the illegal mag release for the "legal" washer and screw, why is that not allowed?

If the thordsen stock is legal, despite being able to put a pistol grip back on, then your logic is flawed.

Posted: 5/4/2016 4:28:01 PM EDT

[#24]

Fixed re; non-detachable magazine is the easiest, least expensive way to give Cuomo the middle finger salute.

Posted: 5/4/2016 5:30:39 PM EDT

[#25]

I did say the Spur SUCKS...the thordson stock is better. And the guy who says that SKS etc mags can be a test case!

Posted: 5/4/2016 8:22:40 PM EDT

[#26]

Neither the M-1 or the SKS uses a MAGAZINE. M-1 uses a en bloc CLIP, the SKS uses stripper clips.

ARMaglock has submitted their magazine lock for approval and it has NOT BEEN. Your pins/nuts/bolts/epoxy are lesser versions of the same idea. Given the climate in NY and the vague SAFE act, until someone with a "fixed" magazine is arrested. tried and found innocent any LEO or DA can decide you are a law breaker. As the old saying goes "you can indict a ham sandwich."

Even then the court will probably draw such a narrow definition that pinning may be legal but other methods will not be covered.

It appears we have no attorneys here that have dealt with courts that usually draw very narrow opinions. The SAFE act reflects all the attorneys in the state government. STUPID !

Had someone with common sense drafted the law, it would have been two lines:

" 1. Any firearm that the chamber of which is not reloaded by a 100 % manual operation is banned. (before you jump, it says reloaded, not loaded)
2. Any firearm that has a removable magazine with a capacity greater than 10 cartridges is banned." (tube feed 22s are okay)

Find me ANY real AR that slips thru that !

Bottom line: the Thordsen stock has been approved, no magazine modification has.

Posted: 5/4/2016 9:31:48 PM EDT

[#27]

Again...for the 3rd time...by your logic, the Garand and the SKS are banned because they can both easily be modified to take detachable mags. There are easy conversions for both on the market.

There is nothing in the law that "approves" anything. Who is to say a thordsden stock isn't considered a pistol grip? It does protrude beneath the action after all...

Nothing in the law says permanent, for a reason. If the law said permanent then it would ban all guns.

Posted: 5/4/2016 9:41:45 PM EDT

[#28]

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Quoted:
Bottom line: the Thordsen stock has been approved, no magazine modification has.

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What the hell are you talking about? I do not remember the court case that ruled that way. It has not been determined one way or the other, in any court case. PERIOD.

Posted: 5/4/2016 10:25:04 PM EDT

[#29]

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Quoted: It appears we have no attorneys here that have dealt with courts that usually draw very narrow opinions.

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You seemed to have missed the opinion by one of our very favorite attorneys here. I can almost smell the herring from here.

Posted: 5/5/2016 10:48:42 AM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
Might be moving back to NY from a free state. None of my ARs pass muster under the SAFE act. There are posts all over the web but many seem to conflict with Cuomo's own website.

I have one that might pass with just a grip swap OR fixing magazine. DPMS 308 w/24" target bbl, fixed stock no banned features except grip and magazine.

Better to go fixed mag and keep grip or vice versa ?

Ideas on appropriate products that pass muster would be appreciated (can't trust all makers claims)

Thanks in advance.

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Join date, meh, post count....ah yep, usage of "muster" and "12bore"(in a later post), yep

.........please don't feed the troll

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Posted: 5/5/2016 11:00:45 AM EDT

[#31]

Look guys, tired of the debate. Has this "attorney" been to court ? Tested the law ? Won anything to do w/SAFE ?

Opinions are like belly buttons .... we all have them.

The stock mentioned has been blessed, go to their website if you doubt it.

No fixed magazine modification has.

Just because a law does not specifically state something is forbidden, does not mean some Cop or DA can't make your life a mess just trying.

When you're dealing with guns the NY establishment hates, you already are 2 strikes down.

Lots of words but NO NY progun organization has had a member walk into the CopShop with his fixed magazine AR and asked for a written opinion AND if they say "no, it's banned", said "you're wrong, arrest me." Until that happens and the court to the highest state level say "ok", y'all are just crossing your fingers.

As for the M-1 and the SKS they were not configured by the makers to accept detachable magazines, ALL real ARs are configured to accept detachable magazines as manufactured. If that distinction is not clear as glass, I give up.

When you folks go to court and win all the way to the NY Court of Appeals, come on back and tell me how to fix my magazine IAW the court's ruling and I will.

If you have doubt about how governments can prervert clear court rulings, take a look at what is REALLY happening in DC and Chicago where you might think people can now easily get handguns !

Posted: 5/5/2016 11:39:03 AM EDT

[#32]

I guess I just don't understand why you asked us for our opinions regarding fixed mag options or grip options...when you already seem to have your mind 100% made up?

Fact is, NOTHING has been approved by a court case regarding making guns compliant.

A letter from some NYSP trooper saying the thorsden stock is legal means nothing. Is it legal? In my opinion yes.

But I also believe that removing the mag release and replacing it with a bolt and washer is legal...but you disagree?

If you think a washer/bolt isn't legal because it isn't permanent...then do you CEMENT your thorsden stock into the pistol grip hole so that if you removed the thorsden stock, it would destroy the lower? And not allow you to install a pistol grip?

Because a thorsden stock is NOT permanent either.

Posted: 5/5/2016 12:34:11 PM EDT

[#33]

Dave,

Here's a RADICAL suggestion for you.

Go to the stock compay website and get some FACTS.

Twas NOT a letter from some trooper. And YES the approving people did say to secure the stock screw with epoxy.

Running your mouth with NO facts does not make you appear bright.

I deny nothing, I state facts about legal precedent that you cannot refute.

Pin, glue, screw, weld your magazine all you want. Until an OFFICIAL option is rendered, you have nothing to hang your hat on except a "reasonable opinion". Hillary has a "reasonable opinion" that nothing she has done is criminal. Chuckle !

Headline:

State Police arrest man charged with trying to evade Assault Weapon ban by modifying AR rifle

Text:

DA says he will ask for maximum sentence to send message to other gun owners that the SAFE act cannot be skirted by shadetree modifications to banned assault weapons.

Attorney General's lead attorney says investigation of gun shops selling weapons modified without approval by regulating agencies is also proceeding. Susan Gunhater was quoted as saying:" The intent of the SAFE act is clear. We cannot have individuals trying to go around the act that protects our children from assault rifle wielding maniacs in our state."

It has been rumored that Gunhater has been tagged by some in the Clinton organization as a candidate for a top position at DOJ.

So, my friend, YOU can enjoy your "15 minutes of fame." When you are bankrupt, all your guns gone and after 5 years declared innocent, you can proudly say :"see I was right".

Posted: 5/5/2016 12:42:03 PM EDT

[#34]

Quote History

Quoted:
Dave,

Here's a RADICAL suggestion for you.

Go to the stock compay website and get some FACTS.

Twas NOT a letter from some trooper. And YES the approving people did say to secure the stock screw with epoxy.

Running your mouth with NO facts does not make you appear bright.

I deny nothing, I state facts about legal precedent that you cannot refute.

Pin, glue, screw, weld your magazine all you want. Until an OFFICIAL option is rendered, you have nothing to hang your hat on except a "reasonable opinion". Hillary has a "reasonable opinion" that nothing she has done is criminal. Chuckle !

View Quote View All Quotes

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Quote History

Quoted:
Dave,

Here's a RADICAL suggestion for you.

Go to the stock compay website and get some FACTS.

Twas NOT a letter from some trooper. And YES the approving people did say to secure the stock screw with epoxy.

Running your mouth with NO facts does not make you appear bright.

I deny nothing, I state facts about legal precedent that you cannot refute.

Pin, glue, screw, weld your magazine all you want. Until an OFFICIAL option is rendered, you have nothing to hang your hat on except a "reasonable opinion". Hillary has a "reasonable opinion" that nothing she has done is criminal. Chuckle !

What legal court decisions / precedents have you stated??? Please post links to actual final court decisions.

You say that pinning or gluing mags is not legal because it is not permanent, but then you suggest (above) that gluing a thorsden stock somehow IS permanent enough??

Quoted:
Soapbox responses are not responsive to the question.

I have read both the SAFE act and the penal code.

What is clear that any and all modifications that are reversible, open the door for zelots to hang you out.

Pinned/screwed and glued "fixed" magazines can all be undone. Even a spot welded one could have the welds cut.

However changing an illegal part to a legal one appears to pass muster.

IMHO only the spur or better yet (as a legal opinion has been rendered) the Thordsen stock is the way to go.

No. A legal opinion has absolutely NOT been rendered regarding the thordsen stock.

Your logic is all over the place.

I think the thorsden stock AND the pinned fixed mag are BOTH legal. Nothing in the unSAFE act says a gun has to be PERMANENTLY modified to never be an AW in the future...because that is impossible. ANY gun can be modified to be an AW. Duct tape a wood dowel onto a gun and VOILA! You've added a pistol grip. Does NOT mean all guns you can duct tape a wood dowel onto are now illegal.

If the thorsden stock is legal, then so is a pinned fixed mag.

If a pinned/fixed mag is not legal because it is not "permanent," then the thorsden stock is also not legal.

Can't have it both ways.

Posted: 5/5/2016 1:40:20 PM EDT

[#35]

Im sorry dave, you tried. You have gone on the crusade, spent tons of your own cash, countless hours, and have been proven right. I do thank you. Lets all move on, Good day Sir.

Posted: 5/5/2016 1:52:58 PM EDT

[#36]

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Quoted:
Im sorry dave, you tried. You have gone on the crusade, spent tons of your own cash, countless hours, and have been proven right. I do thank you. Lets all move on, Good day Sir.

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Posted: 5/5/2016 2:53:01 PM EDT

[#37]

There was a man arrested with a Ar-mag lock on a separate offense and he was not charged with anything because of the rifle.

Still I would avoid the Ar-Mag lock like the plague, i would feel comfortable with a T-nut or a Bullet button with Epoxy back filling it...something i need to get a drill out to drop the mag. Remember when the SAFE act was passed representatives from NYSP council suggested to the people in information sessions that epoxy was fine for a level of permanence(that is not in the law), in order to fix stocks etc.

I have both the spur and the Thorsden stock and the FRS is a better option by far...but they both kinda suck.

but as far as case law on any of this...there isn't any...at all

Posted: 5/5/2016 8:57:42 PM EDT

[#38]

Back in 2001 when I did the FAB 10 here in Calif, I sent a sample to ATF for a determination on a permanent non detach magazine lower receiver. The Federal assault ban was still in place at that time. The ATF determination at that time for permanent alteration is that it takes drilling, grinding, machining , welding or any method that would show intent on modifying. It had to be a modification that required more than the simple use of tools to reverse. Calif. DOJ also agreed with that . When I did the NY10 , I sent a sample to ATF again for their determination on whether they considered it a non detachable mag lower. They would not issue me a determination simply because the Federal Assault Weapon Ban no longer existed . It no longer fell under any Federal regulations so there is nothing to determine. Even though the rivet that was the determining factor for the old FAB10, is the same modification for the NY10, they just can not make a call on a law that no longer exist Federally. I would suggest that any modification you do follow those guidelines. Craig

Posted: 5/6/2016 10:09:14 AM EDT

[#39]

Craig, thankyou, nice to have some facts.

As for the stock, inspite of the "Clinton parsing" about "court opinions", both the NYS AG and NYSP told the company in a meeting with witnesses that the stock was ok. (If anyone cares, the tale is all told on the company's website). No such meeting or approval has been given to any magazine modification. IOW, there is nothing to go on except one's own opinion.

As Craig points out, back in the day, the Feds rendered an opinion. IMO were I the state I would look to that opinion when/if setting guidance for NY.

Anyone can do as they wish. As for me, I have no plans on becoming the test case on this issue.

All the internet chest thumping aside, the hard fact is that the fixed magazine issue is still an open issue.

Posted: 5/6/2016 2:39:18 PM EDT

[#40]

Ugh. A meeting with some morons from the NYSP or NYS AG means nothing. That would not hold up in court as a valid defense, even if it makes you feel better.

Yes I believe the thorsden stock is legal, but not because it was magically "approved" by some schmoes in some back room.

So M1 carbines are AWs even with no evil features? It only takes a few minutes to put a bayonet lug on the barrel. Even if you weld or pin the barrel band on, it's not permanent.

I should probably just stop arguing...but I am really not arguing with you, I am just pointing out the absurdity of the law, and how it is being interpreted.

Nothing is permanent...therefore all semi auto guns with detachable mags must be illegal in NY, by this logic.

If a gun doesn't have any banned features, it can't be an AW...doesn't matter how easy it is to modify it into an AW.

If you were arrested, you would hold up the gun in front of the judge/jury...and say: "Please identify how this gun runs afoul of the unSAFE act."

Does it have a detachable magazine in its current form? No.

Any other banned features? Nope.

Well then it can't be an AW.

The SKS and the Garand both have internal fixed magazines, but they can easily be removed too. Better turn in all the SKSs and Garands.

DON'T MAKE IT EASY ON NY AND THE NYSP. DON'T LET THEM MAKE UP THEIR OWN LAWS AND INTERPRETATIONS. HOLD THEM TO EXACTLY HOW THE LAW IS WRITTEN, AND DON'T GIVE THEM AN INCH MORE.

Posted: 5/6/2016 3:56:50 PM EDT

[#41]

Yes I believe the thorsden stock is legal, but not because it was magically "approved" by some schmoes in some back room.

why do I doubt you would call any NY AAG or trooper a schmoe to his/her face

So M1 carbines are AWs even with no evil features? It only takes a few minutes to put a bayonet lug on the barrel. Even if you weld or pin the barrel band on, it's not permanent.

f you added the lug regardless of how it is attache the gun would be banned

I should probably just stop arguing...but I am really not arguing with you, I am just pointing out the absurdity of the law, and how it is being interpreted.

Posted: 5/6/2016 3:57:46 PM EDT

[#42]

yes you should as your grasp of the facts is what is absurd

Nothing is permanent...therefore all semi auto guns with detachable mags must be illegal in NY, by this logic.

no, only if you add a second banned feature

If a gun doesn't have any banned features, it can't be an AW...doesn't matter how easy it is to modify it into an AW.

again, reading comprehension problem. a semi-auto can have one feature and not be an AW, add a second and it is

Posted: 5/6/2016 3:58:39 PM EDT

[#43]

If you were arrested, you would hold up the gun in front of the judge/jury...and say: "Please identify how this gun runs afoul of the unSAFE act."

of course I would not have the gun. the people testifying on behalf of the state would be the ones defining the gun as illegal. of course it would not be me as any AR I would own would conform to the law as presently interpreted,

The SKS and the Garand both have internal fixed magazines, but they can easily be removed too. Better turn in all the SKSs and Garands.

The SKS does have a fixed magazine as designed, under no stretch is it easily detachable. The M-1 has no magazine and is a single shot w/o the enbloc clip. one wonders if you own either of them ?

Posted: 5/6/2016 4:10:45 PM EDT

[#44]

DON'T MAKE IT EASY ON NY AND THE NYSP. DON'T LET THEM MAKE UP THEIR OWN LAWS AND INTERPRETATIONS. HOLD THEM TO EXACTLY HOW THE LAW IS WRITTEN, AND DON'T GIVE THEM AN INCH MORE.

well I suppose you could have the same motto if you had a still, a pot patch or were cooking meth in your kitchen. in the end, in all cases you would lose and be a roomate with 300 pound Askam Awallh Washington whom would become very attached to you in various ways

The internet never fails to disappoint !

Think it's time to drop this subject as as Abe Lincoln said: "When a man makes a bad bargain he tends to cling to it all the tighter."

Potentially getting arrested for a fixed magazine in an AR could turn out to be a very bad bargain !

Posted: 5/6/2016 4:14:46 PM EDT

[#45]

Ugh. Buddy. You have 14 posts. You have a lot to learn. I assume you won't last much longer here.

I am stating logic and facts. You are spouting off like an angry child. Get a grip.

My point is, nothing on a gun is permanent...therefore ANY gun can be modified to be an AW.

Where in the law does it say a gun has to have a permanently attached fixed magazine? Nowhere.

There is nothing in the law that gives guidance on what a "fixed" magazine is. There is nothing in the law that says the thordsen stock is not a pistol grip. Doesn't make it illegal.

Posted: 5/6/2016 4:18:26 PM EDT

[#46]

Vauxhall you are way wrong about the evil feature test. Detach mag semi + ANY 1 feature make it an AW!!!!

Posted: 5/6/2016 4:21:32 PM EDT

[#47]

Quote History

Quoted:
Vauxhall you are way wrong about the evil feature test. Detach mag semi + ANY 1 feature make it an AW!!!!

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And he says my reading comprehension is questionable? Ha.

One wonders if he even read the UNSAFE act.

Fact of the matter is, an AR with a bolt and washer setup has a fixed mag. Can it be undone? Sure. But so can a thordsen stock.

Posted: 5/6/2016 8:06:17 PM EDT

[#48]

There are several modifications that are probably compliant. The problem is that the council for the safe act will not give out any determinations. I spent a lot of time and effort trying to get that. I spoke with the head council twice. I actually got him to agree to allow me to send them a sample to at least look at. I also told him, and included in a letter that if for any reason they were against it, I would go no further. They kept it for 366 days. They sent it back with zero response. They did look at it I could tell. I have given several to State Troopers. One is showing it around and has hopes of showing it to some DA's and even higher up the ladder. I just keep plugging away at it. There are around 150 NY10's all across NY since 2014. I have had some good feed back from quite a few guys. At the ranges, range masters and even several times LEO's have taking a close look . There have been zero issues to this point. That is really all I can tell you. They love to keep everyone in the grey area . Craig

Posted: 5/6/2016 8:15:51 PM EDT

[#49]

Is the ny10 the same thing as a fab 10?

Posted: 5/6/2016 8:16:17 PM EDT

[#50]

I should add and make it clear that I am not trying to promote and sell NY10's here. When enough guys want them , I do a run. They are really not my favorite thing to do. I am simply trying to pass on what my experiences have been over the years to try and get some kind of reassurance from these various Govt. agencies that compliance is being met and guys stay out of trouble. It is tiresome really. It should not be as difficult as it is. Craig

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - New York Compliant AR ??? (Page 1 of 3)

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