Truth be told, New York does in-fact ban an entire class of weapons, ie. mgs.  We all know that Nolo is challenging the ban nationwide with a similar position, but this seems to be even more ironclad.  The federal government might argue nationally (in response to Nolo) that MGs aren't banned, only heavily regulated and limited, and you can get one made before the cutoff if you have the money (no ban).  But New York's position, even pre-NFA, has been an outright ban.  Even those who comply with the federal registration requirements (NFA) are still barred from ownership in New York.

Has there ever been a challenge to this?  Perhaps it might be possible to crowd-source a bit and give it a shot?  I have to admit they are probably fairly useless now, given the fact that we're restricted to 10 rounds, but they could still be fun.  And maybe the court might find NFA weapons in that class exempt from the ban imposed by SAFE too, who knows.





I know the response will be "in your wildest dreams," but even though Heller indicated that our second amendment right was not absolute, it did establish the standard where an absolute ban on an entire class of weapons was unconstitutional...

IIRC, the MG ban in New York predates even the NFA.  Probably as much luck overturning it as the Sullivan Law.  Even if there was a successful nationwide suit to overturn the NFA ban at the federal level, New York will never comply.  They already ignore laws they disagree with and the Second Circuit gives them a pass every time.

I'm overturning it by moving 3 hours East.

smart man...

I don't see it as an NFA issue honestly.  It's a constitutional issue, based on the standard established in heller.  Government can't ban an entire class of arms.  The federal government, some might say, haven't because you can still buy machine guns (albeit expensive and pre-86).  New York bans all of them, which is clearly at odds with the standard established by SCOTUS.

The standard set by the SCOTUS Heller ruling does have an "out clause" with regards to machine guns; dangerous and unusual weapons.  The specific issue of machine guns was brought up by one of the justices as being dangerous and unusual and Alan Gura did not challenge it.  Granted the case at hand was the entire Second Amendment and not specific classes of weapons so there was no real reason for Alan to rattle the cage at that time and shut down Justice Kennedy as a yes vote.



Still it looks like a good indicator that the Supreme Court would not entertain a challenge to machine gun bans.  We cannot even get them to take up a case on semi-auto AWB bans like New York's, California's and Maryland's to name a few.



 

There are over 8000 registered NFA items in NYS.    So all you need are the right licenses.  No, it's not as simple as a Form 4, but if you're serious, and have the cash, you can do it too.

I jumped ship for a number of reasons, towards the top of the list was gun laws.

Form 4 for a silencer waiting for approval now and form 1 going out next week for an SBR..
Just added a few new toys that are "NO-NO's" in NY yesterday,,

Life is good

I'm assuming you mean FFL and sot?

I'd be curious to know what NFA items we as a civilian can own in NY without the above mentioned FFL and SOT. I'm only aware of the Serbu Super Shorty, which is the pump action pistol grip shotgun with a forward grip (AOW).





 

I think the MG ban has been in effect since an irish mobster tried to whack a sicilian but hit a child years ago.

A civilian can't own, but a business whose industry is making, selling, distributing, testing NFA firearms for legitimate Law Enforcement and government agencies or Atomic Energy Contractors  (now NRC and any legitimate NRC contractors) or for sale as export outside the US.

So in NY one could theoretically have a business to be a manufacture/distributor and test out your NFA wares , but the individual has no rights to keep

Yes, and they are all owned with the exception of a handful of AOW's by police agencies as they have to register them too

Smooth Bore pistols are it (AOW's)  and there are not many SOT's that will do the federal transfer.  The closest one to me cant be bothered.

More than a handful.  Manufacturers, testers, even museums.   And don't forget there are loads of unregistered "DEWATS" on memorials.  I know of a mortar in a lightly visited town park, and an ARFCOMer sent me a photo of a M1917 MG.

Yep, pre-1934.  Doesn't make it right, of course.

I wouldn't count a mortar on display in a park
Not like I can roll over to the VFW and borrow their M60 MBT


The 8000 figure probably also includes the SBRs or SBS's owned by individual officers, not just agency-owned full auto

Officers are not exempt from the ban on NFA weapons. Things like high cap mags and assault weapons, yes. But there is no exemption from the NFA ban for individually owned firearms.

I don't doubt there may be officers or agents who own sbr uppers for their rifles, but they are not exempted from the total ban by NY law.

Not true
edit:
Definitions:
3. "Firearm" means (a) any pistol or revolver; or (b) a shotgun having
 one or more barrels less than eighteen inches in length; or (c) a  rifle
 having  one  or  more barrels less than sixteen inches in length;

Further down the legalese:

265.01 Criminal possession of a weapon in the fourth degree.
 A  person  is  guilty of criminal possession of a weapon in the fourth
 degree when:
   (1) He or she possesses any firearm,

Now to the exemptions section

S 265.20 Exemptions.
  a.  Paragraph  (h)  of  subdivision  twenty-two  of section 265.00 and
 sections 265.01, 265.01-a, subdivision one of section 265.01-b,  265.02,
 265.03,  265.04, 265.05, 265.10, 265.11, 265.12, 265.13, 265.15, 265.36,
 265.37 and 270.05 shall not apply to:
   1. Possession of  any  of  the  weapons,  instruments,  appliances  or
 substances  specified in sections 265.01, 265.02, 265.03, 265.04, 265.05
 and 270.05 by the following:
   (a) Persons in the military service of the state of New York when duly
 authorized by regulations issued by the adjutant general to possess  the
 same.
   (b)  Police  officers as defined in subdivision thirty-four of section
 1.20 of the criminal procedure law.

I don't think individual LEOs can go the trust route that so many here prefer, since they are possessing the SBR based on their LEO status

Hope that explains things for you a little better

I stand corrected, as per the letter of the law.

But has anyone ever gotten a CLEO to sign off on a form 1 or 4?

I have never heard of it anywhere and I even have several co-workers who live north of dutchess county who I just asked, and they never heard of it either...?

You could do a FOIL request and see how is listed in the 8000 or so weapons.

Since its purely a LEO exemption, it wouldn't be as stretch for a CLEO to sign off on one of his guys
The older generation of my predecessors had several officers who'd gotten one of Ithaca  Guns SBS Bonnies or Clydes on a form 4 since the factory was right here in town
Before that was the Ithaca Auto Burglar which ended production when the NFA went into effect.
I wish I could have had one of the old factories Auto Burglars more or less as a piece of local history. we had one at my old PT agency and they're a nice looking SBS for that era.
The current generation of officers leans more towards SBRs and I only know of a couple of other local guys who've jumped through the hoops
You have to understand that when you tell a non-gun guy that you've paid $200 for a tax stamp just to cut a barrel down, most will look at you bug eyed and ask why you'd ever bother doing such a thing.
Most of them spend far more money on their respective hobbies, whether it be boating, ATVs , snowmobiles, hunting etc.
But to the non-gun guy, $200 for  a tax stamp is considered a bit nutty.

most of the cops I know don't work and live in the same jurisdiction. I guess farther upstate its more common. Something tells me if I walked into the county PD Chief's office and asked him to sign off on my tax stamp he would laugh me out the station house door...

Until a couple of years ago we HAD to live in our own county by law
Years ago there were quite the shenanigans when admins would go to great lengths try to prove that out of county guys they'd hired hadn't moved into the county as required.
The CLEO at the time was raiding the PD in the next county because somehow in his mind they were a better crop of candidates
Of course he didn't have to send them to the basic school as laterals and maybe his new hire and local lateral list was pretty slim.
It got to the point that that agencies head asked him to stop raiding his personnel.

You live in a much more anti-gun part of the state, no doubt about it
We wouldn't want to see any harm come to all of you, but if all of the bridges separating Upstate from Downstate suddenly disappeared and you guys south of Westchester were on your own, we wouldn't lose any sleep over it as long as Andy was in the City when it happened.