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pincushion
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Posted: 8/12/2013 7:44:03 AM
[Last Edit: 8/12/2013 7:44:03 AM by VA-gunnut]
So its always been my dream to own an AR and I finally have the means to get on and New York has all but totally banned them. Does anyone know of an AR variant that has a permanently mounted clip that can be loaded from the receiver? this seems to be the only way you can own an AR in NY with the "Evil" features... Any and all help would be appreciated
CMSENGINE
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Posted: 8/11/2013 11:01:18 PM
Jasontum, you have to rub it in to us guys in the restricted states, don't you. Here is one of the problems with modifying existing receivers. The new Calif law that most likely will be signed within the next month, states that if a conversion is easily or readily able to be reversed back to AWB status, it may not be considered compliant. My experience in the past, no one wants to be the first to find out. A big grey area in favor of DOJ. NY's law is similar. What is goofy about NY law, you can have a 10 round mag but only put 7 rounds in it(wink wink) Driving out a few pins or removing a few screws isn't going to get it this time around. That Is why I started from scratch. Whatever anyone does, if it is to sell, be careful and research. There are a bunch of torpedo patents out there waiting for someone to encroach on. A couple of guys patented a bunch of non-detachable conversion designs back in the 2003-2007 time frame. Oh, by the way Jasontum, just in case, can Texas handle another hundred million or so? Craig
doubleajaybrock
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Posted: 8/11/2013 11:28:26 PM
[Last Edit: 8/11/2013 11:29:55 PM by doubleajaybrock]
Nevermind
You ain't leading but two things right now. Jack and Shit. And Jack just left town.
CMSENGINE
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Posted: 8/11/2013 11:33:57 PM
Aimless. BATF will not give me a determination on NY law. What they will make a determination on is whether they would consider it a permanently fixed mag or not. If they won't, then there is no chance in hell that NY will. My contact in NY who is helping me, actually has a letter stating that a FAB10(I produced back in 2000) was compliant. That was just about a month ago. Look, I am a beers half full kind of guy. I know it is a tough road, but I am taking it. A couple guys contacted me about 2 1/2 months ago. They had bought a couple of the old FAB 10 lowers I made back 2000. They wanted to know If I still made them. I told them I sold the patent rights, and Bushmaster now owns it. They asked me if I could come up with something. I was already working on a design for here in Calif. because I knew what was coming. There was no reason it should not work in NY as well. They asked, I am trying to help. It sure as hell isn't to get rich. It is not cheap to do this. The only reason I can do it is because I own my equipment, I design, program, test and manufacture all on my own. Otherwise it would be too huge a gamble.It would be nice to break even, but you are right, it could go in the turd bucket real fast. Time will tell, and I will keep you all up to date. I don't think I am the sharpest knife in the drawer,the brightest bulb on the tree and so on. For me it is about keeping guys in the game. The challenge is my therapy from the day job. Craig
Aimless
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Posted: 8/12/2013 12:42:00 AM
I bought a FAB10 a couple of years ago because I foresaw this coming.
JeremyB99
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Posted: 8/12/2013 5:16:50 AM
This claims to be NYS compliant http://www.amazon.com/AR-MR2-Release-Legal-AR15/dp/B00CY2I0BS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idkP5n8BhdY
pabin25
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Posted: 8/12/2013 6:01:53 AM
[Last Edit: 8/12/2013 6:05:29 AM by pabin25]
New York's old assault weapon ban no longer exists. They replaced it with the "Safe Act". So, they do not allow any new "assault rifles to be bought or sold in NY and you are no longer allowed to possess mags over 10rds (grandfathered or not). So they way the law was explained to me is you can have a rifle with the banned features since that law no long on the books (must own them before "Safe Act" took place), BUT you must register them and cant transfer them in NY.
jukeboxx13
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Posted: 8/11/2013 8:46:53 PM
[Last Edit: 8/11/2013 8:48:14 PM by jukeboxx13]
No one is making a NY AR15 right now I beleive so your going to have to ask a gunsmith to modify one for you out of state then send in into NY.

Probably?

ETA: By clip do you mean mag, and if its perm attached then your going to have to load it from the top with the upper and lower detached or put a round straight in the chamber.
pincushion
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Posted: 8/11/2013 8:56:55 PM
yes by "clip" I did mean mag. I was thinking of something along the lines of most bolt action rifles that can accept multiple cartridges. By New York law a detachable mag is illegal if you pair it up with a pistol grip. I have already put out a call to a manufacturer for a solution to this but was just curious if anyone else has had something like this made.
jukeboxx13
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Posted: 8/11/2013 9:00:13 PM
[Last Edit: 8/11/2013 9:00:35 PM by jukeboxx13]
I doubt anyone makes a NY legal AR right now since the laws just passed this year.

Maybe in a few years.

Good luck
CMSENGINE
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Posted: 8/11/2013 9:27:00 PM
R@D done, testing done, Patents filed, sample on way to ATF for determination. If all clear, about 2 months out. Will announce on AR15 .COM the correct way when the time comes. Can't say any more. Craig.
backbencher
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Posted: 8/11/2013 9:29:55 PM
This might be of help to you:

http://www.cammenga.com/product-p/em2-556.htm



You'll have to modify it quite a bit to get it down to 7 rounds. But it could be permanently mounted in the magwell, & just mill out the front of the well below the pivot pin.

Or you could join us and build a plastic lower w/ a 7 round vertical hopper that takes stripper clips.

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/effortcalifornia/effortCalifornia.html
Volunteer for the Feinstein project - help build a functional AR lower out of plastic building blocks! www.FeinsteinProject.org
Aimless
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Posted: 8/11/2013 9:32:39 PM
Originally Posted By CMSENGINE:
R@D done, testing done, Patents filed, sample on way to ATF for determination. If all clear, about 2 months out. Will announce on AR15 .COM the correct way when the time comes. Can't say any more. Craig.
ATF?
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Posted: 8/11/2013 9:33:06 PM
Originally Posted By backbencher:
This might be of help to you:

http://www.cammenga.com/product-p/em2-556.htm

http://www.cammenga.com/v/vspfiles/photos/EM2-556-2T.jpg

You'll have to modify it quite a bit to get it down to 7 rounds. But it could be permanently mounted in the magwell, & just mill out the front of the well below the pivot pin.

Or you could join us and build a plastic lower w/ a 7 round vertical hopper that takes stripper clips.

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/effortcalifornia/effortCalifornia.html
10 round mags are legal
CMSENGINE
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Posted: 8/11/2013 10:14:38 PM
For those who wonder why I sent a sample to ATF, here is why. I did a Calif. compliant lower back in 2000. I started with ATF Tech Branch to get their determination if the design met the parameters of the law, in their opinion. It has been my experience in the past that they look at it from a mechanical, Technical perspective. I spoke to the same agent I spoke to back in 2000. Without going into detail, there are modifications they feel are too easily reversed, and ones they consider permanent. From the past experiences, I have a pretty good understanding on what they will require. If I don't get it right the first time, I will redesign until I do. Once I have a favorable determination, I have a name and number of a CLEO in NY who I will contact and send a sample to as well. Without a determination from ATF first, you are just spinning your wheels, they won't even consider you. On top of that, I have 5 AR15.COM members, from NY, that will be receiving samples to do with as they please. I am sure from some of their past posts, they will have no problem pointing out any flaws or quality issues. I have been down this road before, and it was no picnic here in Calif. On top of that, every one is leary, not just about legality, but quality of product as well. Just trying to go the distance to ease the worries. Craig
Jasontum
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Posted: 8/11/2013 10:30:13 PM
Why can't you perm. Attach the mag and then hit your pivot pin and open your rifle to reload. When you pivot your upper it exposes the top of your mag and could be loaded easily. Just my .02 cents. Just happy that I live in Texas
Aimless
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Posted: 8/11/2013 10:45:46 PM
Originally Posted By CMSENGINE:
For those who wonder why I sent a sample to ATF, here is why. I did a Calif. compliant lower back in 2000. I started with ATF Tech Branch to get their determination if the design met the parameters of the law, in their opinion. It has been my experience in the past that they look at it from a mechanical, Technical perspective. I spoke to the same agent I spoke to back in 2000. Without going into detail, there are modifications they feel are too easily reversed, and ones they consider permanent. From the past experiences, I have a pretty good understanding on what they will require. If I don't get it right the first time, I will redesign until I do. Once I have a favorable determination, I have a name and number of a CLEO in NY who I will contact and send a sample to as well. Without a determination from ATF first, you are just spinning your wheels, they won't even consider you. On top of that, I have 5 AR15.COM members, from NY, that will be receiving samples to do with as they please. I am sure from some of their past posts, they will have no problem pointing out any flaws or quality issues. I have been down this road before, and it was no picnic here in Calif. On top of that, every one is leary, not just about legality, but quality of product as well. Just trying to go the distance to ease the worries. Craig
I find it hard to believe that the BATF will give you a written opinion on NY Law. I'm not sure what you mean by CLEO, but an opinion of a sheriff won't stop the State Police. NYSP is the only ow that matters, if you can get an written opinion out of them. Good luck, thanks for trying.
Aimless
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Posted: 8/11/2013 10:46:30 PM
Originally Posted By Jasontum:
Why can't you perm. Attach the mag and then hit your pivot pin and open your rifle to reload. When you pivot your upper it exposes the top of your mag and could be loaded easily. Just my .02 cents. Just happy that I live in Texas
That would probably be legal, I have one of those actually