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Posted: 9/14/2015 9:33:13 PM EDT
[#1]
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I have NEVER personally witnessed for myself folks ever carrying a rifle or shotgun around in the street, though it's legal. So just because it becomes legal in January 2016 for handguns, why should we expect to see any jackasses walking around with a holstered pistol on their hip just for the hell of it? If this is something you must do, well then knock yourself out and be the first one on your block to do it. Because you WILL be the only one seen doing it on your block, and probably anywhere for that matter. Enjoy all the attention. Because you certainly will get. I can wear my pants down past my balls too, but some things for attention just don't appeal to me. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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This is the reason everyone should open carry as much as possible come Jan 1. After a while the police will get tired of stopping people to check for a CHL. If they don't and keep harassing people, it would probably be grounds for a lawsuit. I have NEVER personally witnessed for myself folks ever carrying a rifle or shotgun around in the street, though it's legal. So just because it becomes legal in January 2016 for handguns, why should we expect to see any jackasses walking around with a holstered pistol on their hip just for the hell of it? If this is something you must do, well then knock yourself out and be the first one on your block to do it. Because you WILL be the only one seen doing it on your block, and probably anywhere for that matter. Enjoy all the attention. Because you certainly will get. I can wear my pants down past my balls too, but some things for attention just don't appeal to me. Oh don't be so dramatic. I OC'd all the time when I lived in VA, even into downtown Richmond. Occasionally I'd get a comment asking what type of gun it was or if I was a cop, but I was never stopped by a cop I walked by or had them called on me. It is going to be the same in TX, no one will care because 98% of people are oblivious and half of the rest don't care or think it's fine. |
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Posted: 9/14/2015 9:48:51 PM EDT
[#2]
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What other type of holsters, or method of open carry would you suggest? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't think I have a problem with people like that not being allowed to carry around a gun. I think where we will be with the new LTC licensing for open and concealed carry is the best balance (except for the stupid holster requirements). Now if we could get more freedom with campus carry and other places, that would be great. Some might say a drop leg holster is attached to your belt and therefore a belt holster. A cop might argue it is not. Either way, what makes a OWB holster better/safer than a drop leg holster? It just seems a really stupid and unnecessary thing to put in the law. Maybe write the law just requiring a holster so that no one try's to say they are legal walking around with a gun in their hand. |
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Posted: 9/15/2015 8:53:19 AM EDT
[#3]
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Some might say a drop leg holster is attached to your belt and therefore a belt holster. A cop might argue it is not. Either way, what makes a OWB holster better/safer than a drop leg holster? It just seems a really stupid and unnecessary thing to put in the law. Maybe write the law just requiring a holster so that no one try's to say they are legal walking around with a gun in their hand. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't think I have a problem with people like that not being allowed to carry around a gun. I think where we will be with the new LTC licensing for open and concealed carry is the best balance (except for the stupid holster requirements). Now if we could get more freedom with campus carry and other places, that would be great. Some might say a drop leg holster is attached to your belt and therefore a belt holster. A cop might argue it is not. Either way, what makes a OWB holster better/safer than a drop leg holster? It just seems a really stupid and unnecessary thing to put in the law. Maybe write the law just requiring a holster so that no one try's to say they are legal walking around with a gun in their hand. Honestly, because some jack wagon will make a wrist holster and walk around with his booger hook on the bang switch. It could have been written better, but the intent makes some sense to me. |
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Posted: 9/15/2015 10:48:18 AM EDT
[#4]
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Ditto. Where is this?? I don't think openly carrying a handgun is PC for a terry stop as you described. Yes it is illegal under 46.02, but so is operating a motor vehicle. Two people driving, one with a DL, one without. You cant tell who does and who doesnt have one, so do you pull both over and check DLs? no, because theres no PC. I interpret the handgun laws the same way. it would be unlawful search if you were ID'd every time you drove, and every time you legally carried openly. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The only thing open carry means to me is that I will no longer give a shit if my shirt completely covers my pistol at all times. Ditto. Quoted:
I know one local PD is printing booklets with info on the new law. When someone calls, they will make contact with the caller only and provide the information. They will not make contact with the person carrying unless a crime was witnessed. I was quite surprised that they are going through the trouble of actually making contact with the caller and printing materials. Where is this?? Quoted:
Says who? A Driver license is not the same here. Penal Code 46.02 makes it unlawful to carry a handgun. Cop sees you with handgun. He immediately has PC to arrest you for UCW, violation of 46.02. The non-applicability in 46.15 that allows you to carry with a license is the same that allows a armed guard to carry, or a person to carry while hunting, or to carry an illegal knife while fishing. You telling me a cop cannot verify any of those activities if he sees you with said weapon? Cop sees you with handgun. PC exists for arrest. You provide handgun license and show you meet the non-applicability. I don't think openly carrying a handgun is PC for a terry stop as you described. Yes it is illegal under 46.02, but so is operating a motor vehicle. Two people driving, one with a DL, one without. You cant tell who does and who doesnt have one, so do you pull both over and check DLs? no, because theres no PC. I interpret the handgun laws the same way. it would be unlawful search if you were ID'd every time you drove, and every time you legally carried openly. I would point out one difference. If you drive past me in a car I can't see whether you have a license on your person or not. Stopping you at that point is a complete fishing expedition on my part. You cannot stop a car just to determine if someone is licensed since they is a better than even chance that they are....no reasonable suspicion. However, if you walk by with a gun holstered on your hip, I can see that. That's PC to stop right there. Unless and until the Legislature addresses this issue, the cops will be able to stop you to verify whether you are license or not. I would hope that most officers will become inured to OC pretty quickly and this won't be an issue. As an LEO I will not be stopping anyone based soley on OC, There needs to be additional facts available. Most cops I know will behave the same way but not all of them. |
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Posted: 9/15/2015 1:28:19 PM EDT
[#5]
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I would point out one difference. If you drive past me in a car I can't see whether you have a license on your person or not. Stopping you at that point is a complete fishing expedition on my part. You cannot stop a car just to determine if someone is licensed since they is a better than even chance that they are....no reasonable suspicion. However, if you walk by with a gun holstered on your hip, I can see that. That's PC to stop right there. Unless and until the Legislature addresses this issue, the cops will be able to stop you to verify whether you are license or not. I would hope that most officers will become inured to OC pretty quickly and this won't be an issue. As an LEO I will not be stopping anyone based soley on OC, There needs to be additional facts available. Most cops I know will behave the same way but not all of them. Yea, it, like most laws, are clear as mud and open to many different opinions when different people read the same vernacular in the laws. Only time will tell come January, and how people act and LEOs. Haters gonna hate, players gonna play, dumbasses gonna be dumb. While I would like to OC on Jan 1, I think it prudent to get a feel of the land for a couple weeks before I strap anything on...er...tuck my shirt in behind my pistol. I'll prolly start carrying OWB is only difference. |
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Posted: 9/15/2015 1:56:47 PM EDT
[#6]
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Honestly, because some jack wagon will make a wrist holster and walk around with his booger hook on the bang switch. It could have been written better, but the intent makes some sense to me. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't think I have a problem with people like that not being allowed to carry around a gun. I think where we will be with the new LTC licensing for open and concealed carry is the best balance (except for the stupid holster requirements). Now if we could get more freedom with campus carry and other places, that would be great. Some might say a drop leg holster is attached to your belt and therefore a belt holster. A cop might argue it is not. Either way, what makes a OWB holster better/safer than a drop leg holster? It just seems a really stupid and unnecessary thing to put in the law. Maybe write the law just requiring a holster so that no one try's to say they are legal walking around with a gun in their hand. Honestly, because some jack wagon will make a wrist holster and walk around with his booger hook on the bang switch. It could have been written better, but the intent makes some sense to me. |
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Posted: 9/15/2015 8:52:57 PM EDT
[#7]
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I like the TV bad guy/Hedi holster that pops out of a sleeve. Never seen one for sale though. "Only in the movies" Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't think I have a problem with people like that not being allowed to carry around a gun. I think where we will be with the new LTC licensing for open and concealed carry is the best balance (except for the stupid holster requirements). Now if we could get more freedom with campus carry and other places, that would be great. Some might say a drop leg holster is attached to your belt and therefore a belt holster. A cop might argue it is not. Either way, what makes a OWB holster better/safer than a drop leg holster? It just seems a really stupid and unnecessary thing to put in the law. Maybe write the law just requiring a holster so that no one try's to say they are legal walking around with a gun in their hand. Honestly, because some jack wagon will make a wrist holster and walk around with his booger hook on the bang switch. It could have been written better, but the intent makes some sense to me. The guy in Taxi Driver made his out of a drawer slide. 
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Posted: 9/18/2015 9:45:37 AM EDT
[#8]
An open carry question:
A. Law enforcement is allowed to stop you and ask to see your concealed carry license if you are open carrying. B. The concealed handgun license can now be used as identification, as of Sept. 1 2015. If you are stopped while open carrying as a pedestrian and asked to show your concealed carry license, are you required to show any additional ID? |
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Posted: 9/18/2015 9:59:27 AM EDT
[#9]
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An open carry question: A. Law enforcement is allowed to stop you and ask to see your concealed carry license if you are open carrying. B. The concealed handgun license can now be used as identification, as of Sept. 1 2015. If you are stopped while open carrying as a pedestrian and asked to show your concealed carry license, are you required to show any additional ID? AFAIK, this law is still on books: Sec. 411.205. REQUIREMENT TO DISPLAY LICENSE. If a license holder is carrying a handgun on or about the license holder's person when a magistrate or a peace officer demands that the license holder display identification, the license holder shall display both the license holder's driver's license or identification certificate issued by the department and the license holder's handgun license. As we know there is no penalty for failing to do so. I do not think OC changed anything. I also think there is a difference between being asked for ID and being asked to show your license. This is moot of course if there is no penalty. |
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Posted: 9/18/2015 11:45:40 AM EDT
[#10]
Thanks
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Posted: 9/18/2015 3:41:21 PM EDT
[#11]
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AFAIK, this law is still on books: Sec. 411.205. REQUIREMENT TO DISPLAY LICENSE. If a license holder is carrying a handgun on or about the license holder's person when a magistrate or a peace officer demands that the license holder display identification, the license holder shall display both the license holder's driver's license or identification certificate issued by the department and the license holder's handgun license. As we know there is no penalty for failing to do so. I do not think OC changed anything. I also think there is a difference between being asked for ID and being asked to show your license. This is moot of course if there is no penalty. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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An open carry question: A. Law enforcement is allowed to stop you and ask to see your concealed carry license if you are open carrying. B. The concealed handgun license can now be used as identification, as of Sept. 1 2015. If you are stopped while open carrying as a pedestrian and asked to show your concealed carry license, are you required to show any additional ID? AFAIK, this law is still on books: Sec. 411.205. REQUIREMENT TO DISPLAY LICENSE. If a license holder is carrying a handgun on or about the license holder's person when a magistrate or a peace officer demands that the license holder display identification, the license holder shall display both the license holder's driver's license or identification certificate issued by the department and the license holder's handgun license. As we know there is no penalty for failing to do so. I do not think OC changed anything. I also think there is a difference between being asked for ID and being asked to show your license. This is moot of course if there is no penalty. Good to know. I don't mind showing my ID to a police officer when asked. What I do mind is being the subject of a fishing expedition and getting harassed for exercising my rights. I can keep a level head only so far when I am being fucked with. |
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Posted: 9/18/2015 3:57:13 PM EDT
[#12]
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Good to know. I don't mind showing my ID to a police officer when asked. What I do mind is being the subject of a fishing expedition and getting harassed for exercising my rights. I can keep a level head only so far when I am being fucked with. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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An open carry question: A. Law enforcement is allowed to stop you and ask to see your concealed carry license if you are open carrying. B. The concealed handgun license can now be used as identification, as of Sept. 1 2015. If you are stopped while open carrying as a pedestrian and asked to show your concealed carry license, are you required to show any additional ID? AFAIK, this law is still on books: Sec. 411.205. REQUIREMENT TO DISPLAY LICENSE. If a license holder is carrying a handgun on or about the license holder's person when a magistrate or a peace officer demands that the license holder display identification, the license holder shall display both the license holder's driver's license or identification certificate issued by the department and the license holder's handgun license. As we know there is no penalty for failing to do so. I do not think OC changed anything. I also think there is a difference between being asked for ID and being asked to show your license. This is moot of course if there is no penalty. Good to know. I don't mind showing my ID to a police officer when asked. What I do mind is being the subject of a fishing expedition and getting harassed for exercising my rights. I can keep a level head only so far when I am being fucked with. Everyone keep in mind one thing: There is at least one anti-gun group in Texas that has promised to "call the police every time we see an OC person." I think that will backfire on them in the long run . . . CMOS |
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Posted: 9/18/2015 4:30:07 PM EDT
[#13]
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Everyone keep in mind one thing: There is at least one anti-gun group in Texas that has promised to "call the police every time we see an OC person." I think that will backfire on them in the long run . . . CMOS I agree... At some point "crying wolf" always does. |
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Posted: 9/19/2015 9:46:20 AM EDT
[#15]
All I know is that I'm looking forward to January 1st.... well, really May through October. I'm tired of trying to conceal a VP9 under a t-shirt
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Posted: 9/19/2015 10:33:34 AM EDT
[#16]
Say hello to my little pistol friend
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Posted: 9/19/2015 4:15:07 PM EDT
[#17]
There was some congresscritter from (I think) Dallas who was on the news a couple months back blabing about how open carry should be illegal and how their was a delay in implementation (to January) to give businesses time to post 30.07.
I swear morons shouldn't be allowed to talk to reporters or hold public office. |
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Posted: 9/19/2015 4:16:54 PM EDT
[#18]
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Anyone make a belt holster for a Cobray M11/9 ? 
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See: http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/rsd/chl/legal/newlegislation.htm The general consensus, at least from my interactions with other licensees, is that open carry will be fairly rare. Certainly, it will be a nice convenience, but most state a preference for CC. Once open carry is proved to be a non-issue, attitudes will hopefully change. I think in some hostile enclaves, like Austin, caution is warranted. Send out a few canaries and see how they fare...at least in the first few months (or year). I can hardly wait to go around in public with my EAA handheld bullet hose out where everyone can marvel at it's awesomeness.
Anyone make a belt holster for a Cobray M11/9 ?
You'd be surprised how much you can fit in some "generic" nylon holsters. |
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Posted: 9/19/2015 6:32:57 PM EDT
[#19]
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There was some congresscritter from (I think) Dallas who was on the news a couple months back blabing about how open carry should be illegal and how their was a delay in implementation (to January) to give businesses time to post 30.07. I swear morons shouldn't be allowed to talk to reporters or hold public office. I am not surprised that some ass-hat congress critter said that shit. It does make sense to let the new signage be made and distributed to businesses that want them. I am glad that a business will advertise straight up that they do not want my money. |
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Posted: 9/19/2015 11:39:26 PM EDT
[#20]
GH,
I think it is just NOT MEXICAN CARRY |
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Posted: 10/8/2015 9:04:01 PM EDT
[#21]
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Say hello to my little pistol friend <a href="http://s1283.photobucket.com/user/beech18/media/2014-06-27144147_zps034d84bb.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a552/beech18/2014-06-27144147_zps034d84bb.jpg</a> Damn that is nice! I have my Glock 21 for open carry when legal. 
Maybe this? 
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Posted: 10/9/2015 1:30:43 AM EDT
[#22]
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I agree... At some point "crying wolf" always does. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone keep in mind one thing: There is at least one anti-gun group in Texas that has promised to "call the police every time we see an OC person." I think that will backfire on them in the long run . . . CMOS I agree... At some point "crying wolf" always does. Depends on the agencies policy and then the officer. My old agency had a policy if someone called, Dispatch SHALL send a Deputy.. Regardless how redundant the call was... Oh how I enjoyed getting dispatched to a location in the county, for someone legally shooting fireworks...  Or even better, someone calling in about people shooting. And their complaint was generally, "This isn't a gun range, we paid a lot of money to live in the county for the peace and quiet". Was always hard for me to tell those city slickers with a straight face, "Well they paid a lot of money to legally shoot in the county, they're not breaking any laws. Have a nice day"
Being a seasoned guy, I cleared a LOT of BS calls without ever getting out of my car or making contact with anyone... 99% of rookies would always make contact...  Guess it was just me, but I had better things to do than waste my time and someone else's who wasn't breaking any laws or being unsafe. YMMV
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Posted: 10/9/2015 12:51:15 PM EDT
[#23]
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Depends on the agencies policy and then the officer. My old agency had a policy if someone called, Dispatch SHALL send a Deputy.. Regardless how redundant the call was... Oh how I enjoyed getting dispatched to a location in the county, for someone legally shooting fireworks... Or even better, someone calling in about people shooting. And their complaint was generally, "This isn't a gun range, we paid a lot of money to live in the county for the peace and quiet". Was always hard for me to tell those city slickers with a straight face, "Well they paid a lot of money to legally shoot in the county, they're not breaking any laws. Have a nice day"
Being a seasoned guy, I cleared a LOT of BS calls without ever getting out of my car or making contact with anyone... 99% of rookies would always make contact... Guess it was just me, but I had better things to do than waste my time and someone else's who wasn't breaking any laws or being unsafe. YMMV
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Everyone keep in mind one thing: There is at least one anti-gun group in Texas that has promised to "call the police every time we see an OC person." I think that will backfire on them in the long run . . . CMOS I agree... At some point "crying wolf" always does. Depends on the agencies policy and then the officer. My old agency had a policy if someone called, Dispatch SHALL send a Deputy.. Regardless how redundant the call was... Oh how I enjoyed getting dispatched to a location in the county, for someone legally shooting fireworks... Or even better, someone calling in about people shooting. And their complaint was generally, "This isn't a gun range, we paid a lot of money to live in the county for the peace and quiet". Was always hard for me to tell those city slickers with a straight face, "Well they paid a lot of money to legally shoot in the county, they're not breaking any laws. Have a nice day"
Being a seasoned guy, I cleared a LOT of BS calls without ever getting out of my car or making contact with anyone... 99% of rookies would always make contact... Guess it was just me, but I had better things to do than waste my time and someone else's who wasn't breaking any laws or being unsafe. YMMV
I hear you on the bullshit calls. Last May was at my dads land for my semi-annual camping trip and we were shooting up a storm and one of the neighbors that live a mile down the road called the cops on us. Her complaint was that we were shooting at her horses. We were shooting into a backstop a full mile away through the woods and 90 degrees to her property. The sheriff knew it was bullshit call and he still had to walk back to where we were camping a good half mile from the main gravel road. After we showed him the back stop he was satisfied. The new shift made contact with us around 10pm that night and told us that neighbor called several times that day. |
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Posted: 10/9/2015 2:26:54 PM EDT
[#24]
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I hear you on the bullshit calls. Last May was at my dads land for my semi-annual camping trip and we were shooting up a storm and one of the neighbors that live a mile down the road called the cops on us. Her complaint was that we were shooting at her horses. We were shooting into a backstop a full mile away through the woods and 90 degrees to her property. The sheriff knew it was bullshit call and he still had to walk back to where we were camping a good half mile from the main gravel road. After we showed him the back stop he was satisfied. The new shift made contact with us around 10pm that night and told us that neighbor called several times that day. Seems like there are a lot of dumb@$$ people who buy horses and move out in the country but have no business being there. The guy who used to have the "Crazy Lady" shoots had the same kind of problems with a lying, trespassing neighbor like that... Called the cops every time shooting happened and claimed bullets were "whizzing by"... Of course no evidence of anything being hit... because the range was 90 degrees off from her place and had a big backstop. She also crossed over no-trespass marked fence lines to take pictures... sent kids behind the backstop and filed false reports such as claiming she could "smell meth being cooked"... Of course no evidence of that... It is all a huge waste of time for deputies... To the point where I wouldn't feel sorry if the people who make those calls found that when they really NEED help that the deputies were all busy running someone else's BS call. |
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Posted: 10/9/2015 4:02:54 PM EDT
[#25]
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I would point out one difference. If you drive past me in a car I can't see whether you have a license on your person or not. Stopping you at that point is a complete fishing expedition on my part. You cannot stop a car just to determine if someone is licensed since they is a better than even chance that they are....no reasonable suspicion. However, if you walk by with a gun holstered on your hip, I can see that. That's PC to stop right there. Unless and until the Legislature addresses this issue, the cops will be able to stop you to verify whether you are license or not. I would hope that most officers will become inured to OC pretty quickly and this won't be an issue. As an LEO I will not be stopping anyone based soley on OC, There needs to be additional facts available. Most cops I know will behave the same way but not all of them. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The only thing open carry means to me is that I will no longer give a shit if my shirt completely covers my pistol at all times. Ditto. Quoted:
I know one local PD is printing booklets with info on the new law. When someone calls, they will make contact with the caller only and provide the information. They will not make contact with the person carrying unless a crime was witnessed. I was quite surprised that they are going through the trouble of actually making contact with the caller and printing materials. Where is this?? Quoted:
Says who? A Driver license is not the same here. Penal Code 46.02 makes it unlawful to carry a handgun. Cop sees you with handgun. He immediately has PC to arrest you for UCW, violation of 46.02. The non-applicability in 46.15 that allows you to carry with a license is the same that allows a armed guard to carry, or a person to carry while hunting, or to carry an illegal knife while fishing. You telling me a cop cannot verify any of those activities if he sees you with said weapon? Cop sees you with handgun. PC exists for arrest. You provide handgun license and show you meet the non-applicability. I don't think openly carrying a handgun is PC for a terry stop as you described. Yes it is illegal under 46.02, but so is operating a motor vehicle. Two people driving, one with a DL, one without. You cant tell who does and who doesnt have one, so do you pull both over and check DLs? no, because theres no PC. I interpret the handgun laws the same way. it would be unlawful search if you were ID'd every time you drove, and every time you legally carried openly. I would point out one difference. If you drive past me in a car I can't see whether you have a license on your person or not. Stopping you at that point is a complete fishing expedition on my part. You cannot stop a car just to determine if someone is licensed since they is a better than even chance that they are....no reasonable suspicion. However, if you walk by with a gun holstered on your hip, I can see that. That's PC to stop right there. Unless and until the Legislature addresses this issue, the cops will be able to stop you to verify whether you are license or not. I would hope that most officers will become inured to OC pretty quickly and this won't be an issue. As an LEO I will not be stopping anyone based soley on OC, There needs to be additional facts available. Most cops I know will behave the same way but not all of them. Negative. Merely carrying OC is legal, with a permit. You have to have reason othe than just the acct of OC to stop the carrier. Is that so hard to fucking understand? Maybe a judge will help it sink in during the civil suit you're apparently looking forward to. |
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Posted: 10/9/2015 4:46:29 PM EDT
[#26]
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Negative. Merely carrying OC is legal, with a permit. You have to have reason othe than just the acct of OC to stop the carrier. Is that so hard to fucking understand? Maybe a judge will help it sink in during the civil suit you're apparently looking forward to. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I would point out one difference. If you drive past me in a car I can't see whether you have a license on your person or not. Stopping you at that point is a complete fishing expedition on my part. You cannot stop a car just to determine if someone is licensed since they is a better than even chance that they are....no reasonable suspicion. However, if you walk by with a gun holstered on your hip, I can see that. That's PC to stop right there. Unless and until the Legislature addresses this issue, the cops will be able to stop you to verify whether you are license or not. I would hope that most officers will become inured to OC pretty quickly and this won't be an issue. As an LEO I will not be stopping anyone based soley on OC, There needs to be additional facts available. Most cops I know will behave the same way but not all of them. Negative. Merely carrying OC is legal, with a permit. You have to have reason othe than just the acct of OC to stop the carrier. Is that so hard to fucking understand? Maybe a judge will help it sink in during the civil suit you're apparently looking forward to. WOW
In for the TXI smackdown
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Posted: 10/9/2015 8:12:40 PM EDT
[#27]
I predict that a judge will be deciding on the holster & requesting ID issues. As stated in older threads, who wants to be the test case?
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Posted: 10/9/2015 9:37:10 PM EDT
[#28]
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Negative. Merely carrying OC is legal, with a permit. You have to have reason othe than just the acct of OC to stop the carrier. Is that so hard to fucking understand? Maybe a judge will help it sink in during the civil suit you're apparently looking forward to. let's play that out. Penal code 46.02 makes it unlawful to carry a handgun. Cop see person with handgun; that provides probable cause to believe a violation of 46.02. The cop can make an arrest at that point. Cop asks if person meets the non-applicability in penal code 46.15(b). Person shows handgun license, verifying the non-applicability. |
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Posted: 10/9/2015 11:07:19 PM EDT
[#29]
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Negative. Merely carrying OC is legal, with a permit. You have to have reason othe than just the acct of OC to stop the carrier. Is that so hard to fucking understand? Maybe a judge will help it sink in during the civil suit you're apparently looking forward to. If what you say were true, those OC idiots on Katy trail just won the lottery! No license required to OC a toy gun. ROFLMAO. Thinking this is going to go the way of Prouse vs US is extremely wishful. Most likely it will go like it is today for CC, which is like fishing, hunting, etc. LEO can stop you for a license check. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_8_8/589576_Two_dummies_carry_fake_firearms_down_Dallas_Katy_Trail_with_predictable_results.html |
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Posted: 10/10/2015 2:04:56 PM EDT
[#30]
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Seems like there are a lot of dumb@$$ people who buy horses and move out in the country but have no business being there. The guy who used to have the "Crazy Lady" shoots had the same kind of problems with a lying, trespassing neighbor like that... Called the cops every time shooting happened and claimed bullets were "whizzing by"... Of course no evidence of anything being hit... because the range was 90 degrees off from her place and had a big backstop. She also crossed over no-trespass marked fence lines to take pictures... sent kids behind the backstop and filed false reports such as claiming she could "smell meth being cooked"... Of course no evidence of that... It is all a huge waste of time for deputies... To the point where I wouldn't feel sorry if the people who make those calls found that when they really NEED help that the deputies were all busy running someone else's BS call. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I hear you on the bullshit calls. Last May was at my dads land for my semi-annual camping trip and we were shooting up a storm and one of the neighbors that live a mile down the road called the cops on us. Her complaint was that we were shooting at her horses. We were shooting into a backstop a full mile away through the woods and 90 degrees to her property. The sheriff knew it was bullshit call and he still had to walk back to where we were camping a good half mile from the main gravel road. After we showed him the back stop he was satisfied. The new shift made contact with us around 10pm that night and told us that neighbor called several times that day. Seems like there are a lot of dumb@$$ people who buy horses and move out in the country but have no business being there. The guy who used to have the "Crazy Lady" shoots had the same kind of problems with a lying, trespassing neighbor like that... Called the cops every time shooting happened and claimed bullets were "whizzing by"... Of course no evidence of anything being hit... because the range was 90 degrees off from her place and had a big backstop. She also crossed over no-trespass marked fence lines to take pictures... sent kids behind the backstop and filed false reports such as claiming she could "smell meth being cooked"... Of course no evidence of that... It is all a huge waste of time for deputies... To the point where I wouldn't feel sorry if the people who make those calls found that when they really NEED help that the deputies were all busy running someone else's BS call. Do you live in Smithville?
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Posted: 10/10/2015 5:05:19 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do you live in Smithville? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I hear you on the bullshit calls. Last May was at my dads land for my semi-annual camping trip and we were shooting up a storm and one of the neighbors that live a mile down the road called the cops on us. Her complaint was that we were shooting at her horses. We were shooting into a backstop a full mile away through the woods and 90 degrees to her property. The sheriff knew it was bullshit call and he still had to walk back to where we were camping a good half mile from the main gravel road. After we showed him the back stop he was satisfied. The new shift made contact with us around 10pm that night and told us that neighbor called several times that day. Seems like there are a lot of dumb@$$ people who buy horses and move out in the country but have no business being there. The guy who used to have the "Crazy Lady" shoots had the same kind of problems with a lying, trespassing neighbor like that... Called the cops every time shooting happened and claimed bullets were "whizzing by"... Of course no evidence of anything being hit... because the range was 90 degrees off from her place and had a big backstop. She also crossed over no-trespass marked fence lines to take pictures... sent kids behind the backstop and filed false reports such as claiming she could "smell meth being cooked"... Of course no evidence of that... It is all a huge waste of time for deputies... To the point where I wouldn't feel sorry if the people who make those calls found that when they really NEED help that the deputies were all busy running someone else's BS call. Do you live in Smithville? (well technically Muldoon) |
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Posted: 10/10/2015 8:28:05 PM EDT
[#32]
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I used to live in La Grange.... same thing (well technically Muldoon)
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I hear you on the bullshit calls. Last May was at my dads land for my semi-annual camping trip and we were shooting up a storm and one of the neighbors that live a mile down the road called the cops on us. Her complaint was that we were shooting at her horses. We were shooting into a backstop a full mile away through the woods and 90 degrees to her property. The sheriff knew it was bullshit call and he still had to walk back to where we were camping a good half mile from the main gravel road. After we showed him the back stop he was satisfied. The new shift made contact with us around 10pm that night and told us that neighbor called several times that day. Seems like there are a lot of dumb@$$ people who buy horses and move out in the country but have no business being there. The guy who used to have the "Crazy Lady" shoots had the same kind of problems with a lying, trespassing neighbor like that... Called the cops every time shooting happened and claimed bullets were "whizzing by"... Of course no evidence of anything being hit... because the range was 90 degrees off from her place and had a big backstop. She also crossed over no-trespass marked fence lines to take pictures... sent kids behind the backstop and filed false reports such as claiming she could "smell meth being cooked"... Of course no evidence of that... It is all a huge waste of time for deputies... To the point where I wouldn't feel sorry if the people who make those calls found that when they really NEED help that the deputies were all busy running someone else's BS call. Do you live in Smithville? (well technically Muldoon)
I miss Sheriff Jim & Miss Mona... 
Damn You Marvin Zindler!!!! BIGGER_HAMMER 
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Posted: 10/10/2015 8:36:13 PM EDT
[#33]
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I miss Sheriff Jim & Miss Mona... http://blog.chron.com/thetexican/files/2015/06/La-Grange-single.jpg Damn You Marvin Zindler!!!! BIGGER_HAMMER Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I hear you on the bullshit calls. Last May was at my dads land for my semi-annual camping trip and we were shooting up a storm and one of the neighbors that live a mile down the road called the cops on us. Her complaint was that we were shooting at her horses. We were shooting into a backstop a full mile away through the woods and 90 degrees to her property. The sheriff knew it was bullshit call and he still had to walk back to where we were camping a good half mile from the main gravel road. After we showed him the back stop he was satisfied. The new shift made contact with us around 10pm that night and told us that neighbor called several times that day. Seems like there are a lot of dumb@$$ people who buy horses and move out in the country but have no business being there. The guy who used to have the "Crazy Lady" shoots had the same kind of problems with a lying, trespassing neighbor like that... Called the cops every time shooting happened and claimed bullets were "whizzing by"... Of course no evidence of anything being hit... because the range was 90 degrees off from her place and had a big backstop. She also crossed over no-trespass marked fence lines to take pictures... sent kids behind the backstop and filed false reports such as claiming she could "smell meth being cooked"... Of course no evidence of that... It is all a huge waste of time for deputies... To the point where I wouldn't feel sorry if the people who make those calls found that when they really NEED help that the deputies were all busy running someone else's BS call. Do you live in Smithville? (well technically Muldoon)
I miss Sheriff Jim & Miss Mona... http://blog.chron.com/thetexican/files/2015/06/La-Grange-single.jpg Damn You Marvin Zindler!!!! BIGGER_HAMMER Best Little Whorehouse in Texas
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Posted: 10/11/2015 11:27:28 PM EDT
[#34]
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let's play that out. Penal code 46.02 makes it unlawful to carry a handgun. Cop see person with handgun; that provides probable cause to believe a violation of 46.02. The cop can make an arrest at that point. Cop asks if person meets the non-applicability in penal code 46.15(b). Person shows handgun license, verifying the non-applicability. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Negative. Merely carrying OC is legal, with a permit. You have to have reason othe than just the acct of OC to stop the carrier. Is that so hard to fucking understand? Maybe a judge will help it sink in during the civil suit you're apparently looking forward to. let's play that out. Penal code 46.02 makes it unlawful to carry a handgun. Cop see person with handgun; that provides probable cause to believe a violation of 46.02. The cop can make an arrest at that point. Cop asks if person meets the non-applicability in penal code 46.15(b). Person shows handgun license, verifying the non-applicability. lets play this out. In Texas its illegal to drive a car without a drivers license. Cop sees a person driving a car, that provides probable cause to believe they are in violation of driving without a license. The cop can stop and make an arrest at that point. Cop asks "do you have a drivers license?" Person shows drivers license verifying they are legal to drive. Get it? |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 10:26:54 AM EDT
[#35]
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lets play this out. In Texas its illegal to drive a car without a drivers license. Cop sees a person driving a car, that provides probable cause to believe they are in violation of driving without a license. The cop can stop and make an arrest at that point. Cop asks "do you have a drivers license?" Person shows drivers license verifying they are legal to drive. Get it? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Negative. Merely carrying OC is legal, with a permit. You have to have reason othe than just the acct of OC to stop the carrier. Is that so hard to fucking understand? Maybe a judge will help it sink in during the civil suit you're apparently looking forward to. let's play that out. Penal code 46.02 makes it unlawful to carry a handgun. Cop see person with handgun; that provides probable cause to believe a violation of 46.02. The cop can make an arrest at that point. Cop asks if person meets the non-applicability in penal code 46.15(b). Person shows handgun license, verifying the non-applicability. lets play this out. In Texas its illegal to drive a car without a drivers license. Cop sees a person driving a car, that provides probable cause to believe they are in violation of driving without a license. The cop can stop and make an arrest at that point. Cop asks "do you have a drivers license?" Person shows drivers license verifying they are legal to drive. Get it? Prouse vs US ruins your scenario |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 10:46:07 AM EDT
[#36]
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Prouse vs US ruins your scenario Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Negative. Merely carrying OC is legal, with a permit. You have to have reason othe than just the acct of OC to stop the carrier. Is that so hard to fucking understand? Maybe a judge will help it sink in during the civil suit you're apparently looking forward to. let's play that out. Penal code 46.02 makes it unlawful to carry a handgun. Cop see person with handgun; that provides probable cause to believe a violation of 46.02. The cop can make an arrest at that point. Cop asks if person meets the non-applicability in penal code 46.15(b). Person shows handgun license, verifying the non-applicability. lets play this out. In Texas its illegal to drive a car without a drivers license. Cop sees a person driving a car, that provides probable cause to believe they are in violation of driving without a license. The cop can stop and make an arrest at that point. Cop asks "do you have a drivers license?" Person shows drivers license verifying they are legal to drive. Get it? Prouse vs US ruins your scenario Yup. Supreme Court ruled on this 8-1 in 1979 (case started in Delaware). I suspect someone will be the sacrificial lamb test case on the OC license demand somewhere in Texas. It will go on for years. I can't imagine the legislature will address this issue. |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 11:18:01 AM EDT
[#37]
They didn't have to include 4th amendment affirmations in the OC legislation and law. There may be test cases but the 4th amendment will pass the test. It's already done it in other states.
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Posted: 10/12/2015 11:46:20 AM EDT
[#38]
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They didn't have to include 4th amendment affirmations in the OC legislation and law. There may be test cases but the 4th amendment will pass the test. It's already done it in other states. A handgun being seen by a peace officer is probable cause for an arrest in Texas for UCW. A plain view attest does not violate the 4th. |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 12:12:26 PM EDT
[#39]
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A handgun being seen by a peace officer is probable cause for an arrest in Texas for UCW. A plain view attest does not violate the 4th. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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They didn't have to include 4th amendment affirmations in the OC legislation and law. There may be test cases but the 4th amendment will pass the test. It's already done it in other states. A handgun being seen by a peace officer is probable cause for an arrest in Texas for UCW. A plain view attest does not violate the 4th. |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 12:17:01 PM EDT
[#40]
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They didn't have to include 4th amendment affirmations in the OC legislation and law. There may be test cases but the 4th amendment will pass the test. It's already done it in other states. A handgun being seen by a peace officer is probable cause for an arrest in Texas for UCW. A plain view attest does not violate the 4th. lol that logic won't fly in court I promise. By the same logic the sighting of a car ibeing driven on the road is probable cause to believe they are an unlicensed driver. |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 12:32:59 PM EDT
[#41]
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lol that logic won't fly in court I promise. By the same logic the sighting of a car ibeing driven on the road is probable cause to believe they are an unlicensed driver. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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They didn't have to include 4th amendment affirmations in the OC legislation and law. There may be test cases but the 4th amendment will pass the test. It's already done it in other states. A handgun being seen by a peace officer is probable cause for an arrest in Texas for UCW. A plain view attest does not violate the 4th. lol that logic won't fly in court I promise. By the same logic the sighting of a car ibeing driven on the road is probable cause to believe they are an unlicensed driver. Let us know how your test case works out! We will be anxiously awaiting your daily reports for the next 10 years. |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 12:43:55 PM EDT
[#42]
During legislation of the bill there was talk and even clarification of the 4th amendment issues with OC. The anti gun liberal groups were totally against having it put in there and it was left out to appease them to pass the bill. That does not however negate the 4th amendment protection. The anti gunners and the police associations that are against OC would have you believe that because that amendment was left out that it gives "probable cause" the law is being violated. It doesn't and a test case may end up in a higher court, but the 4th amrndment will prevail. We can sit here and argue all day, but there is no doubt that the logic they have convinced some that the sight of a lawful activity is probable cause is flawed. Driving is illegal unless you are licensed, carrying a pistol is illegal unless you have a license. Being in this country without being a citizen or have immigration papers is illegal. They can't stop you so to see your papers without cause. Believe whatever these butt hurt police associations or liberals want you to believe. The 4th amendment applies...
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Posted: 10/12/2015 12:48:44 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
During legislation of the bill there was talk and even clarification of the 4th amendment issues with OC. The anti gun liberal groups were totally against having it put in there and it was left out to appease them to pass the bill. That does not however negate the 4th amendment protection. The anti gunners and the police associations that are against OC would have you believe that because that amendment was left out that it gives "probable cause" the law is being violated. It doesn't and a test case may end up in a higher court, but the 4th amrndment will prevail. We can sit here and argue all day, but there is no doubt that the logic they have convinced some that the sight of a lawful activity is probable cause is flawed. Driving is illegal unless you are licensed, carrying a pistol is illegal unless you have a license. Being in this country without being a citizen or have immigration papers is illegal. They can't stop you so to see your papers without cause. Believe whatever these butt hurt police associations or liberals want you to believe. The 4th amendment applies... You may well be right, but it won't stop you from taking the ride. Keep us posted. |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 12:51:59 PM EDT
[#44]
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Let us know how your test case works out! We will be anxiously awaiting your daily reports for the next 10 years. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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They didn't have to include 4th amendment affirmations in the OC legislation and law. There may be test cases but the 4th amendment will pass the test. It's already done it in other states. A handgun being seen by a peace officer is probable cause for an arrest in Texas for UCW. A plain view attest does not violate the 4th. lol that logic won't fly in court I promise. By the same logic the sighting of a car ibeing driven on the road is probable cause to believe they are an unlicensed driver. Let us know how your test case works out! We will be anxiously awaiting your daily reports for the next 10 years. Lol I am currently temporarily in Georgia sitting in a bar with my handgun carried openly enjoying freedom. Georgia did put in their OC legislation to clarify 4th amendment protection and the police here cannot stop you for merely OCing because it is a legal activity by permit. By the time I am able to move back to Texas it will be a non issue as it will be tested and the 4th amendment will prevail there too. I do t see why you guys hate freedom so much , I'm gonna finish by cold beer and go take a nap :) |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 2:45:34 PM EDT
[#45]
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lol that logic won't fly in court I promise. By the same logic the sighting of a car ibeing driven on the road is probable cause to believe they are an unlicensed driver. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted:
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They didn't have to include 4th amendment affirmations in the OC legislation and law. There may be test cases but the 4th amendment will pass the test. It's already done it in other states. A handgun being seen by a peace officer is probable cause for an arrest in Texas for UCW. A plain view attest does not violate the 4th. lol that logic won't fly in court I promise. By the same logic the sighting of a car ibeing driven on the road is probable cause to believe they are an unlicensed driver. Not the same. At all. Watch |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 2:49:13 PM EDT
[#46]
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lol that logic won't fly in court I promise. By the same logic the sighting of a car ibeing driven on the road is probable cause to believe they are an unlicensed driver. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted:
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They didn't have to include 4th amendment affirmations in the OC legislation and law. There may be test cases but the 4th amendment will pass the test. It's already done it in other states. A handgun being seen by a peace officer is probable cause for an arrest in Texas for UCW. A plain view attest does not violate the 4th. lol that logic won't fly in court I promise. By the same logic the sighting of a car ibeing driven on the road is probable cause to believe they are an unlicensed driver. One more time - Prouse vs US google it before posting again. |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 2:49:38 PM EDT
[#47]
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During legislation of the bill there was talk and even clarification of the 4th amendment issues with OC. The anti gun liberal groups were totally against having it put in there and it was left out to appease them to pass the bill. That does not however negate the 4th amendment protection. The anti gunners and the police associations that are against OC would have you believe that because that amendment was left out that it gives "probable cause" the law is being violated. It doesn't Of course it does. PC 46.02 states, in part, that a person commits an offense if he intentionally, knowingly or recklessly carries a handgun on about his person. If a LEO sees you with a handgun on your belt, he has PC to arrest for a violation of 46.02. If you have a license, that meets the non-applicability of 46.15(b). Refuse to display the license upon demand and the LEO will arrest you for UCW. The Transportation Code, specifically, the DL law, is not written the same. |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 3:25:46 PM EDT
[#48]
It cracks me up when people argue until their blue in the face over theoretical circumstances. I was in an OC state 3 years ago. Some peopled OCed. Never did I see one get harassed by police. If I was pulled over and they saw my CCW license then they would ask if I had a firearm and if I did I told them where it was. Even then never an issue. No point in arguing shit that hasn't even happened yet.
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Posted: 10/12/2015 4:08:23 PM EDT
[#49]
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Let us know how your test case works out! We will be anxiously awaiting your daily reports for the next 10 years. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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They didn't have to include 4th amendment affirmations in the OC legislation and law. There may be test cases but the 4th amendment will pass the test. It's already done it in other states. A handgun being seen by a peace officer is probable cause for an arrest in Texas for UCW. A plain view attest does not violate the 4th. lol that logic won't fly in court I promise. By the same logic the sighting of a car ibeing driven on the road is probable cause to believe they are an unlicensed driver. Let us know how your test case works out! We will be anxiously awaiting your daily reports for the next 10 years. Two different co-workers got caught with UCW years ago by cops that knew that they carried at all times because of the nature of the business that we were all in. The cops were former customers/patrolled the areas that the shops were in. The guy that ran the successful business and had money for an attorney got off. The other that was not doing so well at the time got hosed. Both times, the cops had no good reason to jack with them, other than knowing from contact at the retail locations that they were probably carrying. One was able to buy his way out, the other was not so lucky. 
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Posted: 10/12/2015 4:25:24 PM EDT
[#50]
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Two different co-workers got caught with UCW years ago by cops that knew that they carried at all times because of the nature of the business that we were all in. The cops were former customers/patrolled the areas that the shops were in. The guy that ran the successful business and had money for an attorney got off. The other that was not doing so well at the time got hosed. Both times, the cops had no good reason to jack with them, other than knowing from contact at the retail locations that they were probably carrying. One was able to buy his way out, the other was not so lucky.
Your point? They broke the law, took a ride, had to pay attorneys, make bail, etc? Go to court, trial, etc?
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