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Posted: 12/5/2016 5:03:43 PM EDT
[#1]
  
It's funny because you thought it would. NJ is truly fucked. We're not citizens of the United States. We're prisoners of the country known as New Jersey. Wee're gun owners as long as the country of New Jersey allows us to posses them. The time for us to turn them in is growing nearer. It's best you plan your exit now. I know I am. |
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Posted: 12/5/2016 5:21:03 PM EDT
[#2]
I'll admit I was hoping.
I have a place in FL and some hunting property upstate NY but because of work cannot list either as a primary residence. Moving isn't an option because I won't make the kind of money I make living anywhere else. So, until the SC takes a case and rules we are screwed. |
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Posted: 12/5/2016 9:11:33 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
<snip>Moving isn't an option because I won't make the kind of money I make living anywhere else. <snip> And therein lies the rub. |
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Posted: 12/5/2016 11:57:09 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:
http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/05/gop-congressman-preps-national-concealed-carry-bill-for-next-congress/ (a) IN GENERAL.—Chapter 44 of title 18, United 4 States Code, is amended by inserting after section 926C 5 the following: 6 ‘‘§ 926D. Reciprocity for the carrying of certain con- 7 cealed firearms 8 ‘‘(a) Notwithstanding any provision of the law of any 9 State or political subdivision thereof (except as provided 10 in subsection (b)), a person who is not prohibited by Fed- 11 eral law from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiv- 12 ing a firearm, who is carrying a valid identification docu- 13 ment containing a photograph of the person, and who is 14 carrying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant 15 to the law of a State and which permits the person to 16 carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a con- 17 cealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, 18 may possess or carry a concealed handgun. So it appears this will not help NJ residents. Figures. sets the stage for 14th amendment case..slam dunk win |
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Posted: 12/6/2016 9:36:25 AM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/05/gop-congressman-preps-national-concealed-carry-bill-for-next-congress/ (a) IN GENERAL.—Chapter 44 of title 18, United 4 States Code, is amended by inserting after section 926C 5 the following: 6 ‘‘§ 926D. Reciprocity for the carrying of certain con- 7 cealed firearms 8 ‘‘(a) Notwithstanding any provision of the law of any 9 State or political subdivision thereof (except as provided 10 in subsection (b)), a person who is not prohibited by Fed- 11 eral law from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiv- 12 ing a firearm, who is carrying a valid identification docu- 13 ment containing a photograph of the person, and who is 14 carrying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant 15 to the law of a State and which permits the person to 16 carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a con- 17 cealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, 18 may possess or carry a concealed handgun. So it appears this will not help NJ residents. Figures. I think the wording could be clearer but I interpret that as you must have: 1. valid photo ID (ie: passport or drivers license) and 2. CCW permit from any state OR live in a state that does not require one to carry a concealed firearm So yes it would still apply to NJ residents with a non resident permit from another state. Farther down in the bill is where it excludes the "state of residence of the person" from where the law applies. TLDR: NJ residents should be able to carry everywhere except NJ with a FL/UT/VA/NH permit. |
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Posted: 12/6/2016 10:20:17 AM EDT
[#6]
Hmmm....
I just re-read it again: a person who is not prohibited by Federal law from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm, --- Check who is carrying a valid identification document containing a photograph of the person, --- Check and ( ( who is carrying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant to the law of a State and which permits the person to carry a concealed firearm ) --- Check or (is entitled to carry a concealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, ) ) may possess or carry a concealed handgun. Read that way... with the 'or' being an alternate way to satisfy the "has a permit issued by a state", to include those from states such as VT, AZ, AK, WY - permitless-carry states. A resident of NJ with a UT permit is: 1) not prohibited by federal law, 2) carrying valid photo ID, 3) carrying a permit issued pursuant to a law of a State which permits the person to carry concealed. We don't need to satisfy the last piece - entitled to carry a concealed firearm in our state, because we satisfy the first part of the requirement... having a valid license or permit issued pursuant to any State's law. |
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Posted: 12/7/2016 1:59:13 PM EDT
[#7]
The OP didn't include the rest of the text of the bill. Similar to the language in HR986, it continues:
18 may possess or carry a concealed handgun (other than a 19 machinegun or destructive device) that has been shipped 20 or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, in any 21 State, other than the State of residence of the person, It's the "other than the State of residence of the person" that kills it for NJ. Back to plan B... moving out of this state. |
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Posted: 12/7/2016 4:29:59 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll admit I was hoping. I have a place in FL and some hunting property upstate NY but because of work cannot list either as a primary residence. Moving isn't an option because I won't make the kind of money I make living anywhere else. So, until the SC takes a case and rules we are screwed. If the law applies to out of state permits, at least you could get one and be good almost anywhere but NJ. |
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Posted: 12/7/2016 11:49:56 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If the law applies to out of state permits, at least you could get one and be good almost anywhere but NJ. I have a FL and NH non res which do me no good in NJ. |
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Posted: 12/7/2016 11:50:28 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The OP didn't include the rest of the text of the bill. Similar to the language in HR986, it continues: 18 may possess or carry a concealed handgun (other than a 19 machinegun or destructive device) that has been shipped 20 or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, in any 21 State, other than the State of residence of the person, It's the "other than the State of residence of the person" that kills it for NJ. Back to plan B... moving out of this state. I included the link for the full bill |
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Posted: 12/8/2016 7:48:39 AM EDT
[#11]
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Posted: 12/8/2016 10:10:26 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I included the link for the full bill Right. Let me re-phrase: Responder to the OP only read the excerpt, and didn't read the link to the full bill before replying, thereby making an ass out of himself by erroneously thinking that somehow NJ's refusal to issue carry permits to their citizens would somehow be subjugated by this proposed federal law. |
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Posted: 12/12/2016 4:27:48 PM EDT
[#13]
This part is interesting
“(c) (1) A person who carries or possesses a concealed handgun in accordance with subsections (a) and (b) may not be arrested or otherwise detained for violation of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof related to the possession, transportation, or carrying of firearms unless there is probable cause to believe that the person is doing so in a manner not provided for by this section. Sounds like assault pistol regulations and magazines limits would not be applicable to non-residents. |
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Posted: 12/12/2016 4:46:24 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Right. Let me re-phrase: Responder to the OP only read the excerpt, and didn't read the link to the full bill before replying, thereby making an ass out of himself by erroneously thinking that somehow NJ's refusal to issue carry permits to their citizens would somehow be subjugated by this proposed federal law. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I included the link for the full bill Right. Let me re-phrase: Responder to the OP only read the excerpt, and didn't read the link to the full bill before replying, thereby making an ass out of himself by erroneously thinking that somehow NJ's refusal to issue carry permits to their citizens would somehow be subjugated by this proposed federal law. What post are you referring to? Nobody in this thread said it would apply to NJ residents while in NJ. |
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Posted: 12/12/2016 6:39:31 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What post are you referring to? Nobody in this thread said it would apply to NJ residents while in NJ. Yes... somebody did. That was me. See the post with the red and green colors, then the immediate follow-up as I read the rest of the bill. |
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Posted: 1/4/2017 2:54:15 AM EDT
[#16]
Update: The bill was introduced yesterday. Curiously, the language about "in any state other than the person's state of residence" has been removed.
Here's the link to the full text of the bill, as introduced: https://hudson.house.gov/uploads/Concealed%20Carry%20Reciprocity%20Act%20of%202017.pdf The bill states: 8 ‘‘(a) Notwithstanding any provision of the law of any
9 State or political subdivision thereof (except as provided 10 in subsection (b)) and subject only to the requirements 11 of this section, a person who is not prohibited by Federal 12 law from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiving 13 a firearm, who is carrying a valid identification document 14 containing a photograph of the person, and who is car- 15 rying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant 16 to the law of a State and which permits the person to 17 carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a con- 18 cealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, 19 may possess or carry a concealed handgun (other than a 20 machinegun or destructive device) that has been shipped 21 or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, in any 22 State that— 23 ‘‘(1) has a statute under which residents of the 24 State may apply for a license or permit to carry a 25 concealed firearm; or 1 ‘‘(2) does not prohibit the carrying of concealed 2 firearms by residents of the State for lawful pur- 3 poses. Somebody check me here.... but as I read the above, I see nothing that wouldn't apply to a NJ resident with a FL permit, while in the state of NJ. |
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Posted: 1/4/2017 6:40:45 AM EDT
[#17]
8 ‘‘(a) Notwithstanding any provision of the law of any
9 State or political subdivision thereof (except as provided 10 in subsection (b)) and subject only to the requirements 11 of this section, a person who is not prohibited by Federal 12 law from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiving 13 a firearm, who is carrying a valid identification document 14 containing a photograph of the person, and who is car- 15 rying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant 16 to the law of a State and which permits the person to 17 carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a con- 18 cealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, 19 may possess or carry a concealed handgun (other than a 20 machinegun or destructive device) that has been shipped 21 or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, in any 22 State that— 23 ‘‘(1) has a statute under which residents of the 24 State may apply for a license or permit to carry a 25 concealed firearm; or 1 ‘‘(2) does not prohibit the carrying of concealed 2 firearms by residents of the State for lawful pur- 3 poses. i'd guess that fucks NJ right there. well, amongst other things.......... |
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Posted: 1/4/2017 9:23:17 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
8 ‘‘(a) Notwithstanding any provision of the law of any 9 State or political subdivision thereof (except as provided 10 in subsection (b)) and subject only to the requirements 11 of this section, a person who is not prohibited by Federal 12 law from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiving 13 a firearm, who is carrying a valid identification document 14 containing a photograph of the person, and who is car- 15 rying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant 16 to the law of a State and which permits the person to 17 carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a con- 18 cealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, 19 may possess or carry a concealed handgun (other than a 20 machinegun or destructive device) that has been shipped 21 or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, in any 22 State that— 23 ‘‘(1) has a statute under which residents of the 24 State may apply for a license or permit to carry a 25 concealed firearm; or 1 ‘‘(2) does not prohibit the carrying of concealed 2 firearms by residents of the State for lawful pur- 3 poses. i'd guess that fucks NJ right there. well, amongst other things.......... This was discussed above. "carrying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant to the law of a State and which permits the person to carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a concealed firearm in the State in which the person resides" "OR" is the crucial word here, you should only have to satisfy one of those conditions. It appears that was added to allow people who live in states that don't require a permit to carry everywhere without one. |
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Posted: 1/4/2017 10:06:22 AM EDT
[#19]
I hope it passes. It however still means nothing to NJ.
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Posted: 1/4/2017 11:39:28 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
17 carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a con- 18 cealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, 21 or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, in any 22 State that— 23 ‘‘(1) has a statute under which residents of the 24 State may apply for a license or permit to carry a 25 concealed firearm; or 1 ‘‘(2) does not prohibit the carrying of concealed 2 firearms by residents of the State for lawful pur- 3 poses. Mak covered the first part (lines 17-18) - and I agree. You either have a permit to carry a concealed firearm issued by "a state", OR you reside in a state that permits it's residents to carry a concealed firearm without a permit. On lines 21-25, and 1-3 on the next page... NJ qualifies as #1... it's a state that has a statute under which residents may apply for a permit to carry a handgun. Forget about how the state rejects those applications - it only matters that NJ has such a statute. And, since condition 1 is satisfied, condition 2 is moot. Again, condition 2 is there for states that have no statute permitting people to apply for a permit, if no permit is required (think VT). I don't see the above language surviving the various gyrations this bill will go through, so I'm not overly optimistic - but as it stands right NOW, if this were to pass, NJ would get a HUGE thumb stuck right up their ass. And THAT makes me happy 
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Posted: 1/4/2017 11:51:21 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
8 ‘‘(a) Notwithstanding any provision of the law of any 9 State or political subdivision thereof (except as provided 10 in subsection (b)) and subject only to the requirements 11 of this section, a person who is not prohibited by Federal 12 law from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiving 13 a firearm, who is carrying a valid identification document 14 containing a photograph of the person, and who is car- 15 rying a valid license or permit which is issued pursuant 16 to the law of a State and which permits the person to 17 carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a con- 18 cealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, 19 may possess or carry a concealed handgun (other than a 20 machinegun or destructive device) that has been shipped 21 or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, in any 22 State that— 23 ‘‘(1) has a statute under which residents of the 24 State may apply for a license or permit to carry a 25 concealed firearm; or 1 ‘‘(2) does not prohibit the carrying of concealed 2 firearms by residents of the State for lawful pur- 3 poses. i'd guess that fucks NJ right there. well, amongst other things.......... Read the bolded part again, the part you highlighted in Red is for states with Constitutional Carry. you need a carry permit issued from "a" state. It says nothing about state of residence. |
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Posted: 1/4/2017 8:24:33 PM EDT
[#22]
If I'm reading it correctly it looks like they fixed the language to legally allow us to get a non resident permit and carry here in state.
Assuming it passes who will volunteer to be the guinea pig? |
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Posted: 1/4/2017 8:52:27 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mak covered the first part (lines 17-18) - and I agree. You either have a permit to carry a concealed firearm issued by "a state", OR you reside in a state that permits it's residents to carry a concealed firearm without a permit. On lines 21-25, and 1-3 on the next page... NJ qualifies as #1... it's a state that has a statute under which residents may apply for a permit to carry a handgun. Forget about how the state rejects those applications - it only matters that NJ has such a statute. And, since condition 1 is satisfied, condition 2 is moot. Again, condition 2 is there for states that have no statute permitting people to apply for a permit, if no permit is required (think VT). I don't see the above language surviving the various gyrations this bill will go through, so I'm not overly optimistic - but as it stands right NOW, if this were to pass, NJ would get a HUGE thumb stuck right up their ass. And THAT makes me happy Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
17 carry a concealed firearm or is entitled to carry a con- 18 cealed firearm in the State in which the person resides, 21 or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, in any 22 State that— 23 ‘‘(1) has a statute under which residents of the 24 State may apply for a license or permit to carry a 25 concealed firearm; or 1 ‘‘(2) does not prohibit the carrying of concealed 2 firearms by residents of the State for lawful pur- 3 poses. Mak covered the first part (lines 17-18) - and I agree. You either have a permit to carry a concealed firearm issued by "a state", OR you reside in a state that permits it's residents to carry a concealed firearm without a permit. On lines 21-25, and 1-3 on the next page... NJ qualifies as #1... it's a state that has a statute under which residents may apply for a permit to carry a handgun. Forget about how the state rejects those applications - it only matters that NJ has such a statute. And, since condition 1 is satisfied, condition 2 is moot. Again, condition 2 is there for states that have no statute permitting people to apply for a permit, if no permit is required (think VT). I don't see the above language surviving the various gyrations this bill will go through, so I'm not overly optimistic - but as it stands right NOW, if this were to pass, NJ would get a HUGE thumb stuck right up their ass. And THAT makes me happy NJ will just change its laws so that is a "non-issue" state. |
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Posted: 1/4/2017 8:59:07 PM EDT
[#24]
Folks... this bill would also invalidate NJ's magazine restriction, as it defines a handgun as:
The term ‘handgun’ includes any magazine
4 for use in a handgun and any ammunition loaded 5 into the handgun or its magazine. Therefore, if you meet the requirements of this, it says that any state law prohibiting possession of that handgun (which now includes it's magazines) is nullified. It also invalidates NJ's AWB with respect to pistols (meaning it would be legal to possess an AR-15 pistol - though you'd probably have to build it yourself, as it would probably still be illegal for an FFL to transfer one to you). And, if you possess an AR-15 pistol, then 30-round magazines become legal, as well. Oh, and of course, carrying hollowpoints would now be fine, too. Holy shit - you could even transport a box of HP ammo from one home to another! It also nullifies the GFSZA (Gun-Free School Zone Act), which is 18 USC § 922Q - another pathetic piece of shit legislation that was already struck down once for being unconstitutional, then just ramrodded back into law by adding in references to "interstate commerce". In a stark bit of irony, that's the exact same legal theory that this pending legislation is based on. Oh, the kittens this is going to create coming out of the liberal democrats' internals.... 
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Posted: 1/5/2017 9:22:29 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Folks... this bill would also invalidate NJ's magazine restriction, as it defines a handgun as: Therefore, if you meet the requirements of this, it says that any state law prohibiting possession of that handgun (which now includes it's magazines) is nullified. It also invalidates NJ's AWB with respect to pistols (meaning it would be legal to possess an AR-15 pistol - though you'd probably have to build it yourself, as it would probably still be illegal for an FFL to transfer one to you). And, if you possess an AR-15 pistol, then 30-round magazines become legal, as well. Oh, and of course, carrying hollowpoints would now be fine, too. Holy shit - you could even transport a box of HP ammo from one home to another! It also nullifies the GFSZA (Gun-Free School Zone Act), which is 18 USC § 922Q - another pathetic piece of shit legislation that was already struck down once for being unconstitutional, then just ramrodded back into law by adding in references to "interstate commerce". In a stark bit of irony, that's the exact same legal theory that this pending legislation is based on. Oh, the kittens this is going to create coming out of the liberal democrats' internals.... Yeah, except NJ will just ban everything. 
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Posted: 1/12/2017 3:29:36 PM EDT
[#26]
Here you go. Should clear up any questions. LOL
http://freebeacon.com/issues/national-reciprocity-bill-will-apply-non-resident-gun-carry-permits/ January 11, 2017 5:52 pm Rep. Richard Hudson (R., N.C.) clarified on Wednesday that his national concealed carry reciprocity bill would apply to permits issued by states to non-residents. After Hudson introduced the Concealed Carry Reciprocity Act of 2017 last week, questions were raised about whether it would apply to permits issued by some states to non-residents. In an interview with the Free Beacon, Hudson confirmed that permits issued by any state to residents or non-residents would have to be recognized by all other states under his legislation. “My legislative intent is to ensure a non-resident carry permit is recognized, and I’ve confirmed this with legislative counsel and Judiciary Committee staff,” Hudson said. Many gun owners in states that use a “may issue” permitting process, such as California or New Jersey, are not able to obtain concealed carry permits from their home state—even if they’ve passed a background check and met the training requirements—since the final decision in those states is left at the discretion of government officials. However, those same gun owners may be able to obtain a non-resident permit from a state with different gun laws. Under Hudson’s proposal, that permit would allow them to carry across the country—including in their home state. |
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Posted: 1/12/2017 3:57:16 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Here you go. Should clear up any questions. LOL http://freebeacon.com/issues/national-reciprocity-bill-will-apply-non-resident-gun-carry-permits/ January 11, 2017 5:52 pm Rep. Richard Hudson (R., N.C.) clarified on Wednesday that his national concealed carry reciprocity bill would apply to permits issued by states to non-residents. After Hudson introduced the Concealed Carry Reciprocity Act of 2017 last week, questions were raised about whether it would apply to permits issued by some states to non-residents. In an interview with the Free Beacon, Hudson confirmed that permits issued by any state to residents or non-residents would have to be recognized by all other states under his legislation. “My legislative intent is to ensure a non-resident carry permit is recognized, and I’ve confirmed this with legislative counsel and Judiciary Committee staff,” Hudson said. Many gun owners in states that use a “may issue” permitting process, such as California or New Jersey, are not able to obtain concealed carry permits from their home state—even if they’ve passed a background check and met the training requirements—since the final decision in those states is left at the discretion of government officials. However, those same gun owners may be able to obtain a non-resident permit from a state with different gun laws. Under Hudson’s proposal, that permit would allow them to carry across the country—including in their home state. If this becomes law it will be the biggest expansion of gun rights in our nation's history. Interesting times for sure. There is a very real chance of it actually passing too and Trumps already made it clear he supports it and will sign it into law. |
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Posted: 1/12/2017 5:52:38 PM EDT
[#28]
If it passes the cock suckers in NJ will make it so it doesn't apply here. Mark my words they'll find a way to fuck us.
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Posted: 1/13/2017 8:04:38 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If it passes the cock suckers in NJ will make it so it doesn't apply here. Mark my words they'll find a way to fuck us. Without a doubt. |
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Posted: 1/14/2017 11:13:24 PM EDT
[#30]
So how do i get a FL permit? Bangers used to have classes but they are closed right now.
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Posted: 1/14/2017 11:28:11 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So how do i get a FL permit? Bangers used to have classes but they are closed right now. Unless you want FL for a specific reason, NH is the best and easiest to get permit for NJ residents right now. No classes, photos, or fingerprints required and it's valid in PA. |
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Posted: 1/14/2017 11:40:11 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Unless you want FL for a specific reason, NH is the best and easiest to get permit for NJ residents right now. No classes, photos, or fingerprints required and it's valid in PA. Wasn't aware of NH. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 9:15:34 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wasn't aware of NH. Link? |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 12:20:04 PM EDT
[#34]
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Posted: 1/15/2017 9:03:11 PM EDT
[#35]
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:37:15 PM EDT
[#36]
Got my NH NR CCW (FTW!) several months ago. I gave them copies of my FID and UT permit - not sure that was entirely necessary. It would be good to know of someone who got a NH permit just by submitting a NJ FID.
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Posted: 1/16/2017 11:26:18 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Got my NH NR CCW (FTW!) several months ago. I gave them copies of my FID and UT permit - not sure that was entirely necessary. It would be good to know of someone who got a NH permit just by submitting a NJ FID. This is what I'm waiting for. Someone to say that got one without submitting them. I do the want to apply then get denied because I didn't submit them. Then I'd have to answer yes to the whole, "Have you ever been denied" question. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 4:50:50 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is what I'm waiting for. Someone to say that got one without submitting them. I do the want to apply then get denied because I didn't submit them. Then I'd have to answer yes to the whole, "Have you ever been denied" question. Have you tried calling them? |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 6:00:15 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have you tried calling them? No, I just found out about it this weekend. |
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Posted: 1/17/2017 12:06:10 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is what I'm waiting for. Someone to say that got one without submitting them. I do the want to apply then get denied because I didn't submit them. Then I'd have to answer yes to the whole, "Have you ever been denied" question.  Attached File |
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