Sorry, I live in CT but I have some friends that live in NJ and i would like to modify his AR a bit for a Christmas gift. Nothing crazy just a FF rail and and AFG....
What i am trying to find in the laws pertains to the a "firearm"  which in CT can be made from a virgin stripped lower, sig brace, 12 inch barrel and a virtical grip on the FF rail. The overall lenght has to be above 26 inches to keep from being an AOW. Any thoughts on this. thanks i will continue to try and find more in the laws. I would love to get one for him.

EDIT: "Handgun" means any pistol, revolver, or other firearm originally designed or manufactured to be fired by the use of
a single hand.
"Rifle" means any firearm designed to be fired from the shoulder and using the energy of the explosive in a fixed
metallic cartridge to fire a single projectile through a rifled bore for each single pull of the trigger.
so its not a rifle and not a handgun and not a shotgun.... just a firearm... i can't find any reason this would be banned.

the link below is an example from Franklin armory.
Franklin Armory XO-26

Well...  43 views and no replies, pretty much says, "we don't really know".  True, the firearm doesn't appear to fall into NJ's definitions of "handgun", "shotgun", or "rifle".  However, neither does a pistol-grip only shotgun.  However, no one will sell you a PGO without an FID card?  Why not?  An FID is required to purchase rifles and shotguns.  If a PGO isn't a shotgun (designed to fire from the shoulder), then what's the problem, right?

The problem is, you will spend a shit-ton of money in legal fees trying to defend yourself from a charge of "possession of a sawed-off shotgun" (yes - in NJ, a short-barreled rifle is considered a sawed-off shotgun), because no one will care about the technical nuance of the firearm that, "well, it's not designed to be fired from the shoulder, so it can't be a rifle".  In the end, you MAY wind up winning - but not until you've spent over $50,000 on attorneys, expert witnesses, and the like...  and spent more than a few months behind bars, as it all gets "sorted out".  And even then, I'd only put your chances of prevailing at around 12%.

Again - this is another one of those, "it may be legal, but you still shouldn't do it" - much like walking down Main Street with an unloaded AR-15 slung over your back, and FID in hand.  Technically, you're breaking no laws.  Doesn't mean you won't be arrested (or worse), charged, and ran through "the system".

I'll preface this with "I believe"

I believe that in the great state of NJ, if you remove the shoulder fire capability of a rifle, then it becomes a handgun...and to be a NJ legal handgun, the magazine must feed through the pistol grip.  It cannot be separate.

And I am certain, that SBRs are not legal in NJ.  Therefore a rifle must have a 16" (O.A.L.) barrel.

***EDIT***

From the NJ Division of Criminal Justice

"a semi-automatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of the following:
an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;
a threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer;
a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned;
manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; and
a semi-automatic version of an automatic firearm."

No mention of overall length.

This was the same problem I ran I to in CT. It took almost 11 months to get a decision from the state police, but in the end it is legal and also exempt from all the assault weapons laws. Here in CT if the barrel of any firearm is less that 12 inches it becomes a handgun. For NJ all I can find is if it is designed to be used with one hand it is a handgun. The rules for the firearm is as follows: virgin lower( never been a rifle), two handed grip ( pistol grip and a vertical grip not an afg) and the overall lenght of 26 inches keeps it from being an AOW (requiring a 5 dollar strap) just a firearm which fro. Want I can tell is good to go for you guys to.
Just try to get you guys some sweet little ar's.
Maybe the next step is contacting the state police firearms unit.
Thanks for the responses.

The FID is a firearm ID card that allows you to purchase a firearm so a PGO is a shotgun but if you add a pistol grip on the front and is overall 26 inches or longer you have a firearm.... either way the FID should allow you to purchase....  sounds like some clarification from the state would help. This includes your local FFL.... they can make calls to get this clarification.

No - a firearms ID card is required to purchase "rifles and shotguns".  From 2C:58-3b:



I wasn't really asking it as a question...  I was using it as an example of, "just because something doesn't fit into the defined parameters of our laws, doesn't mean it's cut-and-dry legal".  And a PGO isn't a shotgun by our definition, just as your firearm example isn't a rifle - because neither are designed to be fired from the shoulder...  and said characteristic is in our definitions of both shotgun and rifle.

I wish you luck with your pursuit of this to the state police.  However, I can already tell you what their answer will be.  The last time someone down in Trenton went out on a limb (the fiasco over the ML Carbine - a virtual clone of the M1 Carbine), he got his dick slapped pretty hard, and those who purchased those rifles had to return them to the FFL, or face prosecution.  I'm sure that incident cemented into their minds that, when in doubt, the answer is always "no - not legal".

OK, Thanks for all the info. it seems you guys are in a worse spot than me in CT, i never thought that possible. Thanks again

I do not believe that all were returned.

  NJ laso has a Weight Limot of 50 Oz for "Handguns" and doesnt allow a "Barrel Shroud"  IIRC there has only ever been one "Factory" NJ AWB Legal AR "Pistol" one of the Bushmaster Carbon 15 line.

Just to throw a wrench out there...I spoke to a buddy that just picked up a NJ legal AR pistol from an FFL because it had no barrel shroud.  Short barrel, magazine feeds separate from the pistol grip, etc.  Still NJ legal.

Apparently, as long as you can't hold it with your 2 hands, you're ok (according to my friend's FFL)

I hold my factory-jersey-legal AR pistols (2) with both my hands all the time.
Sometimes I use both hands on the pistol grip, and sometimes I use my dominant hand on the grip while the other hand wraps around the front of the 15 round mag.
Whether you can use 2 hands to hold it or not has absolutely no bearing on its legality in this G-dawful state.

I don't believe the shroudless Bushmaster (or its predecessor the Professional Ordinance) is in production any longer.
But fear not - there is an FFL on the edge of a western desert who is modifying the currently produced Extar EXP 556 pistol to make it jersey-legal.

According to the (now 18-year-old) Attorney General guidelines to prosecutors on what does and does not constitute an "assault firearm", a semi-automatic pistol that can accept a detachable magazine, and has TWO of the following features is an assault firearm, and illegal in NJ:

- an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip
- a threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer
- a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned
- a manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded

When talking about an AR pistol, it can not have a barrel shroud (handguards), can not have a forward handgrip, can not have a threaded barrel, can not have a flash suppressor (even if permanently attached), and can not weigh 50 oz. or more when unloaded

Again...  these are guidelines issued to prosecutors in an attempt to define what is "substantially identical" to the list of named firearms NJ considers "assault firearms".  The above is NOT codified in law(*).  The truth is, no one can say for sure whether or not an AR pistol that meets the above qualfiications is actually illegal.  The last time "substantially identical" was challenged in court, the charge was dismissed.  Could that happen again?  Yup.  You could also be found guilty of a 2nd degree offense, and spend at least 3.5 years in prison.  Given the severity of guessing wrong, most choose to adhere to the guidelines "as if" they had the force of law.


* The actual law, 2C:39-1w, reads, in part:
"Assault firearm" means:
(1) The following firearms [list of 37 or so makes and models]
(2) Any firearm manufactured under any designation which is substantially identical to any of the firearms listed above

Tom,

I wish to take issue with your statement:
"When talking about an AR pistol, it can not have a barrel shroud (handguards), can not have a forward handgrip, can not have a threaded barrel, can not have a flash suppressor (even if permanently attached), and can not weigh 50 oz. or more when unloaded "

Reading the "evil features list", it says in plain English that the second evil feature is a THREADED BARREL, not the accessories that can be attached to same.
The Bushmaster AR pistol line uses an air-hose type coupler to attach its muzzle accessories. The barrel is NOT threaded. And so long as threads are not accessible, they are not there, same as on a rifle with a permanently (pin and weld, silver solder) attached muzzle accessory. The rifle list, however, includes flash suppressors as an evil feature, whereas the pistol list does not.

IANAL, but I did install GeniusSTAT thermostats in a Holiday Inn Express.

Understood.  Since a "threaded barrel capable of accepting a forward grip" didn't make much sense to me, I took the list of items after "threaded barrel" to be separate and distinct.

Remember - these are guidelines...  they're suggestions.  Nothing stops a prosecutor from saying, "well, obviously a flash suppressor is an identifying characteristic of an assault firearm, since it was spelled out in other sections."  It's all about what "substantially identical" means at the time.  Frankly, I think it's all a bunch of shit, and should just be ignored.  Problem is, I'm not willing to step up and be the test case to prove that conjecture true.

 It isnt the AG Guideline as much as the "Administrative Code" that is the Issue.... But at this point it's all Moot.  Luckily we havent had a really "Active" Anti as Ag Since Paula Dow has been removed.....she was on her way to Declaring ALL AK-Pattern firearms, and, eventually AR's as well as "Substantially Identical" with her actions in going after Auto Ordnance with their Carbine copy, and then getting the IO AK-Pattern rifles banned as well.  In All Honesty, as long as you follow the external essentially Cosmetic rules you should be OK..i Doubt anyone would ever actually Weigh it....unfortunately I think the Sig Brace would take you out of the "Safe" realm


ETA:  Just remeber one thing..this is NJ we are talking about where the State Supreme Court made the ruling that "In the matter of Firearms, the citizen acts at his own Peril"

Is "substantially identical" further defined in the NJAC?

You forgot he is in a cave

Nope..therein lies the problem..they've NEVER actually defined it..so they can use it as a catch-all... Just as DOW did with first Auto Ord, and then IO Inc.  AG Guidelines really only apply to LE and how they respond to subjects enumerated in it,  Vehicular Pursuits, Domestic Violence, Use of Force, Firearms Qualification, for example.....the Administrative Code is how the actual Statute is interpreted by the Courts, and in the case of the AWB, the NJSP Firearms Unit