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OK, technical (and legality) question...
What happens if you have a squib load that only partly cycles the action? |
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Since the first proto-types, the bolt has been lightened to prevent short strokes.
Bob, as with most firearms manufacturers, says not to use homeloaded ammunition in the rifle, so this shouldn't happen. In my opinion, the round would have to be dangerously low pressure to short stroke the action, as it is traveling soo fast with normal factory ammunition, so would you really want to pull the trigger again if that happened? |
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Since the first proto-types, the bolt has been lightened to prevent short strokes. Bob, as with most firearms manufacturers, says not to use homeloaded ammunition in the rifle, so this shouldn't happen. In my opinion, the round would have to be dangerously low pressure to short stroke the action, as it is traveling soo fast with normal factory ammunition, so would you really want to pull the trigger again if that happened? .....but does that mean it could......... |
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Since the first proto-types, the bolt has been lightened to prevent short strokes. Bob, as with most firearms manufacturers, says not to use homeloaded ammunition in the rifle, so this shouldn't happen. In my opinion, the round would have to be dangerously low pressure to short stroke the action, as it is traveling soo fast with normal factory ammunition, so would you really want to pull the trigger again if that happened? That answers one of my questions, thanks. Another couple of questions: It appears from the photos that the rotating cam bolt is no longer a part of the system, presumably to enable easier ejection and that ejection is caused by blowback alone (i.e. no gas system) Is this right? |
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Quoted: Quoted: Since the first proto-types, the bolt has been lightened to prevent short strokes. Bob, as with most firearms manufacturers, says not to use homeloaded ammunition in the rifle, so this shouldn't happen. In my opinion, the round would have to be dangerously low pressure to short stroke the action, as it is traveling soo fast with normal factory ammunition, so would you really want to pull the trigger again if that happened? That answers one of my questions, thanks. Another couple of questions: It appears from the photos that the rotating cam bolt is no longer a part of the system, presumably to enable easier ejection and that ejection is caused by blowback alone (i.e. no gas system) Is this right? No cam pin because it's a blowback design. It therefore doesn't need to rotate as there are no locking lugs |
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Highly recommended that you wear shooting glasses with it as well, else you might get nasty stuff in your eyes. Why is there a channel for a cocking lever on the LHS if it does not require one?
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I had a question about the lower and a concern. If you can't take it apart how can you properly clean it, with it being a blowback action I'd expect it to get a little dirtier than the average and need it once in a while?
The concern I have is the statement that holding the release lever down whilst firing WILL damage the rifle causing a repair bill for a third of the cost of the rifle! Is this not something that could be done accidentally whilst trying to shoot it quickly, and it also seems like something someone who hadn't shot one before might try so it'd put me off letting other people have a go... |
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I can only assume that there is a disconnector setup whereas the trigger group will not set until the carrier has cycled and pushed it down.
As for cleaning, please explain this cleaning to me |
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Just seems a bit odd that something which could probably be done quite easily (not sure as I obviously haven't shot one) would severely damage the rifle?
As for cleaning, that's what you do when your gun stops working, or what you do just before Dillon have to send you the replacement bits in my case Andy |
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I can only assume that there is a disconnector setup whereas the trigger group will not set until the carrier has cycled and pushed it down. As for cleaning, please explain this cleaning to me ....Off topic....ban him.... ....and to keep it on track, is there an answer to the squib load question.? Just because someone says "don't shoot home loads" don't mean they won't. Who's responsible/liable if this thing 'auto loads'.......... |
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Quoted: Quoted: I can only assume that there is a disconnector setup whereas the trigger group will not set until the carrier has cycled and pushed it down. As for cleaning, please explain this cleaning to me ....Off topic....ban him.... ....and to keep it on track, is there an answer to the squib load question.? Just because someone says "don't shoot home loads" don't mean they won't. Who's responsible/liable if this thing 'auto loads'.......... Tis but a good point because amongst other things, how much 9mm is available on the market? Me thinks not much (apart from what Jim 'n' his dad have stashed away) so this will eventually lead to the reloading bench and prolonged sessions of tipping the jug. It doesn't have to fire the second round, just chamber it |
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Quoted: Quoted: I can only assume that there is a disconnector setup whereas the trigger group will not set until the carrier has cycled and pushed it down. As for cleaning, please explain this cleaning to me ....Off topic....ban him.... ....and to keep it on track, is there an answer to the squib load question.? Just because someone says "don't shoot home loads" don't mean they won't. Who's responsible/liable if this thing 'auto loads'.......... I've seen a number of .22's fire bursts when dirty - it's just 'one of those things'. Nobody seems to worry about it... |
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Since the first proto-types, the bolt has been lightened to prevent short strokes. Bob, as with most firearms manufacturers, says not to use homeloaded ammunition in the rifle, so this shouldn't happen. In my opinion, the round would have to be dangerously low pressure to short stroke the action, as it is traveling soo fast with normal factory ammunition, so would you really want to pull the trigger again if that happened? That answers one of my questions, thanks. Another couple of questions: It appears from the photos that the rotating cam bolt is no longer a part of the system, presumably to enable easier ejection and that ejection is caused by blowback alone (i.e. no gas system) Is this right? Yep - It's a straight blowback action. The only thing holding the bolt forward is the recoil/return spring in the stock. And no gas parts |
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Highly recommended that you wear shooting glasses with it as well, else you might get nasty stuff in your eyes. Why is there a channel for a cocking lever on the LHS if it does not require one? +1 You should always wear safety glasses when shooting everything. It's his standard speedmaster upper receiver, so it has the ability to take a left hand cocking lever if required (although it's not required on these). These are high quality upper receivers, and by using them it helped keep development costs down. Yes this does mean that the pins will line up, and fit together with a standard lower receiver, but due to differences in the position, and size of the hammer, this would just result in a rifle that doesn't go bang, and a lot of smashed up trigger parts. |
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I had a question about the lower and a concern. If you can't take it apart how can you properly clean it, with it being a blowback action I'd expect it to get a little dirtier than the average and need it once in a while? The concern I have is the statement that holding the release lever down whilst firing WILL damage the rifle causing a repair bill for a third of the cost of the rifle! Is this not something that could be done accidentally whilst trying to shoot it quickly, and it also seems like something someone who hadn't shot one before might try so it'd put me off letting other people have a go... Yes the action does get dirty, but you can clean it easy enough by using solvents, without dissassembly. Unfortunately the holding the lever down damage cannot be avoided, and is a side effect of the hold open mechanism. The bolt travels back with a lot of force, so if held down, the bolt will grind against the hold open mechanism, and chip against the sear. It's something that has to be accepted. I do not advise trying, but the odd mistake shouldn't do much harm, just don't do it all the time. |
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I can only assume that there is a disconnector setup whereas the trigger group will not set until the carrier has cycled and pushed it down. As for cleaning, please explain this cleaning to me ....Off topic....ban him.... ....and to keep it on track, is there an answer to the squib load question.? Just because someone says "don't shoot home loads" don't mean they won't. Who's responsible/liable if this thing 'auto loads'.......... I've seen a number of .22's fire bursts when dirty - it's just 'one of those things'. Nobody seems to worry about it... Exactly - it's something that can unintentionally happen to many rifles we already own... The perfect amount of dirt on a 10/22 can result in undesirable effects.... If it happens on this rifle, it will be an exceptionally rare occurrence, that shouldn't be worried about. |
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I had a question about the lower and a concern. If you can't take it apart how can you properly clean it, with it being a blowback action I'd expect it to get a little dirtier than the average and need it once in a while? The concern I have is the statement that holding the release lever down whilst firing WILL damage the rifle causing a repair bill for a third of the cost of the rifle! Is this not something that could be done accidentally whilst trying to shoot it quickly, and it also seems like something someone who hadn't shot one before might try so it'd put me off letting other people have a go... Yes the action does get dirty, but you can clean it easy enough by using solvents, without dissassembly. Unfortunately the holding the lever down damage cannot be avoided, and is a side effect of the hold open mechanism. The bolt travels back with a lot of force, so if held down, the bolt will grind against the hold open mechanism, and chip against the sear. It's something that has to be accepted. I do not advise trying, but the odd mistake shouldn't do much harm, just don't do it all the time. Is the lever under spring tension to return it to it's pre-prelease position or does the movement in the trigger group reset it? Presumably you can rest your thumb lightly on it allowing it to reset and that wouldn't cause a problem? |
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Yes the lever is sprung, and will return to the up position, and so you can rest your thumb on it, without applying downward pressure.
P.s. Thanks for all the positive messages/replies. Heading out to Czech for a week now, for the shotgun match. So might not get on here for while! |
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Are other trigger options offered? I'm still not sure whether I want one or not. Will he take orders different specs?
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Good question as I'd prefer mine with M4 style handguards and an A frame foresight, can Bob do this or do we have to send them to an Irish gunplumber ?
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Good question as I'd prefer mine with M4 style handguards and an A frame foresight, can Bob do this or do we have to send them to an Irish gunplumber ? Initial reports suggest that bolt on "external" accessories are more than possible. After market triggers may not be an option. |
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With this now being an accepted type of action, is there any reason why it could not be used for .223, Grendal etc?
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Quoted: With this now being an accepted type of action, is there any reason why it could not be used for .223, Grendal etc? At this time it is not a recognised action type. As for rifle calibres, I think that is a whole new ball game and would take this whole thing right back to square one |
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With this now being an accepted type of action, is there any reason why it could not be used for .223, Grendal etc? That's the bit I'm interested in, .223 that is, maybe even 7.62mm,. I would imagine it will depend how it's received. Essentially as far as I can see it merely interrupts the semi-auto cycle and relies on it's totally re-worked trigger & 'lever release' group to maintain it's integrity as not readily convertible. I don't see that the whether the cyling is gas blow-back or gas impingement has any relevance. |
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It wouldn't be that hard to do in ar10 or any of the other ar15 calibers, It wouldn't be that hard to make it so you can actually use "Other Triggers"
the problem is..... we'd all reload, and it only takes an accidental not enough powder in one of our cartridges to cause massive ramifications.... Tyga, has already said the bolt on the 9mm has had to be lightened somewhat to avoid any chance of this happening, so it'll be interesting to see what it does to the end of the buffer tube |
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I'm not sure I would want to fire an 5.56mm AR with an unlocked bolt not sure what would happen but it does lock for a reason!!!!
So it would have to be gas operated and and then lock back, I think that would be a leap too far. |
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I'm not sure I would want to fire an 5.56mm AR with an unlocked bolt not sure what would happen but it does lock for a reason!!!! So it would have to be gas operated and and then lock back, I think that would be a leap too far. I agree with the mechanics but I don't see a difference in the principle, ie all you are doing is interrupting the semi-auto-cycle . Calibre was not the issue. High cyclic rates of fire were the issue, and still are.This is where we start to wander into the ughknown.. |
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I'm not sure I would want to fire an 5.56mm AR with an unlocked bolt not sure what would happen but it does lock for a reason!!!! So it would have to be gas operated and and then lock back, I think that would be a leap too far. I agree with the mechanics but I don't see a difference in the principle, ie all you are doing is interrupting the semi-auto-cycle . Calibre was not the issue. High cyclic rates of fire were the issue, and still are.This is where we start to wander into the ughknown.. That's what I was thinking, the rifle still has to be actioned manually, has no semi-auto capability, and cannot be easily modified. I haven't seen nothing in the legislation that prohibits blowback/recoil/gas operated systems Interesting concept - time will tell. |
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I believe there are no plans ot make it in any calibre other than 9mm
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I do hope thats not the case. I would love one in .300 whisper or even .223
Is the action patented ? Is it possible to patent such an action ? Can any manufacturer use it ? |
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Its ok, just do the rifle - I can get the scope elsewhere.
I really should not use the computer when drinking to excess. |
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I'm sure your expert design team could come up with something Mark.....
it really isn't that hard, its just an open bolt smg sear in the back of a closed bolt rifle! |
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It wouldn't be that hard to do in ar10 or any of the other ar15 calibers, It wouldn't be that hard to make it so you can actually use "Other Triggers" the problem is..... we'd all reload, and it only takes an accidental not enough powder in one of our cartridges to cause massive ramifications.... Tyga, has already said the bolt on the 9mm has had to be lightened somewhat to avoid any chance of this happening, so it'll be interesting to see what it does to the end of the buffer tube ..or put a calibrated block in the end of the buffer tube to stop it being able to travel quite far enough..... It'd be interesting to see how these potential problems have been over come to stop them being 'readilly convertible', I'd like to see the action close up. |
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..or put a calibrated block in the end of the buffer tube to stop it being able to travel quite far enough..... |
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It would be nice in .223 with an op rod and adjustable gas block.
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At least this thread hasn't been subject to 'reporting restrictions' unlike some other boards............
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At least this thread hasn't been subject to 'reporting restrictions' unlike some other boards............ Tell us more. |
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At least this thread hasn't been subject to 'reporting restrictions' unlike some other boards............ Tell us more. Baz has done a hatchet job on Tyga's review. Apparently there were some "controversial" remarks in there |
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At least this thread hasn't been subject to 'reporting restrictions' unlike some other boards............ Tell us more. Baz has done a hatchet job on Tyga's review. Apparently there were some "controversial" remarks in there Yep, but to be fair they were coming across as anti shooting. I agree with Baz some people really should think before posting. Andy. |
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Hatchet job on the replies or the review?
Some of the replies |
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At least this thread hasn't been subject to 'reporting restrictions' unlike some other boards............ Tell us more. Baz has done a hatchet job on Tyga's review. Apparently there were some "controversial" remarks in there Yep, but to be fair they were coming across as anti shooting. I agree with Baz some people really should think before posting. Andy. Wrong, They were questioning the integrity of it in an open debate. There are still a lot of concerns regarding the Unicorn ® and these should be aired, no matter how uncomfortable they are. To call them anti-shooting is glossing over the cracks and merely a diversion |
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Did you read the one about different types of current rifles available which could be used in a Hungerford scenario?
Andy. |
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At least this thread hasn't been subject to 'reporting restrictions' unlike some other boards............ Tell us more. Baz has done a hatchet job on Tyga's review. Apparently there were some "controversial" remarks in there Yep, but to be fair they were coming across as anti shooting. I agree with Baz some people really should think before posting. Andy. They were merely trying to ascertain whether an investment of over £1000 in a rifle was going to be at a risk of not being able to keep the rifle, not really anti-shooting, just common sense |
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Did you read the one about different types of current rifles available which could be used in a Hungerford scenario? Andy. No, but a scenario such as Hungerford could be carried out with a single shot rifle or shotgun. Do you think that by not talking about it it couldn't happen? |
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Did you read the one about different types of current rifles available which could be used in a Hungerford scenario? Andy. No. Not really the same though is it ? |
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At least this thread hasn't been subject to 'reporting restrictions' unlike some other boards............ Tell us more. Baz has done a hatchet job on Tyga's review. Apparently there were some "controversial" remarks in there Yep, but to be fair they were coming across as anti shooting. I agree with Baz some people really should think before posting. See my post above. Andy. Andy. They were merely trying to ascertain whether an investment of over £1000 in a rifle was going to be at a risk of not being able to keep the rifle, not really anti-shooting, just common sense |
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Hatchet job on the replies or the review? Some of the replies Scope eye would be banned instantly |
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