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Posted: 8/21/2014 11:03:50 AM EDT
[#1]
It shouldn't matter if law enforcement wants it dropped or not.
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Posted: 8/21/2014 7:08:09 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It shouldn't matter if law enforcement wants it dropped or not. Wouldn't it be the decision of the SA? Either way, this will be an interesting case to follow. |
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Posted: 8/21/2014 7:17:26 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wouldn't it be the decision of the SA? Either way, this will be an interesting case to follow. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
It shouldn't matter if law enforcement wants it dropped or not. Wouldn't it be the decision of the SA? Either way, this will be an interesting case to follow. SA? State Attorney? That would be the prosecuting attorney. Actually according to what was posted it's the "elected" prosecuting attorney, who has appointed attorney's under him, who does not wish to try the case or be the guinea pig for the state. Either way if they drop the case that is basically caving to Constitutional Carry. They don't want to do that. They also do not wish to try the case for fear of losing. If they sit on this hopefully another case from another jurisdiction may come up. But this allows other LE agencies to continue to make arrests. Odds are they are getting directions from the Attorney Generals(McDaniels) office. |
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Posted: 8/21/2014 9:15:07 PM EDT
[#4]
Oh, yeah, prosecuting attorney would make more sense. Oops.
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Posted: 8/22/2014 8:45:26 AM EDT
[#5]
It is nice to see the state in a position where they have to actually make a decision on this though.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 11:04:52 PM EDT
[#6]
You telling me i cant dress up like rambo and go for my morning jog yet?
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Posted: 8/27/2014 12:26:04 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You telling me i cant dress up like rambo and go for my morning jog yet? http://static.planetminecraft.com/files/resource_media/screenshot/1209/fuuuu-rage-guy1_1596246.jpg You can! But you might also be raped. Your choice. |
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Posted: 8/27/2014 12:28:06 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You telling me i cant dress up like rambo and go for my morning jog yet? http://static.planetminecraft.com/files/resource_media/screenshot/1209/fuuuu-rage-guy1_1596246.jpg That's some fudd shit right there |
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Posted: 8/31/2014 7:14:08 PM EDT
[#9]
So...can I carry a loaded pistol in my vehicle in that state when I visit, or not? I am moving in a few months and would have to turn my LA CCW in, anyway, so I just let it lapse.
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Posted: 9/1/2014 5:01:34 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So...can I carry a loaded pistol in my vehicle in that state when I visit, or not? I am moving in a few months and would have to turn my LA CCW in, anyway, so I just let it lapse. There are stipulations on the law. Technically it says you have to be on a trip outside of your home county. Since no cop can really prove where you're going without following you, they can't prove that you're not leaving the county on a drive unless you open your mouth and tell them. Why give up your CHL? Just transfer it to Arkansas. |
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Posted: 9/1/2014 9:49:45 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There are stipulations on the law. Technically it says you have to be on a trip outside of your home county. Since no cop can really prove where you're going without following you, they can't prove that you're not leaving the county on a drive unless you open your mouth and tell them. Why give up your CHL? Just transfer it to Arkansas. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
So...can I carry a loaded pistol in my vehicle in that state when I visit, or not? I am moving in a few months and would have to turn my LA CCW in, anyway, so I just let it lapse. There are stipulations on the law. Technically it says you have to be on a trip outside of your home county. Since no cop can really prove where you're going without following you, they can't prove that you're not leaving the county on a drive unless you open your mouth and tell them. Why give up your CHL? Just transfer it to Arkansas. The "Journey" portion is only a "part" of the reworded law. That's what the AG keeps referring to while ignoring the real change. The real change comes from the reworded ACA 5-73-120 (a) A person commits the offense of carrying a weapon if he or she possesses a handgun, knife, or club on or about his or her person, in a vehicle occupied by him or her, or otherwise readily available for use with a purpose to attempt to unlawfully employ the handgun, knife, or club as a weapon against a person. The WORDS in BOLD were added by Act 746. It is true they finally defined what a "Journey" was however. But section (a) renders the journey portion null. That is the meat of the amended statute. And it doesn't specify concealed or open. Thus "Constitutional Carry" is inferred. There are still advantages to having a CCL. This is how the author of the Bill, Denny Altes, sees how the rewording affected us: Open Carry has always been the law in Arkansas since at least the 1800s. When most people walked out their front door, they assumed they were on a “journey” or going hunting, and thousands open carried for over a century. “Journey” was not defined. It was against the law to conceal a weapon or gun. So, for well over a hundred years you had to open carry. If you put your gun in your glove box or under your seat,or under your clothes you were breaking the law. You had to carry your gun so that it was plainly visible on your body or on the seat of your car or on the dash (According to A.C.A. § 5-73-120). Then, in1997, Senator Bill Walters passed the Concealed Carry law (Ark. Code Ann. §§5-73-301 – 323), which is a totally different section of code addressing a different issue. In 2011,I had heard many different discussions on carrying in Arkansas, and I wanted to clarify the law,especially Section 120. I asked the State Police lawyer to help me. We spent a lot of time coming up with a bill to please everyone. The people teaching classes for Concealed Carry didn’t want the law clarified because it would cut into their livelihood and also the State Police would take a revenue cut on the money from people buying licenses. So, in the end, my bill passed the House but failed in the Senate at the end of the session. In 2013, I started earlier with the same bill, but the State Police had changed their mind on a few things. So, we wound-up with a totally different bill. Also, the University System wanted me to exclude their campuses. We had several meetings with the Sheriff’s Association, the Chiefs of Police association, the Prosecutors’ Association, and the State Police. The old code was written so there were many defenses to carrying a weapon. So, I asked why not make it a right with exceptions. This met with approval from everyone. It seems that it is two sides of the same coin. So, we didn’t really change the law, we only clarified that it is a right to keep and bear arms according to the Second Amendment of our Constitution (According to Webster’s “bear” means “to carry”)." ~ Denny Altes |
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Posted: 9/1/2014 11:27:54 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The "Journey" portion is only a "part" of the reworded law. That's what the AG keeps referring to while ignoring the real change. The real change comes from the reworded ACA 5-73-120 (a) A person commits the offense of carrying a weapon if he or she possesses a handgun, knife, or club on or about his or her person, in a vehicle occupied by him or her, or otherwise readily available for use with a purpose to attempt to unlawfully employ the handgun, knife, or club as a weapon against a person. The WORDS in BOLD were added by Act 746. It is true they finally defined what a "Journey" was however. But section (a) renders the journey portion null. That is the meat of the amended statute. And it doesn't specify concealed or open. Thus "Constitutional Carry" is inferred. There are still advantages to having a CCL. This is how the author of the Bill, Denny Altes, sees how the rewording affected us: Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
So...can I carry a loaded pistol in my vehicle in that state when I visit, or not? I am moving in a few months and would have to turn my LA CCW in, anyway, so I just let it lapse. There are stipulations on the law. Technically it says you have to be on a trip outside of your home county. Since no cop can really prove where you're going without following you, they can't prove that you're not leaving the county on a drive unless you open your mouth and tell them. Why give up your CHL? Just transfer it to Arkansas. The "Journey" portion is only a "part" of the reworded law. That's what the AG keeps referring to while ignoring the real change. The real change comes from the reworded ACA 5-73-120 (a) A person commits the offense of carrying a weapon if he or she possesses a handgun, knife, or club on or about his or her person, in a vehicle occupied by him or her, or otherwise readily available for use with a purpose to attempt to unlawfully employ the handgun, knife, or club as a weapon against a person. The WORDS in BOLD were added by Act 746. It is true they finally defined what a "Journey" was however. But section (a) renders the journey portion null. That is the meat of the amended statute. And it doesn't specify concealed or open. Thus "Constitutional Carry" is inferred. There are still advantages to having a CCL. This is how the author of the Bill, Denny Altes, sees how the rewording affected us: Open Carry has always been the law in Arkansas since at least the 1800s. When most people walked out their front door, they assumed they were on a “journey” or going hunting, and thousands open carried for over a century. “Journey” was not defined. It was against the law to conceal a weapon or gun. So, for well over a hundred years you had to open carry. If you put your gun in your glove box or under your seat,or under your clothes you were breaking the law. You had to carry your gun so that it was plainly visible on your body or on the seat of your car or on the dash (According to A.C.A. § 5-73-120). Then, in1997, Senator Bill Walters passed the Concealed Carry law (Ark. Code Ann. §§5-73-301 – 323), which is a totally different section of code addressing a different issue. In 2011,I had heard many different discussions on carrying in Arkansas, and I wanted to clarify the law,especially Section 120. I asked the State Police lawyer to help me. We spent a lot of time coming up with a bill to please everyone. The people teaching classes for Concealed Carry didn’t want the law clarified because it would cut into their livelihood and also the State Police would take a revenue cut on the money from people buying licenses. So, in the end, my bill passed the House but failed in the Senate at the end of the session. In 2013, I started earlier with the same bill, but the State Police had changed their mind on a few things. So, we wound-up with a totally different bill. Also, the University System wanted me to exclude their campuses. We had several meetings with the Sheriff’s Association, the Chiefs of Police association, the Prosecutors’ Association, and the State Police. The old code was written so there were many defenses to carrying a weapon. So, I asked why not make it a right with exceptions. This met with approval from everyone. It seems that it is two sides of the same coin. So, we didn’t really change the law, we only clarified that it is a right to keep and bear arms according to the Second Amendment of our Constitution (According to Webster’s “bear” means “to carry”)." ~ Denny Altes My cwp stated that I had 30 days from the time I moved to turn it in as void. I didn't bother renewing because it was just a risk I took. I can't carry at work and at the gym it's difficult as hell with the compound lifts I do and what I wear. I rarely go elsewhere not in my vehicle. Mmqb away, but it's what happened. I will get a new cwp when I move. In the mean time...it sounds like I can carry a loaded weapon in my vehicle yes? |
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Posted: 9/1/2014 11:49:30 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My cwp stated that I had 30 days from the time I moved to turn it in as void. I didn't bother renewing because it was just a risk I took. I can't carry at work and at the gym it's difficult as hell with the compound lifts I do and what I wear. I rarely go elsewhere not in my vehicle. Mmqb away, but it's what happened. I will get a new cwp when I move. In the mean time...it sounds like I can carry a loaded weapon in my vehicle yes? Well obviously I'm no attorney but the general consensus is you'll be GTG. We are still in a transition phase here in Arkansas. Some LEO and PAs are still not on board. However many LE departments are saying be cautious when dealing with calls about Open Carry due to the possibility of further lawsuits against those departments for false arrest. The election later this year will hopefully change some things even more in OC favor because our current anti-gun Attorney General will be gone. Both primary candidates have expressed they both feel the Act 746 changes give us OC or more correctly true Constitutional Carry. As was mentioned there are still some advantages to have a concealed license. One is for the background check when buying guns. Two has to do with the gun free zone thing. Having a license get's one a pass. And three if of course when traveling out of state with a firearm. |
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Posted: 9/1/2014 2:53:28 PM EDT
[#14]
Since 746 i have seen a lot more businesses putting up anti-gun stickers on their doors.
I'm thinking about creating a boycott website and facebook group for CHL holders and general gun owners to shame them in the open and pressure them into being reasonable and stop the anti-gun crap. I don't do business with those idiots putting up those stickers on the doors and I tell them that face to face. |
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Posted: 9/1/2014 3:03:03 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Since 746 i have seen a lot more businesses putting up anti-gun stickers on their doors. I'm thinking about creating a boycott website and facebook group for CHL holders and general gun owners to shame them in the open and pressure them into being reasonable and stop the anti-gun crap. I don't do business with those idiots putting up those stickers on the doors and I tell them that face to face. The problem with "anti-gun" stickers is unless you actually ask the owner what they really mean with those signs, some of them anyway, could be misconstrued. Some of the no guns signs are meant for the "thug" mentality and hood rats and if you ask the owners they have no problem with concealed carry. Some are indeed anti gun. Some are just anti OC. I can accept NO OC as long as they support at least carrying concealed. Not everybody likes icky guns. 
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Posted: 9/1/2014 5:39:30 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The problem with "anti-gun" stickers is unless you actually ask the owner what they really mean with those signs, some of them anyway, could be misconstrued. Some of the no guns signs are meant for the "thug" mentality and hood rats and if you ask the owners they have no problem with concealed carry. Some are indeed anti gun. Some are just anti OC. I can accept NO OC as long as they support at least carrying concealed. Not everybody likes icky guns. Their opinion doesn't matter on concealed carry. If a lawful CHL holder walks through that door with a sticker on it then they are a felon and can be arrested and lose their rights. Through the store manager's/owner's ignorance, they are allowing their business to become less safe while also disarming or criminalizing customers. If they feel strongly against firearms then they need to accept loss of revenue. 80% of a business' income comes from 20% of their customer base. I support rational open-carry. The idiots carrying rifles/shotguns into restaurants in Texas are retarded. You can't secure a firearm while eating and it's not safe. They're just idiots. It's not rational or practical. If you're on a hike or something then fine, but there is zero use for a rifle in a Taco Bell or Chilis unless it's a time of natural disaster or crisis like Katrina. |
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Posted: 9/1/2014 9:10:00 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Their opinion doesn't matter on concealed carry. If a lawful CHL holder walks through that door with a sticker on it then they are a felon and can be arrested and lose their rights. Through the store manager's/owner's ignorance, they are allowing their business to become less safe while also disarming or criminalizing customers. If they feel strongly against firearms then they need to accept loss of revenue. 80% of a business' income comes from 20% of their customer base. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The problem with "anti-gun" stickers is unless you actually ask the owner what they really mean with those signs, some of them anyway, could be misconstrued. Some of the no guns signs are meant for the "thug" mentality and hood rats and if you ask the owners they have no problem with concealed carry. Some are indeed anti gun. Some are just anti OC. I can accept NO OC as long as they support at least carrying concealed. Not everybody likes icky guns. Their opinion doesn't matter on concealed carry. If a lawful CHL holder walks through that door with a sticker on it then they are a felon and can be arrested and lose their rights. Through the store manager's/owner's ignorance, they are allowing their business to become less safe while also disarming or criminalizing customers. If they feel strongly against firearms then they need to accept loss of revenue. 80% of a business' income comes from 20% of their customer base. I'm not so sure I would call them a Felon. I don't even think there is a punishment for carrying concealed in a signed business. A misdemeanor perhaps but again it's not mentioned. The ASP "might" take your license but again there is nothing in the statute about the punishment. The business could trespass you but then all you would need to do is leave. |
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Posted: 9/2/2014 3:11:38 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not so sure I would call them a Felon. I don't even think there is a punishment for carrying concealed in a signed business. A misdemeanor perhaps but again it's not mentioned. The ASP "might" take your license but again there is nothing in the statute about the punishment. The business could trespass you but then all you would need to do is leave. Well, it depends which prohibited area that you carry a firearm in. I'm sure a private business is most likely a misdemeanor, but others on the list would be more serious from trumped-up law garbage. It's all very stupid to have "gun-free" zones because they don't prevent crime and only encourage mass murder from people being unarmed and soft targets; ie any mass shooting since the 90s |
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Posted: 9/2/2014 12:06:24 PM EDT
[#19]
Someone was issued a warning yesterday in Fayetteville for OC. Gun was removed and placed in person vehicle. This morning at 2 am someone OCing at Walmart in Cabot was cited with 5-73-120, Carrying a Weapon. Gun was taken but given back in parking lot. Friendly contact and officer basically said he was following the Chiefs instructions. Running the Cabot one down now.
And for an update....looks like Dave Elswick is jumping on the Cabot one. Might be on air tomorrow. |
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Posted: 9/5/2014 9:43:53 PM EDT
[#20]
So if you cannot afford a CCW, you do not have the right to protect yourself, and you also cannot protect yourself in your home county, you have to be on a trip. It makes perfect sense
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Posted: 9/5/2014 11:08:29 PM EDT
[#21]
And the Cabot one has escalated quickly. The person already has an attorney from NLR. Looks like this case will skip the local court and go right to District court. The PA wants this settled as well. Arraignment is Oct 8th. Also a letter about OC from the Cabot city attorney has been discovered. In it he basically is directing LE to cite and disarm, but not arrest(although technically it's still an arrest), individuals who OC but leave groups alone. No mention of those who conceal without a license. Something else that we are not capable of doing since Act 746. This one might cost the city some money.
This persons name has not been released yet. And FYI the Lonoke county Sheriff is onboard. Seems very Pro 2A. For the Fayettville "Warning" one there is a planned OC gathering at some place on the street where this one took place. The business where they will be gathering is Pro OC. |
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Posted: 9/8/2014 11:54:00 AM EDT
[#22]
Disarm individuals, but not groups...
Sounds legit. |
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Posted: 9/8/2014 12:17:54 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Disarm individuals, but not groups... Sounds legit. Reminds me of other groups that only target the weak . . . Gangs. That's what we call them. I forgot. |
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Posted: 9/11/2014 1:25:41 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So if you cannot afford a CCW, you do not have the right to protect yourself, and you also cannot protect yourself in your home county, you have to be on a trip. It makes perfect sense ..... you could just carry concealed. ? |
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Posted: 9/11/2014 3:13:27 PM EDT
[#25]
Yep. Despite what concealed carry instructors ate claiming, Arkansas has no law making the carrying of a firearm illegal. CHL or not.
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