I see that GA has reciprocity with MI.  I may have to travel to Detroit in  a week or so.  Anything I need to know other than don't carry in a bar, school, sporting event, or government building?

thanks

That pretty much covers it, Michigan has state preemption so Detroit has no special laws.  If you would like to carry in the "pistol free zones" it is easily accomplished by open carry.  Detroit is like Mogadishu though, watch your back, the things you have heard are not exaggeration, they are under statements.  Pro tips: Do not go out at night, do not go out alone, do not leave the green zone (the area inside the people mover tracks), stay alert, avoid driving the side streets as much as possible, do not leave the freeway for gas or anything else, and trust no one.  Avoid I94, the traffic is horrible and people in Detroit do not know how to drive.  Maps are important, scavengers have stolen most of the street signs (and many of the manhole covers) for scrap metal and many of the remaining signs are often wrong (likely deliberately done by the locals to lead you into ambush points, ask me how I know.) and Detroit is a maze of dead end streets and random one ways with streets splitting off in odd directions and they have no concept of a service drive.  Did I mention the locals do not know how to drive?

State preemption is a bigee.  What do you mean by pistol free zones to carry openly?

What part of Detroit are you visiting?

Not sure what part.  We usually go into willow run airport

Willow Run isn't Detroit.  There are bad areas around there was well but you're still 30 miles from the action at Willow Run.  Probably need to get a specific destination as there is so much urban sprawl around here that one suburb can be like Hollywood while the next is Mogadishu.

Our "pistol free zones" specifically say CONCEALED, so they do not apply if you are carrying openly.  We have a separate law which would apply to open carry but that one has a specific exception for anyone who has a CPL (like you), the result is that if you have a CPL but are carrying openly than there is no such thing as a "pistol free zone" so you can carry whatever you like wherever you like.  Federal law still applies though so be mindful of post offices and federal buildings etc.

One caution though, state preemption only applies to guns and ammunition, you may still run into problems with knives, and sprays, etc.

There is a tacked thread at the top of the forum with the relevant laws, attorney general and court opinions if you want to read the, but that is the gist of it.

This, but in general as long as you stay west of Telegraph road and north of 8 Mile road you should be fine, but the closure you get to the DMZ (the roads I just mentioned) the dicier it gets, unless you start to get close to Flint then it starts getting dicier again.  So basically avoid Detroit and the inner suburbs and you should be fine, for the most part.

Willow Run is in Ypsilanti, closer to Ann Arbor than Detroit. There are rough areas of Ypsilanti too, but it's not bad.

As for S_A_C, I'm going to have to call you out on your statements. If there was a Pit still, I would tell you to meet me there. What you post is directly to cause people not to want to visit Detroit. The statements you make are hardly true. I want to say more, but I'm going to bite my tongue.

OP, don't listen to S_A_C's views of Detroit.

I have not said anything I have not personally observed, including the narrowly missed ambush, truth be told I have not even gone into half the detail, if that is the reason people avoid Detroit than Detroit has brought it upon themselves.  Most of Detroit is a post apocalyptic hellscape.  What part of what I said would you dispute?  That traffic sucks and Detroiters can't drive for shit?  That I94 is a parking lot through most of the day?  That many of the road signs and manhole covers have been stolen?  That many of the remaining signs are incorrect?  That it is not safe to go out at night?  That the city is dangerous outside of the green zone?  That you should watch your back?  That it is best not to travel alone?  That there is a vast difference from one side of 8 Mile or Telegraph to the other?  What exactly do you find so untrue?  I didn't even get into the barred up buildings, razor wire on roofs, torched cars, burned out and bombed out and collapsed buildings, and debris strewn sidewalks, would you like me to cover that as well?  How about the tracker tire that rolled out in front me to try and make me stop so I could get jumped by the guys on the side of the road, should I get into that?  The fact that the city is mostly abandoned (700,000 left out of an original 2,000,000 plus) should I mention that?  That parts of Detroit look like an over grown rural Alabama but with more trash, debris, and random abandoned boats, should I talk about that?  Because I have personally seen all of those things.  If Detroit wants to fix its image it needs to actually fix it, not complain when anyone mentions them and just try to gloss it over, maybe if it gets trashed enough they will actually be motivated to fix it.

I haven't been in DeToilet for 10 years and S_A_C has it nailed

I used to say I was born in Detroit. It got so bad St John's Hospital moved their Main Entrance from Moross to Mack, which is in Gross Point(sic)

Now their mailing has the Grosse Pointe zip code, and now I can say I was born in GrossPoint

I live several miles east of Telegraph and I feel very safe over here.  The only thing I'm not too fond of is our street conditions, which make driving in my brother's Buick very uncomfortable.  

Detroit city limits is literally right up the street and I'm not dealing with any super high crime rate.  On the flip side,  I've had a car stolen in Ann Arbor as well as four others broken into there.  My neighbors here are watching my six and keeping an eye out and I'm doing the same.  

Some neighborhoods in Detroit aren't that bad either.  My brother is a realtor and has been showing houses non-stop in Rosedale.  While I was between carry permits,  I tagged along and ventured that neighborhood on foot unarmed.

Willow Run isn't very bad.  If you are staying in that area,  you'll likely be in Belleville or Ypsilanti.  Neither are necessarily high end places, but Ypsi is fairly nice as long as you are more than a mile from I-94.  Ypsi township is different and does not have the same problem.  

Thanks for the replies

I flew out of Willow Run for fifteen years, and still live in the Belleville area.  Most areas around are fine.  You've got the basics of the Michigan carry laws covered above.

Michigan cpl laws http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(m20i0dv0rgr3rhgxkkbvoecw))/mileg.aspx?page=GetObject&objectname=mcl-750-234d
http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(kc0hgwizhbvmgj4i54szmijs))/mileg.aspx?page=GetObject&objectname=mcl-28-425o

I'm there every day and his post is bullshit. I've spent over 40 years living, working, and partying in the city.  Maybe some folks just go out of their way to find bad situations.

Maybe your too close?  It's kind of a different perspective from the outside in, less rose colored glasses, again, what did I say, specifically, that you think is untrue?

I have said nothing which I have not directly observed, it is not that we seek trouble we simply have not grown accustomed to it so that we overlook it.  Don't believe me?  Go out to the outer suburbs and drive around for about an hour and just observe, count the number of liquor stores, check cashing places, store front "churches," and strip clubs and compare that, in terms of ratio to all other stores.  While your counting count how many empty, abandoned, burned, collapsed, or blown up buildings you see.  Of the open buildings count how many have either chain link on the windows or razor wire fences on the roofs.  Also, count the number of abandoned/stripped/burned cars you see, and how many street signs and manhole covers are missing.  Now go have lunch, go to any fast food place you want, and note whether or not the person taking your order is behind heavy bulletproof glass and your food is passed to you via an armored lazy susan or pass through like a bank. Now go back to Detroit and make the same series of observations utilizing the same methods and compare your two sets of numbers.  Using this quantifiable objective information please evaluate Detroit.

I haven't seen a missing manhole cover since that big storm hit a couple years ago and the water pressure blew them off.  I can't remember the last time I saw a missing street sign.  I live in an outer suburb now and know exactly what the differences are, that's why I moved here.  Yes, there is more crime in Detroit.  No one is disputing that.  On the other hand it isn't Mad Max like you're trying to portray it.  There are more abandoned buildings and more security, but that wasn't what you started off with.  You're backtracking quite a bit.

Your right, I started off quite a bit more mild, I just said that he should watch his back because Detroit is not safe, not go out at night and try not to go out alone and that Detroit's traffic and roads are horrible and recommended he avoid I 94 for that reason.  Not sure what part of Detroit you were in but the parts I have been through (mostly near 94/75) are horrible and most metal things like signs and manhole covers are indeed missing.

Most metal things are missing on the homes, besides the bars on the windows.

Ok, what neighborhoods are you referring to exactly? Scrap prices have been shit for almost 10 years and no one bothers stealing ferrous metals like they make signs and manhole covers from.  Scrap yards won't even take them. The roads are terrible, but that isn't especially out of the ordinary in MI generally, and Wayne County specifically.  Other than right down town during rush hour or events, traffic in the city moves pretty well.  That also applies to a ton of other areas and to every major city.  If OP has ever driven in Atlanta, he will laugh at Detroit "traffic". I can't think of a major city that doesn't have worse traffic than Detroit, at least here it clears up after 6 or 7.

Pretty much any place you would want to go is as safe as any other major city.  Yes, some areas are worse than others, but I don't think we need to point out that hanging out in crack houses late at night is a bad idea. Using the same common sense you would use in any other unfamiliar area is more than enough to keep you safe and sound while spending some time in Detroit.  If all the little suburban girls I know who decided it would be cool to move to and work in Detroit over the last 20 years can do it, I think even an arfcommer can handle it.

I told you, the 94/75 area, I would often have to detour when 94 would randomly turn into a parking lot with no cause whatsoever.  Scrap prices may be shit, but these are crack heads were talking about, they are dumb as fuck, but being stolen for scrap is just speculation, all I can tell you is that they seemed to be missing en mass and the few remaining signs would direct me into circles or dead ends, I ultimately had to rely 100% on GPS.  My comment on the roads being terrible is not strictly concerning their condition but also their layout, a "grid" seems to be a foreign concept to Detroit, the streets seem to be laid out with no apparent rhyme or reason, to damn many wierd intersections, hairpin turns and random one ways and dead ends.  Now add heavy traffic to that and the people of Detroit having no concept of traffic laws or even common sense togethor with the lack of signage and it's horrible to drive down there and would a service drive be so much to fucking ask?  Normally when I hit a traffic jam on the freeway I just take the first exit and drive down the service drive for a few miles before reentering.  If I try to detour in Detroit what logically seems to be a service drive somehow always seems to lead to the area around Ford Field, no matter which road you start on and if you try to just follow the freeway as parallel as possible you end up hitting a random dead end or one ways and spend the next 20 minutes trying to find an on ramp.  Want to have some fun?  Go out toward Livonia on 94, once your out of Detroit turn around and go back East on 94 toward Port Huron, right before 94 interchanges with 75 take the last possible exit, at the top of the ramp there should be a gas station, go fill up and play "find the on ramp to 94". I played that game and ended up on a dead end street (which was also posted one way, only in Detroit) adjacent to the fence along 94 with burned out abandoned houses on my right and had a truck or tractor tire roll out in front of me when I turned around.

Where exactly are you from?  What brought you into the city?

Lmfao. No wonder S_A_C has so many complaints. He has no business being anywhere near a big city.

Sixpack, I'm glad someone else is fighting this one with me. I've had enough of S_A_C's stupid stories and didn't feel like refuting them all over again in this thread.

S_A_C, Detroit's road layout is called a wagon wheel style. The roads go out from the riverfront like the spokes on a wagon wheel. That's a common design for coastal cities. I-94 and I-75 is near Wayne State, the Hamtramck Assembly Plant, the Fisher Theater, etc. I have never seen a missing manhole cover or street sign, and I've definitely never seen an incorrect street sign. Have you ever driven in any other large city? NYC is a mess of one ways and crazy drivers, yet people handle it just fine. Please tell us, when exactly was the last time you were in Detroit?

OP, I'm sorry you have to listen to S_A_C's stories, but they're not the norm. Detroit has had low points, but it is on the up and up lately. Keep your awareness up as you would in any large city and you'll be fine. If S_A_C's stories were true, do you really think $1,000+/month lofts would be selling out before they're built? What about $150k+ condos and townhouses?

I just took a detour on surface streets through downtown on Friday. First time I had been down there in eight years.

That place looks far beyond safe. It seriously looks like Portland now.

Last year, I went to the Old Miami for the first time in about 10 years... maybe more.  It was like a Twilight Zone episode.  There was all this nice stuff all over, and I walk in and there are all these hipsters, but it's still the Old Miami.

The pockets with $1,000 a month lofts are not the areas I am talking about, I specified outside the Greenzone, you know, the areas were $1,000 would damn near buy you an entire block, the places with the sub $500 houses.  You may think I am hard on Detroit but you are making it out to be perfectly safe and glossing over its problems.

I was nowhere near the downtown hub I'm talking about the immediate area of that interchange and the few blocks adjacent to 94, mostly near the West end of the city.  I.E. The areas you would have to detour through if 94 jammed up.  And yes I have been through other large cities Memphis, Toledo, and Dayton most recently.  Further back in time and you can add places like Orlanda, Miami, Atlanta, Houston, St. Louis, and Las Vegas.

The commute I am talking about was my former daily work commute from Eastpointe to Livonia and back down 94 with frequent detours through the ghetto when 94 would jam for no reason at all which was at least once or twice a week.

"Wagon wheel style" is fucking stupid, don't try to be artsy, streets are supposed to be about transportation, a simple grid works best.  On the ground that "wagon wheel" is a confusing pain in the ass, add urban congestion and sprawl togethor with too damn many one ways and dead ends that have occurred over the years and it is near impossible, and I say again, what kind of idiot doesn't install a service drive?  A grid (with service drives) is simple and predictable a wagon wheel just sucks.

I was last in Detroit about a year ago, straight down the freeway to the DIA and straight back to the freeway, I was last in Detroit regularly about 5 years ago.

So you were all fucked up driving in Toledo and Dayton with their wagon wheels too?

94 parallels Harper and has a service drive along much of it.  All of the freeways in Detroit either have a service drive or another road running parallel to it that feeds it exactly the same as a service drive. Why were you taking 94 the whole way anyway?

Well, off to hang out in Warrendale, at night.  Wish me luck!

My buddy used to live in Warrendale a few years back.  That place is starting to look nice too!  It's only a few exits up the Southfield from me.  

Yet navigating them was much easier.

A "service drive" that turns off and starts to randomly go toward the center of town is not a service drive, 96 has a service drive, 75 has a service drive, even 94 has a service drive, just not through Detroit, service drives do not have right angles.  Taking 94 the whole way was more efficient, the only other way was down 8 mile and I really didn't feel like dealing with traffic lights or driving a surface street with Detroit on the side most of the way.  As slow as 94 was the few times I took 8 mile took me nearly twice as long.  I would get on to 94 in Eastpointe and take it all the way down to Livonia and get off at Merriman or Middlebelt and be at work inside 5 minutes later.  I was unable to find a more efficient route, at least in terms of time.

OK, so Dayton and Toledo are both easier to navigate because Detroit has a wagon wheel layout and lacks a service drive right downtown on one of the three major expressways?  This is in spite of the fact that Dayton and Toledo are both laid out on a wagon wheel and lack service drives on the major expressway that goes through them?

Why didn't you take 94 to 96?  96 has a service drive and traffic moved very well on it.  It also put you dead center of Livonia unlike 94 that puts you almost 20 minutes south of Livonia's southern border?

Edit: Sorry, I see that you were able to go the 8 miles from 94 to Livonia inside of 5 minutes. On Middlebelt or Merriman.

Spent a lot of time in Warrendale! have a lot of friends who lived there. I just went through Brightmoor and Old Redford today, even recorded the drive up Lahser just in case I had a tire rolled out in front of me or I got ambushed!

Sadly, all the street signs were there and none of the manhole covers were missing.  Stupid Dan Gilbert gentrifying those isolated pockets.

They planted a lot of trees over in Old Redford, going to look nice, that's one of the things I miss is a lot of the old trees were cut down and never replaced over there.

If you do stray off the beaten path and see a gathering of folks in the street. It may just be a DeeTroit Street  BBQ, with DeeTroit and Barbecue Ribs. Some of the finest around.

You will be greeted with scowls by some, until you say tasty and ask for a second order.

How did I miss this thread?    I'm firmly with rjbergen and sixpack on this one.  You'll notice the "stories" come from those who admit to having not been in the city for decades or who drive through on the expressways.  I'll add that the $150k condo comment is off base though - try $350k, no joke.

Was just in Detroit for a 5 k sponsored by Atwater brewery. Drank beer. Had a great time without any problems. Did I mention I like dirty blond beer?

Ended up in detroit city airport.  Stayed at the doubletree hotel.  A good time was had by all.  It is kind of weird (like zombie movie weird) seeing the downtown area completely empty at 8pm.

Thanks again

Detroit - where even the chief of police gets car jacked.

I've never had a problem in the city but have seen some violence first hand.  Always carry and be situationally aware.

Fwiw I was very nervous driving around Atlanta when I went for business. But that's because I didn't have my gun.  The area around the airport isn't pretty, just like DeToilet