Posted no firearms signs

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Posted no firearms signs

Posted: 12/18/2016 5:44:53 AM EDT

Can anybody post a link to the requirements of a posting to be legally binding here in NC? I see signs here and there, but I know they have to be a certain size and location to be legally upheld. Ive looked around and could find all the other information, except the actual requirements of the posted sign. Thanks

Posted: 12/18/2016 9:21:26 AM EDT

[#1]

From what I've read there is no requirement for size or location, only that it be "conspicuous".

http://handgunlaw.us/states/northcarolina.pdf gives the text of and a link to the appropriate statue.

§ 14-415.11. Permit to carry concealed handgun; scope of permit.
(c) Except as provided in G.S. 14-415.27, a permit does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun in any of the following:
(8) On any private premises where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the premises.

Posted: 12/18/2016 11:05:46 AM EDT

[#2]

No rules/guidelines in NC. In layman's terms, if you see it and understand it, it counts.

Posted: 12/18/2016 3:30:43 PM EDT

[#3]

If it's not conspicuous, it doesn't count.

I haven't seen a sign in years.

Posted: 12/18/2016 4:04:05 PM EDT

[#4]

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Quoted:
If it's not conspicuous, it doesn't count.

I haven't seen a sign in years.

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There's one at "On the Border" in Fayetteville. I have taken to checking the anti-gun list I'll link below to avoid victim-disarmament:

http://ncgunfreedining.blogspot.com/p/find-restaurant.html

It's not a complete list but it'll give you a heads up. If somebody posts a sign, I don't go in. It can get cumbersome sometimes, especially when I am with a group of people, but screw them for being anti-gun.

Posted: 12/19/2016 1:31:08 AM EDT

[#5]

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Quoted:
If it's not conspicuous, it doesn't count.

I haven't seen a sign in years.

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Really? I see a good many around when im out, the red circle with the slash through it.

Posted: 12/19/2016 1:34:30 AM EDT

[#6]

Quote History

Quoted:
From what I've read there is no requirement for size or location, only that it be "conspicuous".

http://handgunlaw.us/states/northcarolina.pdf gives the text of and a link to the appropriate statue.

§ 14-415.11. Permit to carry concealed handgun; scope of permit.
(c) Except as provided in G.S. 14-415.27, a permit does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun in any of the following:
(8) On any private premises where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the premises.

View Quote

Well that sucks, in SC there are guidelines that it must be a certain size and location to be legally binding.

So I wonder how the court would see this, a small sticker with the circle and slash through it at the bottom corner or a door at the entrance to an establishment. Is that conspicuous, who gets to decide?

Posted: 12/19/2016 2:27:26 AM EDT

[#7]

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Quoted:

So I wonder how the court would see this, a small sticker with the circle and slash through it at the bottom corner or a door at the entrance to an establishment. Is that conspicuous, who gets to decide?

View Quote

My luck would be a jury of 12 anti 2A jurors.

Now a days there are so many cameras out there having a video of you pointing and laughing at the sign would not be out of the realm of possibilities too.

Posted: 12/19/2016 8:52:11 AM EDT

[#8]

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Quoted:

Really? I see a good many around when im out, the red circle with the slash through it.

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Quoted:

Quoted:
If it's not conspicuous, it doesn't count.

I haven't seen a sign in years.

Really? I see a good many around when im out, the red circle with the slash through it.

I think you missed my point.

Posted: 12/19/2016 8:55:14 AM EDT

[#9]

Quote History

Quoted:

Well that sucks, in SC there are guidelines that it must be a certain size and location to be legally binding.

So I wonder how the court would see this, a small sticker with the circle and slash through it at the bottom corner or a door at the entrance to an establishment. Is that conspicuous, who gets to decide?

View Quote

And as I mentioned in the other similar thread, it's only an infraction as of last December, if you happened to not see the sign and anything happens. Max fine of $500, or relinquish your permit. Not even a misdemeanor anymore.

Posted: 12/19/2016 7:42:52 PM EDT

[#10]

I do see them occasionally and most of them are posted prominently.

Posted: 12/19/2016 11:01:08 PM EDT

[#11]

Quote History

Quoted:

Well that sucks, in SC there are guidelines that it must be a certain size and location to be legally binding.

So I wonder how the court would see this, a small sticker with the circle and slash through it at the bottom corner or a door at the entrance to an establishment. Is that conspicuous, who gets to decide?

View Quote

Don't forget that statute only applies to concealed carry.

Posted: 12/20/2016 7:16:21 AM EDT

[#12]

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Quoted:

I think you missed my point.

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I got you sir

When I was looking around online, I was specifically looking for that update last December and what changes were made. Do you have a link to that by chance?

Posted: 12/20/2016 10:26:19 AM EDT

[#13]

Quote History

Quoted:

I got you sir

When I was looking around online, I was specifically looking for that update last December and what changes were made. Do you have a link to that by chance?

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Quoted:

Quoted:

I think you missed my point.

I got you sir

When I was looking around online, I was specifically looking for that update last December and what changes were made. Do you have a link to that by chance?

I think the text you're looking for is:

Any person who has been issued a valid permit who is found to be carrying a concealed handgun in violation of G.S. 14-415.11(c)(8) shall be guilty
of an infraction and may be required to pay a fine of up to five hundred dollars ($500.00). In lieu of paying a fine the person may surrender the permit

14-415.11(c)(8) is below:

§ 14-415.11. Permit to Carry Concealed Handgun; Scope of Permit.

(c) Except as provided in G.S. 14-415.27, a permit does not authorize a person to carry a concealed
handgun in any of the following:

(8) On any private premises where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the
posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the
premises.

Posted: 12/20/2016 9:44:13 PM EDT

[#14]

You can always go to toys r us and measure there's. They have the most discreet no firearms allowed sign in all their stores.

Posted: 12/21/2016 12:11:43 AM EDT

[#15]

Quote History

Quoted:

I think the text you're looking for is:

Any person who has been issued a valid permit who is found to be carrying a concealed handgun in violation of G.S. 14-415.11(c)(8) shall be guilty
of an infraction and may be required to pay a fine of up to five hundred dollars ($500.00). In lieu of paying a fine the person may surrender the permit

14-415.11(c)(8) is below:

§ 14-415.11. Permit to Carry Concealed Handgun; Scope of Permit.

(c) Except as provided in G.S. 14-415.27, a permit does not authorize a person to carry a concealed
handgun in any of the following:

(8) On any private premises where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the
posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the
premises.

View Quote

As a new resident of NC what exactly does an "infraction" mean. Does it simply mean the fine is the only consequence? Or are there other consequences such as misdemeanor charges, etc.

Posted: 12/21/2016 12:43:02 AM EDT

[#16]

Quote History

Quoted:

As a new resident of NC what exactly does an "infraction" mean. Does it simply mean the fine is the only consequence? Or are there other consequences such as misdemeanor charges, etc.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:

I think the text you're looking for is:

Any person who has been issued a valid permit who is found to be carrying a concealed handgun in violation of G.S. 14-415.11(c)(8) shall be guilty
of an infraction and may be required to pay a fine of up to five hundred dollars ($500.00). In lieu of paying a fine the person may surrender the permit

14-415.11(c)(8) is below:

§ 14-415.11. Permit to Carry Concealed Handgun; Scope of Permit.

(c) Except as provided in G.S. 14-415.27, a permit does not authorize a person to carry a concealed
handgun in any of the following:

(8) On any private premises where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the
posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the
premises.

As a new resident of NC what exactly does an "infraction" mean. Does it simply mean the fine is the only consequence? Or are there other consequences such as misdemeanor charges, etc.

I'm not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice, but an infraction is punishable by the fine only (similar to a speeding ticket I assume). I'd imagine if you didn't pay the fine, you'd end up in bigger trouble.

Disclaimer: I do not advocate breaking any laws.

Posted: 12/21/2016 5:25:53 AM EDT

[#17]

Quote History

Quoted:

I think the text you're looking for is:

View Quote

Thank you sir, that would be it.

Posted: 1/1/2017 11:16:14 PM EDT

[#18]

If you see it, you should boycott them if you can. This is not Kalifornia, MA nor NY.

Posted: 1/3/2017 10:17:46 AM EDT

[#19]

Quote History

Quoted:

As a new resident of NC what exactly does an "infraction" mean. Does it simply mean the fine is the only consequence? Or are there other consequences such as misdemeanor charges, etc.

View Quote

From North Carolina General Statute 14-3.1

(a) An infraction is a noncriminal violation of law not punishable by imprisonment. Unless otherwise provided by law, the sanction for a person found responsible for an infraction is a penalty of not more than one hundred dollars ($100.00). The proceeds of penalties for infractions are payable to the county in which the infraction occurred for the use of the public schools.

(b) The procedure for disposition of infractions is as provided in Article 66 of Chapter 15A of the General Statutes. (1985, c. 764, s. 1.)

Posted: 1/3/2017 2:53:14 PM EDT

[#20]

Quote History

Quoted:

As a new resident of NC what exactly does an "infraction" mean. Does it simply mean the fine is the only consequence? Or are there other consequences such as misdemeanor charges, etc.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

As a new resident of NC what exactly does an "infraction" mean. Does it simply mean the fine is the only consequence? Or are there other consequences such as misdemeanor charges, etc.

In regards to concealed carry "Infraction" has a bit different meaning from what is specified in NC statute 14-3.1. The fine can be a bit steeper.

NC Statute 4-415.21

14-415.21. Violations of this Article punishable as an infraction.

(a) A person who has been issued a valid permit who is found to be carrying a concealed handgun without the permit in the person's possession or who fails to disclose to any law enforcement officer that the person holds a valid permit and is carrying a concealed handgun, as required by G.S. 14-415.11, shall be guilty of an infraction and shall be punished in accordance with G.S. 14-3.1. Any person who has been issued a valid permit who is found to be carrying a concealed handgun in violation of G.S. 14-415.11(c)(8) shall be guilty of an infraction and may be required to pay a fine of up to five hundred dollars ($500.00). In lieu of paying a fine the person may surrender the permit.

(a1) A person who has been issued a valid permit who is found to be carrying a concealed handgun in violation of subsection (c2) of G.S. 14-415.11 shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.

(b) A person who violates the provisions of this Article other than as set forth in subsection (a) or (a1) of this section is guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor. (1995, c. 398, s. 1; 2011-268, s. 21(a); 2013-369, s. 16; 2015-195, s. 9.)

As an additional note, this is a relatively new change in laws for NC where it went from a misdemeanor to an infraction BUT there is still a "gotcha" clause in Article 54B which is the group of statutes that regulate concealed carry and that's NC statute 14-415.18. Revocation or suspension of permit.

14-415.18. (a)The sheriff of the county where the permit was issued or the sheriff of the county where the person resides may revoke a permit subsequent to a hearing for any of the following reasons:
(4) The violation of any of the terms of this Article.

Which means any terms stated in Article 54B which includes the carry where posted statutes.

It may be possible for your sheriff to suspend or revoke your permit if you are caught carrying where posted and fined.

With the spectrum of sheriffs we have in this state I wouldn't be surprised to see one or more try this route. I haven't seen it happen yet but it's still fairly new legislation.

Just covering the bases.

Posted: 1/9/2017 5:55:53 AM EDT

[#21]

To muddy the waters even more, in the newest edition of Recoil's concealed carry magazine there is a large article talking about this very thing. It says that in some states you can and probably will be charged with trespassing if found to be carrying a weapon in a business that has a posted "no weapons" sign. Not sure if it would be a misdemeanor or felony(have to re-read over it to double check), but that seems a bit extreme. Thoughts, regarding NC specifically?

This is the first I have ever heard of this.

Posted: 1/27/2017 1:55:11 AM EDT

[#22]

It would be nice if they removed the force of law from the signs... wishful thinking?

Posted: 1/27/2017 2:35:39 AM EDT

[#23]

Quote History

Quoted:
To muddy the waters even more, in the newest edition of Recoil's concealed carry magazine there is a large article talking about this very thing. It says that in some states you can and probably will be charged with trespassing if found to be carrying a weapon in a business that has a posted "no weapons" sign. Not sure if it would be a misdemeanor or felony(have to re-read over it to double check), but that seems a bit extreme. Thoughts, regarding NC specifically?

This is the first I have ever heard of this.

View Quote

You're correct, in NC you can be charged if found to be carrying concealed where posted. No additional warnings needed.

NC statute 14-415.21 says it's an infraction to violate statute 14-415.11(c)(8) which is the statute that prohibits concealed carry on any private premises where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the premises.

The penalty for this infraction is that you may be required to pay a fine of up to five hundred dollars ($500.00). In lieu of paying a fine the you may surrender your permit.

Posted: 2/10/2017 11:40:30 AM EDT

[#24]

Quote History

Quoted:
To muddy the waters even more, in the newest edition of Recoil's concealed carry magazine there is a large article talking about this very thing. It says that in some states you can and probably will be charged with trespassing if found to be carrying a weapon in a business that has a posted "no weapons" sign. Not sure if it would be a misdemeanor or felony(have to re-read over it to double check), but that seems a bit extreme. Thoughts, regarding NC specifically?

This is the first I have ever heard of this.

View Quote

I just moved into NC and recently took the required CCW course. My class instructor was a retired Sheriff's Dept Major with 35 years on. He was all about "ALWAYS CARRY" and argued that you should always have one or more firearms within reach, in public or and at home.

But...When I asked about the no firearms signs and concealed carry vs open carry. He was very firm that if you see a no firearm sign of any kind, turn around and go elsewhere. Do NOT walk into an establishment with a no firearms sign while carrying your weapon.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Posted no firearms signs

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